Netrunner: A Living Card Game

Timbrewolf · Post by **Timbrewolf** » Wed Aug 19, 2015 4:24 am #113167

So it's not a videogame but I don't really know where else to put this. "Off-Topic" seems too vague and the "Roleplaying" thread is for either IC roleplay or RPG's.

I've been meaning to get into this game for ages but I finally had the chance to sit down and play a game of it using the core set with a friend (I bought it for them for their birthday and we dove in).

THIS IS FUCKING AWESOME. I seriously regret not getting in on this beforehand.

Does anyone else here play/has played Netrunner before?

Drynwyn · Post by **Drynwyn** » Wed Aug 26, 2015 12:41 pm #114960

I once tried to play it, but nobody around me plays it, which is something of a fatal flaw in a card game.

EndgamerAzari · Wed Aug 26, 2015 9:00 pm

You oughta make a video about it so maybe I can figure out how the Christ to play it.

Timbrewolf · Post by **Timbrewolf** » Wed Aug 26, 2015 11:22 pm #115062

I've been teaching people how to play on my lunches. I could probably post something if you think it would honestly help you.

Drynwyn wrote:I once tried to play it, but nobody around me plays it, which is something of a fatal flaw in a card game.

There are some ways to play the game online. I'd be up for some games using whatever toolset you think works best. I'm still new to the game but I'm learning the meta as I go.

NBN is fucking faaaaaaaaaaaaast.

Preamble · Post by **Preamble** » Thu Aug 27, 2015 12:08 am #115066

This game is fucking boss.
Also jinteki.net is a thing you can play online with, you guys should make accounts so I can school you nerds. Literally the only person I can play irl with is my brother because all my friends are disgusting fucking plebs.

Timbrewolf · Post by **Timbrewolf** » Thu Aug 27, 2015 5:08 am #115152

I love my coworkers but I'm a little disappointed how reluctant they are to get into this.

It's a tough sell: it's a really complex game that you need to build two completely different decks to play. You have to understand the meta of two different games to play one.

The people who are smart enough to grasp it and be interested in it seem turned off by the competitive aspect and brewing/testing time you need to put in to climb the ranks of the metagame.
The people who are competitive enough to want to GIT GUD at something can't handle the mental gymnastics required to play the game and master both sides of the gameplay.

You need to have both a lot of patience/intelligence to learn the game, and the drive to really want to win to stick with it. There's no such thing as like a "casual play" fun-time version like Pauper or EDH.
Netrunner is like the DORF FORT of cardgames in that you need to be autistic enough to want to learn it but also have to have the sadistic nature to suffer through it/want to cause suffering with it.

It certainly doesn't help either that of the handful of people who are familiar with it and have played it long enough to get a solid impression, a lot of people have quit for different reasons.
I've had three different people tell me the meta for the game is broken three different ways. Spoiler alert: that just means they came up against a wall they couldn't build/play around and got tilted.
I've had two other people tell me they quit the game after negative experiences in competitive scenes. Not really anything I can say about that other than that every competitive scene has its pitfalls.

TechnoAlchemist · Thu Aug 27, 2015 5:12 am

I have a close friend who is very, very into the game.

I've played it a couple of times and it's fun, but apparently if you want to be successful you have to stick to 2 corp factions and one runner faction and stick to their respective metas to win in even slightly competitive play.

Timbrewolf · Post by **Timbrewolf** » Thu Aug 27, 2015 5:15 am #115155

TechnoAlchemist wrote:I have a close friend who is very, very into the game.

I've played it a couple of times and it's fun, but apparently if you want to be successful you have to stick to 2 corp factions and one runner faction and stick to their respective metas to win in even slightly competitive play.

People keep telling me that but

http://netrunnerdb.com/en/decklists/tournament

If you look at the decklists from people who are actually winning events that's just not true. Every single corp and runner faction is represented somewhere, and winning somewhere.
Like seriously look at that. There's a deck for every corp that won 1st place at some event somewhere in the last month alone.

NBN won 1st place at some 21 man 5 round event in Stockport
Jinteki won Australian Nationals
HB won some Cyber Nationals tournament
While Weyland got 1st at some other qualifier as well

...so anybody saying "You can't win unless you run this one deck" is just being salty.

Preamble · Post by **Preamble** » Thu Aug 27, 2015 11:09 am #115183

Yeah as Anon noted there is a pretty large variety of competitive decks.
I mean certain cards are used in 99% of decks (cough Jackson Howard cough) but that barely reduces the overall variety of the game.

