Techwebs situation.

[Shezza]

Since I was told there will be no official poll ingame about this why not try forums.

It's been a few months since introduction of techwebs, a few things were changed since then.

But large amout of things that people still complain about were not, and its been going on like this for a long time now.


Discuss what bugs you about techwebs, what could be changed, and how you feel about the feature.

Summing up a few first posts.

1. Bad UI
2. Departaments never get ores except for science and maybe virology.
3. Anyone can press a button to research a tech which is bad
4. Techfabs still not ingame

[oranges]

there will be no changes to techwebs in their current format.

[Shezza]

I would like to hear opinion from people who actually play too.

Just because you say there will be nothing doesn't matter other people feel like that.

[Saegrimr]

Neat idea but holy shit the UI is just one of those things. Not as bad as the Requires-a-wiki Genetics but still.

[Shezza]

Personally i dislike how the only thing that can affect the speed of research are bombs.

And because people like GreyRachnid constantly find faster way to max science 12 minutes, its constantly getting nerfed, which is counterproductive.

[onleavedontatme]

Needs a better UI

Needs a better way to distribute ore to lathes (A centralized machine in cargo that holds all the ore, with the ability to authorize/deauthorize lathes on station, and lathes will draw from bluespace storage if their local storage doesnt have enough for a recipe. Probably a log of things being built using bluespace storage as well so cargo can tell if the janitor buys 80 advanced mops).

Needs better icons for the department lathes+better locations on the maps so people remember they exist

[Shezza]

Needs a better way to distribute ore to lathes (A centralized machine in cargo that holds all the ore, with the ability to authorize/deauthorize lathes on station, and lathes will draw from bluespace storage if their local storage doesnt have enough for a recipe. Probably a log of things being built using bluespace storage as well so cargo can tell if the janitor buys 80 advanced mops).

that feature is "in-works" since introduction of techwebs.

The point was raised many times but was never addressed, even an admin had to ahelp about it because he thought the feature was broken.

[onleavedontatme]

but was never addressed

WYCI

[Saegrimr]

Personally i dislike how the only thing that can affect the speed of research are bombs.

Does the experimentor do anything or is that just a forgotten relic by now?

Got bored and made a bunch of canister bombs as Atmos and detonated them at the test site trying to get a bigger boom so hey at least another department can have fun with it.

[Shezza]

Personally i dislike how the only thing that can affect the speed of research are bombs.

Does the experimentor do anything or is that just a forgotten relic by now?

Got bored and made a bunch of canister bombs as Atmos and detonated them at the test site trying to get a bigger boom so hey at least another department can have fun with it.

No, experimentor is only abused for very obscurely known exploits that take extreme amounts of time.

[zaracka]

Ores: Move ORM inside Cargo. Cargonians give out ore based on requests.
Alternative: What Kor said except allocate/sent through a console interface (replaces stocks in terms of busywork?). Either by quantity or percentage.

Research: Remove circuit imprinter from R&D. Restrict Robotics circuit imprinter to Robotics-related boards only. Remove Research console from Engineering.
Fix Inconsistencies: What's the difference between a protolathe and a techfab? Why are some machines interactive while others need a console? Why does rebuilding some machines reset their restrictions? Examples: Using a screwdriver on the Engineering Research console unlocks the "Technology" button and using a screwdriver on a circuit imprinter removes it's board restrictions.

[Bombadil]

The ui is awful. I just wish you could queue the research rather than having to stand around and stare at a computer. Atleast when it was deconstructive analyzer i got to run around and grab shit for research. Also the worst is having engineering or robotics hijacking to research experimental surgeries when you were trying to get advanced mining.


A queue would really make techwebs a lot more tolerable. Do we really need to have someone waste their time pressing a button.

[Bombadil]

Ores: Move ORM inside Cargo. Cargonians give out ore based on requests.
Alternative: What Kor said except allocate/sent through a console interface (replaces stocks in terms of busywork?). Either by quantity or percentage.

Research: Remove circuit imprinter from R&D. Restrict Robotics circuit imprinter to Robotics-related boards only. Remove Research console from Engineering.
Fix Inconsistencies: What's the difference between a protolathe and a techfab? Why are some machines interactive while others need a console? Why does rebuilding some machines reset their restrictions? Examples: Using a screwdriver on the Engineering Research console unlocks the "Technology" button and using a screwdriver on a circuit imprinter removes it's board restrictions.

We have that on box. The roboticists just run in when a cargo tech comes in or they get let in by some dipshit

[zaracka]

A queue would be a nice QoL change. Non-Supply jobs would no longer get ORM access.

[onleavedontatme]

The button that chooses the next research should be RD office and bridge only.

Or at least not robotics etc. Everyone else should only be printing.

Circuit imprinters dont need to be different machines than protolathes anymore.

[cedarbridge]

Personally i dislike how the only thing that can affect the speed of research are bombs.

Does the experimentor do anything or is that just a forgotten relic by now?

