[Hbk2006, Ausops, ForcefulCJS, Lollerderby] Thomas Laser

[FranzKrake]

Byond account and character name: Thomas Laser

Admin: Hbk2006, ForcefulCJS, Lollerderby - Ausops who replied to the adminhelp

Time incident occured: 14th of April, 19.20 Berlin Time

Details:
Ive played a shift on Sybil roughly 1 Hour before the posted time above. Thomas Laser started as assistant, stole the Caps ID, gave a bunch of his friends all access and he killed me, the HoS, as non antag. He then proceeded to do greytide business. Round ends, hes not an antag.
Now heres the whole problem:

When I ahelped it, Ausops said "You made a ban request, ban request forums no longer exist, please contact a headmin". Next round Laser is still playing.

Whats the problem?
We have 4 Admins online and not a single one enforces such a blatant break of rule 1. Lasers Greytiding blatantly, killing, playing antag as non antag. 4 Admins are online and not a single one is enforcing the rules.

Why would admins not enforce rules?
The guy playing Thomas Laser is a regular, maybe some guys are buddies with him and dont want to see him banned.
Another possible reason could be that they use the removal of the ban request forum as excuse to not do their job (Which in my opinion is the enforcing of the server rules, correct me if Im wrong an we can all forget this topic)

For me, Im the type of guy that reads the damn rules and abides to them, largely. I expect to be punished if I fuck up and I want other people to be punished when they break the rules. Fair game really. But this incident clearly showed me that there is no such thing as fair game on Sybil. Really looking forward to your explanation of this incident.

[imblyings]

Did you read the description on the forum front page regarding ban requests?

>Ban requests has been closed. If someone is spamming, crashing the server, or maxcapping the station at random contact a headmin via PM. Otherwise move on with your life.

HELP: FjKrake/(FjKrake): I want a ban for Thomas Laser for breaking rule 1, precedent: - Unprovoked grief (occasionally known as greytiding), repeated cases of minor unprovoked grief, and unprovoked grief targeted towards specific players or groups (i.e. metagrudging) fall under rule 1. - heard by 5 non-AFK admins who have +BAN.
PM: Ausops/(Ausops)->FjKrake/(FjKrake): I think headmins handle ban requests now, you'd have to contact one of them.
ASAY: Ausops/(Ausops) : are you saying you want to be responsible for ban requests done through ahelps now
PM: FjKrake/(FjKrake)->Ausops/(Ausops): Im just asking you to do your job here. Apparently you dont want to
PM: Ausops/(Ausops)->FjKrake/(FjKrake): Ban requests was closed by a headmin and they specified ban requests being sent to headmins in the case of extreme grief i.e. bombs. Please contact them.
Lzimann deadmined themself.
PM: FjKrake/(FjKrake)->Ausops/(Ausops): Dude. He broke the rules. In a round you played in / were admin. And youre not following up on people breaking rules this blatantly. If I have to go to the forums for this, Ill write 2 Posts. 1 For Thomas and 1 For you.
PM: Ausops/(Ausops)->FjKrake/(FjKrake): You've claimed someone broke the rules and requested a ban when ban requests is now closed. The headmins did this, all I've done is ask you to pass the request onto them.
PM: FjKrake/(FjKrake)->Ausops/(Phoneti Callyso Undname): Isnt it your job to look into it when people break the rules? Someone just broke the rules - Look Into it! Thank you!
PM: FjKrake/(FjKrake)->Ausops/(Phoneti Callyso Undname): Quite frankly you just dont wanna do your job right now in my opinion cause laser is a regular player here and probably your buddy.
PM: Ausops/(Phoneti Callyso Undname)->FjKrake/(FjKrake): No, no ahelps were made as far as I can recall when I was playing. Before the headmins closed the ban requests forum, players who reported a possible rule violation that required extensive investigation were directed to the ban requests forum due to the nature of sorting those out. Since it doesn't exist, and since it's removal was due to a headmin, I've asked you to contact a headmin about it.
ASAY: Ausops/(Phoneti Callyso Undname) : >please look into multiple rounds spanning over god knows how long a period for vague things that might not even be logged so I can be less mad
PM: FjKrake/(FjKrake)->Ausops/(Phoneti Callyso Undname): Okay - Lets cut the chase. Thomas Laser broke rule 1 with massiv greytiding last shift. Are you gonna look into or not?
PM: Ausops/(Phoneti Callyso Undname)->FjKrake/(FjKrake): I've already given you all the assistance I can, I can ping the headmins if you want.
PM: FjKrake/(FjKrake)->Ausops/(Phoneti Callyso Undname): Ping the headmin.
PM: Ausops/(Phoneti Callyso Undname)->FjKrake/(FjKrake): All three were informed on the appropriate channel, unfortunately their response may take a while.
PM: FjKrake/(FjKrake)->Ausops/(Phoneti Callyso Undname): Fuck it. Im off to the forums to open a can of worms.
PM: Ausops/(Phoneti Callyso Undname)->FjKrake/(FjKrake): A shame the ban requests forum doesn't exist.
PM: Ausops/(Phoneti Callyso Undname)->FjKrake/(FjKrake): It'd make this a lot more easier.

While it's nice that you feel so strongly about it, my advice remains the same. Please contact a headmin about it. And no, players don't get to circumvent the removal of the subforum by ahelping admins ingame. Especially if you wait until the round end to ahelp.

[FranzKrake]

Why do I have to go the extra mile as Player when there are 4 admins online that can deal with this in a time efficient manner? This is bullshit. This moves WORK from the Admins away onto the Headmin and Players. What is your job again?

[imblyings]

It's not a time efficient manner at all. Ban requests involving alleged repeated cases of unprovoked grief or metagrudging is a time-consuming investigation involving the pulling of logs over an indeterminate timeframe that may require multiple witnesses to PM admins about it. The whole process would take days if not weeks.

In fact it would be less time-consuming and easier for everyone if it were done on the forums but as the forum homepage and I have said, ban requests is closed and any ban requests should be forwarded to a headmin.

So please, listen to the advice I gave you at the start.

-

While it is unfortunate that you are not familiar with the process of handling investigations, I've explained it to you above. A ban request cannot simply be given to admins with an expectation that an admin will contact you soon with a message that the person was banned. Regardless of the process or method, it would take a lot of work from you as admins would have to constantly ask you, ask other parties, compare statements and logs, and clarify inconsistencies. I understand you feel entitled to admins doing something for you but this is no longer the case. Thankfully, the current method of making a ban request is asking a headmin about it, which should be easy for you to do and which is what I have advised you to do.

[FranzKrake]

Im playing on a regular basis on your servers and I dont even know your headmins etc. Going onto the forum and pming around is for me not something that is easy nor convenient nor efficient from the perspective of a player. Adminhelps or Ban requests per Forum Thread worked, but Im not going to PM around here, sorry.

Your system does not work. Thank you for letting me know what the deal is.

[imblyings]

I'd say the system works as intended but if you ever want to pursue the matter further, our current headmins, Hornygranny, Shadowlight123, and Korphaeron are mostly often available in game and should be happy to help with any ban request queries.

[Hornygranny]

Thanks for the feedback, we appreciate it sincerely.