/tg/Station 13

There are people who only play Captain, HOP, Chemist, Xenobiology, Security. But when you do this with antags it's suddenly a heinous crime? It doesn't make sense.
Why is antag rolling such a big deal? If someone only wants to play when antag, who cares if he suicides as assistant roundstart? Would he have had a great positive impact on the round had he not suicided? No.
Antag rolling is a victimless crime, and is way less severe than blatant griefing, metacomms, metagrudging ,yet admins seem to treat antag rolling as something blasphemous.
I'm not sure why we have to just "accept" that antag rolling is bad, nobody can ever logically prove it's a bad thing. This is definitely a rule that needs an update.

because you're wasting a job slot
because you're suggesting you cant have fun normally only if you get antag
because you're lowering the odds someone who's playing and rolling for antag fairly will get it
because suiciding roundstart is lame and puts a little bit of a damper on things when people see it

In Among Us terms, it's like disconnecting when you don't get to become the IMPOSTER, and you instead always play as the crewmate. If everyone immediately disconnected from the server when they didn't get to become the IMPOSTER, then we'd have no crewmates. And, if we had no crewmates, who would the IMPOSTER kill? Playing the crew is equally as important as playing the antagonist, otherwise who does the antagonist antagonize?

>wasting a job slot
There is no cap on assistants.
>you're suggesting you can't have fun normally
So what if I can't have fun normally? How is that relevant to anything?
>lowering odds
TG doesn't have antag rep, it's completely random, there is no fairness to the system.
>suiciding roundstart is lame
It's a fucking LRP server bro who cares. Go to Bay if you want immersion.

@san7890
This is understandable if done on Manuel. But if I antag roll on Terry with 90 players, nobody is going to notice, it's a drop in the bucket. Antag rolling as a bald assistant is no different to just observing roundstart and waiting for ghost role antags.

san7890 wrote: ↑Mon Jul 25, 2022 11:36 pm In Among Us terms, it's like disconnecting when you don't get to become the IMPOSTER, and you instead always play as the crewmate. If everyone immediately disconnected from the server when they didn't get to become the IMPOSTER, then we'd have no crewmates. And, if we had no crewmates, who would the IMPOSTER kill? Playing the crew is equally as important as playing the antagonist, otherwise who does the antagonist antagonize?

sorry can someone put this in fortnite terms I still dont understand

blackdav123 wrote: ↑Mon Jul 25, 2022 11:39 pm -snip-

sorry can someone put this in fortnite terms I still dont understand

Okay, let's say that you love landing at TOMATO TOWN, and do not like landing at DIRTY DOCKS. However, sometimes, the BATTLE BUS doesn't go over TOMATO TOWN. Met with a TOMATO TOWN-less future, you disconnect from the game. Now, what if everyone disconnected from the game because they wouldn't get TOMATO TOWN? Then, there would not be much of a game to play for those who land at DIRTY DOCKS, since everyone else would have disconnected. You get plenty of BATTLE ROYALES, but you don't really get an increase in skill or a "full" game, it's a husk of itself.

Antag rolling is a "tragedy of the commons" scenario, and it's best to just make it to get the people who can not handle DIRTY DOCKS rounds out of there. I hope that helps.

itsswagga wrote: ↑Mon Jul 25, 2022 11:39 pm -snip-

@san7890
This is understandable if done on Manuel. But if I antag roll on Terry with 90 players, nobody is going to notice, it's a drop in the bucket. Antag rolling as a bald assistant is no different to just observing roundstart and waiting for ghost role antags.

This isn't a great argument if one were to connect to all four servers at the same time and suicide on the other three if they get antag on the one of them. It still affects all four servers in some manner.

san7890 wrote: ↑Mon Jul 25, 2022 11:43 pm Antag rolling is a "tragedy of the commons" scenario, and it's best to just make it to get the people who can not handle DIRTY DOCKS rounds out of there. I hope that helps.

I'm sorry San, I actually don't play fortinite or Amongus, could you please explain this in Minecraft terms?

itsswagga wrote: ↑Mon Jul 25, 2022 11:39 pm >wasting a job slot
There is no cap on assistants.
>you're suggesting you can't have fun normally
So what if I can't have fun normally? How is that relevant to anything?
>lowering odds
TG doesn't have antag rep, it's completely random, there is no fairness to the system.
>suiciding roundstart is lame
It's a fucking LRP server bro who cares. Go to Bay if you want immersion.