Got bored and made a bunch of canister bombs as Atmos and detonated them at the test site trying to get a bigger boom so hey at least another department can have fun with it.

Literally just to dupe pugs.

[Bombadil]

The button that chooses the next research should be RD office and bridge only.

Or at least not robotics etc. Everyone else should only be printing.

Circuit imprinters dont need to be different machines than protolathes anymore.

Just limit technology tab by scientist id, research director or captain. Is that doable? Because sometimes we just don't have an rd on sybil

[Shezza]

Whats really shitty is also that robotics cannot make organ auguments anymore.

Literally content cut from a job for no reason and given to medical, except noone does it now unless a roboticist steals the board.

[Davidchan]

The lack of overlap is jarring. Cargo dept late doesn't seem to be able to make anything useful, even though cargo is where you're supposed to go if you need extra equipment. Particularly in the case of a department being assholes so you're trying to set up elsewhere. Medbay bombed to fuck or just refusing service to anyone not in their metaclub? Well can't get a defib anywhere else, better luck next time.

[somerandomguy]

Personally i dislike how the only thing that can affect the speed of research are bombs.

Does the experimentor do anything or is that just a forgotten relic by now?

Got bored and made a bunch of canister bombs as Atmos and detonated them at the test site trying to get a bigger boom so hey at least another department can have fun with it.

Someone made a rework but it got closed and said they were going to re-open it or something a week ago but didn't yet

[EagleWiz]

We were promised all sorts of features and ways to get points, and what we got was points just happen every couple seconds. Bad change. The only things I see R&D used for are mining tools (which miners get quite annoyed if they are not rushed), the machine upgrades for mining, cloning, cryo and maybe sleepers (upgrades to sleepers do have downsides). Oh and possibly fightsuits and BOHs for the memes. I get that there were issues with the old R&D job, but this was close to a straight removal.

[Gun Hog]

I do not have a problem with Techwebs itself, but departmental protolathes, specially the restricted Science protolathe. Adding in a system that is designed to prevent scientists unlocking everything in an average round along with removing access to many of the items makes R&D much less attractive to do. Why waste your limited points on research that produces nothing for you, either directly or indirectly? As a scientist, your priorities usually lie in upgrade components, mining tools (miners are your BFF), medical tech (upgrading medbay benefits everyone), sometimes engineering (they can give you more points), and then fun stuff such as the BoH and other toys. Unless someone is yelling at you for something, or you are really after another department's item, you are not inclined to sacrifice your points unlocking something that you will never get or even see.

Virtually all of the other nerfs to Science as a result of Techwebs are tolerable. The UI is not perfect, especially the need to use the R&D console to print things. That has always been a problem, and it is partially fixed on the headless lathes; Make all the Sci lathe and printer like this, so there is no need for people to fight over the R&D console.

Finally, to Kor:

The button that chooses the next research should be RD office and bridge only.

Please do not do this, it will only make the problem I mentioned even worse. Low-pop rounds would suffer from this the most. It means that Scientists will have to break into the RD's office if there is not one, and people outside Science will probably be building their own consoles to deal with that problem as well, should it get that bad. I do not see many of the other heads wanting to hang around the bridge to unlock gear for a department either.

[Wyzack]

Tie it to the low pop expanded access system?

[onleavedontatme]

Unless someone is yelling at you for something, or you are really after another department's item, you are not inclined to sacrifice your points unlocking something that you will never get or even see.

Ideally the tree would be laid out in such a way that all paths/branches are viable, and the random shit you probably wouldn't go out of your way to research otherwise (like the advanced mop) would be included with stuff RnD wants.

[SpaceInaba]

on one hand yeah science was powerful on the other techwebs combined with department lathes are so horrible and boring it made me completely drop the department completely despite literally 70% of my playtime being in it
It's honestly extremely depressing that we've gone this far and STILL the only FUCKING point boost is toxins, like seriously? I know it's a WHEN U CODE IT thing but it's just kind of absurd that we've gone this long with this bland system with a skill ceiling lower than my math test scores and everybody says they're gonna make it better and then never do it.

[SpaceInaba]

also the interface is laggy as shit but that's unrelated to techwebs

[somerandomguy]

on one hand yeah science was powerful on the other techwebs combined with department lathes are so horrible and boring it made me completely drop the department completely despite literally 70% of my playtime being in it
It's honestly extremely depressing that we've gone this far and STILL the only FUCKING point boost is toxins, like seriously? I know it's a WHEN U CODE IT thing but it's just kind of absurd that we've gone this long with this bland system with a skill ceiling lower than my math test scores and everybody says they're gonna make it better and then never do it.

With the tesla coil researchers it's possible to make a paper engine to boost it but it takes a long time and you need to babysit it to fix the grille every time it breaks

[Saegrimr]

Imagine if the experimentor was useful

[onleavedontatme]

on one hand yeah science was powerful on the other techwebs combined with department lathes are so horrible and boring it made me completely drop the department completely despite literally 70% of my playtime being in it
It's honestly extremely depressing that we've gone this far and STILL the only FUCKING point boost is toxins, like seriously? I know it's a WHEN U CODE IT thing but it's just kind of absurd that we've gone this long with this bland system with a skill ceiling lower than my math test scores and everybody says they're gonna make it better and then never do it.

