Killing Floor 2

Cheridan · Post by **Cheridan** » Mon Apr 20, 2015 2:24 pm #82950

Someone gave me a beta key and I played a whole two hours before the servers shut down and then another hour solo since I still had the game running and wanted to try the rest of the perks FUCK THE POLICE ask me anything.

Early Access opens on Tuesday 21st apparently.

http://wiki.tripwireinteractive.com/ind ... ng_Floor_2 They've got a wiki up with basically nothing on it.

Current classes include the classic Support / Medic / Commando / Berserker and will eventually include all the old perks as well as new ones like SWAT and Martial Artist.

Steelpoint · Post by **Steelpoint** » Mon Apr 20, 2015 2:27 pm #82953

Great game from what little I've played of it. I really enjoy how they expanded the Medic class with a wider array of versatile guns, as well as the auto-lock on healing dart.

Timbrewolf · Post by **Timbrewolf** » Mon Apr 20, 2015 2:37 pm #82954

Do want.

Cheridan · Post by **Cheridan** » Mon Apr 20, 2015 2:48 pm #82956

Steelpoint wrote:Great game from what little I've played of it. I really enjoy how they expanded the Medic class with a wider array of versatile guns, as well as the auto-lock on healing dart.

Yeah, I think what they're doing with KF2 is trying to make the perks feel less "boxed-in". There aren't any perk discounts now, so you can grab an off-perk gun now for backup/versatility if you feel like.

Berserkers are more credit to team now, since parrying and their EMP grenades will de-rage Scrakes and Fleshpounds.
I like that Supports are actually supporty now, with the skill that lets you pass out ammo. In KF1 it just kind of felt like they couldn't think of a better name for "Weldy Shotgun Man"

The one change I noticed that I don't like is that doors don't get repaired between waves like in KF1. So if you weld something and it gets knocked down, RIP for the rest of the match. In the admittedly few games I played it didn't seem like anyone cared about welding at all, when it was a pretty big part of KF1 strategy.

QuartzCrystal · Mon Apr 20, 2015 3:43 pm

Anything else you've noticed that's different for better or worse?

Steelpoint · Post by **Steelpoint** » Mon Apr 20, 2015 4:11 pm #82962

Well as Cheridan noted the game has tried to make buying guns more versatile, instead of KF1 where your perk heavily defined what guns you can take, this time around its very viable for you to buy a off perk weapon. Overall though everything is just taking the first game and updating and improving it to a greater extent.

A few misc things I'll mention.

Zed spawns tend to be somewhat more aggressive from what I've seen, you can have very large groups of high levels zeds spawn just behind a door your running through. Somewhat discourages running and gunning to a extent.

Higher difficulty levels are better balanced, instead of KF1 where enemies are made into bullet sponges in KF2 Zeds retain the same amount of health they do on lower difficulties, but they get better attacks and unique movement/attack sets (Such as sprinting attacks or what not).

Whenever Scrakes or Fleshpounders enter the map a global sound is played indicating their arrival, essentially said Zed making a very loud and ominous sound. Alerts you to their arrival but it tends to eliminate some tension, so its less likely for you to be shocked on turning a corner and seeing a Scrake.

Fully levelling up a perk is not as insanely long as it took in the first game. Also playing on higher difficulty settings grants you a lot more XP than on lower settings. So if you want to power through ranks try and play on Hard or Suicidal if you can/are capable.

I was quite surprised to see some good customization of characters. This means there's quite a bit of flavour between different players. From serious soldiers to flamboyancy.

EndgamerAzari · Mon Apr 20, 2015 4:22 pm

Sounds promising. Glad my six-year-old PC will be able to run it, at least on minimum settings.

miggles · Post by **miggles** » Mon Apr 20, 2015 11:44 pm #83018

everyone take a look at the EULA
its a bit offputting but i still have high hopes for this game and will probably buy it tomorrow anyway

Cheridan · Post by **Cheridan** » Tue Apr 21, 2015 1:09 am #83026

miggles wrote:everyone take a look at the EULA
its a bit offputting but i still have high hopes for this game and will probably buy it tomorrow anyway

Which parts are you referring to?