@san7890
This is understandable if done on Manuel. But if I antag roll on Terry with 90 players, nobody is going to notice, it's a drop in the bucket. Antag rolling as a bald assistant is no different to just observing roundstart and waiting for ghost role antags.

ok lets say you allow it. antag rolling is allowed. now what happens when 30 people start joining as assistant to do this almost ritualistically to antag roll? the "drop in the bucket" argument fails because doing something shitty that only becomes shitty when everyone does it doesnt make it any less fuckin shitty

i can throw my trash out my car window onto the street and it wont really make a difference. its just me! a drop in the bucket. ok but if everyone did this our city would be covered in trash so it's still shitty and shouldn't be allowed to prevent lots of people from doing it

if you cant have fun normally it's relevant to the fact that you're probably burned out on the game as it is and if the ONLY possible way you can have fun is by rolling antag and killing people to end their fun then youre not making a positive impact on the server

Sightld2 wrote: ↑Mon Jul 25, 2022 11:49 pm -snip-

I'm sorry San, I actually don't play fortinite or Amongus, could you please explain this in Minecraft terms?

Alright, have you played the popular Minecraft game mode BED WARS? Let's say that you really like playing as Red on whatever BED WARS map. However, this time you get Blue, which you don't like playing as on this BED WARS map. You don't think you'll get the epic victory, so you disconnect as Blue. If everyone who got blue were to disconnect, whose bed would the Red Team on BED WARS destroy? It would have little/no wool protection, no fun around chasing down people with TNT, it's just laughably easy.

If you don't play bed wars then just imagine you spawn in a desert when you really wanted something nice like a taiga forest, so you immediately delete the world until you get a Taiga Forest. That... what the fuck is this analogy? Just pretend like your eating up the amount of worlds that'll spawn you in the desert and then all the speedrunners who love spawning in the desert will suffer even more in your quest to find a taiga. sometimes you just gotta start in the desert and find a better spot

itsswagga wrote: ↑Mon Jul 25, 2022 11:39 pm >you're suggesting you can't have fun normally
So what if I can't have fun normally? How is that relevant to anything?

If you can't have fun as a non-antagonist you should reconsider playing the game. It's a roleplaying game, not a competitive one.

itsswagga wrote: ↑Mon Jul 25, 2022 11:39 pm >lowering odds
TG doesn't have antag rep, it's completely random, there is no fairness to the system.

A completely random system is the fairest one. Random chances always average out after a large enough data set.

itsswagga wrote: ↑Mon Jul 25, 2022 11:39 pm >suiciding roundstart is lame
It's a fucking LRP server bro who cares. Go to Bay if you want immersion.

LRP means low roleplay. Roleplay. You still have to do it, it's not an NRP server. We care.

This is tangentially related so im Using this as an excuse to drop my take that roundstart suicide in a vacuum should NOT be policed ama

wesoda25 wrote: ↑Tue Jul 26, 2022 12:08 am This is tangentially related so im Using this as an excuse to drop my take that roundstart suicide in a vacuum should NOT be policed ama

It already largely isn't, I thought. Any recent examples (appeals) come up regarding this?

itsswagga wrote: ↑Mon Jul 25, 2022 11:26 pm There are people who only play Captain, HOP, Chemist, Xenobiology, Security. But when you do this with antags it's suddenly a heinous crime? It doesn't make sense.
Why is antag rolling such a big deal? If someone only wants to play when antag, who cares if he suicides as assistant roundstart? Would he have had a great positive impact on the round had he not suicided? No.
Antag rolling is a victimless crime, and is way less severe than blatant griefing, metacomms, metagrudging ,yet admins seem to treat antag rolling as something blasphemous.
I'm not sure why we have to just "accept" that antag rolling is bad, nobody can ever logically prove it's a bad thing. This is definitely a rule that needs an update.

Do you really need us to explain how sitting on Basil, Sybil and Terry simultaneously round after round after round decreases the opportunities for your fellow players to roll antagonist?

(Because that's what you were doing.)

If you're clearly only playing the game to play antagonist, you aren't enjoying the game for what it is.

Antag bans for antag rollers are a good way to "suggest" they learn or experience a new aspect of the game than only playing antagonist. If they don't even connect a single day while antag banned, then well, maybe there's better servers for them?

mrmelbert wrote: ↑Tue Jul 26, 2022 12:52 am If you're clearly only playing the game to play antagonist, you aren't enjoying the game for what it is.

Antag bans for antag rollers are a good way to "suggest" they learn or experience a new aspect of the game than only playing antagonist. If they don't even connect a single day while antag banned, then well, maybe there's better servers for them?

Admins should be able to issue antag bans that only count down for living time played lol, imagine the antag roller salt.

BeeSting12 wrote: ↑Tue Jul 26, 2022 5:43 am

mrmelbert wrote: ↑Tue Jul 26, 2022 12:52 am If you're clearly only playing the game to play antagonist, you aren't enjoying the game for what it is.

