[POLL] Murderbone as antag

[scaredofshadows]

Bottom post of the previous page:

We're finally going to add this to the rules. I'd suggest that silent mass murder (without roleplaying of any kind) can be considered a bannable offense under rule 1. These bans might be anywhere from 24h to permanent and would be subject to review.

The community should decide what constitutes unacceptable murderbone with no roleplaying elements. I'm going to define 'unusual objectives' for the purpose of this thread as any objective where mass murder is an aid to rather than a hindrance from completing objectives. Obviously 'escape alone' requires a lot of murder. Assassinate one person and steal one item not only does not require mass murder, the odds of succeeding go down when you have the rest of the station hunting for you. Antagonists who have a reasonable motive for mass murder (borgs during Malf for example) are not under scrutiny here.

[Stickymayhem]

Alternatively you could all stop going LOOK THESE PEOPLE AGREE WITH ME THAT'S BECAUSE I'M RIGHT LOL every time the votes swing one way or another.

Unless it's like 20 against 2 it really doesn't matter. Votes should display close to unanimous support to be the reason for change. But they usually don't. In my opinion they aren't a good idea and discourage discussion in favour of slapping your votes on the table and fencing with them.

Just use your words to explain why something is good or not. Then use your words against someone else's words if you disagree with them. Then shut the fuck up and sit back and let whoever is in charge make their decision.

[Deuce]

Any rules against powergaming should apply to antags too.

[callanrockslol]

Any rules against powergaming should apply to antags too.

Are you actually retarded or do you just pretend to be on the internet for fun?

Antags are about completing an objective and antagonizing the station, how they do that is up to them, either they RP their way to a greentext or they take it through force or subterfuge.

Saying antags cannot powergame is literally saying that they are not allowed to do their fucking role.

[cedarbridge]

Any rules against powergaming should apply to antags too.

Are you actually retarded or do you just pretend to be on the internet for fun?

Antags are about completing an objective and antagonizing the station, how they do that is up to them, either they RP their way to a greentext or they take it through force or subterfuge.

Saying antags cannot powergame is literally saying that they are not allowed to do their fucking role.

And sec's role is to play stupid so that the antag has an easier time completing that objective clearly.

[Timbrewolf]

The poll can't be trusted as accurate anyway, people have been making multiple forum accounts to spam them.

Please give several examples

It was investigated by stickymayhem and myself, and confirmed by MSO last night that several trash accounts were made just to vote in polls. It's been changed so that 10 forum posts are now required to vote in polls, but from what I know we can't take off the existing fake votes.

This isn't the first time this has happened either.

[Incoming]

Forum polls are worthless in terms of getting an objective cross section of the player base, moreso now that people who only visit the forums casually or not at all can't vote. I don't really think anything can be said definitively on any subject with any poll besides an in game poll, since that's the only dang place you can be sure everyone who actually plays the game can see it.

[Timbrewolf]

On the one hand you would think people who care more about the game will go through the trouble to make an account and post actively. It's not really asking a whole lot to just sign up and read the stuff.
On the other hand you're right, that a lot of people either don't care enough and would rather just spend all the time playing and talking in OOC, or they just don't like the community and don't want to engage with it beyond the game proper.

[Bibliodewangus]

Antags should be able to do whatever they want. You will kill this game if you limit their options.

How? Explain your points beyond stating them.

Well the whole point of SS13 is responding to a given round's "antagonist" be it traitors or meteors. If the traitors are restricted to a very limited course of action ie "your objective is to kill this guy so you can kill this guy and only this guy" then we will have the same maybe 5 rounds over and over. Antag either gets emag and goes to steal some items, or antag gets a sleepy pen and c4 to kill one guy then afks in a locker because he will get banned if he does anything creative. The stories that attracted me to SS13 we're all the crazy over the top shit the creative antags could do like releasing slimes all over the station or whatever, but that will never happen if you try to put rules in about what antags can and can't do. It basically forces everyone to play the same role all the time, every time, which is guaranteed to get boring.

Explain your points man! how could it possibly be good to tell antags what they can and can't do? maybe less people will die? that's a negative

[Cipher3]

Well the whole point of SS13 is responding to a given round's "antagonist"

No.

[Bibliodewangus]

Well the whole point of SS13 is responding to a given round's "antagonist"

No.

Ok explain to me why SS13 does not focus around dealing with antagonist threats to your space station and the ensuing RP that occurs as fallout. (Yes I know you can just RP with nothing going on, but there is a reason why extended always ends up with events happening.)

sidenote does anyone else notice this very prevalent attitude among SS13 players but this community specifically where if someone disagrees with you they flat out refuse to discuss it civilly and will respond to you right off the bat with a slew of insults or something like "No." It's really annoying and it doesn't do anything or anybody any good, why all the needless negativity? Even worse than the "no." replies in my opinion though are the people who try to censor the opinions of people they disagree with. You only legitimize what someone is saying by resorting to deleting everything they said. If they're so wrong then why does it matter if people hear what they have to say?

[Stickymayhem]

sidenote does anyone else notice this very prevalent attitude among SS13 players but this community specifically where if someone disagrees with you they flat out refuse to discuss it civilly and will respond to you right off the bat with a slew of insults or something like "No."

No.

