/tg/Station 13

Posted: **Fri Dec 28, 2018 1:58 pm**

According to the roundstart fluff detectives are not supposed to make arrests yada yada.

I've always seen that as a roleplay suggestion much like spesslaw is, especially since promoted detectives don't get to see this text at all.

However it's been used as an argument as part of a ban(valid or not aside and it's only a small part of the whole reasoning) but I'd like a clear guideline from the headmins because I've never enforced the detective can't arrest thing myself since I thought it was roleplay fluff.

An additional note is that anyone can arrest anyone, ye olde citizen arrest. Since it's roleplay fluff it should probably not protect you from sec arresting you for making well, unlawful arrests, if your reasoning is dumb.
Also if we are enforcing this roleplay fluff this would mean detectives don't have the same escalation protection as security which may or may not be the case already.

Posted: **Fri Dec 28, 2018 2:01 pm**

it's there to discourage validhunting with the stupidly powerful detective's revolver
since validhunting isn't discouraged anymore it should be dropped

Posted: **Fri Dec 28, 2018 2:12 pm**

dets that run off into maint to catch baddies are the worst, even moreso than wardens that leave the brig, change my mind

Posted: **Fri Dec 28, 2018 2:22 pm**

DemonFiren wrote:it's there to discourage validhunting with the stupidly powerful detective's revolver
since validhunting isn't discouraged anymore it should be dropped

Emphasis mine.

Hasn't the detective's revolver recently been nerfed, and now it's just considered equivalent to a stetchkin?

Posted: **Fri Dec 28, 2018 3:02 pm**

Why would you want to further nerf the underdog?

No access.
Starts out with a mindshield implant.
Taser (1 hit gg - 4 shots) / Disabler (3 hit gg - 8 shots) > Revolver (4 hits - 6 shots, hassle to reload in combat) - Revolver has been nerfed to the point that one is better asking the warden for a taser.

If the rules aren't changed 180 degrees, then there is no reason to prevent the detective from catching the bad guys. Being a detective is not about being a boring pencil pusher only. Think of shows like The Wire and The Shield.

Edit: Security positions are underfilled most of the time, because its more beneficial to be a valid hunting assistant as the bad guys won't even see you coming when you pull out your sawn off shotgun and fill them with rubbershot etc.

Posted: **Fri Dec 28, 2018 4:00 pm**

We don't have any RP restrictions on player actions on this server, outside of no ERP and no OOC in IC. And the rule that requires heads of staff and the AI to at least make a minimum effort to do their job if that counts.

So no, the detective fluff matters as little as space law does.

Posted: **Fri Dec 28, 2018 5:17 pm**

I would say it matters. Think of it like a clown who ditches his shoes at round start except the crew can bully the clown. The det who runs off and demands HUDs and various sec gear and then acts like sec all round is worthy of ridicule and often gets a lot of it... but he has the means to fuck you up if you bully him and has sec backing him. Dunno how best to handle it. Id be cool with particularly shitty dets getting det ban so they can just play actual sec and learn the difference but i dont know if thats a direction that admins would want to go as it could be too subjective. I think its fine for dets to handle crime infront of them but primarily they should be communicating with sec and providing evidence against criminals.

Posted: **Fri Dec 28, 2018 5:40 pm**

That's all IC conflict though, if they want to make fun of each other or something. Our current rules don't require the detective to only detect. So no, the detective fluff doesn't matter right now. There might be value in discussing "should we make the detective fluff matter?" But I feel like that's going to enable a whole pile of line toeing and enforcement issues.

Posted: **Fri Dec 28, 2018 5:43 pm**

DrunkenMatey wrote:I would say it matters. Think of it like a clown who ditches his shoes at round start except the crew can bully the clown. The det who runs off and demands HUDs and various sec gear and then acts like sec all round is worthy of ridicule and often gets a lot of it... but he has the means to fuck you up if you bully him and has sec backing him. Dunno how best to handle it. Id be cool with particularly shitty dets getting det ban so they can just play actual sec and learn the difference but i dont know if thats a direction that admins would want to go as it could be too subjective. I think its fine for dets to handle crime infront of them but primarily they should be communicating with sec and providing evidence against criminals.