When you paid for Killing Floor 2 you did not actually buy the game. What you bought was a license to use the software that comprises the game and its related materials.

This?
Because my understanding is that's basically the case with everything you buy on Steam.

This part did stand out to me:

Your Mods must not contain any sexually explicit, harmful, threatening, abusive, obscene [...]

You mean like naked zombie women getting decapitated, lit on fire, and then blown to smitheerens? Because that would just be awful and unheard of.

Cheats include, but are not limited to [...] "aimbots" that automatically target other players or that automatically simulate any other player input to gain an advantage over other players; or any other program or modification that functions in a similar capacity or allows any prohibited conduct.

Seems like macro programs like AutoHotkey would be banned under these terms, which is pretty shit.

We also will not tolerate anyone using the game, or any servers or forums provided for the game, to be continually or repeatedly abusive to other players. This includes, but is not limited to, "griefing", racist bigotry, sexism or any other forms of "cyber bullying". We will also not tolerate anyone hosting servers for the game where such behaviors are continually or repeatedly allowed to take place.

Oh. You were probably talking about this.
WOOP WOOP HERE COME THE TONE POLICE TO TELL ME I CAN DO ON MY OWN SERVER.

Fleckers · Post by **Fleckers** » Tue Apr 21, 2015 1:43 am #83028

Cheridan wrote:
We also will not tolerate anyone using the game, or any servers or forums provided for the game, to be continually or repeatedly abusive to other players. This includes, but is not limited to, "griefing", racist bigotry, sexism or any other forms of "cyber bullying". We will also not tolerate anyone hosting servers for the game where such behaviors are continually or repeatedly allowed to take place.
Oh. You were probably talking about this.
WOOP WOOP HERE COME THE TONE POLICE TO TELL ME I CAN DO ON MY OWN SERVER.

The day companies start to regulate private servers is the day old school multiplayer dies off. Everyone prepare for lobbies and parties.

PC was supposed to be different than consoles in this regard, but now it seems like they are just dumbing it down for transitioning console kiddies who read about PC MASTER RACE on digg.

Spoiler:

Saegrimr · Post by **Saegrimr** » Tue Apr 21, 2015 1:46 am #83029

"They" have already been dumbing shit down and moving on to "matchmaking" and MMR bullshit.

Because apparently a serverlist is too hard to understand. Look at Nosgoth for example. God damn that matchmaking is infuriating.

Akkryls · Post by **Akkryls** » Tue Apr 21, 2015 12:33 pm #83087

5~ hours.
Goddamnit, on my day off I'm only going to get an evening of KF2 in (After download/install time)

Still can't freaking wait though.

Timbrewolf · Post by **Timbrewolf** » Tue Apr 21, 2015 5:11 pm #83136

ITS INSTALLIN LADS

TIME 2 DOSH

Cipher3 · Post by **Cipher3** » Tue Apr 21, 2015 6:57 pm #83159

Saegrimr wrote:"They" have already been dumbing shit down and moving on to "matchmaking" and MMR bullshit.

Because apparently a serverlist is too hard to understand. Look at Nosgoth for example. God damn that matchmaking is infuriating.

I have only ever had a problem with Nosgoth matchmaking once, probably because I was in a three-person party.

AnonymousNow · Wed Apr 22, 2015 12:06 am

I'm in, and getting to grips with the new medic system.

Add me @ AnonymousNow/Lunar Water on Steam, chaps.

onleavedontatme · Wed Apr 22, 2015 12:09 am

Pretty underwhelming. Not really any reason to play this over KF1 right now. Nothing new other than the bossfight and the much improved leveling.

Which I knew going in, but I couldn't resist buying it anyway for whatever reason. Looking forward to the new perks when they get added though.

Timbrewolf · Post by **Timbrewolf** » Wed Apr 22, 2015 3:43 am #83216

Field Medic is god-tier. Get dat shotgun and dat assault rifle and go fucking crazy. Your grenades are arguably the best in the game and your ability to spam healing on everyone is essential to winning.

Support is actually not total shit shotgun guy anymore. The perk that lets people get ammo from you helps a fucking ton. I've always hated support but this makes me like having them around a lot. Now if only I could get them to weld the right doors and not weld people out of rooms.

