The Experimentor

bandit · Post by **bandit** » Sat Jan 24, 2015 6:44 pm #62345

I assume this is currently supposed to replace destructive analyizing / R&D cookbooks. But is it completely random?

Lumbermancer · Post by **Lumbermancer** » Sat Jan 24, 2015 6:58 pm #62350

I never achieved anything of value using Experimentor. Once it turned one worthless item into different worthless item.

Snakebutt · Post by **Snakebutt** » Sat Jan 24, 2015 7:06 pm #62354

Never played with it myself, but I have watched science play with it through the chemistry window on eff3. Every round, they end up with radium all over the floor, 2 explosions and a few gas releases. Never heard them yelling from the rooftops about big breakthroughs either.

Miauw · Post by **Miauw** » Sat Jan 24, 2015 7:43 pm #62377

Snakebutt wrote:Never played with it myself, but I have watched science play with it through the chemistry window on eff3. Every round, they end up with radium all over the floor, 2 explosions and a few gas releases. Never heard them yelling from the rooftops about big breakthroughs either.

first part seems about exactly what is supposed to happen, really.

Bombadil · Post by **Bombadil** » Sun Jan 25, 2015 12:08 am #62486

By the way. The experimentor can release a cloud of xenomicrobes.

I'm not fucking kidding.

Nanites too

Only via gas option but its random what will trigger this shit EVERY round.

Some items dont trigger anything the experimentor really needs some work

Bombadil · Post by **Bombadil** » Mon Jan 26, 2015 4:15 pm #63067

Also can someone please make this thing place the objects in a normal fashion i had a SHOWS THE OBJECTS TRUE NATURE and i couldn't find the object at all.

It never places items in a normal location it just seems to launch them which can lead to the items being destroyed by glitches. Instead have it eject to the right of the experimentor

Shadowlight213 · Sun Feb 08, 2015 2:27 am

Fun fact. the experimentor can cause meteors.
Follow up fun fact. the last 5 round I have been in had meteors come in 10 minutes into the round.

Seriously, its getting retarded.

Saegrimr · Post by **Saegrimr** » Sun Feb 08, 2015 2:33 am #67152

Also xenos, one of those rounds had both xenos and meteors happen almost simultaneously.

callanrockslol · Sun Feb 08, 2015 1:51 pm

There were aliens and nuke ops, at the same time.

10/10 this thing is beautiful.

Incomptinence · Sun Feb 08, 2015 2:24 pm

Well screw milking slimes for the rare roburgers. Didn't they make xenomicrobes and nanites impossible to hold in containers specifically to prevent xeno-robo smoke madness? Seems to go against some really good design decisions had in the past.

Cik · Post by **Cik** » Sun Feb 08, 2015 4:31 pm #67302

occasionally turns random people into cyborgs so that's pretty neat

otherwise it seems to kill lots of people that are using it so that's not good ;_;

Loonikus · Post by **Loonikus** » Sun Feb 08, 2015 5:23 pm #67319

I actually like the idea of this thing. I enjoy the fact that using this to up your research levels can actually be dangerous as opposed to the scavenger hunt. Those strange objects people find in Maint are perfect for shoving in this thing.

However, I would still consider making the benefits of using it more obvious or more immediately rewarding. Some of the things it can do are pretty dangerous (xenos, meteors, etc.) so the rewards it can give should better reflect that.

soulgamer · Post by **soulgamer** » Sun Feb 08, 2015 6:09 pm #67324

Loonikus wrote:I actually like the idea of this thing. I enjoy the fact that using this to up your research levels can actually be dangerous as opposed to the scavenger hunt. Those strange objects people find in Maint are perfect for shoving in this thing.

However, I would still consider making the benefits of using it more obvious or more immediately rewarding. Some of the things it can do are pretty dangerous (xenos, meteors, etc.) so the rewards it can give should better reflect that.

>Try every option 20 times on a strange object
>Nothing happens. Nothing Happens. Nothing happens. It gets thrown out of the machine. Nothing happens Nothing happens Nothing happens. Nothing happens.
>It gets destroyed
>Insert next strange object and repeat
I have no idea how this is supposed to work but I cant get it to do ANYTHING.