Why would you want to force the detective to have massive blueballs and rely on the competency of other sec by not allowing them to catch criminals after grinding to solve the crimes? Especially in times, where higher ups not brigging traitors with sleeping carp that deflect projectiles in front of their eyes is considered IC issue? Saying that only Captain or other head players can have fun and decide whats going on takes away agency from everybody else - doesn't matter that you ground for 30 minutes to track down the identity of the maintenance murderer, you can't catch him and if he is caught you can't decide whats going to happen. Le epic fun game.

Edit: Meanwhile a random assistant slips the guy with double sword, kills him, loots him and thats a-okay. Yet, you, the detective player are the problem there is no RP on the server!!

Posted: **Fri Dec 28, 2018 6:00 pm**

If you see a crime happening go nuts. But main job of det is finding out who committed a crime, set em to wanted and tell sec to bring em in. You can then have your fun telling the guy how you caught em if thats your thing. If sec isnt cooperating with you then fine go get em or if you see them while you are investigating fine. But walking around with sec huds you dont start with shooting people with a grey square or a w next to their name is not your job.

Posted: **Fri Dec 28, 2018 6:03 pm**

I'm assuming this is for when sec is populated, because lower pop rounds can find that the detective and warden are the only two security personnel on the station.

It has never mattered and shouldn't. The hard lines of what's expected of the job has only ever been defined by habitual behavior and silicons. If you want to make the detective explicitly a private investigator then you need to make several code changes that separate them from security (and not just map changes...).

Space Law is used only when it suits the individual invoking it, including admins. Fluff text should only matter in lavaland since there are rules explicitly telling you to follow such.

Posted: **Fri Dec 28, 2018 6:18 pm**

DrunkenMatey wrote:If you see a crime happening go nuts. But main job of det is finding out who committed a crime, set em to wanted and tell sec to bring em in. You can then have your fun telling the guy how you caught em if thats your thing. If sec isnt cooperating with you then fine go get em or if you see them while you are investigating fine. But walking around with sec huds you dont start with shooting people with a grey square or a w next to their name is not your job.

Yeah, thats why you use cameras (sec hud is vital, unless you want to get a pixelburn on your retina and carpatunnel) and do occasional maintenance sweeps.I personally shoot only when I have gathered enough intel to put them away and they are actively running away or have received intel over the comms. I rarely see detectives running around and gunning down random Ws, then again who even mains the detective beside people who like being gimped.

Posted: **Fri Dec 28, 2018 6:31 pm**

Ok lets be real here. The only reason we are having this discussion is because you have been playing a shit ton of detective and people hate how you play det. If you get the odd shit det n and then its no big deal but when its the same guy over and over and over then people bitch enough that we get this thread. So then the real question is, should you have to change your play style? Or should people stop bitching?

Thats more for admins to decide. Ive had bad and ok experiences with you. Ive had you shoot me down and arrest me for having a captain icon next to my name because HoP gave me all access, then ended up losing my id entirely and getting dicked around for awhile before finally getting let out, at which point HoP gave me a new all access mime ID (he was an antag of some sort). So is that normal good det behaviour? Didnt seem like it to me but whatever. Ive cremated you as an antag and ive saved your ass as a nonantag and will continue to treat you like a new person every round, being kind or dickish depending on how weve interacted during that round. But my impression of you is that you are a lawful evil kinda guy. You are treating space law as the word of god and using it to kill/maim/fuckover everyone you can.

P.s. why dont you just play sec or HoS if you think det is gimp? Seriously, if you were a HoS main people might not like you but I doubt youd be getting this level of attention/scrutiny.

Edit: an idea. For everyone who see a det player they hate, why not set det to high the next round and play it how you want it to be played?