DrPillzRedux · Post by **DrPillzRedux** » Wed Apr 22, 2015 4:37 am #83234

There's already a 64 player server mutation.

Akkryls · Post by **Akkryls** » Wed Apr 22, 2015 9:54 pm #83451

Damn son, Hans Volter is hard.
Between work and life, I've managed about 10~ full length games so far. I've killed Hans a total of twice. Nearly three times when I managed to stunlock him in a corner with the Eviscerator until my fuel ran out.

Looking forward to have Demolitionist back to deal some heavy explosive damage to the big guys.

miggles · Post by **miggles** » Thu Apr 23, 2015 1:20 am #83494

yeah i think most of the difficulty regarding the new patriarch is just artificial because the weapons you would usually be using to kill him arent in yet

onleavedontatme · Thu Apr 23, 2015 1:28 am

miggles wrote:yeah i think most of the difficulty regarding the new patriarch is just artificial because the weapons you would usually be using to kill him arent in yet

He went down pretty easy when I had a few people around level five on my team. I think you're supposed to grind a bit at first as well.

I can't really bring myself to grind knowing perks are getting reset though

DrPillzRedux · Post by **DrPillzRedux** » Thu Apr 23, 2015 3:55 am #83511

They never confirmed a reset, they just said that if they need to, they will.

Also the boss is easy if you aren't bad. AA12 and dodging.

Steelpoint · Post by **Steelpoint** » Thu Apr 23, 2015 4:58 am #83518

Which is the problem, right now the best 'setup' is essentially five supports with AA12's and one medic, maybe one berserker for stun locking.

I would attribute this to a lack of class diversity, but right now the support seems one of the stronger class types. Berserker can be powerful but it has a really high skill ceiling. Commando is good for trash clean up but lacks the firepower to kill a high level Zed by itself. Medic's great at running away and dodging and keeping everyone else alive.

Timbrewolf · Post by **Timbrewolf** » Thu Apr 23, 2015 6:15 am #83526

>best setup
>not six medics with shotguns and AR's unleashing hell and ensuring everyone is immortal

Medic weapons have serious ammo management problems but they pack enough punch to run alongside others just fine. I like the utility spread a lot. You get a class pistol, smg, shotgun, and assault rifle. No other perk gets that much diversity. Also their grenade is just plain stupidly good and the effects of it stack. Everyone throwing their grenades into the same spot creates a cloud of death gas for zeds and invincibility for anyone standing in it. The only thing you have to worry about are sirens coming through and destroying the grenade itself with their AOE's.

The AA12 is really good though, 60 rounds of hurt and a tight spread. Not saying it's a bad weapon but it's the only thing the Support has going for it. The ammo ability turns out to only give one reload's worth of ammo once per wave, it's basically just a single ammo pickup for anyone who remembers to run up to you and grab it. When everyone is running around as the DJ or Mister Foster it can be pretty difficult to pick apart which guy in the crowd has the ammo for you.

Berzerker can stunlock scrakes and fleshpounds. If you don't want to just zerg medics a mix of like four medics and two berzerkers can steamroll everything easy peezy as long as the berzerkers trust the medics and stand their ground. I've had a few unfortunate TPK's when the guy who is supposed to be holding up the horde o' scrakes turns and runs when his armor drops, baiting the big guys out of my grenade's AOE and tripping everyone up. STOP FUCKING RUNNING YOU SHIT. INHALE THE BLUE GAS ITS GOOOOOOOOOD.

Side note: buy a goddamn medic pistol everyone. Swap to it periodically to fire a single dart at a friend and carry on your business. It's only 200 buckaroos and takes 1 weight. You apparently WILL EARN MEDIC EXP for healing people with it even if medic isn't your currently selected perk. AFAIK you wont get any of your passive perk buffs for using it but I do know running around killing things with a shotgun will earn you support EXP even while playing a different perk, for example. So even while you might not be earning exp for the perk you are using and you wont get increased damage at least those kills aren't "wasted".

Steelpoint · Post by **Steelpoint** » Thu Apr 23, 2015 7:14 am #83531

Medic guns are seemingly very powerful simply because the Medic class is the only class to not gain a damage bonus as they level up, meaning other higher level classes will get more damaging guns as they level up but the medic simply does not get damage bonuses.

