/tg/Station 13

This feature has garnered a lot of controversy in the short time it's been on the server. Rather than trying to argue across PRs like bee lore, I thought it would be worthwhile to discuss it on the forums. Please vote in the poll I've made, and explain your opinions in more detail in the thread.

Personally, I feel that the whole thing is just useless, and the little icon shaking animation that happens whenever an item is put into your hand (including when taking it out of backpacks and the like) is downright ugly. I don't think this feature has any merit to stand upon, and aesthetically it is extremely unappealing.

PRs linked for brevity:
https://github.com/tgstation/tgstation/pull/39231
https://github.com/tgstation/tgstation/pull/39261

I like it. It gives you more visual feedback. What someone picked up (say from a big pile of items), what item someone pulled out (say a weapon). Something your character would be aware of, but it's not that obvious in game. It's great from AI perspective too.

But it introduces some pick up delay, which I didn't notice before, it could probably go. |edit| <- it doesn't

Some more visual feedback of who picked what up is nice.

My only complaints are:
The item showing up when you take something out of your bag/pockets. The text message is enough for those.
Not a fan of the pick up delay.
The shaking looks odd and doesn't really fit with the aesthetics.

is this a copypaste of the yog forum post?

Remove/Minimize Shaking and scale the speed of the animation with obj weight

Lumbermancer wrote:I like it. It gives you more visual feedback. What someone picked up (say from a big pile of items), what item someone pulled out (say a weapon). Something your character would be aware of, but it's not that obvious in game. It's great from AI perspective too.

But it introduces some pick up delay, which I didn't notice before, it could probably go.

It is not supposed to introduce any pickup delay, you have the item in hand as soon as you click on it, the animation should be purely visual, are you sure the delay isn't just in your head?

while visual feedback is nice I feel like a simple "item shrinks as it glides 'into' your sprite" is better than the shaking.
overcomplication is not always good, even if it seems like it's more "fancy" than a simple one.

oranges wrote:

Lumbermancer wrote:I like it. It gives you more visual feedback. What someone picked up (say from a big pile of items), what item someone pulled out (say a weapon). Something your character would be aware of, but it's not that obvious in game. It's great from AI perspective too.

But it introduces some pick up delay, which I didn't notice before, it could probably go.

It is not supposed to introduce any pickup delay, you have the item in hand as soon as you click on it, the animation should be purely visual, are you sure the delay isn't just in your head?

Unless I'm going senile already, I was able to click-swap hands-click instantly before, there's some delay now, on second click to pick.

--edit

Well nevermind, I just tested and there's no delay. I don't know what happened before, was it in my head or lag induced.

oranges wrote:is this a copypaste of the yog forum post?

Is it? I don't browse the Yog forums, but I don't think what I've said or the way I've phrased it is an uncommon opinion in any respect.

The overlays appear on alt-clicked tiles.
The shake animation looks dumb.
Can be spammed while running down a hall clicking your backpack with something big in your hand
Constant crashing ever since.

Saegrimr wrote:Constant crashing ever since.

Gonna point out that all the crashes I hear about on this issue are usually people using an old version of 512. I've not been able to replicate the pickup animation causing crashes issue on the latest 512 Beta builds.

subject217 wrote:

Saegrimr wrote:Constant crashing ever since.

Gonna point out that all the crashes I hear about on this issue are usually people using an old version of 512. I've not been able to replicate the pickup animation causing crashes issue on the latest 512 Beta builds.

To be fair we shouldn't have a code that crashes people who don't use the potentially buggy Beta build. If something is going to be added to the game then it should work for the Current Non-beta build

Remove the delay, the little shake the items do before picking them up, and the icon appearing when you inventory.

Inventory effect is a bug and there's literally no inventory delay it's all cosmetic.

