Standard borg zipties

[Yakumo_Chen]

Bottom post of the previous page:

Aside from the buckle-tossing trick (which I think is exploity), standard borgs don't even have a way to stun on their own to cuff, even with hacking.

[Malkraz]

Only Peacekeeper is "meant to stop harm" (in the most direct sense), hence the name "peace keeper" and not "engineering".
Regardless of what they're "meant" to do, there's always going to be a disconnect between "this is what you're supposed to do" and "this is what players do" with any given tool. It has to be taken into consideration how players are going to use the tools provided to them, and as has already been stated in the thread this tool easily leads to shitty secborg-lite gameplay. Honestly why is standard even an option?

[Dr_bee]

When you say things like you know what borgs are supposed to do, but only started playing in 2017, it makes me feel sad.

Borgs are not meant to stop harm, they just happen to be obligated to do so under their laws.

Borgs have always had that aspect of their laws, it wasnt magically added sometime before that person started playing.

If borgs arent designed to stop harm why the fuck is there an inaction clause in the first place? If it is a relic from the pre HG days when borgs were actually a threat that isnt applicable anymore why has the clause stuck around?

[Lumbermancer]

Borgs are not meant to stop harm, they just happen to be obligated to do so under their laws.

So you're saying they are meant to stop harm?

[oranges]

no they're not meant to, they're obligated to do so.

For Rp reasons, it doesn't mean they have to actually be good at it mechanically, which is what I said, but for the benefit of slow people I'm happy to repeat myself.

[Steelpoint]

Cyborgs stopping harm is a side effect of their Nanotrasen approved Lawset, but that is not their primary function.

You could argue that the only Cyborg who is intended to prevent harm is the Security Borg, and the Peacekeeper Borg to an extent, allthough the Peacekeeper seems built more to encourage harmony and cooperations amongst the crew than actually stopping harm.

Every other borg has a primary function that has nothing to do with preventing harm.

[Lumbermancer]

Cyborgs stopping harm is a side effect of their Nanotrasen approved Lawset, but that is not their primary function.

Why do you think we need the silicon policy and all the unwritten rules? Because the lawset was purposefully flawed to allow Asimov to write stories. Primary function is not a factor within the lawset.

[Steelpoint]

Which is why I always find it amusing we use the Asimov three laws when the laws were intentionally designed to be flawed. You'd think we'd be better off writing a unique lawset, but we've been through that song and dance a hundred times.

[Lumbermancer]

Universal lawset will always be problematic. If you really don't want borgs to prevent muh harm, and to follow their function, it has to be unique for each type.

[confused rock]

When you say things like you know what borgs are supposed to do, but only started playing in 2017, it makes me feel sad.

Borgs are not meant to stop harm, they just happen to be obligated to do so under their laws.

Borgs have always had that aspect of their laws, it wasnt magically added sometime before that person started playing.

If borgs arent designed to stop harm why the fuck is there an inaction clause in the first place? If it is a relic from the pre HG days when borgs were actually a threat that isnt applicable anymore why has the clause stuck around?

I hate to break it to you but asimov didn't write his laws to be optimal and he DEFINITELY didn't write them for space station 13

[Yakumo_Chen]

Standard Borg is meant to be the Jack of all trades, it has zip ties as a hold over from secborg (like its removed stun baton). Standard has plenty of functions that make it usable and there's no real reason to remove it outside of ided

Outside of tatoring the cuffs don't see much use and if you get zip cuffed by Borgs because you stood there and ignored the loud sound that lays and the large red text or because you got stunned by someone else and the Borg cuffed you while you got stunned it sounds like you just need to get good

[somerandomguy]

Aside from the buckle-tossing trick (which I think is exploity), standard borgs don't even have a way to stun on their own to cuff, even with hacking.

what are flashes

[Shadowflame909]

Aside from the buckle-tossing trick (which I think is exploity), standard borgs don't even have a way to stun on their own to cuff, even with hacking.

what are flashes

Don't forget Service Borgs are literally infinite stun murder-borgs. I abused their stun so much that I got a note for it.

>Spray-cans can stun.
>Service Borgs get a spray can
>They can spray flammable liquids onto people so they catch on fire along with the stun.
>Spray Cans are quite flammable.
>Literally Plasma Fire/Any sort of fire method like an electric grille + Spray can and you have a murder-borg.

Or you can just feed someone a shitload of alcohol whilst your stunning them. They're quite literally an underused sec borg alternative. I don't know why I'm mentioning this though because I hate sec-borgs and this will probably get them nerfed.

You can just use a mask to negate this though. Whilst sunglasses to negate there flash.

[Yakumo_Chen]

Any Borg that can get the flash stun has other methods of locking you down anyway or can flat valid you, so the cuffs aren't really the underlying problem.

