/tg/Station 13

I wanted to collect some feedback and see how this is going. If you have some feedback specific to the feature, share away

I've got a question, when you order something as a member of an department it says that the Head of Staff can revoke the order, how's that work, via the Head of Staff's tablet or via the console?

I didn't know they existed until someone showed me, they're nice but I haven't been using them too much

I like to order contraband as chef and put it in my kitchen for enviromental cqc(I combo with shit around me)

very few people know they actually exist. they're pretty damn useful, too, though the supply drop machine is far better if cargo is doing well. i rarely see cargo tekkies actually deliver them, its usually whoever ordered them popping down to cargo.

Googles_Hands wrote: ↑Fri Nov 26, 2021 7:13 am I've got a question, when you order something as a member of an department it says that the Head of Staff can revoke the order, how's that work, via the Head of Staff's tablet or via the console?

They press the big red button on the console it was ordered on. It becomes unable for revoking when the crate has been sent on the cargo console.

Mothblocks wrote: ↑Fri Nov 26, 2021 7:25 am I didn't know they existed until someone showed me

ardentarclight wrote: ↑Fri Nov 26, 2021 8:07 am very few people know they actually exist.

I think awareness on both orderer and supplier needs to be much higher for this to really get out there, from what I've been spectating myself I see what you guys are talking about. Maybe I should add a readable section to the cargo console...?

ardentarclight wrote: ↑Fri Nov 26, 2021 8:07 am i rarely see cargo tekkies actually deliver them, its usually whoever ordered them popping down to cargo.

IDK if i'm blind or something, but the last time I played techie and saw one of these crates, I had no idea who to deliver it to. There wasn't anything special on the shipping manifest from what I could tell.

datorangebottle wrote: ↑Fri Nov 26, 2021 9:00 am

ardentarclight wrote: ↑Fri Nov 26, 2021 8:07 am i rarely see cargo tekkies actually deliver them, its usually whoever ordered them popping down to cargo.

IDK if i'm blind or something, but the last time I played techie and saw one of these crates, I had no idea who to deliver it to. There wasn't anything special on the shipping manifest from what I could tell.

It doesn't say where its from so cargo tech's don't ask who's order it is and it either gets left or not delievered,

TL;DR make it so they know which department it is from.

I've been seeing medical use it most of all. Blood packs, medipens, all that good stuff. Chefs are mostly ordering the express it seems.

NecromancerAnne wrote: ↑Fri Nov 26, 2021 10:11 amChefs are mostly ordering the express it seems.

It takes so long to get my godamn delivery as a chef I just express it.

I kind of miss being able to stamp the paper right infront of people at the requests console, now I never see the papers as no one brings it to cargo

NecromancerAnne wrote: ↑Fri Nov 26, 2021 10:11 am I've been seeing medical use it most of all. Blood packs, medipens, all that good stuff.

Makes sense. Science, engineering, service, and sec can generally get away with what they start with. Medbay has consumable supplies and they run out quickly, not even accounting for people just taking entire medkits.

I use them all the time as HoS, they're incredibly useful but cargo almost always plays no role in it. Most of the time cargo will either steal your crates for themselves, sell them back, or cancel your orders, so you kinda have to be super proactive in ordering --> unloading --> retrieving as your department. Apart from that I love them.

sinfulbliss wrote: ↑Fri Nov 26, 2021 8:26 pm Most of the time cargo will either steal your crates for themselves, sell them back, or cancel your orders, so you kinda have to be super proactive in ordering --> unloading --> retrieving as your department. Apart from that I love them.

I did not go far enough it seems. The stupid part about cargo cracking dep order crates is that they'd just earn enough money bringing it somewhere to where they'd be able to order the crate themselves

Mothblocks wrote: ↑Fri Nov 26, 2021 7:25 am I didn't know they existed until someone showed me, they're nice but I haven't been using them too much

Also wasn't initially aware they existed, and still not sure on how to actually order one, and then after that not sure how to make sure it actually reaches me.

Armhulen wrote: ↑Fri Nov 26, 2021 8:30 pm

sinfulbliss wrote: ↑Fri Nov 26, 2021 8:26 pm Most of the time cargo will either steal your crates for themselves, sell them back, or cancel your orders, so you kinda have to be super proactive in ordering --> unloading --> retrieving as your department. Apart from that I love them.

I did not go far enough it seems. The stupid part about cargo cracking dep order crates is that they'd just earn enough money bringing it somewhere to where they'd be able to order the crate themselves

How are they informed of the destination and the reward for bringing it there? I haven't cargoteched lately.