Posted: **Fri Dec 28, 2018 6:38 pm**

If admins aren't going to ban people who make max caps and blow bits of the station up to stop antagonists, they certainly shouldn't be doing anything against a member of security stopping arresting people

maybe the people being arrested by the detective need to stop doing things that deserve being arrested for

Posted: **Fri Dec 28, 2018 6:41 pm**

I don't play detective to fuck over people. I play detective to do my job, which is catching the bad guys. I like to think that the reason some people complain about me is due to my better-than-average detection skills. The same way people complain about somebody being super robust at murderboning - "Oh, man deswording is so cheap!", yet when they try to do it themselves, they get dunked within the first 5 minutes.

I never interfere with the actions of the red team - if you are implanted at the round start, then you do you. Perma an assistant for pushing you? Not my problem.

I don't play HoS, because I like to look at the pixels on my screen. Meaning Lizards are barred from Head positions from round start.

DrunkenMatey wrote:Edit: an idea. For everyone who see a det player they hate, why not set det to high the next round and play it how you want it to be played?

Thats a splendid idea. Not only that, set sec high or medium as well.

Fatal wrote:maybe the people being arrested by the detective need to stop doing things that deserve being arrested for

Another solid point. I don't think there has been any arrests or interruptions for somebody just grinding away at their workplace.

Posted: **Fri Dec 28, 2018 6:52 pm**

The true problem revealed! Lizard player!

Posted: **Fri Dec 28, 2018 7:08 pm**

Ladies and gentlemen, we got him!

DrunkenMatey wrote:Ive had bad and ok experiences with you.

Don't forget the countless good experiences, where we never met or met for brief moments as we passed by each other.

Posted: **Fri Dec 28, 2018 7:19 pm**

Detectives revolver was nerfed into horizontalising people by critting them. detectives still use it to arrest, though. Anyone who picks detective to play security but with a ballistic is worthy of ridicule.

Posted: **Fri Dec 28, 2018 7:37 pm**

The fluff doesn't really matter, I can't see the server starting to enforce people to play their jobs properly so it's pointless to expect the same on a detective. Security officer gets access to all the tools needed to play that role so picking Detective to do the same job is just doing it for the fashion. The detective gun isn't even good anymore. If you are tired of a non-human detective shooting perps you can just remind AI to make sure it doesn't harm humans with it's harm only gun. As a HoS/Warden you can always tell the detective to fuck off when they ask for Huds and security gear, usually it's worth giving them the huds though. Taser is nice but if a detective wants to do the role of a Security Officer maybe they should have picked Security Officer. There is always a sec slot open. Either-way we haven't really stopped valid hunter detectives in the past and I would be surprised if we stopped them now.

Posted: **Fri Dec 28, 2018 7:38 pm**

Dax what in the fuck do you mean anyone can make arrests. Civilian Arrests are the most looked down upon things in the game. If I’m warden half the time I’ll let people arrested that way go to spite the assistant with a stun baton who brought them in.

And I believe current policy is that detective isn’t limited to any sort of gameplay. When I first started playing I didn’t think det should be allowed to make arrests, but when I ahelped admins told me otherwise. I personally think that detectives should identify criminals, not hunt them. However if we start enforcing this, there’ll be too much argument and its stupid to force people to play a certain way.

That being said, detectives are mechanically suggested to just identify criminals and maybe make a small amount of arrests. They have no non harmful way of bringing down targets at range, their baton has a cooldown, and they don’t have sec huds.

Enter why most people hate this guy when he plays detective. He guns you down into crit to make an arrest, and then screams AI rogue when it dunks him for harming humans. He ignores the mechanical limitations of the job, begging for sec gear and the like.

Posted: **Fri Dec 28, 2018 7:42 pm**

Detective fluff doesn't really matter, but a good detective will stick somewhat to the fluff. In the same way space law shouldn't be referenced in regards to rules, detective fluff shouldn't be referenced either.

Posted: **Fri Dec 28, 2018 7:46 pm**

>Tell detective that no, they can't have the sechuds that they don't start with

at least one of the following now inevitably happens
guy whinges at sec officers to give him huds/steals them from a nearby locker
guy is extremely incompetent and rude to warden/hos for rest of round "maybe I could've shot those juggernauts if I had a sechud!!!!!"

