[Deleted] Security Cyborg Module

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Gun Hog
 
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Security Cyborg Module

Postby Gun Hog » Sat Feb 18, 2017 1:03 am #257108

The Security Cyborg module is a subject of controversy withing the player base.

How do you feel about the Secborg removal, desire among some players to have it enabled again, and opposition among other players to keep it the module disabled? If you are made a Head Administrator, how would you vote regarding its availability to players, and why?



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Haevacht
 
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Re: Security Cyborg Module

Postby Haevacht » Sat Feb 18, 2017 1:13 am #257120

Secborg should stay gone.

Sure, people will want them back, people want ll sorts of things. They can keep making policy threads about em, and they'll probably pollute other threads with discussion about them (which is bad).

I would vote against secborg returning. Immune to regular stuns and very powerful, it's just too much for the AI to have. And with borg riding, a traitor could ride one of these and wipe half a station, unless someone gets ion/flashes.
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Re: Security Cyborg Module

Postby DemonFiren » Sat Feb 18, 2017 1:24 am #257132

Test-readd them, then check the sodium content of deadchat, OOC and the forums.
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Re: Security Cyborg Module

Postby BeeSting12 » Sat Feb 18, 2017 1:27 am #257134

I didn't like them while they were in. And I feel like we've been fine without them.
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Re: Security Cyborg Module

Postby ShadowDimentio » Sat Feb 18, 2017 2:03 am #257200

They were completely fine. The only people campaigning their removal were a very select group of assblasted players that got dunked by the AI/secborg after they seriously fucked up as antag.

Bring them back. People will get dunked, but soon they'll learn and start carrying flashes if they get worried about secborgs.
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Re: Security Cyborg Module

Postby John_Oxford » Sat Feb 18, 2017 2:33 am #257232

I've made threads in regards to a rework.

It's not really hard to appease everyone, more so in this situation. Adding them back but making them situational (peacekeeper transformation, round start security slot) would be a compromise with the people who didn't want them to begin with.
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Re: Security Cyborg Module

Postby imblyings » Sat Feb 18, 2017 2:43 am #257245

borgs have been severely neutered but people continue to play silicon roles and the game in general

I would be supportive of responsible attempts at making similar borg types or re-introducing the sec borg but we'll see.
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Re: Security Cyborg Module

Postby PKPenguin321 » Sat Feb 18, 2017 3:14 am #257278

DemonFiren wrote:Test-readd them, then check the sodium content of deadchat, OOC and the forums.

It was done as a meme (not even a serious test) for like two rounds a while ago and there was real salt from just that.

Secborgs are detrimental to the game. In a video game, a thing designed for the fun and enjoyment of its players, secborgs had only managed to lessen fun and enjoyment (except for maybe the secborg player itself). No arguments for them have ever really addressed this, and I doubt anybody really has any argument that does. Secborgs are a definite no from me.
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Re: Security Cyborg Module

Postby ChangelingRain » Sat Feb 18, 2017 3:18 am #257279

Secborgs were terrible for the game, being a dispenser of stuns that few people were able to actually deal with due to, as a borg, being immune to all but a few types of stun.

As such I don't think they'll be coming back, though new, similarly-intentioned but better-balanced borg modules might.
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Re: Security Cyborg Module

Postby Alipheese » Sun Feb 19, 2017 9:09 am #257915

Sec borgs should stay gone.
Security roles' rules are pretty set and clear cut.
Peacekeeper borgs are filling the role of helping the actual officers as a silicon.
Working to help without adding in another set of rules to deal with, secborg policy and standard borg policy. Easier for both players to understand, and easier on the admins.
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Re: Security Cyborg Module

Postby iamgoofball » Sun Feb 19, 2017 9:09 am #257916

secborg will probably stay gone

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Re: Security Cyborg Module

Postby Thunder11 » Tue Feb 21, 2017 2:54 pm #258770

The majority of secborgs never did everything but validhunt all round. They need to stay gone until people are actually capable of putting their laws above space law.
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Re: Security Cyborg Module

Postby MimicFaux » Tue Feb 21, 2017 9:14 pm #258955

I'm in agreement with Thunder the 'problem' with SecBorgs was never the module, but the player piloting them. I mentioned this in my candidacy thread, but enforcing some clarity of purpose between player and policy would help crackdown on the issues. Silicon roles should always be powerful assets for / against the station, confined and regulated by their laws. That's always been their identity, and where the disconnect happens is when players start selectively interpreting their laws.

Until players understand what it means to play as a silicon, security borgs should stay shelved.
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Re: Security Cyborg Module

Postby Armhulen » Tue Feb 21, 2017 9:22 pm #258961

well we should at least fix standard borgs being better at stopping harm than peacekeepers
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Re: Security Cyborg Module

Postby TehSteveo » Tue Feb 21, 2017 11:06 pm #259025

I feel something has to be done at a coding level with security borg as I'm mixed on security borgs. I'm generally pro-silicon as I use to exclusively play silicons a lot. Right now I find borgs right now kind of being at their weakest state in someways with the game as of now. Yet, at the same time security module I find can be really fucking OP in the correct players hands. I suppose other borgs can be too; but all the borgs are limited in what they can do where as security module can easily play a kiting game with their disabler spam then cuffing their target when they eventually get them on their back which ends the fight.

I feel that for security borg; they should be a module upgrade for Peacekeepers unlocked via RnD and resources from mining. Maybe also a module that traitor AI can buy to upgrade their peacekeepers. I'd also say their disabler should be looked at and even suggest dividing duties where one borg is better suited for actual combat, but another can serve as "warden" that is more melee oriented that holds the cuffs and is meant to detain and move hostiles. Yet similar proposals code wise have been met with mixed review and the last attempt to make them available via code red alerts failed.

I will also note when we done away with security borg, complaints about silicons being shitty dropped drastically. Which seems to imply it attracts a type of player that wants to hunt valids, yet doesn't want to player as a security officer which causes problems as they may not be law compliant or they are, but a player is just salty that the security borg just easily took care of them as they didn't have the counters for the borg.

As such I don't think as a headmin I'll be touching the configuration option to enable them leaving the burden more on coders at this stage.
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