/tg/Station 13

There are no real mechanics in the game that form any sort of canon regarding the style of ship-to-ship combat in the ongoing NT-Syndicate war (Which I'm assuming isn't a standstill cold war given the CONSTANT nature of military-level operations being performed on facilities). To clarify, I'm referring to what I'd consider the three main archetypes of scifi ship combat:

- Warhammer-esque, which is closest to 18th-century naval battles, where while the victor can be decided very early on, battle can last for extended periods of time with both ships circling each other. Deployment of small fighter craft is limited at best, with the majority of a ship's guns being broadside-oriented large guns. Ships rarely, if ever, are capable of ducking in and out of a planet's atmosphere - Built in space to stay in space, or launched into space to stay in space

- Star Wars-esque, with lots of lasers and fore-mounted guns and fucking fuck guns fucking all over everything, small fighters are everywhere and are extremely dangerous, with larger craft having holocaust-tiers of turrets to prevent pesky bombers from doing too much. Fights can be short, explosive, and light up space with glorious laser-shows. Ships don't give a fuck about atmospherics and go wherever they want yo.

- Star Trek, where sometimes things instantly explode for no reason, weaponry is vague at best, and more or less everything is automated. Objectively the worst.

Of course, if you've got a different idea, I'd love to hear it. The concept of the NT Navy intrigues me.

Bonus: Make up a false name and class designation for an SS13-universe warship. I'll settle for the NSS Volunteer, Wyvern-class cruiser commanded by one Captain Lacon

Bluespace weapons is a thing, and we know they have them mounted on forward firing cruisers from an away mission map. If that is the case it's possible that battles are spread far out with a 'battleships' playstyle like early WW1 naval encounters with escort/scouts/pickets probing for enemy fleets, and minor close engagements between the pickets of each. When you can teleport munitions direct on a point location in 3d space, positioning and elimination of the enemies ability to spot you would be key to winning the battle.
Based on conjecture, the BSA was probably developed in response to Point Defense being advanced to the point where computer could handle hundreds of small targets and eliminate them successfully, ruling out any carrier based warfare or missile swarms.
If it was only lasers/ion guns, it would be close ranged brawls (turreted not broadsides - turrets are way more superior considering maneuverability in space and getting a firing angle).

Violaceus wrote:We should remember that NT is mostly a company looking for profit so I imagine most ships are cargo vessels.
Syndicate also is not a single evil empire or even one organisation, I don't think they are capable of something more than covert operations and ocassionally nuclear strike team.

I'd like to think that NT is large enough to warrant having at least some degree of a private fleet, considering that when operating on the scale that they do it's more or less required to ensure that trade-ways stay clear and the Syndicate stays out of NT space.

Comrade Leo wrote:Bluespace weapons is a thing, and we know they have them mounted on forward firing cruisers from an away mission map. If that is the case it's possible that battles are spread far out with a 'battleships' playstyle like early WW1 naval encounters with escort/scouts/pickets probing for enemy fleets, and minor close engagements between the pickets of each. When you can teleport munitions direct on a point location in 3d space, positioning and elimination of the enemies ability to spot you would be key to winning the battle.

That does beg the question of Bluespace tech's wider availability: Is it so commonplace outside of the super high-tech research labs that it's totally redefined the style of combat? If that was the case, I imagine there'd be some pretty cool boarding parties. Although it's arguably more efficient to bomb a ship's key systems with your fancy bluespace, you get mad style points for teleporting into the Bridge and capturing their Captain.

Comrade Leo wrote:Based on conjecture, the BSA was probably developed in response to Point Defense being advanced to the point where computer could handle hundreds of small targets and eliminate them successfully, ruling out any carrier based warfare or missile swarms.

Probably the best explanation. Point defense drones when?

I wonder what turn things will take once teleport disruption tech becomes available, with near-perfect point defense being a thing I imagine it's back to super-sized laser cannons or mass drivers.

Maybe a form of anti-teleportation technology already exists, meaning bluespace weapons are ineffective in directly attacking a ship.

DemonFiren wrote:I wonder what turn things will take once teleport disruption tech becomes available, with near-perfect point defense being a thing I imagine it's back to super-sized laser cannons or mass drivers.

Steelpoint wrote:Maybe a form of anti-teleportation technology already exists, meaning bluespace weapons are ineffective in directly attacking a ship.

I've wanted Bluespace Disruption Fields for ages now.

