Guardian Spirits

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onleavedontatme
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Guardian Spirits

Post by onleavedontatme » #110132

They're now in the game, adminspawn only (read: telecrystal trade).

Looking forward to any and all feedback about playing with them/as them/against them.

Powers for those curious

Shared Attributes: Manifest/recall to hide in summoner/pop out to fight, private communication verb with summoner, invincibility (but transfers damage to the summoner, and dies if they die), limited range (pulled back to the summoner if they attempt to go too far).

Standard: Generic simple animal, does high melee damage, strong damage resist, can destroy unreinforced walls. Can set a battlecry to shout repeatedly on attack (default being ATATATATATATATATAT)

Fast: Same as the standard, but OLDSPEED, less damage resist, can't break walls, no battlecry

Shield: 100% damage resist, can't attack

Scout: Can't attack, very low damage resist, can move through walls/has infinite range

Fire: Ignites mobs when it bumps into them. Won't ignite it's summoner.

Bluespace: Fires teleport bolts, teleports mobs and objects on attack

Healer: Can't deal damage, heals on attack

Explosive: Can turn any object into a bomb by shift clicking it (with a cooldown). The next person to touch that object will set it off (will revert if not touched after a while, examining objects while close enough reveals they've been rigged).

Ranged: Spams very weak projectiles at very high speed.
Last edited by onleavedontatme on Tue Aug 18, 2015 8:17 am, edited 6 times in total.
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invisty
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Re: Guardian Spirits

Post by invisty » #110139

These sound cool as fuck, more so if the guardian player is good at RP. I'll throw in an order if I ever actually roll traitor.
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Re: Guardian Spirits

Post by rdght91 » #110156

What sort of powers do they have?
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Re: Guardian Spirits

Post by Amelius » #110188

'Guardian Spirits'

Can we stop pretending and just called them stands? Anyways, I totally missed the round, but it sounds cool.
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Re: Guardian Spirits

Post by Alex Crimson » #110213

Add a "fury" one that has little/no attack delay...

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Re: Guardian Spirits

Post by Montyblancs » #110236

Played a round with the healer spirit, helped me in my futile attempts to destroy the AI for that sweet sweet greentext and ended up bringing me back from crit about 3 times. Died on the escape shuttle to the fire spirit because the fire damage from that thing is stupidly high.

My spirit was talking to me before, but I hucked the deck of cards I pulled it from while panicking in some singulo wreckage, and after that it didn't say a word. Is it's voice tied to that, or did it just decide to stop talking to me?
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Re: Guardian Spirits

Post by Pybro » #110273

Fire needs some fixing. Maybe lower the amount of fire it sets you on? Or make the ignite on hit?

Also, how does the teleport Guardia work? Do the bolts just teleport randomly ala blink/hand tele/RD's armor?
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Re: Guardian Spirits

Post by Ricotez » #110274

Image

Good addition, can't wait to see it work in-game.
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Re: Guardian Spirits

Post by onleavedontatme » #110275

Amelius wrote:'Guardian Spirits'

Can we stop pretending and just called them stands? Anyways, I totally missed the round, but it sounds cool.
Dunno what you're talking about this is an an ORIGINAL GHOST DO NOT STEAL. If you wanna call them stands that's kind weird but cool I guess??
Montyblancs wrote: Is it's voice tied to that, or did it just decide to stop talking to me?
Stopped talking for some reason.
Pybro wrote:Fire needs some fixing. Maybe lower the amount of fire it sets you on? Or make the ignite on hit?

Also, how does the teleport Guardia work? Do the bolts just teleport randomly ala blink/hand tele/RD's armor?
Yeah it needs to deal way less damage. I'm having trouble balancing these because of their weird "if they get hit the summoner dies" mechanic. Don't want them to do so little damage as to just be a liability, but right now the fire one is over the top.

Also hard because I want to give them somewhat unique mechanics (like the bomb one), but interesting and strange often ends up overpowered. Still not sure whether this is meant to entirely replace an antags kit or supplement it either. How many TC/genomes would someone pay for one of these (when there is an appropriately tech themed version for the traitor, that is).

