Remove all forms of little-no maintenance, indefinite stuns

[Cobby]

If a player deserves to be out of the round forever just kill them.

If they don't, don't use it.

Things like N2O and Straightjacket are dumb and should either be changed to be escapable or removed.

[D&B]

But death is the best stun

[Incomptinence]

We put ghost whenever in so absurdly horrible people who merit such treatment to wuss out like the whiners they are.

Literal non issue.

[Lazengann]

But those options make you less likely to get banned

[Cobby]

But those options make you less likely to get banned

I'm more apt to ban you because it's dumb.

If it was really no different than death you'd just kill them, people do these purposefully knowing it puts many players in a mind game to literally keep them out of the round in any form since they'd rather wait it out and enact vengeance on that character as opposed to ghost out.

[CPTANT]

I thought you could resist out of straight jackets nowadays.

I think it would be good if you could resist off your breath mask even while you are unconscious.

[danno]

But those options make you less likely to get banned

Yeah definitely not true
I would sooner ban someone who tried to n2o lock a person than someone who simply killed one. Probably ban for longer, too.

[Armhulen]

both take people out of the round permanently, what's the difference

[Lazengann]

The difference is when the admin says you fucked up you can just let them out of the N2O room but if they're dead then they're fuckin dead

I have never done this to anyone as a disclaimer

[ShadowDimentio]

I just kill bad people and worry about the bwoinks later

[Dr_bee]

Removing N2O stuns would also be a major buff to already stupidly overpowered changelings. N2O internals is pretty much the only way to make sure a ling says down for good on the way to gibbing.

[FantasticFwoosh]

At least have the decency to present it as a choice to the victim, ghost out but stay alive or die & be forgotten and float away into a ghost role or something (not explained in IC terms ofc)

Id say stick it out with the permastun and ghost, because its less cheaty post ahelp for a admin to put you back into your body without having to resurrect you (and if you are a ling you can hit your adrenal gland and wake back up)

---

Freezing people in icecubes with freon is still better for the record. Cryo futureprisons rules.

• Lings are unkillable without gibbing them literally, don't code shitty antags that can basically revert the damage & consequences of failure then cry when the only option is to lock you indefinitely forever on N20 or stuck inside xenobio's main blast door chamber.

[Cobby]

I didn't code lings nor have I touched them so that is not my problem :^)

[Incomptinence]

"Someone dumb and nasty enough to get straight jacketed may be too dumb to ghost."

The only argument in the pile of salt from people who get hard retrained more than once in a blue moon.

[calzilla1]

STRAIT JACKETS ARENT EVEN PERMA RESTRAINTS ANYMORE. YOU FUCKING FUCK!!! FUCKING HUGBOX REEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE (I have no idea why I'm so angry about this post)

[Cobby]

"Someone dumb and nasty enough to get straight jacketed may be too dumb to ghost."

The only argument in the pile of salt from people who get hard retrained more than once in a blue moon.

if they're that simplistic then there shouldn't be a problem with removing them then.

STRAIT JACKETS ARENT EVEN PERMA RESTRAINTS ANYMORE. YOU FUCKING FUCK!!! FUCKING HUGBOX REEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE (I have no idea why I'm so angry about this post)

was this actually fixed?

[Qbopper]

But those options make you less likely to get banned

Yeah definitely not true
I would sooner ban someone who tried to n2o lock a person than someone who simply killed one. Probably ban for longer, too.

^

both take people out of the round permanently, what's the difference

if I die normally I can be cloned or get a ghost role

if I'm given n2o haha fuck myself

[FantasticFwoosh]

if I die normally I can be cloned or get a ghost role

if I'm given n2o haha fuck myself

Id say stick it out with the permastun and ghost, because its less cheaty post ahelp for a admin to put you back into your body without having to resurrect you

Yeah, OOC tab > Ghost out and write up a ahelp if you feel its particularly bullshit, play a ghost role if it gets rejected.

[Qbopper]

if you have to go to an admin to resolve something, there is by definition a problem

[FantasticFwoosh]

Here's another one for you, drink 100u of honey and spend the rest of the round in "You go into hyperglycaemic shock! Lay off the twinkies!" like i did for 10 minutes

[danno]

both take people out of the round permanently, what's the difference

one of the two demonstrates, in my opinion, a more clear intent to take fun away from someone out of spite, rather than out of any necessity for the sake of the game.