Methelod · Post by **Methelod** » Sun Feb 08, 2015 6:40 pm #67342

In it's current state, all the experimentor is useful for is griefing people. The most useful thing I've seen it do (And it is VERY rare compared to all of the bad instances) is that it'll upgrade a part that you throw in it. Oh, and make pets. On the other hand it turns people into xenos, cyborgs, irradiates them, summons meteors, damages them, releases gas, destroy the item that's in it for no apparent reason, EMP the area around RnD. Often breaking the consoles nearby.

At the very least it needs more upsides to actually using it. I know there is a function to discover the true purpose of the strange objects but that's currently bugged and even then. Meteors and aliens fuck up the station, but what does the experimentor have to contribute to the station as a whole? If you wanted to make it more useful for science, give it shit that only it can make, like new mech parts, or upgraded versions of some items.

Cipher3 · Post by **Cipher3** » Sun Feb 08, 2015 9:46 pm #67401

Methelod wrote:In it's current state, all the experimentor is useful for is griefing people. The most useful thing I've seen it do (And it is VERY rare compared to all of the bad instances) is that it'll upgrade a part that you throw in it. Oh, and make pets. On the other hand it turns people into xenos, cyborgs, irradiates them, summons meteors, damages them, releases gas, destroy the item that's in it for no apparent reason, EMP the area around RnD. Often breaking the consoles nearby.

At the very least it needs more upsides to actually using it. I know there is a function to discover the true purpose of the strange objects but that's currently bugged and even then. Meteors and aliens fuck up the station, but what does the experimentor have to contribute to the station as a whole? If you wanted to make it more useful for science, give it shit that only it can make, like new mech parts, or upgraded versions of some items.

This is very true. You'll frequently hear shouting from science about something going terribly wrong, but not once has there been a cry of 'EUREKA' and waving some beautiful shiny new thing around.

Bombadil · Post by **Bombadil** » Mon Feb 09, 2015 2:16 am #67458

Also the weird usage of what happens to the item. IT THRASHES IT VISCERATES IT IS CRUSHED. And the thing is fine.

Also REPEATED EMPS blow up the rds consoles and can fuck up the machinery in the research lab royally

Gun Hog · Post by **Gun Hog** » Mon Feb 09, 2015 5:30 am #67494

The Experimentor has very few rewards because it was originally meant as a replacement from the Destructive Analyzer. TeleScience was removed at the same time it was put up in a PR, so instead of TWO heavy nerfs to the fun of Science, coderbus opted to simply replace TeleSci with the Experimentor. All in all, the Experimentor is simply a DA that kills you. Sawu (the coder for it) ragequit, so I took up the task of fixing it. The fixes to relic scanning are merged but not on the server yet. When someone uses the machine while I am playing as RD, I simply order him to move the setup to the testing lab where it will do less damage. I do agree that it needs to give some better rewards in return for all the DEATH it causes.

Ikarrus · Post by **Ikarrus** » Mon Feb 09, 2015 5:49 am #67497

Sos threatened to go into the code and manually remove the thing next update after he heard about the meteor storm incident.

This thing is ridiculous. No subtlety at all. And keeps finding ways to grind the server to a halt.

Post by **lumipharon** » Mon Feb 09, 2015 5:54 am #67498

Holy shit, whatever you do Gunhog, just make sure that an negative side effects ONLY EFFECT SHIT IN THE SAME ROOM AS IT.

Seriously, having half of science getting emp'd (destroying all the consoles in the RD office and wiping any unsaved research from R&D) 20 times is pretty awful.
Not to mention meteor storm for the 10th time in a row.

Then scientists have the gall to get angry at ME for stopping them from literally ass fucking the station by using it more.

callanrockslol · Mon Feb 09, 2015 7:40 am

Crazy idea, but what if it had a load of different effects based on what type of thing was in it, plasma would tend to behave extremely weirdly in every circumstance, biological stuff would create life/turn you into shit/drain your blood to improve itself, power cells would be boring etc

Poking things would have different results than burning would, stuff like that.

Bombadil · Post by **Bombadil** » Mon Feb 09, 2015 2:39 pm #67589

The thing definitely needs work its so extremely basic its disgusting.

Scones · Post by **Scones** » Mon Feb 09, 2015 3:13 pm #67593

"B-but you can do R&D with it!"

It's so wildly inefficient in what it does that literally the only purpose is to repeatedly EMP til you've broken every console in the RD's office and then just exploit meteor showers until you get lynched/banned. I have never seen notable progress be contributed to R&D by this machine.

