/tg/Station 13

Seriously, radiation is way too hard to cure for how easy it is to spread. A couple of seconds of exposure leaves you fucked for the rest of the round.

I got radiated by visiting engineering for 20 seconds, and then took 10 u of pentetic acid, followed by 50u of pottasium iodine all the while showering for 10 minutes AND STILL RADIATED. This seems to happen every single time.

Is the radiation from one person feeding the other, creating a feedback loop or something? Otherwise the healing chems are way too weak for the levels of radiation reached.

edit: ohw yeah I tested it, even pentetic is WAAAAAAY too weak. 10u pentetic heals only like 50 radiation units, while contamination easily reaches 500+

showering removes only 0.5 rad units per metabolization tick or something.

Were you wearing contaminated gear? Cleaning contaminated gear is harder than actually getting rads off of people with medicine.

Dr_bee wrote:Were you wearing contaminated gear? Cleaning contaminated gear is harder than actually getting rads off of people with medicine.

No, and I showered for ages anyway. The amount of radiation in you just goes up so incredibly fast.

I mean it shouldn't be too difficult to tweak the decay rate when showering ?

It really isnt all that difficult, you must either be using the chems wrong or have a source of new radiation close to you. Notably, your items can get contaminated and keep irradiating you which will make getting rid of rads harder. Pentetic is more effective on large amounts of radiation (in the thousands), while PI is needed for smaller amounts (in the hundreds).
Showering does nothing unless you have irradiated items on you, in which case showering follows the same non linear pattern of doing a lot if the contamination is high, and little if it is low.

Keep in mind you can decontaminate your items quickly in a suit storage unit.

does showering your items not decontaminate them?

shouldn't radiation inherently be super toxic and hard to get rid of though? like that's why rad suits exist? i dunno maybe it's just me but it feels like radiation should be spooky and really dangerous

just like real life that makes it not very fun at all

oranges wrote:does showering your items not decontaminate them?

It does last I checked, but you run into the same issue of contaminated items contaminating each other, so you end up with a really fucking slow decon process. Frankly there should be primary sources of radiation that can contaminate and secondary sources of rads that cant. that way you dont end up with a feedback loop from wearing pants that got a little rads on em.

It isnt realistic, but realism isnt always fun, especially when medbay has limited supplies of anti-rads and usually low manpower.

I don't think the issue is that radiation is hard to get rid of, but rather that it's way too easy to spread around. It's to the point that I've started refusing to treat engineers as a medical doctor out of fear that the entire fucking medbay will become rad hell.(which it will)

I think it'd be better to look at ways of slowing the spread of radiation in the first place, rather than speeding up rad treatment itself. Sure, it sucks to be on a pentetic IV under a shower for 5 minutes straight, but radiation is supposed to be a pain in the ass to get rid of. It's the fact that it winds up becoming an accidental pandemic with zero effort that irks me.

Your contaminated items generally won't contaminate your other items enough that it matters. It's just that showering isnt very effective at removing ALL the radiation. It gets rid of the high numbers quickly, but the small numbers will take forever. The way radiation works, if a very contaminated engineer runs into medbay your items will generally not get contaminated. You will get irradiated though.


Just to reiterate, getting rid of the contaminated items and using the radiation chems correctly is key.
As a test case, I irradiated myself on fusion. 40000 irradiated, 25000 contamination, which you have to agree is a worst case scenario while not also dead. By the time 30u pentetic was done metabolizing, with my items on, I was down to 3k irradiation. My items were already down to 1700 contaminination just by themselves, no showering. Taking my stuff off and eating 20u more pentetic has me at 700 irradiation which is getting to the point where PI will be more effective. Mind you, the pentetic outhealed the toxin damage from the radiation so in this time I have been a functioning member of station society. I havent stood around in a shower staring at the wall. So just passively letting chems metabolize for around 8 minutes almost got rid of everything.
Around 20 potassium iodine reduced the rest of the radiation below the level where it affects me. No problem. All the other test mobs I put in medbay got some irradiation, but no contamination. So they get sick, but don't spread it around. And by the time I was free of rads, my items were down to less than 200 contamination. Not enough to irradiate me or anyone else around me anymore, as it is very low per-item. I could have also put them in an SSU to immediately get rid of the contamination and speed up the initial chemical radiation drop.

Could showering decontaminate faster? Yeah, I wouldn't have a problem with that. It just doesnt really matter all that much.


Okay then, so how do you deal with an irradiated engineer? Strip their shit in a remote location, on meta the maint storage is fine. Then go heal them, noone else got hurt and everyone is happy. Teach them about the dangers of radiation contamination, move on with your day. Take some pentetic for good measure, you probably got a dose of rads since you took charge of the situation like a boss instead of turning them away.

thank you for this research skoglol, very useful.

oranges wrote:thank you for this research skoglol, very useful.

Can we make the medbay holobarrier refuse passage to irradiated people as well as diseased people?

50u pentetic to be somewhat functional is a rather large amount when the standard medbay injectors inject only 10.

Also why do all our damage models scale from 0-100 and does radiation scale from 0 to 10k+, it makes reading the numbers really non intuitive.

