Lack of chemical grenade diversity

For feedback on the game code and design. Feedback on server rules and playstyle belong in Policy Discussion.
Post Reply
Kryson
Code Maintainer
Joined: Thu Nov 29, 2018 11:04 pm
Byond Username: Kryson

Lack of chemical grenade diversity

Post by Kryson » #484652

It seems to me that only a few chemicals grenades are ever used, at least on Terry where i play most of the time.

CFl3 smoke
CFl3 + plasma smoke
Potassium + Water
Meth explosion

Rarely Cfl3 foam

And often these do not even seem that amazing unless detonated on the shuttle.

Where are the poison, acid, mutagen smokes and foams?

Most of the poisons seem perfectly viable when applied using the old aids syringe or sleepy pen.

Is it simply unreliable to catch people in the smoke or foam?

Or is the amount delivered too low before the victims can escape?

Is the grenade diversity greater on bagil?

Should anything be changed, if so, what?
User avatar
SaveVatznick
Joined: Fri Jul 28, 2017 12:40 am
Byond Username: SaveVatznick

Re: Lack of chemical grenade diversity

Post by SaveVatznick » #484657

Well, this issue is once people put on their internals, they never tend to take them off, so smoke nades are hard to pull off. People just run out of them before they inhale enough anyways, so fire smoke works well because once you're hit by it, you're guaranteed to take at least some damage regardless of internals.

Foam is better because it entraps people with slips, increasing their exposure time, but I can't think of a reason to use a poison foam over Chlorine Trifluoride. Poison damage is hard to kill with when the chem fridges come stocked with a bottle plus ten pills of charcoal each by default. Fire ends up doing more damage than unblended poisons and is easier to make, as well as heating up the air and making the environment unlivable, dissuading helpers from coming to drag victims away.

I'd even go so far as to say that fire is better in syringes as well. A Phlogiston/Napalm/clfl3 syringe does high fire damage and superheats the victim even if they extinguish themselves, husking them so they cannot be cloned, and is less complex to make than an advanced toxin syringe.

Fire just does more with less effort. Yes,poisons can out damage fire, I'll bet,but why go through the effort just to be foiled by someone wearing a hardsuit or internals?
Leora Fleebish is every bad part of me stuffed into a 32x32 sprite.
User avatar
wesoda25
Joined: Thu Aug 10, 2017 9:32 pm
Byond Username: Wesoda25

Re: Lack of chemical grenade diversity

Post by wesoda25 » #484674

Don’t blame lack of player imagination on lack of game mechanics. Back in my chem main days I discovered a shit ton of memey shit, grenades and syringes alike. Theres also a lot of deadly shit hiding under the radar, I can think of at least one department leveler off the top of my head, which doesnt even cause a hull breach or anything. And after all that I still know theres tons I haven’t discovered.

Simply put, get good. That being said, adding new chem interactions would be fun and add even more variety to the game.
[this space reserved]
User avatar
lmwevil
Joined: Sun Mar 01, 2015 3:09 pm
Byond Username: Lmwevil

Re: Lack of chemical grenade diversity

Post by lmwevil » #485014

vatznick is right but forgot the very fact that a hellfire grenade is also just fucking awesome to watch compared to a low impact smoke that makes people die
User avatar
PKPenguin321
Site Admin
Joined: Tue Jul 01, 2014 7:02 pm
Byond Username: PKPenguin321
Github Username: PKPenguin321
Location: U S A, U S A, U S A

Re: Lack of chemical grenade diversity

Post by PKPenguin321 » #485019

Polysmoke and mutagensmoke were so fucking fun and hilarious, readd them NOW coders
i play Lauser McMauligan. clown name is Cold-Ass Honkey
i have three other top secret characters as well.
tell the best admin how good he is
Spoiler:
Image
User avatar
iamgoofball
Github User
Joined: Fri Apr 18, 2014 5:50 pm
Byond Username: Iamgoofball
Github Username: Iamgoofball

