Traitors Buying Nuke Op Hardsuits

[Steelpoint]

As much as people will call me out for 'metagaming' I've found it perplexing that we've changed the system around so that traitors buying a space suit get the nuke op hardsuit sprites instead.

I dislike this because it not only causes a lot of disruptions with the round as people try and figure out if the station's being attacked by nuke ops, gets rid of a old and traditional space suit but also immersion breaking that simple traitors have access to gear that should be reserved for the syndicates special forces.

What is the exact reasoning for this change, and would there be support/opposition for it to be reverted to using the traditional traitor space suits?

[Ikarrus]

Exactly to discourage players from playing optimally all the time by adding uncertainty to it.

It is intentionally deceptive by design.

[Bombadil]

It's so people can't metagame nuke ops.

But not enough people ever buy the damn things anyway so most of the time we still know its nuke ops.

I feel like we should give all the traitors free syndicate comm dongles so Traitors could coordinate shit like that

[PKPenguin321]

iirc hardsuits are separate from syndicate space suits, you can buy either and the hardsuit costs 2 TC more
hardsuits are meant to be a metabreaker and work as intended

[Incoming]

The hardsuit also has the inbuilt jetpack that no one ever uses because the guy who made it didn't give it a verb button.

And yeah I gave it to them for the express purpose of screwing with the meta. If this bit frustrated you oh boy you don't want to look at my datum based antag stuff.

[Cheimon]

I feel like we should give all the traitors free syndicate comm dongles so Traitors could coordinate shit like that

Some guy came in with an emag?

Grab his headset, Lou, we're gonna get a list of every stupid syndie on this station.

[kevinz000]

Daily reminder that in exchange for the higher price (it costs more, right?)
NUKEOPS HARDSUITS HAVE INTEGRATED JETPACKS.

[invisty]

Remember when we had the old redsuit sprites? They had such a notoriously excellent appearance.

[Steelpoint]

No skin of my back, my encounter with a traitor with a nuke op hardsuit was when he decided to follow the strategy of blowing his way into the armoury and then get stunned by the Warden. We ended up having the shuttle called however, and this was early into the round mind you.

[RG4]

If you wanna make it deceptive then make a chameleon space suit that mimics the appearance of every space suit and not hard suits? It makes the TC cost reasonable and allows for clever deception with use of ID hiding objects. Dick around with a red space suit,change it standard, fuck around,repeat,hide,win.
Multiool for rainbow space suit.

[PKPenguin321]

lol there is seriously nothing wrong with traitors being able to buy bloodreds, i don't even see the purpose of this thread

[Steelpoint]

The equivalent would be allowing traitors to buy changeling fleshspacesuits, sure there's nothing wrong as its just a sprite change, but that equipment is not something that belongs to traitors.

The Nuke Op Hardsuits belong to the Nuke Ops.

E: Also if we end up rebalancing the Nuke Op hardsuits in the future, then traitors will also get the benefit.

[Cik]

these two things are not the same

the nuke op suit is a syndicate technology. if you're working for the syndicate why can't you have access to it?

i think it's fine. yes i would support being able to get an m90 or c20r as well probably

nothing wrong with adding a little uncertainty.

[PKPenguin321]

The equivalent would be allowing traitors to buy changeling fleshspacesuits, sure there's nothing wrong as its just a sprite change, but that equipment is not something that belongs to traitors.

The Nuke Op Hardsuits belong to the Nuke Ops.

E: Also if we end up rebalancing the Nuke Op hardsuits in the future, then traitors will also get the benefit.

The hardsuit gets an inbuilt jetpack and two modes, it's more than a sprite change
And the nuke op hardsuit is no longer JUST the nuke op hardsuit, that's the entire point of a metabreaker

[Steelpoint]

That raises another point, if Nuke Op hardsuits have a jetpack then why do the suit storage lockers have a second jetpack?

The game needs to make it obvious the hardsuits have a inbuilt jetpack, like a context action button.

[Not-Dorsidarf]

Built-in-jetpacks are basically emergency packs.

Old spacesuits are still in the game and purchaseable (and cheaper), so you should probbably amend the bit where you complain that it's deleted the proud history of big red spacesuits or whatever.

[Incoming]

You can get pretty decent distance on a filled large canister, but if you're using a standard emergency tank you'll be airless in just a few screens worth of movement, and also choking to death.

[iamgoofball]

"I can't meta ops anymore"

Yeah, no.

[Steelpoint]

"I can't meta ops anymore"

Its not hard to distinguish between a Nuke Op and a Traitor with the suit.

What I'm trying to say is that I personally preferd it when Traitors could not buy a piece of equipment that is well known as being what Nuke Ops wear, that hardsuit is what people think of when they think of Nuke Ops.

Meta has nothing to do with this, its consistency.

[Jacquerel]

Nuke Ops and Syndicate have the same employers. Pay enough TC, get some of their military surplus.
Doesn't have a huge effect on metagaming but has some effect.
No downsides here.

[Anonmare]

What is exactly the issue here? The effect on meta is not too great but exists, which is good because metaing is literally worse than Space Hitler, and it's not exactly cheap on TCs so the extra survivalbility you get from it seems justified to me. Traitors and Nuke OPs both have the same employers so it's not breaking lore (lol) and I don't see why the Syndicate would deny Traitors access to the suits it's not as though it's high level technology, like their borgs for example.

I'm really not seeing the issue, IC or OOC or otherwise.

[PKPenguin321]

Meta has nothing to do with this, its consistency.

No offense to you, steelpoint, but I don't think you're grasping the concept that the meta is consistency. When things happen consistently, they become the meta. A metabreaker breaks the meta by breaking consistency. It's the whole point.