[WJohnston]

indefinite stuns are not fun to play against. nobody likes being basically dead but with the slight chance of maybe coming back so they don't ghost, and instead look at a black screen or are held hostage for 20+ minutes. they're not fun.

get rid of both, or at least with N2O make it either slow you down severely in high concentrations, or otherwise knock you out repeatedly for a milisecond so it makes combat very difficult, as you cannot hold a weapon to defend yourself. I'd go with the former, since at least you can fight back/put a mask on, although move cripplingly slowly.

[Anonmare]

Why not have it so that being N2O'd for too long causes you to suffocate to death?

[kevinz000]

Why not make n2o not stun lock hmm
Also isn't co2 just as bad

[Armhulen]

Why not make n2o not stun lock hmm
Also isn't co2 just as bad

correct because falling unconscious resets your resist timers for cuffs so

[WJohnston]

CO2 is much, much, much more obvious on the point of no return, and takes much, much longer to do so. N2O by comparison happens in about 2 seconds, typically faster than you can pull your internals out in, and you have no way to know at a glance whether you're just giggling from light exposure to instantly and helplessly sleeping.

[onleavedontatme]

if you have to go to an admin to resolve something, there is by definition a problem

If there is a player problem (misuse of game mechanics) you ask an admin to resolve it yes, whats your point?

[John_Oxford]

cobby got n2o+straightjacketed

and shit i wasn't even playing hos, what'd you do to piss off sec son

[Tokiko2]

Anyone want to remind us why ghosting requires punishment in the first place? Why not just make ghosting the same as being killed?

[Not-Dorsidarf]

Anyone want to remind us why ghosting requires punishment in the first place? Why not just make ghosting the same as being killed?

ghosting is leaving the round in an OOC manner without killing yourself, thats the whole distinction?

[onleavedontatme]

Carn changed it so suicide wouldnt work while restrained so we could have kidnap objectives or something and five years later we have two suicide buttons and no kidnap objectives

[iamgoofball]

Here's another one for you, drink 100u of honey and spend the rest of the round in "You go into hyperglycaemic shock! Lay off the twinkies!" like i did for 10 minutes

Maybe don't get the 'beetus next time, dumbass.

[kevinz000]

Here's another one for you, drink 100u of honey and spend the rest of the round in "You go into hyperglycaemic shock! Lay off the twinkies!" like i did for 10 minutes

Maybe don't get the 'beetus next time, dumbass.

[FantasticFwoosh]

Here's another one for you, drink 100u of honey and spend the rest of the round in "You go into hyperglycaemic shock! Lay off the twinkies!" like i did for 10 minutes

Maybe don't get the 'beetus next time, dumbass.

The point i was striving towards is once that's in the open to be common knowledge its a non-harmful way to almost permanently incapacitate someone due to metabolisation rates and however long the effect lasts.

• As HOS/botany traitor literally turn a empty area such as a spare office into a morphine bee torture room then forcefeed morphine & honey (from morphine queen bee) for combined effect of pernament morphine intoxication sleeping and hyperglacemic shock.

How about coderbus collectively stops making lings able to revive without consequence, because really "shutting down" a prisoner is fundamental, and changelings do not "die" without the total destruction of their being that can only really occur in four different ways. Supermatter shards, extreme explosions, being ground into beef in a gibber and incinerated. Without mutual co-operation to enter the areas and use the materials the best alternative is to wall them in which is not fun or advisable.

If your regular "mortal" traitor has implants or adrenaline injection, attach cuffs to the shoes and once confirmed the implants exist surgically remove it from their bodies. For sleeping carp the only alternative to death is being borged.

[kevinz000]

if you are unable to deal with a goddamn changeling of all things as a security player without n2o internal stunlock
... Acquire fucking proficiency.

[FantasticFwoosh]

Anything less than a security player powergame-prepped and people are ignoring you without having extremely job specific access to bypass certain doors and reach said areas where you can pernamently kill a changeling and you're fucked.