Posted: **Fri Dec 28, 2018 7:50 pm**

wesoda25 wrote:If I’m warden half the time I’ll let people arrested that way go to spite the assistant with a stun baton who brought them in.

And thats why its easier for the assistant who is in the right to just execute on the spot, if they know the Warden is going to be incompetent and probably let an antag they caught go.

wesoda25 wrote:However if we start enforcing this, there’ll be too much argument and its stupid to force people to play a certain way.

Agree, doubt the profession gets any more popular if you have to "hurr durr arr pee MY WAY!!" or its dingdongbannu.

wesoda25 wrote:He guns you down into crit to make an arrest, and then screams AI rogue when it dunks him for harming humans. He ignores the mechanical limitations of the job, begging for sec gear and the like.

That, my friend, is a bold claim. Usually when people get gunned down by me there is more than enough evidence to put them away and/or they are actively resisting. Obviously you as an antag would love if detective couldn't use ranged weapons and always had to engage in the "50/50 melee game of disarm spam and getting dunked on". Have you ever tried batoning running people with 200ms latency? I think not. Mechanical limitations cannot be ignored, I rely on sec to be competent and time the cells, since I don't have access - this has backfired such as Warden or HoS letting traitors with Carp go and so on.

AI has never dunked me, there have been few singular cases of borgs acting rogue, one of them turned out to be 14 years old. That particular borg interfered with me detaining a glowwy boy, who was not a human.

@confused rock, maybe its time to put down the pipe?

Posted: **Fri Dec 28, 2018 8:02 pm**

DemonFiren wrote:it's there to discourage validhunting with the stupidly powerful detective's revolver
since validhunting isn't discouraged anymore it should be dropped

t. doesn't play the game ever so isn't even aware of balance changes that took place months ago
stick to the hut, sweatie

Posted: **Fri Dec 28, 2018 8:04 pm**

wesoda25 wrote:If I’m warden half the time I’ll let people arrested that way go to spite the assistant with a stun baton who brought them in.

Not all heroes wear capes. I also let at least 3 people go a round because they get dumped into a cell wordlessly and the officer who brought them in ignores me when I ask what they're in for.

wesoda25 wrote:Enter why most people hate this guy when he plays detective. He guns you down into crit to make an arrest, and then screams AI rogue when it dunks him for harming humans. He ignores the mechanical limitations of the job, begging for sec gear and the like.

I have both been begged for sec gear as warden AND called rogue for trying to prevent harm. I miss the days when silicons could actually dunk people for shit, I was completely powerless to stop a murderous captain and their cat lackey warden last night.

We need some Chad HOS players to come on and put the detectives in their places. I try when I play warden but it's met with mixed results. "I arrested and fired the detective because he shot up 6 people, beat 2 of them into crit, and 1 of them was actually guilty" "Fuck you ligger give the detective his ID back for dunking 1 traitor in 6 attempts"

Posted: **Fri Dec 28, 2018 8:07 pm**

Back in my day, det gun did fuck all damage with normal ammo but stunned people... of course most dets back then made lethal rounds or got a stun revolver from r&d >.>

Posted: **Fri Dec 28, 2018 8:08 pm**

Isto I don’t think you understand assistants shouldn’t concern themselves with antags to begin with, unless they actually fuck with them. The mentality of “assistants should just execute antags themselves” is a reallllyyyy shitty one and it doesn’t surprise me you got a sec ban.

And you complaining about not being able to take someone down at melee range is possibly a reason why you shouldn’t be making arrests as detective.

Also crocodillo I get that issue all the time. I demote someone who is fucking god awful at sec, and then I’m valid to be attacked by them????

Posted: **Fri Dec 28, 2018 8:11 pm**

wesoda25 wrote: Also crocodillo I get that issue all the time. I demote someone who is fucking god awful at sec, and then I’m valid to be attacked by them????