Meteors have been detected on collision course with the station
Meteors have been detected on collision course with the station
Meteors have been detected on collision course with the station
Meteors have been detected on collision course with the station
Meteors have been detected on collision course with the station

Gun Hog · Post by **Gun Hog** » Mon Feb 09, 2015 8:21 pm #67685

I will soon be nerfing the EMP range so it does not shut down the RD office or the main research lab, it might still be able to trip the fire alarm or zap a few cameras. I am also replacing the meteor event with FIREBALLS! Scientists have their PDA ringtone set to *boom* for a reason! It is strongly urged to have a

nearby (but not too close or it will be destroyed!) for when it happens. It has the same chance as the meteor trigger, so do be careful.

Bombadil · Post by **Bombadil** » Tue Feb 10, 2015 1:42 am #67789

Gun Hog wrote:I will soon be nerfing the EMP range so it does not shut down the RD office or the main research lab, it might still be able to trip the fire alarm or zap a few cameras. I am also replacing the meteor event with FIREBALLS! Scientists have their PDA ringtone set to *boom* for a reason! It is strongly urged to have a nearby (but not too close or it will be destroyed!) for when it happens. It has the same chance as the meteor trigger, so do be careful.

So its any random item that triggers shit right?

So like insert a analyzer and it releases xenomicrobe gas? Or did you remove xenomicrobes

Tokiko2 · Post by **Tokiko2** » Thu Mar 12, 2015 5:04 pm #75117

I really, really love this addition.

Maybe you could have the Experimentor produce a waste item that inherits the original item's research levels and raises one of them by one or rarely two levels if the experiment was a success? That would be a very nice alternative way to max out research levels.

Gun Hog · Post by **Gun Hog** » Thu Mar 12, 2015 5:20 pm #75121

Xenomicrobes are removed, replace with sulfuric acid in the "Gas" mode. The Fireballs event only happens if you choose the "Heat" mode.

And...HOLY MOTHER OF POLY, it is Tokiko!

To answer your question, the Experimentor does this when it sucks your blood. It is possible to gain levels that are not possible any other way through this. It comes at obviously high risk, though. Fireballs, getting your face dissolved, the machine eating the item, etc.

Bombadil · Post by **Bombadil** » Thu Mar 12, 2015 5:23 pm #75122

Gun Hog wrote:Xenomicrobes are removed, replace with sulfuric acid in the "Gas" mode. The Fireballs event only happens if you choose the "Heat" mode.

And...HOLY MOTHER OF POLY, it is Tokiko! To answer your question, the Experimentor does this when it sucks your blood. It is possible to gain levels that are not possible any other way through this. It comes at obviously high risk, though. Fireballs, getting your face dissolved, the machine eating the item, etc.

The problem is its just a shitty dangerous research console now. You can do all your research easily without problem and without looking at odd messages, Gnashes Viscerates destroyed. Etc

Scones · Post by **Scones** » Thu Mar 12, 2015 5:26 pm #75125

Talkin' about Strange Objects real quick

These things are sort of silly and could benefit from rebalancing. Especially the explosive one - Not only is the explosion actually pretty big, but it won't destroy the object. We had a round where people kept wandering in, grabbing the object, exploding, and leaving it for the next poor soul.

soulgamer · Post by **soulgamer** » Thu Mar 12, 2015 6:12 pm #75131

Scones wrote:Talkin' about Strange Objects real quick

These things are sort of silly and could benefit from rebalancing. Especially the explosive one - Not only is the explosion actually pretty big, but it won't destroy the object. We had a round where people kept wandering in, grabbing the object, exploding, and leaving it for the next poor soul.

Working as intended.
[youtube]dCeD2gF9jUo[/youtube]

Babin · Post by **Babin** » Thu Mar 12, 2015 8:05 pm #75148

soulgamer wrote:
Scones wrote:Talkin' about Strange Objects real quick

These things are sort of silly and could benefit from rebalancing. Especially the explosive one - Not only is the explosion actually pretty big, but it won't destroy the object. We had a round where people kept wandering in, grabbing the object, exploding, and leaving it for the next poor soul.
Working as intended.

The video fits Scones' description so well that I need to say it's a feature.