Timbrewolf · Post by **Timbrewolf** » Wed Sep 16, 2015 1:53 am #119037

New set came out. Contains this:

Fucking hell. This is the silver bullet to a lot of tag n' bag decks. Weyland just got shit on hard. Thankfully the same set also incorporates this:

Point, meet counterpoint.

EDIT: I gotta say that art for Contract Killer sucks though. So many firearm errors going on. That left-handed posture. That imminent scope-eye. We got a real professional on our hands here guys.

Preamble · Post by **Preamble** » Sat Sep 19, 2015 12:46 am #119707

How exactly is Film Critic meant to screw tag'n'bag decks over?

Timbrewolf · Post by **Timbrewolf** » Sat Sep 19, 2015 5:15 am #119741

Film Critic allows the runner to take agendas without stealing them.

Cards like Punitive Counterstrike, Argus Security, TGTBT, and Midseason Replacements wont work, since the agenda has never been stolen.

When combo'd with this:

You'll be able to dodge SEA Source and other forced-tag effects during the Corp's turn, but since you're never stealing agendas you never have to give up your security blanket.
Not to mention it also makes The Source insanely one-sided as well.

Preamble · Post by **Preamble** » Sat Sep 19, 2015 1:08 pm #119765

City hall is barely used anyway, and running film critic just to keep it up seems incredibly unlikely outside of some shaper decks. The biggest influence of film critic will be as a counter to Cambridge jinteki to dodge fetal AI's and future perfect, and for Stirling to cheat his econ.
That said the combo with the source is pretty neat and something I hadn't seen before. That in Stirling looks like it would be really good.

Timbrewolf · Post by **Timbrewolf** » Sat Sep 19, 2015 3:17 pm #119782

I think the sentence you are trying to form is:

City hall was barely used anyway....

Film Critic is going in every runner deck. It allows you to sidestep so much boobytrap agenda bullshit, dodge so much punishment, and take things you may not otherwise have been able to take (NAPD Contracts, agendas protected by upgrades like Red Herrings). It neuters so many corp cards it's ridiculous.

The 1-2 punch of that plus the protective screen of NACH is strong enough that you're going to see it a lot. Film Critic prevents your NACH from going away. NACH prevents you from getting tagged and having your Film Critic popped (or from getting scorched to bits). Is it good enough that you can stop running Plascete? Mmmmmaybe maybe not. Good enough that you could swap Plascrete for Brain Cage or a few Public Sympathy? I think so.

cedarbridge · Post by **cedarbridge** » Fri Sep 25, 2015 2:19 am #121097

I used to play this now and then on OCTGN but I never really got to competition level competence.

Timbrewolf · Post by **Timbrewolf** » Fri Sep 25, 2015 2:23 am #121098

The competitive scene is a bit weird. There isn't a giant cash purse on the line like MTG, it's usually just some exclusive promo items and a trophy.

Some of those promo items, though, can sell for hundreds of dollars to Netrunner fans. So in a roundabout way there is some value on the line, but nothing like the couple grand you might get from getting top-8 at a major MTG event.

On the flipside though the barrier to entry is much much much lower (like I said before you can buy out the entire collection of cards that currently exist for the price of a single MTG Modern deck) and from what I've experienced so far the community is a bit more mature and friendly.

cedarbridge · Post by **cedarbridge** » Fri Sep 25, 2015 2:26 am #121101

An0n3 wrote:The competitive scene is a bit weird. There isn't a giant cash purse on the line like MTG, it's usually just some exclusive promo items and a trophy.

Some of those promo items, though, can sell for hundreds of dollars to Netrunner fans. So in a roundabout way there is some value on the line, but nothing like the couple grand you might get from getting top-8 at a major MTG event.

On the flipside though the barrier to entry is much much much lower (like I said before you can buy out the entire collection of cards that currently exist for the price of a single MTG Modern deck) and from what I've experienced so far the community is a bit more mature and friendly.

Team Covenant's Netrunner coverage is also way more bearable to watch than Star City's MTG coverage imo.

Timbrewolf · Post by **Timbrewolf** » Fri Sep 25, 2015 2:28 am #121103

Professional obligations prevent me from commenting on Star City's coverage of events.

Timbrewolf · Post by **Timbrewolf** » Mon Oct 26, 2015 3:42 am #129557

YO GODDAMN

http://www.jinteki.net/

You can play Netrunner online for free and spectate other people's games.