I get this problem all the fukken time lmao it sucks

Posted: **Fri Dec 28, 2018 8:15 pm**

When you get an HOS that actually tries to manage the department instead of just solo hunting antags it's great. On the rare occasion I play a human and HOS I try to not fight antags myself until shit gets bad(plus I'm not robust at all).

Posted: **Fri Dec 28, 2018 8:18 pm**

wesoda25 wrote:Isto I don’t think you understand assistants shouldn’t concern themselves with antags to begin with, unless they actually fuck with them. The mentality of “assistants should just execute antags themselves” is a reallllyyyy shitty one and it doesn’t surprise me you got a sec ban.

And you complaining about not being able to take someone down at melee range is possibly a reason why you shouldn’t be making arrests as detective.

Also crocodillo I get that issue all the time. I demote someone who is fucking god awful at sec, and then I’m valid to be attacked by them????

I think you are missing the point. I am against assistants validhunting and executing. Just pointed it out why there are people who do it, because you brought up that you are an incompetent warden at times.

Edit: People play assistantcurities, because "if they push me or steal my thing - valid, lol" (looser escalation, cant execute as sec if they steal something from you) and "lol i can just dick around the entire shift without having to contribute to it".

Posted: **Fri Dec 28, 2018 8:27 pm**

wesoda25 wrote:Dax what in the fuck do you mean anyone can make arrests. Civilian Arrests are the most looked down upon things in the game. If I’m warden half the time I’ll let people arrested that way go to spite the assistant with a stun baton who brought them in.

You chumbis I mean admin action wise. We don't boink clowns for making a legit arrest of a tot. This is the policy forum about what admins SHOULD and SHOULDN'T enforce in regards to administrative actions.

Posted: **Fri Dec 28, 2018 8:30 pm**

wesoda25 wrote:I demote someone who is fucking god awful at sec, and then I’m valid to be attacked by them????

I don't think demotion should be a green-light for escalation unless it's completely arbitrary. I suppose the problem then is that people will argue over what a arbitrary demotion is. Moot point I suppose as a demoted officer going full ham on security for a legitimate demotion will probably eat a ban one way or another and everything in between is just in game conflict.

Posted: **Fri Dec 28, 2018 8:32 pm**

Arr Pee is very subjective and should not be enforced. Some people are okay with doing things that are justifiable IC, while some require you to become the vampire wizards and if you say anything out of line, you will be shunned for life!

If admins want to increase the RP interactions, there is a solution - slow the pace of the game down, remove 1 hit ggs, enforce anti-tiding policies. The problem was never sec, it has always been the tiders.

Posted: **Fri Dec 28, 2018 8:35 pm**

Gigapuddi420 wrote:
wesoda25 wrote:I demote someone who is fucking god awful at sec, and then I’m valid to be attacked by them????
I don't think demotion should be a green-light for escalation unless it's completely arbitrary. I suppose the problem then is that people will argue over what a arbitrary demotion is. Moot point I suppose as a demoted officer going full ham on security for a legitimate demotion will probably eat a ban one way or another and everything in between is just in game conflict.

It usually is considered IC conflict though. If you're shitsec enough to get fired but not enough to get bwoinked you can usually retaliate against whoever fired you.

Posted: **Fri Dec 28, 2018 8:39 pm**

Detectives literally start with handcuffs in most maps and 100% a baton that does not lose charge, how are they NOT mechanically encouraged to make arrests?

Posted: **Fri Dec 28, 2018 8:43 pm**

Cobby wrote:Detectives literally start with handcuffs in most maps and 100% a baton that does not lose charge, how are they NOT mechanically encouraged to make arrests?

Disarms exist. Slips exist.

Posted: **Fri Dec 28, 2018 8:44 pm**

They are, but the original idea was more self defense and emergencies(nvm the fact that the old revolver was incredibly strong). The police baton has a much shorter stun than a baton and they have no built in access to flashbangs so it's much harder to fight more than 1 scrub.

Not getting SecHuds is dumb, and has always been dumb. Being able to see someone's status and set someone to arrest with a glance when you see them commit a crime is a big part of being a snoop like you're supposed to be.