DemonFiren · Post by **DemonFiren** » Fri Mar 13, 2015 9:02 am #75379

Well, except it makes holes, too, right?

Post by **lumipharon** » Fri Mar 13, 2015 9:29 am #75381

That's a hilarious video that fits it well. That said, it's far less funny when it get triggered 5 times, between science and medbay, and everything is exposed to space, and everyone is crying bitter tears because retards keep activating it.

It's even less funny when some shitler gets the mob spawning on, then proceeds to spawns swarms of lethal mobs ALL ROUND.

soulgamer · Post by **soulgamer** » Fri Mar 13, 2015 3:16 pm #75404

lumipharon wrote:That's a hilarious video that fits it well. That said, it's far less funny when it get triggered 5 times, between science and medbay, and everything is exposed to space, and everyone is crying bitter tears because retards keep activating it.

It's even less funny when some shitler gets the mob spawning on, then proceeds to spawns swarms of lethal mobs ALL ROUND.

so change to the explosions to be like welder bombs were. They gib the person or at least kill them and make a single hole to space.

Post by **lumipharon** » Fri Mar 13, 2015 11:39 pm #75455

>see random object on the ground
>gibs you

Or alternatively:
>Use experimentor
>activate the object you unlocked
>gibbed

Yeah, nah.

Incomptinence · Sat Mar 14, 2015 12:41 am

Too dangerous far too dangerous. Spawned space bears when I was AI, like 4-5 civilians critted some runnning some fighting. That was only one of the bears, it actually spawned 2 the second was trapped with the experimentor.

Post by **MisterPerson** » Sat Mar 14, 2015 3:54 pm #75510

lumipharon wrote:>see random object on the ground
>gibs you

Or alternatively:
>Use experimentor
>activate the object you unlocked
>gibbed

Yeah, nah.

Yeah, that doesn't sound fun to me.

Loonikus · Post by **Loonikus** » Sun Mar 15, 2015 9:07 pm #75784

Seems to me that all these problems could be fixed if you could activate the experimentor from outside of the danger zone and if a second, smaller machine was added just to discern the effects of a strange object without having to risk killing yourself and everyone else.

Post by **lumipharon** » Sun Mar 15, 2015 9:20 pm #75787

That's not really the issue. The experimentor itself (now that the xbox huge emp, meteors etc are gone) is not the issue. At worst some chucklefuck will blow up the experimentor lab, but that doesn't really effect anything else.
The issue is when they unlock the strange objects, then roam the halls griefing with them.

The worst ones are:
UNLIMITED explosive
UNLIMITED hostile mob spawner
UNLIMITED mob spawner (sometimes hostile)
UNLIMITED blind drive thing
UNLIMITED flashbang

Seriously, stahp.

Loonikus · Post by **Loonikus** » Sun Mar 15, 2015 9:31 pm #75793

Right. Exactly why I'd say that having a way to determine a strange objects use would be good. That way unless your a no good shitter you can isolate bad objects and lock them away so they will never hurt anyone or be used for evil.

Post by **lumipharon** » Mon Mar 16, 2015 6:03 am #75859

Only the explosive one gets used repeatedly, accidentally. The rest literally just exist as grief tools.They should be limited use or not exist - filling the station with bears, carp and bees is real shit.

AnonymousNow · Thu Mar 19, 2015 12:21 pm

There still need to be super powerful effects and game-changers available through the Experimentor, but rare as hen's teeth.

Like, re-add xenomicrobes and similarly disruptive effects, but make it so that they'll only pop up once in every 25 rounds or so that an Experimentor is fully played with.

Gun Hog · Post by **Gun Hog** » Thu Mar 19, 2015 4:53 pm #76454

What I would like to do is implement a light version of Rapid Prototyping (https://github.com/NTStation/NTstation13/pull/627) and repurpose the relics into unique modules that modify a prototype in unique or stronger ways than pure research would. Perhaps something such as using the Experimentor to deconstruct a laser gun to get a module that applies burn type damage, or the RD's reactive armor to get the base module, after which he can apply that effect to another prototype device.

Essentially, it would move the Experimentor from being a DA that kills you to the machine that lets you make items to modify your prototype items (and kills you). It would be a beast of a project to do, though.

Miauw · Post by **Miauw** » Thu Mar 19, 2015 5:25 pm #76465

unlimited mob spawner is basically an infinite meat fountain for the chef, too.