All in your browser, no apps or shit needed.

This is awesome.

RescueRanger · Wed Oct 28, 2015 7:10 am

An0n3 wrote:YO GODDAMN

http://www.jinteki.net/

You can play Netrunner online for free and spectate other people's games.

All in your browser, no apps or shit needed.

This is awesome.

HOLY THIS FIXES MY BIGGEST ISSUE WITH NR (the fact all the good sets where mass bought blah blah)

EndgamerAzari · Wed Oct 28, 2015 2:16 pm

Now if only I wasn't too stupid to understand the rules!

Timbrewolf · Post by **Timbrewolf** » Wed Oct 28, 2015 11:20 pm #130286

RescueRanger wrote: HOLY THIS FIXES MY BIGGEST ISSUE WITH NR (the fact all the good sets where mass bought blah blah)

The reprint of the most essential expansion pack (Opening Moves) just hit shelves today.

Go fucking get it. If you ever think you'll play the game for realsies you will definitely want this expansion.

Even if you don't think you will ever play the game there's a reasonable chance it might sell out all over the place again and the price will spike again.

RescueRanger · Fri Oct 30, 2015 9:51 am

An0n3 wrote:
RescueRanger wrote: HOLY THIS FIXES MY BIGGEST ISSUE WITH NR (the fact all the good sets where mass bought blah blah)
The reprint of the most essential expansion pack (Opening Moves) just hit shelves today.

Go fucking get it. If you ever think you'll play the game for realsies you will definitely want this expansion.

Even if you don't think you will ever play the game there's a reasonable chance it might sell out all over the place again and the price will spike again.

Awww shit my LGS better have some tomorrow

Timbrewolf · Post by **Timbrewolf** » Thu Feb 04, 2016 3:33 pm #151703

Ayyyy new cycle has started
Ayyyy store championships
Ayyyy new tournament rules to nerf over used cards

EndgamerAzari · Thu Feb 04, 2016 3:50 pm

Ayyyy I'm still too dumb to properly play this game

Timbrewolf · Post by **Timbrewolf** » Thu Feb 04, 2016 3:53 pm #151706

Ayy sounds like we need to play more Jinteki
Ayy that's perfect timing I have a new brew that needs testing (runner)

Helios · Post by **Helios** » Fri Feb 05, 2016 8:52 am #151977

I had a midseason traffic accident cerebral imaging deck. The central idea was have them get a midseason, permatag them, then recur traffic accidents and a scorch over and over burning through any plates. It was slow but nobody knew the combo. I also had enough influence for a single unbreakable ice. The one that gains subroutines per card in your hand. Without morningstar they couldn't get in one of my servers. And depending on if they were criminal etc it could lock them out

Timbrewolf · Post by **Timbrewolf** » Sat Feb 06, 2016 1:40 am #152139

I published my current runner list here:

http://netrunnerdb.com/en/decklist/3156 ... and-butter

dezzmont · Post by **dezzmont** » Sun Feb 07, 2016 4:26 am #152359

Are bigrig alt-run criminal decks still possible?

Likewise how viable is econ style Weyland?

Timbrewolf · Post by **Timbrewolf** » Sun Feb 07, 2016 7:11 am #152380

Weyland has the strongest economy in the game.

Run Blue Sun as your identity.
Use Oversight AI on shit like Curtain Wall.
Return Curtain Wall to your hand and gain 14 credits at the start of your turn.

MONEY FOR NOTHING AND YOUR CHICKS FOR FREE

http://netrunnerdb.com/en/decklist/28359/force-of-will

This is my current go-to corp list because it fucking shits on people in multiple ways.
Gigantic econ lets you rush the table with ICE you shouldn't be seeing outside of glacier decks.
The only time I've ever lost while piloting it was to someone I was teaching to use my aforementioned runner deck and they surprised me with some tech I didn't realize I had even included in the build (Panchatantra + Deus X as one shot break-anything device wrecked something I had installed Oversight AI on and scored them a 6-point agenda that would've otherwise been impossible for them to get near that early in the game).
It also includes the feelgood fuck you combo of the century with Power Shutdown -> Jackson Howard -> Accellerated Diagnostics -> Sea Source / Scorch / Scorch.
Got ten credits? Get J Ho on the board? Got a PS and AD in hand? Runner run last turn? Congrats you just won the game.

dezzmont · Post by **dezzmont** » Sun Feb 07, 2016 4:40 pm #152472

I was thinking of using classic Weyland with Subliminal Message and transaction cards, but despite the fact there are more transaction cards it looks like they overall have gotten way bigger making that sort of a losing proposition compared to Curtain Wall which seems to literally be made of money. This is just what I needed to get a better grasp of the corporate metagame!