[Shadowflame909]

Any Borg that can get the flash stun has other methods of locking you down anyway or can flat valid you, so the cuffs aren't really the underlying problem.

This is true, any borg has a sort of unconventional way of stunning that goes along with their flash. Not all of them are decent though.

If there was any change that came from this argument. I hope it'd be giving peacekeeper borgs can make an infinite amount of fake handcuffs via battery power for an interesting mechanical change. The ones that take 1 second for you to break out of, so anytime your persecutor stops dragging you. Either via a door or something like that. You can instantly break out of them. Yet, you can't break out of them whilst moving.

[somerandomguy]

Any Borg that can get the flash stun has other methods of locking you down anyway or can flat valid you, so the cuffs aren't really the underlying problem.

This is true, any borg has a sort of unconventional way of stunning that goes along with their flash. Not all of them are decent though.

If there was any change that came from this argument. I hope it'd be giving peacekeeper borgs can make an infinite amount of fake handcuffs via battery power for an interesting mechanical change. The ones that take 1 second for you to break out of, so anytime your persecutor stops dragging you. Either via a door or something like that. You can instantly break out of them. Yet, you can't break out of them whilst moving.

Trick handcuffs

[Yakumo_Chen]

It's not even about other stuns, Borgs have plenty of ways to subdue you without a cuff module. You can strip someone and bolt them in a fire closet in a few uses of flash.

Not even the easiest method of nonlethal effective round removal, or the most absolute one. Cuffs or not, any Borg can get valids with enoigh prep or clever thinking, no amount of module removals is likely to change that.

The issue is players, not code, as always. If a Borg isn't following laws to valid you, it's up to you to report it.

[Shadowflame909]

It's not even about other stuns, Borgs have plenty of ways to subdue you without a cuff module. You can strip someone and bolt them in a fire closet in a few uses of flash.

Not even the easiest method of nonlethal effective round removal, or the most absolute one. Cuffs or not, any Borg can get valids with enoigh prep or clever thinking, no amount of module removals is likely to change that.

The issue is players, not code, as always. If a Borg isn't following laws to valid you, it's up to you to report it.

Exactly. As I learned during a previous cult round.

>Engineering Borg: Who needs cuffs lmao
>Opens a can of n20
>Get literally KO'd for the rest of the round.

I expected the N20 to at least kill my of o2 loss. But that never happened. I guess what I'm trying to say is, zipties are a pretty lame thing to argue about removing. No matter what you do, you'd pretty much have to remove borgs in general if you want to stop any sort of borgs being able to restrain people.

That could be anything from a quick engineering borg building an electric grille with a couple clicks of a button. Or a Service borg making infinite amounts of the Neurotoxin Bartender drink and feeding it to people.

[confused rock]

Just because its possible for a borg to be a fag without ties doesn’t mean that zipties don’t promote shit behaviour. An assistant can bomb the hotline, but they don’t start with a maxcap.

[Shadowflame909]

Just because its possible for a borg to be a fag without ties doesn’t mean that zipties don’t promote shit behaviour. An assistant can bomb the hotline, but they don’t start with a maxcap.

..Should I tell him? Or...

[Yakumo_Chen]

How often do you actually see a Borg go standard just for ties though, outside of Malf?

[Shadowflame909]

How often do you actually see a Borg go standard just for ties though, outside of Malf?

I know I'm commenting alot here but

>Going standard ever for ties.

Brutal honesty kicking in, I just play standard because of the chance that I'll get emagged and I get to esword people. The cuffs can suck ass, I rarely ever use them. Or get a need to.

Usually, when I'm not emagged, I just walk around and EPI pen people in critical condition and just react to situations? There's not much to do other than roaming around. Can barely mine.

The most valid hunting borg players I've seen are mainly janitor borgs surprisingly. They flash you and take you all the way to sec on Asimov, even if you complain and law two them to stop doing this.

My static is not very well liked in the borg community.

[WarbossLincoln]

The most valid hunting borg players I've seen are mainly janitor borgs surprisingly. They flash you and take you all the way to sec on Asimov, even if you complain and law two them to stop doing this.

Ahelp this if it happens to you, or if you see it happen. I'm quick to say: stop nerfing silicons, start banning shitty silicon players, but admins can't administrate things they don't know are happening.

[Nabski]

The most valid hunting borg players I've seen are mainly janitor borgs surprisingly. They flash you and take you all the way to sec on Asimov, even if you complain and law two them to stop doing this.

Ahelp this if it happens to you, or if you see it happen. I'm quick to say: stop nerfing silicons, start banning shitty silicon players, but admins can't administrate things they don't know are happening.

If you law two to be released, don't have another order saying to arrest you, and there's not some "in the middle of harm" going on you should be released.

But if you don't ahelp it, I'm not going to know. If you let me know then I'll gladly act on it.