The shake isn't getting removed since the only argument posed against it is "it's weird" and "ss13 is old"

iamgoofball wrote:The shake isn't getting removed since the only argument posed against it is "it's weird" and "ss13 is old"

The only argument for remove it is "I don't like it"
The only argument for keeping it is "I like it"

The shake is ugly

The shake is not because "I don't like it", it's because it

1) Doesn't convey any information. The item moving to the player conveys who picked up the item, the shaking does not.

2)makes stealing a pain when the object, to no control of your own, goes HEY LOOK IM BEING TAKEN.

The response to number 2 was "lol just don't steal when people are around" so I know i'm wasting my breath on the topic though.

Somebody suggested having it so that walking and picking something up wouldn't play the animation so you can still have stealth item grabbing and I think that sounds cool

No

lmao

I love how this happens every time with goofball

Saegrimr wrote:I love how this happens every time with goofball

The only opinion that matters about a feature is maintainer opinions and headcoder opinions.

iamgoofball wrote:

Saegrimr wrote:I love how this happens every time with goofball

The only opinion that matters about a feature is maintain opinions and headcoder opinions.

Well, which one are you?

Neither, and the same goes for you. Have fun.

iamgoofball wrote:and the same goes for you

How's that relevant?

Try thinking really hard.

Also, the maintainers gave me the changes they want made.

goof is basically the new pap without the cute girl profile picture and can sometimes make good prs

iamgoofball wrote:Try thinking really hard.

Also, the maintainers gave me the changes they want made.

So that was a general "you filthy unwashed masses" you, not a "me specifically" you?

Cobby wrote:goof is basically the new pap without the cute girl profile picture and can sometimes make good prs

Not only do I predate paprika but paprika also did literally nothing wrong.

Saegrimr wrote:

iamgoofball wrote:The shake isn't getting removed since the only argument posed against it is "it's weird" and "ss13 is old"

The only argument for remove it is "I don't like it"
The only argument for keeping it is "I like it"

well actually it's not that you like, it's that *I* like it

oranges wrote:

Saegrimr wrote:

iamgoofball wrote:The shake isn't getting removed since the only argument posed against it is "it's weird" and "ss13 is old"

The only argument for remove it is "I don't like it"
The only argument for keeping it is "I like it"

well actually it's not that you like, it's that *I* like it

Yeah that

Even though I personally like the shake, it's bad for gameplay. As showcased in this thread, it gives players the impression that picking up items is delayed as the animation takes almost a full second to complete

That's not my opinion, it's plain bad visual feedback

Mickyan wrote:Even though I personally like the shake, it's bad for gameplay. As showcased in this thread, it gives players the impression that picking up items is delayed as the animation takes almost a full second to complete

hey see look at that, actually useful feedback

which has been posted before but you elected to ignore it in favour of taking bait

subject217 wrote:

Saegrimr wrote:Constant crashing ever since.

Gonna point out that all the crashes I hear about on this issue are usually people using an old version of 512. I've not been able to replicate the pickup animation causing crashes issue on the latest 512 Beta builds.

I have upgraded to the latest 512 Beta build and i keep crashing due to the shitty pick up animation.

Pizzatiger wrote:

subject217 wrote:

Saegrimr wrote:Constant crashing ever since.

Gonna point out that all the crashes I hear about on this issue are usually people using an old version of 512. I've not been able to replicate the pickup animation causing crashes issue on the latest 512 Beta builds.

I have upgraded to the latest 512 Beta build and i keep crashing due to the shitty pick up animation.

I can't reproduce the crash, man. What are your specs? Also, which server is this?

Fairly sure you cannot click through the animation, which makes picking up several items slower. Otherwise I like it, though it could possibly be toned down a bit.

skoglol wrote:Fairly sure you cannot click through the animation, which makes picking up several items slower. Otherwise I like it, though it could possibly be toned down a bit.

The animation has no impact on speed of picking up items.

It should be disabled for tiny and small items so you can feasibly get away with taking small stuff. Obviously anyone could see you take a taser or baton, but something smaller such a an ebow or ID could go unnoticed.