Teleport does it randomly, yeah.
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Re: Guardian Spirits

Post by Incomptinence » #110277

Call em punchghosts.
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Re: Guardian Spirits

Post by Screemonster » #111027

[youtube]g-njtZmmUw4[/youtube]

Seriously though this sounds like a blast.
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Re: Guardian Spirits

Post by Mister_Doc » #111039

Image

Seriously though this is a neat addition that I totally won't use every time I can.
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Re: Guardian Spirits

Post by ExplosiveCrate » #111062

Can the Stand user/Stand itself name the Stand, or do they have generic/randomized names?
i dont even know what the context for my signature was
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Re: Guardian Spirits

Post by Incomptinence » #111110

Wasn't there a time stop chem reaction being worked on a while back?

So you could just plop that into one of these and have za warudo?
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Re: Guardian Spirits

Post by Bombadil » #111153

Incomptinence wrote:Wasn't there a time stop chem reaction being worked on a while back?

So you could just plop that into one of these and have za warudo?
>He doesn't know Time Stop is already in the game

Although you can't hurt someone directly has to be lasers shot into the time bubbles
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Re: Guardian Spirits

Post by Mister_Doc » #111156

Cream's ability would be so OP. Just walking along when suddenly BZZZT, vaporized. Chef should totally be able to get Pearl Jam and make superfood.
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Re: Guardian Spirits

Post by callanrockslol » #111170

Fuck spacemans can we be JoJo in space already.

Anubis when?
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Re: Guardian Spirits

Post by Incomptinence » #111174

Bombadil wrote:
Incomptinence wrote:Wasn't there a time stop chem reaction being worked on a while back?

So you could just plop that into one of these and have za warudo?
>He doesn't know Time Stop is already in the game

Although you can't hurt someone directly has to be lasers shot into the time bubbles
I know it is in so I am perplexed as to why it isn't being used.
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Re: Guardian Spirits

Post by callanrockslol » #111198

Incomptinence wrote:
Bombadil wrote:
Incomptinence wrote:Wasn't there a time stop chem reaction being worked on a while back?

So you could just plop that into one of these and have za warudo?
>He doesn't know Time Stop is already in the game

Although you can't hurt someone directly has to be lasers shot into the time bubbles
I know it is in so I am perplexed as to why it isn't being used.
It doesn't properly account for posturing or monologs yet.
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Re: Guardian Spirits

Post by onleavedontatme » #112190

No guardians have timestop because it's an uncounterable instant AoE stun.

Which I can vaguely justify by saying "science has to farm 30 minutes to get a limited supply" but it'd be too strong as an innate ability on an unstunnable mob.

Anyway has anyone actually gotten to play with these yet?
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Re: Guardian Spirits

Post by Incomptinence » #112191

I used the fire one yesterday. Seems pretty tame as it couldn't beat the det and the hos to death when they came after me on a tip off from another syndicate.
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Re: Guardian Spirits

Post by onleavedontatme » #112195

Incomptinence wrote:I used the fire one yesterday. Seems pretty tame as it couldn't beat the det and the hos to death when they came after me on a tip off from another syndicate.
I think I probably overnerfed it after the rampage Pybro was mentioning where I killed ~20 people in escape just running in circles igniting all of them.

Melee damage is only 10 right now, definitely should be a bit higher, or the firestack spread upped again.
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Re: Guardian Spirits

Post by ChangelingRain » #112196

Kor wrote:
Incomptinence wrote:I used the fire one yesterday. Seems pretty tame as it couldn't beat the det and the hos to death when they came after me on a tip off from another syndicate.
I think I probably overnerfed it after the rampage Pybro was mentioning where I killed ~20 people in escape just running in circles igniting all of them.

Melee damage is only 10 right now, definitely should be a bit higher, or the firestack spread upped again.
How about making it give firestacks on bump but only ignite on melee attacks, so you have to hit and bump someone to burn them?
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Re: Guardian Spirits

Post by PKPenguin321 » #112197

i had the opportunity to have one of these a while back in an admin event where i had to assassinate a few other people who also had guardian spirits.
spirits are totally fucking radical, and the battles i had with other people with their own spirits were super cinematic. summon magic should have a chance of giving 4~ people guardian spirits, along with making them have objectives to kill each other.