Antag bans for antag rollers are a good way to "suggest" they learn or experience a new aspect of the game than only playing antagonist. If they don't even connect a single day while antag banned, then well, maybe there's better servers for them?

Admins should be able to issue antag bans that only count down for living time played lol, imagine the antag roller salt.

Best idea of the year tbh

Pandarsenic wrote: ↑Tue Jul 26, 2022 10:52 am

BeeSting12 wrote: ↑Tue Jul 26, 2022 5:43 am

mrmelbert wrote: ↑Tue Jul 26, 2022 12:52 am If you're clearly only playing the game to play antagonist, you aren't enjoying the game for what it is.

Antag bans for antag rollers are a good way to "suggest" they learn or experience a new aspect of the game than only playing antagonist. If they don't even connect a single day while antag banned, then well, maybe there's better servers for them?

Admins should be able to issue antag bans that only count down for living time played lol, imagine the antag roller salt.

Best idea of the year tbh

Imagine this existing for every role. That would just be devilish.

itsswagga wrote: ↑Mon Jul 25, 2022 11:26 pm There are people who only play Captain, HOP, Chemist, Xenobiology, Security. But when you do this with antags it's suddenly a heinous crime? It doesn't make sense.
Why is antag rolling such a big deal? If someone only wants to play when antag, who cares if he suicides as assistant roundstart? Would he have had a great positive impact on the round had he not suicided? No.
Antag rolling is a victimless crime, and is way less severe than blatant griefing, metacomms, metagrudging ,yet admins seem to treat antag rolling as something blasphemous.
I'm not sure why we have to just "accept" that antag rolling is bad, nobody can ever logically prove it's a bad thing. This is definitely a rule that needs an update.

yeah you're right it doesn't harm anybody HOWEVER imagine if more then 50% of the server antag rolled just imagine, the server would be of less quality if it became encouraged & more frequent it could actually harm the server. plus its also because whoever wrote the rules (probably mso) wants to discourage people from doing this and encourage people to play the game.

mad that you didn't get roundstart tot?

just wait for midround sleeper and find something to do in the meantime if that doesn't work for you then don't play thats my advice

Of course it harms people, it reduces everyone's chances of being antag.

If a round has 10 people + 10 people who only roll antag and suicide then those 10 people actually playing have their roundstart antag chances halved.

CPTANT wrote: ↑Tue Jul 26, 2022 12:18 pm If a round has 10 people + 10 people who only roll antag and suicide then those 10 people actually playing have their roundstart antag chances halved.

Man shocked into complete silence at the statistical disproving of his entire argument.

mrmelbert wrote: ↑Tue Jul 26, 2022 12:52 am If you're clearly only playing the game to play antagonist, you aren't enjoying the game for what it is.

Antag bans for antag rollers are a good way to "suggest" they learn or experience a new aspect of the game than only playing antagonist. If they don't even connect a single day while antag banned, then well, maybe there's better servers for them?

Banning will continue until morale improves.
Now enjoy this new Orange Merge which removes all powers from genetics, so there's literally no reason to play it and the department is finally balanced.

itsswagga wrote: ↑Mon Jul 25, 2022 11:39 pm
@san7890
This is understandable if done on Manuel. But if I antag roll on Terry with 90 players, nobody is going to notice, it's a drop in the bucket. Antag rolling as a bald assistant is no different to just observing roundstart and waiting for ghost role antags.

Even with 90 people, you're decreasing the chances of other players rolling antag by at least 1%. Probably even more because not everyone rolls for antag. If you ever played a MOBA you'd know even a 1% proc is pretty significant over long enough timelines. So in other words, grow up man. You negatively affected the game for other people. It's fine. We all make mistakes, but you should own up to it. You don't have to admit it to anyone else but you should at least internally acknowledge what you did was wrong from a fair play standpoint.

itsswagga wrote: ↑Mon Jul 25, 2022 11:26 pm -snip-

Please play another game that has constant action you silly silly person.

I have a IC solution, every antag roll should cost you your corporeal soul unless you win against Nanotransen so you can never play in the round again afterwards.

FantasticFwoosh wrote: ↑Sat Jul 30, 2022 9:00 am I have a IC solution, every antag roll should cost you your corporeal soul unless you win against Nanotransen so you can never play in the round again afterwards.

What?

If you knew, the HOP's employment file cabinet contents goes into detail about this specifically. Come on, how many hours do you have and you can't even slam the buzzer on specific trivia.

If you knew, it's actually the lawyer's employment file cabinet contents goes into detail about this specifically. Come on, how many hours do you have and you can't even slam the buzzer on specific trivia.

This Segway is making me miss devil mode.

It was a real progression antag. Should come back for MRP. With wackier contracts.