50u pentetic was for 40000 radiation. You'll never see this much unless you are purposefully standing next to a fusion can. Normal radiation levels from SM will range between 1000-2000, while secondary radiation is usually less than 1000. I mentioned that the last 3000 was dealt with in only 20u pentetic and some potassium iodine, which is pretty reasonable for what is effectively a very deadly dose of radiation. For reference, radiation stops scaling effects past 2000 iirc.

Stickymayhem wrote:Can we make the medbay holobarrier refuse passage to irradiated people as well as diseased people?

I never understood this. Why do you want sick people stuck outside medbay exactly? If they are sick on purpose, they probably came from inside medbay in the first place.

skoglol wrote:50u pentetic was for 40000 radiation. You'll never see this much unless you are purposefully standing next to a fusion can. Normal radiation levels from SM will range between 1000-2000, while secondary radiation is usually less than 1000. I mentioned that the last 3000 was dealt with in only 20u pentetic and some potassium iodine, which is pretty reasonable for what is effectively a very deadly dose of radiation. For reference, radiation stops scaling effects past 2000 iirc.

Stickymayhem wrote:Can we make the medbay holobarrier refuse passage to irradiated people as well as diseased people?

I never understood this. Why do you want sick people stuck outside medbay exactly? If they are sick on purpose, they probably came from inside medbay in the first place.

It's for containment not keeping people out.

skoglol wrote:50u pentetic was for 40000 radiation. You'll never see this much unless you are purposefully standing next to a fusion can. Normal radiation levels from SM will range between 1000-2000, while secondary radiation is usually less than 1000. I mentioned that the last 3000 was dealt with in only 20u pentetic and some potassium iodine, which is pretty reasonable for what is effectively a very deadly dose of radiation. For reference, radiation stops scaling effects past 2000 iirc.

Yes but this amount still completely ruins you, gives you mutations, continuously accumulates toxins damage etc. The effects are major but for some reason this isn't enough radiation to make pentetic actually effective?

perhaps we should add back arithrazine? a strong drug that cured only radiation and hurt the user, similarly to calomel. that, or add its effect to calomel.

skoglol wrote:

Stickymayhem wrote:Can we make the medbay holobarrier refuse passage to irradiated people as well as diseased people?

I never understood this. Why do you want sick people stuck outside medbay exactly? If they are sick on purpose, they probably came from inside medbay in the first place.

It's just a logic problem with penlites that they can't be made into one directional. I think the original intent was that a doctor would be stationed nearby and be able to quickly check on who pinged the barrier, but most doctors seem to prefer hiding down in OR or by cloning rather than be in the one spot where injured or sick people actually congregate. Off topic but its one of many reasons why a public chem fridge is as bad for medical as a public RnD terminal would be for science.

Does radiation still break the laws of thermodynamics? iirc if you had several items like say, 20 pieces of paper, around a radiation source, all 20 pieces of paper would become irradiated the same amount and then put off more radiation than what was originally used. If this is still a thing it should be fixed before trying anything else

PKPenguin321 wrote:Does radiation still break the laws of thermodynamics? iirc if you had several items like say, 20 pieces of paper, around a radiation source, all 20 pieces of paper would become irradiated the same amount and then put off more radiation than what was originally used. If this is still a thing it should be fixed before trying anything else

This is how the RPD SM trick works, so I assume it wasnt fixed.

Stickymayhem wrote:

oranges wrote:thank you for this research skoglol, very useful.

Can we make the medbay holobarrier refuse passage to irradiated people as well as diseased people?

Beautiful fucking idea. Can also try to get a quarantine section for medbay. Maybe have it connect to maint, so its not infecting the medbay directly. Just have it be a sterilized room, you know, with a disposal and a camera for doctors to view. Disposal for shooting infected/contaminated shit into space, and an exit from disposal from doctors, whom toss you your drugs through so as not to infect themselves.

On the older map, in medbay, those two isolation rooms down across from the CMOs office seem like a perfect spot for something like this.

Gamarr wrote:

Stickymayhem wrote:

oranges wrote:thank you for this research skoglol, very useful.

Can we make the medbay holobarrier refuse passage to irradiated people as well as diseased people?

Beautiful fucking idea. Can also try to get a quarantine section for medbay. Maybe have it connect to maint, so its not infecting the medbay directly. Just have it be a sterilized room, you know, with a disposal and a camera for doctors to view. Disposal for shooting infected/contaminated shit into space, and an exit from disposal from doctors, whom toss you your drugs through so as not to infect themselves.

On the older map, in medbay, those two isolation rooms down across from the CMOs office seem like a perfect spot for something like this.

I actually use the isolation rooms for treating infected people, assuming that the infection hasn't already spread station wide. Apart from that...refusing access to infected people is pretty fucking dumb. Radiated people I agree with, but infected people? It is literally your actual job as a doctor to treat sick people. You can tell before even getting close to someone if they're infected, and there's at least two bio-suits available on every map for doctors to use. Get dressed before you decide to get close to someone with a virus icon, you clot.

So tons of chemicals reduce your radiation level by a couple of hundred units, but standing for 5 seconds next to another person trying to decontaminate in the shower gives you thousands of units back 10 times as fast.