Timbrewolf · Post by **Timbrewolf** » Thu Apr 23, 2015 4:03 pm #83592

Yeah there's no scaling for their damage output whatsoever, just their healing abilities.

At higher levels the Medic doesn't get increased damage output they get big fat tanking abilities and kiting abilities. Increased health, armor, and movement speed to run around and away from things so the other people can take care of them and you can rush to the rescue. It's a mutual defense thing, the other guys defend you from the big bad scrakes and shit and you defend them from damage in general.

EndgamerAzari · Thu Apr 23, 2015 4:07 pm

I've been maining berserker, and, while I'm awful at it, I am having a ton of fun with the nailgun.

Timbrewolf · Post by **Timbrewolf** » Thu Apr 23, 2015 4:09 pm #83596

The nailgun is inaccurate as fuck but at close to mid range it's great.

You can click middle-mouse to toggle it between firing one nail at a time or a cloud of seven nails with each trigger pull. Also the nails will ricochet off shit and penetrate through guys. It's a surprisingly effective gun for what is supposed to be "the melee guy".

We should all play tonight. I was going to stream some other shit but if people are down to kill some floors that'd be cool.

EndgamerAzari · Thu Apr 23, 2015 4:19 pm

I'm game. I should be available around 10:30 EST, assuming that I get my ass in gear and get my daily job application done as soon as I get home.

And yeah, the nailgun isn't what you'd call a precision weapon (though the single-shot is pretty good out to about 40 feet or so), but I love that it can pretty much one-shot gorefasts and still mangle anything near them. Firing it into a crowd of clots is incredibly satisfying.

Steelpoint · Post by **Steelpoint** » Thu Apr 23, 2015 5:22 pm #83614

The Nailgun is really effective in clearing out a corridor of trash Zed.

onleavedontatme · Thu Apr 23, 2015 7:57 pm

Apparently Hans is invincible during his HP drain, and has something like an 85% damage resist while trying to grab someone. Therefore the optimal strategy is to actually just let him grab someone so he'll heal/you can hurt him again. You're punished for being able to kite him.

No wonder people are having a hard time with the boss if he has long invincibility sequences without any real cues ingame that you aren't supposed to be shooting him. Really bizarre and counter intuitive.

EndgamerAzari · Thu Apr 23, 2015 7:59 pm

You can't even knock him out of the drain?

Timbrewolf · Post by **Timbrewolf** » Thu Apr 23, 2015 8:27 pm #83652

Yeah you just spam healing on the guy he's grabbed and wait for it to end.
You just learn that shit after fighting him enough. We just naturally figured it out after dumping all kinds of shit on him while he was standing still and noticed nothing happened.

It's unintuitive, sure, but you learn it through trial-and-error if you're actually paying attention. It's kinda like Monster Hunter that way, in that you have to learn through repeated failure. At this point in the game that single boss fight is all it has so taking multiple attempts at it to figure it out is practically all the gameplay there is. If the game made it obvious and you beat him on your first try? Congrats you can stop playing now.

Anyway they need to make the katana a berzerker weapon already so we can roll weeb squad. If the katana gets bloody because you slash fuckers up with it you can press R and you'll flick all the blood off of it onto the floor. It does absolutely nothing but make you a bad ass edgy shitlord.

Post by **oranges** » Thu Apr 23, 2015 9:10 pm #83669

Katana's are shit weapons with crappy steel

Timbrewolf · Post by **Timbrewolf** » Thu Apr 23, 2015 10:13 pm #83685

It's fun to use in this game though. The game doesn't have any other swords.

onleavedontatme · Fri Apr 24, 2015 6:14 am

An0n3 wrote:Yeah you just spam healing on the guy he's grabbed and wait for it to end.
You just learn that shit after fighting him enough. We just naturally figured it out after dumping all kinds of shit on him while he was standing still and noticed nothing happened.

It's unintuitive, sure, but you learn it through trial-and-error if you're actually paying attention. It's kinda like Monster Hunter that way, in that you have to learn through repeated failure. At this point in the game that single boss fight is all it has so taking multiple attempts at it to figure it out is practically all the gameplay there is. If the game made it obvious and you beat him on your first try? Congrats you can stop playing now.