It's an examine on the crate atm.

I used it once to order a huge scrubber crate as an atmospheric technician. Weren't any issues aside from a short wait for cargo. Usually they aren't that prompt though. I didn't like seeing the message that a head of staff could override my order on a whim but I don't think there's enough competition to order things for that to happen at the moment. I initially wasn't aware of the system until someone mentioned it IC and it's not something that I usually think of or can think of a use for when I do. Which is not to say it isn't useful, just that if the feature were better advertised and useful crates for specific departments were better known it would receive more use. Maybe making the sprite of the console more unique, or contain text alluding to its purpose or something would draw attention to it. You could add random posters advertising useful departmental crates too (but this is probably not a realistic suggestion given the work involved).

Armhulen wrote: ↑Sat Nov 27, 2021 12:50 am It's an examine on the crate atm.

You could add an overlay to the crate that's like shiny money hologram ₵₵₵₵. Like the cursed locker sprite for lockers the locker staff the wizard has creates . Then people will know it's a paid delivery crate, that it can't be opened until it's delivered and will be enticed by how shiny and futuristic it looks into interacting with the feature. It could be in a similar style to the bounty cubes, which would be consistent and make it more intuitive.

I've made it my objective to yell loudly on the radio about departmental orders and go out of my way to teach people how to do them if nobody does after I yell.

Kilo service orders don't have a destination set for them. Across multiple rounds I've had to simply break open the crates.

Made this pr to address feedback in the thread: https://github.com/tgstation/tgstation/pull/63159

BrianBackslide wrote: ↑Thu Dec 02, 2021 10:40 am Kilo service orders don't have a destination set for them. Across multiple rounds I've had to simply break open the crates.

Will open a fix today

Appreciated! I also kinda dislike how we can't open them except in the specific location to unlock them. For instance, I ordered a butterfly crate on Delta, but if I opened it in the service hall, then they'd all scatter and I'd lose a few even if I opened and closed it quickly, when I wanted to open it in the pen I had set up for them.

Could the crates be unlocked without having to open them? Bit of an edge case, I know.

Sounds good yeah, after the feature freeze i'll add a special click to remove the delivery lock without opening

ID-locked or something?

Area locked, though sometimes it can be ID and area locked.

i feel like the cooldowns are weird, do the orders not draw from department budget already?

JusticeGoat wrote: ↑Sat Dec 04, 2021 9:33 pm i feel like the cooldowns are weird, do the orders not draw from department budget already?

I think theyre just free with cooldowns.

Rageguy505 wrote: ↑Sun Dec 05, 2021 12:26 am

JusticeGoat wrote: ↑Sat Dec 04, 2021 9:33 pm i feel like the cooldowns are weird, do the orders not draw from department budget already?

I think theyre just free with cooldowns.

Correct!

I noticed significantly less bounties being done, if any at all (on terry at least), I speculate this is due to the fact that people wanted to contribute to the stations budget and now think: "Yeah, those dudes will order crates and get a shitton of money, why bother doing bounties?". I personally would delete departmental orders if it get's people doing bounties back.

I'm not like, the biggest fan of bounties really since it is just bringing your job items to cargo and getting cash, whereas dep. orders has around the same level of depth (none) for the purchasers but gives cargo tasks to do themselves.

Armhulen wrote: ↑Fri Dec 10, 2021 8:37 pm I'm not like, the biggest fan of bounties really since it is just bringing your job items to cargo and getting cash, whereas dep. orders has around the same level of depth (none) for the purchasers but gives cargo tasks to do themselves.

Saaaame.

Some are cool (Virologist bounties!)
Some are boring as shit (Assistant bounties!)

i like em

After having played a round as acting cap where I ran around ordering freebies, they do kinda make it more obvious that Cargo needs more crates and things to order. I still don't see QMs screaming over the radio to order free stuff, and most cargonians are too lazy to even deliver the items even though they get money for it.

every time we put things into cargo some shithead ends up mapping it into the map, super frustrating.

I don't get why so many cargo players are so determined not to play cargo

It's boring. Make delivering shit cool and fun and people will want to do it more. Make loading stuff into the shuttle and stamping manifests less of a chore, too. I'd do the latter myself if I didn't think oranges was going to step on it.

cacogen wrote: ↑Sun Dec 19, 2021 11:56 pm It's boring. Make delivering shit cool and fun and people will want to do it more.

Ideas?

Armhulen wrote: ↑Mon Dec 20, 2021 8:59 am Ideas?