something you could fix: when i spoke telepathically to my spirit, i had no way of telling if he could hear me or not since my own message did not show up in my chat box.
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Re: Guardian Spirits

Post by Incomptinence » #112237

Message shows up now. Does armor interact with fire stacks didn't mention it but the hos never even caught on fire despite repeated hits.
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Re: Guardian Spirits

Post by whodaloo » #112868

this might be a bit late but these things are fucking dope as hell
i dunno if they're really strong or i just got a robust spirit but it was hilarious to play with
i love public logs
Spoiler:
SAY: Kolt Saudwell/RedMcCloud : Beacuse
SAY: Kolt Saudwell/RedMcCloud : ((im banned))

SAY: Zack Bodast/Logman : Hos
SAY: Zack Bodast/Logman : Can i bang you]
SAY: Zack Bodast/Logman : ]plras
SAY: Zack Bodast/Logman : R; I WROTE THIS SOMG FOR YOU HOS

SAY: Bryce Pax/IcePacks : I THINK I WAS A LITTLE HASTY IN GIVING THE CREW ACCESS TO THE ARMORY

Lusty Xenomorph Maid begins to clean the telescopic baton with the soap...

[Common] Garrett Larson says, "How do i shot pod"

OOC: Zoey Webb/Firecage : WHodaloo, why are you so fucking aggressive against me
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Re: Guardian Spirits

Post by Cobby » #112871

> See Guardian Spirit Murderboning at escape
> DANG THIS THING IS ROBUST
> Goes into space to protect itself
> Shuttle Arrives
> Guardian kills its master because it was on a tile where the shuttle spawned

10/10 Bananas This was hilarious :honkman: :honkman: :honkman:
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Re: Guardian Spirits

Post by EndgamerAzari » #112915

What if the summoner gets knocked out? Could you theoretically sit in a cryo tube and let your guardian beat the crap out of everyone nearby while you heal the damage?
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Re: Guardian Spirits

Post by whodaloo » #112916

EndgamerAzari wrote:What if the summoner gets knocked out? Could you theoretically sit in a cryo tube and let your guardian beat the crap out of everyone nearby while you heal the damage?
your spirit is still alive & can move while you're in cit yeah
the problem is the spirit is a simple animal so you can't activate cyro
i love public logs
Spoiler:
SAY: Kolt Saudwell/RedMcCloud : Beacuse
SAY: Kolt Saudwell/RedMcCloud : ((im banned))

SAY: Zack Bodast/Logman : Hos
SAY: Zack Bodast/Logman : Can i bang you]
SAY: Zack Bodast/Logman : ]plras
SAY: Zack Bodast/Logman : R; I WROTE THIS SOMG FOR YOU HOS

SAY: Bryce Pax/IcePacks : I THINK I WAS A LITTLE HASTY IN GIVING THE CREW ACCESS TO THE ARMORY

Lusty Xenomorph Maid begins to clean the telescopic baton with the soap...

[Common] Garrett Larson says, "How do i shot pod"

OOC: Zoey Webb/Firecage : WHodaloo, why are you so fucking aggressive against me
OOC: Engineer Donkin/Whodaloo : i have no idea what you're talking about chief
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Re: Guardian Spirits

Post by newfren » #112936

whodaloo wrote:
EndgamerAzari wrote:What if the summoner gets knocked out? Could you theoretically sit in a cryo tube and let your guardian beat the crap out of everyone nearby while you heal the damage?
your spirit is still alive & can move while you're in cit yeah
the problem is the spirit is a simple animal so you can't activate cyro
Although you totally could walk yourself into cryo and have your spirit kill everyone in medbay over and over.
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Re: Guardian Spirits

Post by Cik » #112942

what's the going rate in tc for these things anyway? they are very strong.

i like them though, haven't used one but they seem neat.
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Re: Guardian Spirits

Post by Mister_Doc » #112944

I would love to see these be sprinkled in at round start to antags and nonantags, just for kicks
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Re: Guardian Spirits

Post by rdght91 » #112945

The concept is cool, but I think they should more able to do things like scramble cameras, (weakly) stun/make people temporally drunk, hack open doors, make lights go out, make invisible walls, weak protective barriers or auras around their charge, unstun/uncuff their charge, turn off internals, that sort of thing, and be unable to directly attack people. It makes them a better asset to more unusual traitor styles and less useful to murderboning, and it'd be kinda cooler to have a ghost mess with you by turning off your internals, locking in you a hazardous area if you're going after the traitor/are his target rather than punching you death.
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Re: Guardian Spirits