Basically lowpop. Or get bwoinked for invalidating "muh player rights" by walling a antagonist in to a 1x1 space/N20 permalocking them. Gee, thanks. And you're the person who would be handling these complaints and yet you show a outward complete lack of empathy to players who regularly have to go though the struggle of finding the motivation to fight lings at all rather than just let it happen and server hop/log out.

Even your powergaming arsenal gets exhausted eventuallly mekhi fighting a ling 3 times in a row because all your supplies run out being wasted on a enemy that just recoils (unless you're shitty and literally carry the N20 canister around with you which arugably is ban baiting for the implied purpose)

• If i wanted a hard "final boss" i had to QTE kill by grab intent and throwing them into a gibber to just finish the game id go play God of War not spessmen.
• Reminder - Adrenaline breaks N20 for the duration of its effect entirely and traitorlings both have implants & genetic ling skills to free themselves from N20 capture

[kevinz000]

I never use n2o and I never had a ling exhaust my weapon unless I die on first contact :^)

[kevinz000]

Also the most powergame of all is n2o stunlock internals.

[danno]

that's not really powergame but it sure is gay

[Cobby]

cobby got n2o+straightjacketed

and shit i wasn't even playing hos, what'd you do to piss off sec son

No but Jmad uses it.

[Lazengann]

used it

[kevinz000]

also i second/third/whatever what the other admins said in the thread
if you want to remove someone from the round and decide to do it by killing them so they can talk with deadchat/explore/do something else until they get the cloner sound/possibly join ghostroles
it'll look better than
>you want to remove someone from the round so you keep them perma-stunlocked with no chance of escape without outside help where they can't fucking do anything but watch the unconscious overlay because oh what if someone gets me up and they don't want to ghost out either because oh that's leaving body so you get perma removed from that character again with no chance of escape.
yes others in the thread said this but, the first sounds like "you did it to remove someone bad from the round" and the second sounds like "i want to dick with this dude".

no i'm not saying n2o internals and similar infinite-stunlock-unconscious-bs isn't allowed but it's sure more severe.

[Incomptinence]

Jmad could get his bondage fix with a pair of handcuffs anyway since escaping someone pulling you while cuffed is just not going to happen without outside interference.

Someone being so attached to their character appearance they dare not ghost is not a code problem, it's a problem with their attitude.
You'd think a game that often renders character into chunky salsa would discourage getting overly attached.

Also wanting to make a decently simulated anaesthetic gas not knock people out while freon is a repeated server crasher just makes me consider you all very silly.

[DemonFiren]

Freon is a goof feature, it gets immunity.

[confused rock]

You can strip a dude and put 4 girders around him and hes basically infinistunned too

[CPTANT]

You can strip a dude and put 4 girders around him and hes basically infinistunned too

At least he can suicide then.

[Qbopper]

You can strip a dude and put 4 girders around him and hes basically infinistunned too

At least he can suicide then.

you can ghost out of being n2o'd but that has the same effect of showing admins that you're intentionally fucking with someone by forcing them to sit and hope they get rescued/die/ghost out and be removed from the round permanently

the moral of the story is to go into the game knowing that there are other people involved and considering your actions (no this doesn't mean don't kill people, it means to read fucking rule 1)

[onleavedontatme]

Infinitely detaining people without killing them has completley different IC and especially asimov implications from killing them though

[onleavedontatme]

A good portion of our gameplay is people taking turns getting a greenlight to power trip and have fun at anothers expense (valid!). I really dont understand all the hand wringing about this.

[FantasticFwoosh]

Infinitely detaining people without killing them has completley different IC and especially asimov implications from killing them though

Consequences remain, but reponsibllity is pretty much dissolved after they are dead in both regards as per the (go play a ghost role or something) approach, AI isn't obliged to serve corpses and sec will ramp up bodies sometimes by accident and release them to genetics & the morgue.

Not that we bother to stock many GOOD ghost roles anyway for thumb twiddling till roundend but you get what you're given.

• Aside from admin ruling, there's no defined "human rights" abstract of human/non-human status applicable outside of server rules. If the player is not able to play and is actively kept in suspension is their OOC suffering and perhaps frustration relayed into IC in a different manner to simply being in perma.