We had ~8 years and no viable ideas to improve old RnD, techwebs is far from perfect but at least we can mostly agree on the issues and realistic, specific ways to fix them.

And after that yeah, WYCI

[Shezza]

on one hand yeah science was powerful on the other techwebs combined with department lathes are so horrible and boring it made me completely drop the department completely despite literally 70% of my playtime being in it
It's honestly extremely depressing that we've gone this far and STILL the only FUCKING point boost is toxins, like seriously? I know it's a WHEN U CODE IT thing but it's just kind of absurd that we've gone this long with this bland system with a skill ceiling lower than my math test scores and everybody says they're gonna make it better and then never do it.

With the tesla coil researchers it's possible to make a paper engine to boost it but it takes a long time and you need to babysit it to fix the grille every time it breaks

Lol not anymore some salty guy removed that

[ohnopigeons]

I don't like it but this is the bed that science mains made for themselves, now they must lie in it.

[SpaceInaba]

I mean to be fair every time I involve myself with science I still print 5 eguns, a flightsuit, bag of holding, riot shield, etc etc etc etc, just now it takes zero mental
work and it takes 30 minutes longer than it did before

[PKPenguin321]

I mean to be fair every time I involve myself with science I still print 5 eguns, a flightsuit, bag of holding, riot shield, etc etc etc etc, just now it takes zero mental
work and it takes 30 minutes longer than it did before

No you don't unless you stole the sec protolathe

[SpaceInaba]

I mean to be fair every time I involve myself with science I still print 5 eguns, a flightsuit, bag of holding, riot shield, etc etc etc etc, just now it takes zero mental
work and it takes 30 minutes longer than it did before

No you don't unless you stole the sec protolathe

>he doesn't know

[somerandomguy]

I mean to be fair every time I involve myself with science I still print 5 eguns, a flightsuit, bag of holding, riot shield, etc etc etc etc, just now it takes zero mental
work and it takes 30 minutes longer than it did before

No you don't unless you stole the sec protolathe

>he doesn't know

[Nabski]

What's the feeling on bringing back the scavenger hunt, but for weaker anomalies.

They last 3-5 minutes and there is always exactly one present on the station. The effects would be smaller than your standard anomaly (think a single tile that just sits on fire, a spot that stays slippery, a mobile shock grille type effect). The best way to collect them would be have one person on the tracker (added experimentor feature) calling out locations and types, and a second person going to hunt it down.

Analyzing them makes a core that can be redeemed for points for the techweb, a "any type" resource, or maybe just unlocks a random tech web automatically. I like the last one because it helps with "science only ever gets what science and mining wants".

[Luke Cox]

The concept is excellent and fundamentally better than old R&D in every way, but the execution needs work. Rework the UI (alphabetize shit for god's sake) and add more sources for research points

[oranges]

put the consoles in the department head offices.

[Bombadil]

put the consoles in the department head offices.

Then we have a bunch of heads competing to get whatever goodies they want first.


It'll be a complete and utter clusterfuck

[oranges]

give it to the HoP then

[JStheguy]

or just straight up nuke techwebs, drop all pretenses, and just stick stuff behind a flat time gate.

[zaracka]

Here's a wild idea. Give nodes a type flag like before aka Biology, Engineering, etc. or based on departments aka Medbay, Engineering, etc. And put in a restriction that prevents too many of one flag being researched after technologies with the other flags fall too far behind. Think of it as a CentCom restriction so that their science encompasses everything and doesn't lag behind the Syndicate's or something. If we want to get really crazy, randomize the value for every flag so you have rounds where Medical was mostly researched early versus Science or Engineering versus Cargo/Supply and so on. Really, really crazy would be X flag must always be +2 any other flag. CentCom wants mostly Medical research this shift, substitute Medical for Engineering, Supply, Science, etc. Or X flag must always be -2 any other flag. CentCom isn't interested in this research.

Maybe split science and robotics, maybe not. Same with atmos and engineering. Cargo and mining. Maybe have some nodes count as 2 or 3 different flags at the same time.

Or forget this idea and just merge some nodes, I guess.

Remove the Science channel from mining radio headsets. I wonder why Science always takes all the ores. Or why Mining is always researched first.

This is kind of irrelevant or maybe it's not. Protolathes and circuits imprinters always ask how many sheets to put in, implying you have more than you need, hmm... Maybe figure out that number when you're asking Cargo for ores or taking from the ORM. I think it would nice if you had to split the stack before putting it in and not have to input a number every time, similar to the autolathe.

[Luke Cox]

It's really simple, just add ways to get more points

[Tlaltecuhtli]

@zaracka at that point just revert to old rnd where tech trees were omogenously researched

[zaracka]

???

research would not be based on fetching items

if you're referring to the merge nodes suggestions, then perhaps

thank you for your post