The shaking isn't good for reasons already stated but I think it has potential if you make it have no effect on small/tiny items

iamgoofball wrote:

Saegrimr wrote:I love how this happens every time with goofball

The only opinion that matters about a feature is maintainer opinions and headcoder opinions.

subject217 wrote:I thought it would be worthwhile to discuss it on the forums. Please vote in the poll I've made, and explain your opinions in more detail in the thread.

Why even post here then you big manbaby lmao

Honestly, I like the idea of it. It makes it easier to see who's picked up what. I just think the wiggle is unnecessarily misleading because it makes you think there's a pick-up delay when there isn't.

oranges wrote:

Saegrimr wrote:

iamgoofball wrote:The shake isn't getting removed since the only argument posed against it is "it's weird" and "ss13 is old"

The only argument for remove it is "I don't like it"
The only argument for keeping it is "I like it"

well actually it's not that you like, it's that *I* like it

Well you like to make people angry so why should we take your opinion as honest and serious as this point.

I heard it's causing crashes on 1416 and below

I don't like how it looks visually at the moment, the shake and the shrinking make the icons look even worse and on smaller icons is basically indecipherable as to which item it actually was.

There are also some noticeable bugs (the one I recall noticing offhand is that removing paper from a paperbin creates a pickup animation underneath the player, rather then from the paperbin to the player)

Fairly sure you cannot click through the animation, which makes picking up several items slower. Otherwise I like it, though it could possibly be toned down a bit.

If the animation/afterimage of the picked up item is covering items still on the ground then this has some pretty important balance implications.

The fact that it's caused substantial number of crashes and required updating BYOND (after a semi-long period of everyone being advised not to update beyond 1416) is the icing on the cake.

Shezza wrote:

oranges wrote:

Saegrimr wrote:

iamgoofball wrote:The shake isn't getting removed since the only argument posed against it is "it's weird" and "ss13 is old"

The only argument for remove it is "I don't like it"
The only argument for keeping it is "I like it"

well actually it's not that you like, it's that *I* like it

Well you like to make people angry so why should we take your opinion as honest and serious as this point.

the point is it doesn't matter how you take my opinion

quit crashing my game, CODERS,

Arianya wrote:I don't like how it looks visually at the moment, the shake and the shrinking make the icons look even worse and on smaller icons is basically indecipherable as to which item it actually was.

There are also some noticeable bugs (the one I recall noticing offhand is that removing paper from a paperbin creates a pickup animation underneath the player, rather then from the paperbin to the player)

Fairly sure you cannot click through the animation, which makes picking up several items slower. Otherwise I like it, though it could possibly be toned down a bit.

If the animation/afterimage of the picked up item is covering items still on the ground then this has some pretty important balance implications.

The fact that it's caused substantial number of crashes and required updating BYOND (after a semi-long period of everyone being advised not to update beyond 1416) is the icing on the cake.

>getting mad over having to do a free update

come on, grow up

.1413 was a work of art goofball and now we had to part ways with it

iamgoofball wrote:

Arianya wrote:I don't like how it looks visually at the moment, the shake and the shrinking make the icons look even worse and on smaller icons is basically indecipherable as to which item it actually was.

There are also some noticeable bugs (the one I recall noticing offhand is that removing paper from a paperbin creates a pickup animation underneath the player, rather then from the paperbin to the player)

Fairly sure you cannot click through the animation, which makes picking up several items slower. Otherwise I like it, though it could possibly be toned down a bit.

If the animation/afterimage of the picked up item is covering items still on the ground then this has some pretty important balance implications.

The fact that it's caused substantial number of crashes and required updating BYOND (after a semi-long period of everyone being advised not to update beyond 1416) is the icing on the cake.

>getting mad over having to do a free update

come on, grow up

>ignoring all other feedback and gotcha-ing people being annoyed at their game crashing

come on, grow up

Arianya wrote:>ignoring all other feedback and gotcha-ing people being annoyed at their game crashing

come on, grow up

Uh excuse me your opinion doesn't matter here, this thread is bait and should be closed.