Anyway they need to make the katana a berzerker weapon already so we can roll weeb squad. If the katana gets bloody because you slash fuckers up with it you can press R and you'll flick all the blood off of it onto the floor. It does absolutely nothing but make you a bad ass edgy shitlord.

I've not played much Monster Hunter, but I think learning attack patterns is a bit different than the guy being secretly invincible during certain stages of his attacks.

There isn't really a way to find that out unless you're playing commando, and who the hell plays commando?

Adding ricochet sound effects/showing bullets bouncing off him during those sequences would make sense.

And even if you figure it out it's still fucking counter intuitive that you have to let him hit you to kill him.

Timbrewolf · Post by **Timbrewolf** » Fri Apr 24, 2015 11:08 pm #83887

I don't want to get too deep in discussing monster hunter but there are no cues to indicate you're doing more damage or less damage depending on which area of a monsters hitbox you're attacking, or what element you're using.

In an environment where you can't just look that shit up, the only way to learn a monster is really strong against a certain element is to mistakenly try killing him with that shit and recognizing that it aint working.
The only way you'd ever find out that Tigrex stuns really easily if you bonk him over the head is if you just chance it and aggressively pull it off, likely dying a lot of times in the process.

Maybe I'm being really generous but a lack of cues like this reminds me of game mechanics implemented as far back as Mega Man, if not earlier. How the hell would you know Bubble Man is weak to Metal Man's weapon if you aren't scrambling to try a lot of different things? FWIW Hans Volter has a lot at least SOME cues for when he's hurt, his color change and quantity of sparks/flashing let you know when you've put some hurt on him. Again maybe I'm being generous but I kinda figured out he at least gained some kind of defense buff around the 5th-6th time I was trying to take him out and noticed he wasn't reacting at all to any of the hate we were pouring on him when he was grabbing someone else to heal or he was running circles around the place chasing someone.

And yeah there is the health bar ability that is pretty clutch for commandos to have. If you have that going it should be really blatant to you "Hey for some reason he's invincible right now".

AnonymousNow · Post by **AnonymousNow** » Sat Apr 25, 2015 3:48 am #83923

I've been playing the hell out of field medic, but I'm still two levels away from the ability to REPAIR MY FRIENDS' ARMOUR.

THE ABILITY TO REPAIR MY FRIENDS' ARMOUR.

DrPillzRedux · Post by **DrPillzRedux** » Mon Apr 27, 2015 5:13 am #84264

How they change difficulties is great. On normal zeds are slow. In Hell on Earth, zeds act almost entirely different and have new abilities and animations. All zeds will SPRINT AT YOU, even fucking bloats. In fact bloats will sprint AND VOMIT AT THE SAME TIME. Sirens charge in and scream like kamikazes. Bloats will try to block you into corners. Scrakes never disengages and even leap at you. Clots, cysts, and slashers will leap at you and grab you.

So difficulty isn't a boring damage and health increase for monsters, it's an entire new skillset.

[youtube]vbLSU5ty6-c[/youtube]

EndgamerAzari · Mon Apr 27, 2015 2:18 pm

I was always terrified of Scrakes and Fleshpounds until I discovered the Pulverizer. Now they fall almost disarmingly quickly.

I AM THE ONE WHO POUNDS.

Timbrewolf · Post by **Timbrewolf** » Mon Apr 27, 2015 4:11 pm #84348

I've been trying to think of the actual mechanics you would need to engineer a pulverizer IRL.

I don't know if it would be possible to pull off without a serious risk of powder burns on the user.

The version in game is a slamfire shotgun that fires from an open bolt, but that's probably just to save on space. Closed bolt would be much better since you presume someone is going to be swinging this thing around and bashing stuff with it...if you can fit all that inside a sledghammer head you've milled out.

Rather than a trigger mechanism you need a latch that is usually held in place that prevents the bolt from dropping down and hitting the shell and some kind of latch or catch the user can hold to move it out of the way so it can fire. Repeated slamfires shouldn't be a thing since it's still a pump gun.