Spoiler:

Fuck you.

[cedarbridge]

sidenote does anyone else notice this very prevalent attitude among SS13 players but this community specifically where if someone disagrees with you they flat out refuse to discuss it civilly and will respond to you right off the bat with a slew of insults or something like "No." It's really annoying and it doesn't do anything or anybody any good, why all the needless negativity? Even worse than the "no." replies in my opinion though are the people who try to censor the opinions of people they disagree with. You only legitimize what someone is saying by resorting to deleting everything they said. If they're so wrong then why does it matter if people hear what they have to say?

Seriously man, not every thread is another reason to complain about the tyranny of social interaction. Just stop.

[Redblaze3000]

Well the whole point of SS13 is responding to a given round's "antagonist"

No.

Ok explain to me why SS13 does not focus around dealing with antagonist threats to your space station and the ensuing RP that occurs as fallout. (Yes I know you can just RP with nothing going on, but there is a reason why extended always ends up with events happening.)

sidenote does anyone else notice this very prevalent attitude among SS13 players but this community specifically where if someone disagrees with you they flat out refuse to discuss it civilly and will respond to you right off the bat with a slew of insults or something like "No." It's really annoying and it doesn't do anything or anybody any good, why all the needless negativity? Even worse than the "no." replies in my opinion though are the people who try to censor the opinions of people they disagree with. You only legitimize what someone is saying by resorting to deleting everything they said. If they're so wrong then why does it matter if people hear what they have to say?

Because not everyone is required to respond to the antag. Also there are servers where RP flows no antags/events ever occur. This is a roleplaying game you aren't supposed to concentrate on the antag/possibility of a antag.

[cedarbridge]

Well the whole point of SS13 is responding to a given round's "antagonist"

No.

Ok explain to me why SS13 does not focus around dealing with antagonist threats to your space station and the ensuing RP that occurs as fallout. (Yes I know you can just RP with nothing going on, but there is a reason why extended always ends up with events happening.)

sidenote does anyone else notice this very prevalent attitude among SS13 players but this community specifically where if someone disagrees with you they flat out refuse to discuss it civilly and will respond to you right off the bat with a slew of insults or something like "No." It's really annoying and it doesn't do anything or anybody any good, why all the needless negativity? Even worse than the "no." replies in my opinion though are the people who try to censor the opinions of people they disagree with. You only legitimize what someone is saying by resorting to deleting everything they said. If they're so wrong then why does it matter if people hear what they have to say?

Because not everyone is required to respond to the antag. Also there are servers where RP flows no antags/events ever occur. This is a roleplaying game you aren't supposed to concentrate on the antag/possibility of a antag.

Even as a sec officer/warden/etc my round doesn't revolve around antags. Sure, determining "Ok there's lings on the station" "oh flukeops" or whatever might change how I approach the round, but it doesn't mean I stop doing whatever I was doing before the revelation. I'm still a warden. It really grinds my gears to hear morons saying things like "omg there's a guy murdering in maint but you're brigging me 4noraisin!" There is a reason (probably) and the existence of some legitimate antag is not an excuse for being a shit.

[Psyentific]

Well the whole point of SS13 is responding to a given round's "antagonist"

No.

Ok explain to me why SS13 does not focus around dealing with antagonist threats to your space station and the ensuing RP that occurs as fallout.

In a way, you're right.

SS13 is about everything going to shit as you and whomever else you're with desperately try not to die. Before that snap, that moment when the crew collectively realizes that everything's gone to shit, SS13 is about doing your job, being paranoid about your co-workers, getting murdered while doing your job, getting murdered for doing your job, and a somewhere in the whole thing there's a clown in riot gear that just keeps giving Security the slip.

If the primary focus of your round is "Stop the antags", you really ought to play Security. Otherwise...eh.

It's the antagonists job to make that 'snap' happen; To create that gradual buildup into full-blown blood-covered-hallways chaos. To break some windows and steal some shit at 15m, spawn holocarp at the 30m mark, open a plasma can in the library at 45m, and C4 the cloner and force a shuttle call at the one hour mark.

[Bibliodewangus]

No I agree, it's very fun when you are just playing your job and trying to run the station. The most fun though is when you're watching everything go to hell and try to keep doing your job.

[callanrockslol]

The most fun is 4 hour long rounds that end with the entire station coming together to fortify Arrivals to keep a deathsquad out and then fight to the last.

[omnitricks]

I have no problems with murderbone but I have problems with shuttle ping pong just to get the murderbone continuing while I stay dead for another half an hour I ain't getting back. Sure I get pissed if some idiot with a steal objective comes and murder me for no reason but thats half the fun of it.

[Ergovisavi]

Murderbonering is fine, SS13 without it is dull, as the sense of paranoia is quicky, quickly lost.

The one thing that isn't fine is repeatedly recalling the shuttle while also murderbonering. You've had your fun, time to move on with the round.

[Steelpoint]

Wrong thread, but relevant bump.

[Sum Ting Wong]

It was a terrible idea to bitch about the recent policy change. Please god put it back.

[cedarbridge]

It was a terrible idea to bitch about the recent policy change. Please god put it back.

It does still exist for extreme cases (as it always has and was only made clearer and codified by the original announcement) under Rules 0 and 1.