Re: Lack of chemical grenade diversity

Post by iamgoofball » #485135

PKPenguin321 wrote:Polysmoke and mutagensmoke were so fucking fun and hilarious, readd them NOW coders
these are both still possible
Tlaltecuhtli
Joined: Fri Nov 10, 2017 12:16 am
Byond Username: Tlaltecuhtli

Re: Lack of chemical grenade diversity

Post by Tlaltecuhtli » #485157

poisons have been balanced to be not epic instadeath while fire has always been deadly as ever, i would say removing the foam/smoke duping reagents that turn in gas (liquid plasma as example) or reworking how they work would put hell nades back on pair with poisons (currently like 5 bars of plasma + foam/smoke with large beakers = plasmaflood of 1/4 th of the station
User avatar
PKPenguin321
Site Admin
Joined: Tue Jul 01, 2014 7:02 pm
Byond Username: PKPenguin321
Github Username: PKPenguin321
Location: U S A, U S A, U S A

Re: Lack of chemical grenade diversity

Post by PKPenguin321 » #485272

iamgoofball wrote:
PKPenguin321 wrote:Polysmoke and mutagensmoke were so fucking fun and hilarious, readd them NOW coders
these are both still possible
Not even close to being what they once were
i play Lauser McMauligan. clown name is Cold-Ass Honkey
i have three other top secret characters as well.
tell the best admin how good he is
Spoiler:
Image
User avatar
oranges
Code Maintainer
Joined: Tue Apr 15, 2014 9:16 pm
Byond Username: Optimumtact
Github Username: optimumtact
Location: #CHATSHITGETBANGED

Re: Lack of chemical grenade diversity

Post by oranges » #485286

re title this thread lack of creativity in tg playerbase
User avatar
Mickyan
Github User
Joined: Tue Oct 14, 2014 11:59 pm
Byond Username: Mickyan
Github Username: Mickyan

Re: Lack of chemical grenade diversity

Post by Mickyan » #485296

Readily available mouth/eye/face covering with no notable downsides means anything that needs ingesting (read: 90% of chemicals) is probably going to affect only a couple of people in a crowded room
ImageI play on Manuel as Swanni, the brain-damaged moth.
Be nice to each other.
Image
Image
Image
Image
Image
User avatar
iamgoofball
Github User
Joined: Fri Apr 18, 2014 5:50 pm
Byond Username: Iamgoofball
Github Username: Iamgoofball

Re: Lack of chemical grenade diversity

Post by iamgoofball » #485367

oranges wrote:re title this thread lack of creativity in tg playerbase
to be fair a ton of chems did get nerfed heavily to be milquetoast because people got mad about medicine having actual downsides
User avatar
wesoda25
Joined: Thu Aug 10, 2017 9:32 pm
Byond Username: Wesoda25

Re: Lack of chemical grenade diversity

Post by wesoda25 » #485375

Wow FUCK those coders for makint it so that any person who read the wiki can’t combine 3 toxins and clf3 in a smoke grenade and kill an entire shuttle (still possible). Even with the nerfs you can do hilarious, deadly, and very rare shit, use your little monkey chemist brains.
[this space reserved]
User avatar
PKPenguin321
Site Admin
Joined: Tue Jul 01, 2014 7:02 pm
Byond Username: PKPenguin321
Github Username: PKPenguin321
Location: U S A, U S A, U S A

Re: Lack of chemical grenade diversity

Post by PKPenguin321 » #485433

breathing mutagen smoke for 0.001 seconds and getting every single disability was, in hindsight, really funny
i play Lauser McMauligan. clown name is Cold-Ass Honkey
i have three other top secret characters as well.
tell the best admin how good he is
Spoiler:
Image
Tlaltecuhtli
Joined: Fri Nov 10, 2017 12:16 am
Byond Username: Tlaltecuhtli

Re: Lack of chemical grenade diversity

Post by Tlaltecuhtli » #485503

i think the new genetics made it so mutagen can only active bad mutations from your personal dna list instead of alll shoul probably test to confirm it
Post Reply

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Bing [Bot]