Add cargo specific crate wrestling. I want to body slam crates from the cargo bay onto the cargo shuttle. Since crates are limited this should be a fun way to get rid of them all

Armhulen wrote: ↑Mon Dec 20, 2021 8:59 am

cacogen wrote: ↑Sun Dec 19, 2021 11:56 pm It's boring. Make delivering shit cool and fun and people will want to do it more.

Ideas?

I was thinking a version of the slime console for loading and unloading crates as an unlockable upgrade at some point similar to the express shuttle console and maybe for delivering stuff too but I think the latter would trivialise delivery rather than enhance it and be too overpowered.

I do quite like delivering multiple crates on MetaStation using the mech you get there but it's slow and clunky. Something along those lines though. Some fun way of delivering multiple crates to different departments at once. Some sort of tethering system between crates to drag a chain of them maybe. I always wanted to make crates able to push each other to make it so that they could be moved around more efficiently but I couldn't figure out how to do it.

While I'm sharing ideas about making it so cargo jobs actually get done, I'd quite like it if the express shuttle console pods could be used to return crates too instead of just ordering them. Inevitably with that console you end up with a huge amount of crates and manifests piled up in cargo and cargo staff are usually too lazy especially that late in the shift to load them onto the shuttle and send it.

Pandarsenic wrote: ↑Sun Dec 19, 2021 9:24 pm I don't get why so many cargo players are so determined not to play cargo

Their game content keeps getting taken away and put on the maps at roundstart, it erodes the dept and leads to people picking the role to do other things rather than the original intent, honestly you can't really blame them, it's more a symptom of the issue with the job design.

also I'd rather make the mech (or a future cargo modsuit) more easy to use than an adv camera console approach.

cacogen wrote: ↑Mon Dec 20, 2021 9:25 am

Armhulen wrote: ↑Mon Dec 20, 2021 8:59 am

cacogen wrote: ↑Sun Dec 19, 2021 11:56 pm It's boring. Make delivering shit cool and fun and people will want to do it more.

Ideas?

I was thinking a version of the slime console for loading and unloading crates as an unlockable upgrade at some point similar to the express shuttle console and maybe for delivering stuff too but I think the latter would trivialise delivery rather than enhance it and be too overpowered.

I do quite like delivering multiple crates on MetaStation using the mech you get there but it's slow and clunky. Something along those lines though. Some fun way of delivering multiple crates to different departments at once. Some sort of tethering system between crates to drag a chain of them maybe. I always wanted to make crates able to push each other to make it so that they could be moved around more efficiently but I couldn't figure out how to do it.

While I'm sharing ideas about making it so cargo jobs actually get done, I'd quite like it if the express shuttle console pods could be used to return crates too instead of just ordering them. Inevitably with that console you end up with a huge amount of crates and manifests piled up in cargo and cargo staff are usually too lazy especially that late in the shift to load them onto the shuttle and send it.

tethering crates together sounds fantastic

It's time to finally make MULEs what they were meant to be: Little cars with a caterpillar trail of carts behind them that they can use to trap themselves in corners in maintenance, then scream for Engineers to free them from

It's slightly annoying how restrictive the crates are about what counts as 'delivered', like ordering stuff as a chef you have to take the crate to the lathe room to open it when it should just open in the kitchen

WineAllWine wrote: ↑Thu Dec 30, 2021 11:11 am It's slightly annoying how restrictive the crates are about what counts as 'delivered', like ordering stuff as a chef you have to take the crate to the lathe room to open it when it should just open in the kitchen

its fine on meta, anywhere else its a pain in the ass.

based, redpilled, but please change from short-long cooldown to numbers

Extremely based and redpilled, however please make it so i can see the actual number cooldowns

Visible cooldown (at least to nearest minute) would be cool.

How many ways are there (if there are multiple) to send orders, anyway?

On uh Ice Box I think you had to open medical crates in the central primary hallway instead of in medical which was cool because I'd just dump their shit outside cargo and fuck off. No, I'd actually bring it around to the opposite side of the hallway close to medbay then dump it and fuck off.

It needs a floating holographic lock symbol that's brown like cargo so you can tell at a glance "oh, it's one of these shitties, you're going to have to drag this halfway across the station for no personal gain" instead of having to examine it. Even though you'd still have to examine it for the location to bring it to. I just think it would be better if the magically locked crates had some sort of visual distinction that also hints at the mechanism that prevents them opening (e.g. being wrapped in hardlight).

You should add a handling tip like what I did with cubes, tbvh. The person who successfully opens the crate first gets like a 10% cut. Cargo personnel could use HAUL gauntlets to prevent plebs stealing their tips.