Do you have any good examples of a criminal sneakdoor bigrig, that is if they still exist?

Timbrewolf · Post by **Timbrewolf** » Sun Feb 07, 2016 8:07 pm #152507

I haven't seen anyone run anything like that in a bit. I'm sure they're still out there.

If you want to build one it's not that complicated.
2x Desperado
3x HQ Interface

3x Sneakdoor Beta
2x Mimic
2x Passport
2x Breach
1x Corroder
1x Yog.0
2x Datasucker

3x Account Siphon
3x Scrubber(?)
3x Same Old Thing
2x Crash Space

...I figure would be the core of the deck and you can just fill the rest out for whatever you like. Hammer the fuck out of HQ either directly or through archives using your specialty breakers with super-efficient Mimic/Corroder/Yog.0 + Datasucker runs on remotes if you need them. Scrubber is a strong choice for an out-of-faction assist in that you'll be accessing large chunks of their hand, and he's free credits to make them discard that shit. Spam Account Siphon. Use Same Old Thing to keep spamming it. Use Crash Space to shed the tags and do it again and again.

Identity is questionable. Gabriel Santiago is an obvious choice for that 2cred economy. Silhouette isn't a bad choice either for her free expose. If you want to flip the whole thing on its head and build Anarch Edward Kim would be a really strong choice as well, allowing you to force discards of Operations you wouldn't otherwise be able to touch. If not running him, Imp would be another thing you probably want to find a slot for in the deck.

EDIT: Actually Imp would be a GREAT choice for this deck either way since it'll allow you to trash ICE out of the corps hand, denying them the ability to ever defend themselves from your bullshit. Hammering them in the ass with Account Siphon to keep them broke and then emptying out their hand of any defense mechanisms is brutal.

dezzmont · Post by **dezzmont** » Sun Feb 07, 2016 8:24 pm #152511

Sounds like not much has changed in regards to crim bigrig then.

Timbrewolf · Post by **Timbrewolf** » Sun Feb 07, 2016 8:38 pm #152516

Passport/Breach/Alias are kinda new.

Alias is questionably effective. If you're tight on influence it does the job fine, but Mimic+Sucker does it so much better you should consider spending the influence on that first and shifting others around instead.

dezzmont · Post by **dezzmont** » Mon Feb 08, 2016 7:49 am #152644

My crim bigrigs generally actually outsourced most breakers. I tend to get some virus affinity in there for the AI breakers. Looking through there seems to be a more efficient path I am trying to crack, may throw something together in a few days.

Timbrewolf · Post by **Timbrewolf** » Mon Feb 08, 2016 2:41 pm #152680

Be warned, Turing is pretty common because of how prevalent Faust has become in the meta. There are way too many Anarchs running around out there with ten card hands drawing tons of cards each turn and pitching them all to make runs.

Incomptinence · Mon Feb 08, 2016 11:55 pm

How does this work is it only runner decks versus corp decks? Do people have 1 corp and 1 runner deck?

Timbrewolf · Post by **Timbrewolf** » Tue Feb 09, 2016 3:09 am #152872

Incomptinence wrote:How does this work is it only runner decks versus corp decks? Do people have 1 corp and 1 runner deck?

Yep. To play you build a runner deck and a corp deck. When playing someone for an official event you play one game, then play a second game swapping the roles. If we both won one of the games, winner of the match is determined by comparing agenda points scored in the two games (flatlining the runner or decking the corp counts as having scored 7). For example, if I win game 1 by scoring 7 agenda points, while you scored 0, then you win the second game by scoring 7 agenda points while I scored 4, I win the match. "Flatlining" means to kill the runner outright by inflicting damage on them as the corp. "Decking" the corp means they had to draw a card and couldn't. Interestingly, the runner doesn't lose the game if he has to draw a card and cannot. Only the corp does.

Timbrewolf · Post by **Timbrewolf** » Tue Feb 09, 2016 6:05 am #152908

Holy fuck this list

http://stimhack.com/hollywood-banking/

That list of ICE looks kinda shaky though. Caprice better do her job or you're going to get dunked on.