Post by whodaloo » #112946

i traded for mine for 17 tc
the next traitor round i got no response for my prayers for one sooooo
i love public logs
Spoiler:
SAY: Kolt Saudwell/RedMcCloud : Beacuse
SAY: Kolt Saudwell/RedMcCloud : ((im banned))

SAY: Zack Bodast/Logman : Hos
SAY: Zack Bodast/Logman : Can i bang you]
SAY: Zack Bodast/Logman : ]plras
SAY: Zack Bodast/Logman : R; I WROTE THIS SOMG FOR YOU HOS

SAY: Bryce Pax/IcePacks : I THINK I WAS A LITTLE HASTY IN GIVING THE CREW ACCESS TO THE ARMORY

Lusty Xenomorph Maid begins to clean the telescopic baton with the soap...

[Common] Garrett Larson says, "How do i shot pod"

OOC: Zoey Webb/Firecage : WHodaloo, why are you so fucking aggressive against me
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One Seven One
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Re: Guardian Spirits

Post by One Seven One » #112953

I got to play one of these in a traitor round and again in the wizard round right after.
I have to say being a guardian is fun as hell.

I really think they need a way to tell how much health their master has so they don't accidentally kill them and maybe for the punching ghosts they need to be incapable of attacking their own master/themselves so they don't accidentally kill them in a fight.

Maybe the guardian also needs a way to bring its master out of crit? Not from a full heal but just enough that they can get their master on their feet, maybe even have it on a long charge time so they can't do it in the middle of a fight and would have to risk being found.
Possibly with downsides like locking yourself from Manifesting/recalling for a while or a self sacrifice.
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EndgamerAzari
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Re: Guardian Spirits

Post by EndgamerAzari » #112958

A non-combat guardian that can upgrade machines, emag them, or give you temporary access by punching them would be pretty sweet.
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Re: Guardian Spirits

Post by callanrockslol » #112968

Just start at part 3 of JoJo's if you haven't already and start stealing shit from there if you have no ideas.
  • Improve food
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    Possess vehicles and turn them into punch ghost robots
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    Electric thing that randomly charges things around it, causes things nearby to go haywire and occasionally shocks people a little
    Electric thing that can posses machines and stuff
    Inter-dimensional fishing rod that can be used to grab random joke items and a sentient carp or something
    An infinite can of lemon lime soda that can leave the can in the form of a lemon lime punch ghost and flood stuff
    Miniature Nar-Sie
The most excessive signature on /tg/station13.

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Deitus
Joined: Tue Feb 17, 2015 5:26 pm
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Re: Guardian Spirits

Post by Deitus » #112977

really hoping that these will be made available to antags, normal taters/DAs wouldnt really fit from an rp perspective (though it'd still be awesome) but maybe cultists? as for cost my 2 cents is that it should be 20, unless they get huge nerfs they're pretty fucking good weapons/companions even if the stand isnt that robust, with a good player it'd be worth more.

also an idea: a kind of "physical" stand that cannot attack but can become...er, physical i suppose for a time, in which they can open doors/retrieve items/etc for their masters (for example, hitting the switch to break them out of perma or grabbing something from the armory for them). this would need to be limited in some way obviously, whether through range, duration, cooldown, or all of the above, but if implemented properly this could be a neat addition imo.
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onleavedontatme
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Re: Guardian Spirits

Post by onleavedontatme » #112991

Based on some feedback (the ones that can't attack are no fun, more utility would be nice, some are too weak, etc) I've merged the ranged and scout guardians, and given it a new ability. It can now deploy surveillance traps which give it a notice when a mob walks over it.

https://github.com/tgstation/-tg-station/pull/11262

Hopefully all of them will have a fun set of powers eventually now that the basic concept has been proven fun for most people. I realize some of the ones I churned out initially are a bit lacking/dull.
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Re: Guardian Spirits

Post by onleavedontatme » #113216

Also these things might be incredibly short lived if I can't come up to a solution to "replace blood with sulfazine, let your ghost punch everything"
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DemonFiren
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Re: Guardian Spirits