We know NT owns several planets (the mime/clown planet being one), they are a corporation that has become a "national entity", and are large enough to warrant all over corps banding together towards eliminating them. Despite them being corporate, they would see strategic sense to equip their naval power with the absolute best they can muster, profit and loss in war goes out the window when the end losses are so great to include the possible collapse of the corporation, no expense then would be spared to prevent it. Considered the aforementioned away mission with a BSA cruiser, if they are more than willing to waste a cruiser on a mission to blow a hole in a station that has no way of retaliating (when even a single deathsquad could literally take it over), implies bluespace tech is cheap and widespread, at least in their military.

As a side note, the antag objective of stealing hand teles is probably a mission to achieve:

Maybe a form of anti-teleportation technology already exists, meaning bluespace weapons are ineffective in directly attacking a ship.

Comrade Leo wrote:We know NT owns several planets (the mime/clown planet being one), they are a corporation that has become a "national entity", and are large enough to warrant all over corps banding together towards eliminating them. Despite them being corporate, they would see strategic sense to equip their naval power with the absolute best they can muster, profit and loss in war goes out the window when the end losses are so great to include the possible collapse of the corporation, no expense then would be spared to prevent it. Considered the aforementioned away mission with a BSA cruiser, if they are more than willing to waste a cruiser on a mission to blow a hole in a station that has no way of retaliating (when even a single deathsquad could literally take it over), implies bluespace tech is cheap and widespread, at least in their military.

I've actually never played the away mission in question.

Anyways, yeah, you'd think that the NT fleet(s) would be consolidations of whatever military holdings they have considering they doubtless acknowledge the need for them, and more to the point, they would spare no expense to ensure that business carries on in the NT-approved sense of 'smooth'. Somewhat-related: Are Deathsquad the rank-and-file combatants in the rare(?) planetary direct warzones? Or are they more like marines/spec ops, with a more standard military branch handling the majority of operations?

I see them as a corporate sub-contract mercs, maybe a subsidiary of NT but off the books so they can claim none involvement. Their name suggests anonymous para-military, as nobody who has ever employed deathsquads irl has ever admitted to using them. NT employees/citzens still have to remain loyal, NT wouldn't out and out back their use or advertise it, but would make it a subtle rumour in the same sense that the NSA/CIA persist the rumour they see all/can kill all, when it suits. I'd wager a bulk of NT military forces are mercenary contracts (subsidiary groups again) in much the same way privatised police forces work in the US.

I imagine NT bought up a private security firm or ten and now uses them as in-house asset protection. ERP are mostly soldier-equivalents, Deaf Squid are spec-ops.

Either that, or all non-Security combatants NT hires really are Belltower-style.

"Artillery wars" where ships are just big fucking BSA guns that shoot at enemy. Or really base-based warfare where they just have to keep their facilities secret or they get blammed by BSA, except that makes no sense since they can get on SS13.

Now battles over a planet, there things get interesting.
Ground bases may or may not be capable of deploying BSAs. Attacking forces may or may not care about not hitting the planet behind their targets.

maybe in the year of our lord 2550 shits all done through subversion, diplomacy, sneaking around, assasinations and suckin a little d.

Big Faggot wrote:maybe in the year of our lord 2550 shits all done through subversion, diplomacy, sneaking around, assasinations and suckin a little d.

>nuke ops


Also why hasn't the syndicate heard of nuclear missiles. I mean, we're even in space - you don't have to design around an atmosphere or the curvature of a planet. Bring a ship in close and pull the trigger.

Cipher3 wrote:

Big Faggot wrote:maybe in the year of our lord 2550 shits all done through subversion, diplomacy, sneaking around, assasinations and suckin a little d.

>nuke ops


Also why hasn't the syndicate heard of nuclear missiles. I mean, we're even in space - you don't have to design around an atmosphere or the curvature of a planet. Bring a ship in close and pull the trigger.

The shuttle is called an 'Infiltrator' if I recall correctly, so my thoughts are that:
1.) As ComradeLeo said, we have point-defense systems that almost totally invalidate that shit
2.) We're in NT-controlled space and thus a conventional warship would have a hard time blasting it's way to the station

In my head there is only one method of resolving ship-to-ship conflict

And that method is RAMMING SPEED

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NT clearly has the edge in this, given their ability to manufacture plasteel out of plasma, the thing they've got and no one else does. I also assume they build their various spacecrap huge (see: boxstation) so even when shit rams them they have a shitload of unrammed space to not suffocate and die in.

Also their evac systems are pretty fucking good. Assumedly SS13 is in some remote ass-end of spess, far the hell away from Central Command, so Centcomm evac shuttles getting there in just ten minutes is probably pretty fucking good.