EndgamerAzari · Mon Apr 27, 2015 4:16 pm

This line of thinking is the sort of thing that leads to a closed-casket funeral and an interesting headline.

Timbrewolf · Post by **Timbrewolf** » Mon Apr 27, 2015 7:50 pm #84373

FOR MY ENEMIES

DemonFiren · Post by **DemonFiren** » Mon Apr 27, 2015 7:59 pm #84376

I think Azari was talking Darwin Awards.

Jacough · Post by **Jacough** » Mon Apr 27, 2015 9:50 pm #84387

Steelpoint wrote:Whenever Scrakes or Fleshpounders enter the map a global sound is played indicating their arrival, essentially said Zed making a very loud and ominous sound. Alerts you to their arrival but it tends to eliminate some tension, so its less likely for you to be shocked on turning a corner and seeing a Scrake.

Eh, not sure I'd necessarily agree with that. If you've put as much time into KF as I have you already know which waves scrakes and fleshpounds start to show up in.

DrPillzRedux · Post by **DrPillzRedux** » Tue Apr 28, 2015 1:08 am #84416

Actually it adds tension steelpoint. You know they're around but you don't know WHERE they are. It's amplified by how much more waves are actually affected by scrakes and fleshpounds on suicidal/hell on earth than in KF1. They do a lot of damage as well as have a lot of health.

Timbrewolf · Post by **Timbrewolf** » Tue Apr 28, 2015 4:14 am #84428

AnonymousNow wrote:I've been playing the hell out of field medic, but I'm still two levels away from the ability to REPAIR MY FRIENDS' ARMOUR.

THE ABILITY TO REPAIR MY FRIENDS' ARMOUR.

I've played with the ability and it sucks shit. Sacrificing 10% of your healing to throw 2% armor at someone isn't worth it, not when your alternative is a free vest for yourself and a 60% discount on repairs. It's a less pronounced advantage on lower-tiers but on harder difficulties the discounted armor helps quite a bit. The armor rep only triggers when you shoot someone who is injured. You can't just keep needling someone who isn't hurt to patch their armor up, and even if you could it's a waste of your time and darts.

As you level up and your syringes become more and more potent trading off all that extra healing for a meager 2-4 points of armor aint worth it. They need to buff that ability if they want it to be an actual choice. Something like 25% of your healing ability for 10% armor would be a lot more useful.

A lot of the Field Medic's customization options are no-brainers like that. Healing Surge sucks, get Enforcer. You don't need 20% more HP when you can constantly dose the fuck out of yourself with your own syringe. You DO need 20% more ammo, because your guns all do comparatively less damage and you need more bullets to handle all the crap being thrown at you than other perks.
Combatant beats Armament for the above stated reasons.
Lacerate beats Regeneration for the same reasons Enforcer beats Healing Surge. You're the goddamn medic, you don't need more HP or passive regen. You need more ammo and any kind of damage buffs you can get your hands on because you otherwise have none.

Steelpoint · Post by **Steelpoint** » Tue Apr 28, 2015 4:18 am #84429

The only time you'll take the free armour perk is in the first wave, then you can swap it to the armour repair perk.

That, plus the lv20 armour repair/bloat immunity, means you can repair a lot of armour.

Timbrewolf · Post by **Timbrewolf** » Tue Apr 28, 2015 4:29 am #84431

Swapping perks like that mid-game is busted. Whether intended or not, it doesn't work that way.

If you try to swap out of a perk that gives you something (like a free vest, or bonus health, ammo, etc.) in the middle of a game you'll lose the advantages the customization gave you (your max health/ammo count will go back to normal, no more discount on vests, etc) without gaining the advantage of the thing you're swapping to.

The field medic's passive bonus to their own armor doesn't affect how much you can repair someone else's, nor can you ever just syringe yourself to regain lost armor. In a situation where another medic is healing me, even at max armor (level 25 perk would grant a total of 175 armor) the 2% rep is still only worth 3.5 units of armor.

DrPillzRedux · Post by **DrPillzRedux** » Tue Apr 28, 2015 4:32 am #84432

At lv25 as medic I am giving around 25% armor repair per heal. It's hilariously broken right now.