Post by DemonFiren » #113264

Well, if you can make burn, toxin, and maybe suffocation damage transfer to the host you'll need to replace your blood with some other chemicals, too.
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non-lizard things:
Spoiler:
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whodaloo
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Re: Guardian Spirits

Post by whodaloo » #113309

maybe just not let your hp increase while your spirit is out of you
i dunno how hard that would be to code though
i love public logs
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SAY: Kolt Saudwell/RedMcCloud : ((im banned))

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DemonFiren
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Re: Guardian Spirits

Post by DemonFiren » #113329

That would kinda defeat the point of healers.
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non-lizard things:
Spoiler:
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whodaloo
Joined: Sun Nov 02, 2014 2:49 am
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Re: Guardian Spirits

Post by whodaloo » #113350

well then make an exception for that one
i love public logs
Spoiler:
SAY: Kolt Saudwell/RedMcCloud : Beacuse
SAY: Kolt Saudwell/RedMcCloud : ((im banned))

SAY: Zack Bodast/Logman : Hos
SAY: Zack Bodast/Logman : Can i bang you]
SAY: Zack Bodast/Logman : ]plras
SAY: Zack Bodast/Logman : R; I WROTE THIS SOMG FOR YOU HOS

SAY: Bryce Pax/IcePacks : I THINK I WAS A LITTLE HASTY IN GIVING THE CREW ACCESS TO THE ARMORY

Lusty Xenomorph Maid begins to clean the telescopic baton with the soap...

[Common] Garrett Larson says, "How do i shot pod"

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onleavedontatme
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Re: Guardian Spirits

Post by onleavedontatme » #113402

whodaloo wrote:maybe just not let your hp increase while your spirit is out of you
i dunno how hard that would be to code though
The human mob actually does not track the guardian at all. I was careful to avoid any checks for the punchghosts in human processing because adding snowflake checks for my weeb garbage to every human for every tick of the game would probably violate every coding standard we have.
Incomptinence
Joined: Fri May 02, 2014 3:01 am
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Re: Guardian Spirits

Post by Incomptinence » #113449

Maybe the chem in question is too strong and should be removed I dunno not like chem is short on toys.
newfren
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Re: Guardian Spirits

Post by newfren » #113466

Incomptinence wrote:Maybe the chem in question is too strong and should be removed I dunno not like chem is short on toys.
The check in question (styptic powder) is the only thing chemistry can make that reliably heals brute damage. Honestly styptic powder and silver sulfadiazine just need to process faster so you can't make yourself immune to melee damage for 5 minutes like you can currently.
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Re: Guardian Spirits

Post by onleavedontatme » #119851

Based on feedback and my own experience, healer and shield are fucking boring to play as. The most interesting to play (in my opinion) is the Ranged/Scout because it has utility other than just murdering things. With that in mind, I am reworking the guardians as follows.

Standard - Unchanged

Chaos- Combines Fire and Bluespace. Teleports targets on hit as well as igniting mobs on touch/bump. Will auto-extinguish its user every tick.

Ranged/Scout - Unchanged since they got combined.

Support - Can toggle between healing and combat mode (healing attacks/slow vs normal attacks/normal speed). Can mark a turf/leave a beacon and warp mobs/objects to it on shift+click (after a standing still delay twice as long as handcuffs). Hopefully kidnapping shenanigans.

Explosive - Unchanged.


So Healer got a new power/toggle to combat, Fire/Bluespace got merged, Fast and Shield got axed (for being redundant and boring, respectively).

Any additional suggestions/feedback before the PR/while its under review would be appreciated.
onleavedontatme
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Re: Guardian Spirits

Post by onleavedontatme » #119890

I'd also like to give them a test run in the traitor PDA soonish, I'm thinking at around 10-12 telecrystals so the traitor themselves isn't left naked. Would prefer to have a tech themed set of sprites first though, can't imagine paranormal things in the PDA will be very well received.
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Ricotez
Joined: Thu Apr 17, 2014 9:21 pm
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Re: Guardian Spirits

Post by Ricotez » #119913

they're not paranormal, they're a manifestation of your soul's power that comes out if you strike a fabulous pose
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