Posted: **Fri Dec 28, 2018 8:47 pm**

By having that baton have a heavy cooldown, having only the singular pair of cuffs, not starting with sechuds, and having a lethal weapon. We removed the detective's office from sec a while ago too, remember that thing that didn't last? I'm pretty sure they're mechanically discouraged from chasing down criminals when not defending themselves.

Posted: **Fri Dec 28, 2018 8:49 pm**

wesoda25 wrote:Disarms exist. Slips exist.

Hey, newfriend who has never been on field, if you open yourself up for 50/50 plays, then you are going to spend a lot of time observing as a ghost.

There are numerous accessories that exist for people like you. From Beepsky Smash rags to Ebows in Storage Implant. And you will be observing again as a ghost.

Edit: As long as there are 1 hit ggs in our laggy 2D spessman, things cannot be expected to change.

Posted: **Fri Dec 28, 2018 8:57 pm**

I think detectives are fine to chase down a suspect they discovered through detecting (like forensic scanner indicates who did a crime) they just shouldnt be patrolling or responding to smaller conflicts. Its where not having sechuds would limit them to busting people they know are guilty through their detecting rather than just running around looking for Ws and brining in people when they have no idea why the person is set to arrest.

Basically dets shouls be pretty single minded in running down one lead at a time is how i see it.

Posted: **Fri Dec 28, 2018 9:04 pm**

DrunkenMatey wrote:Basically dets shouls be pretty single minded in running down one lead at a time is how i see it.

That face when I have been doing so for tha past 2 months. Although, I still think the gameplay should not be restricted, even if some shmuck wants to chase down random Ws, unless you remove mindshield implant and allow detectives to be antags, so they can forge/plant evidence, even though it would be easily metad. Say something over comms - "ITS A COMMS AGENT!!", get a red suit - "CANT BE OPS, NOT ENOUGH PEOPLE", etc.

Posted: **Fri Dec 28, 2018 9:06 pm**

how come people get all this MUH SERIOUS RP and due process shit on the detective when assistants can break into the kitchen to gib a ling? shouldn't they just report it to security and let them do their job if we're going for deep immershuns? does someone even get in trouble for cremating a confirmed antag/someone acting like one and getting what they had coming? I can't avoid laughing at the idea of some retard ahelping cause they got dunked while being a traitor/stealing cap spare/breaking into high sec places, and yet because the fluff text you get when spawning as det this is now somehow wrong or disallowed?

Posted: **Fri Dec 28, 2018 9:13 pm**

wesoda25 wrote:
Cobby wrote:Detectives literally start with handcuffs in most maps and 100% a baton that does not lose charge, how are they NOT mechanically encouraged to make arrests?
Disarms exist. Slips exist.

Yes, I'm aware they exist?

confused rock wrote:By having that baton have a heavy cooldown, having only the singular pair of cuffs, not starting with sechuds, and having a lethal weapon. We removed the detective's office from sec a while ago too, remember that thing that didn't last? I'm pretty sure they're mechanically discouraged from chasing down criminals when not defending themselves.

But they DO have the resources to arrest from the getgo, just not as well as sec officers (as it should be). That doesn't mean they CAN'T do these things, it's just that they have to go through more loops to get such.

Going through these loops repeatedly is no different than an atmos tech optimizing the SM (not Delta) the same time every round then doing solars, or a MD asking for chem access every round to make meds. While it might not be the individual's job, they still adhere to the department's responsibilities. People only dislike it when the detective does it because it means they go to monopoly jail more.

I mean, look no further than security. If a sec officer wanted to nab the forensic scanner (spare) repeatedly, would you expect him to get banned for it? Isn't he butting in the detective's job since he should be making arrests and watching for direct crime violations rather than doing the investigative work? Could he do all three?

As for the code changes, the map got reverted because the separation of Det/Sec was not seen to fruition so it was just a nuisance. Like I said above,

If you want to make the detective explicitly a private investigator then you need to make several code changes that separate them from security (and not just map changes...).

Posted: **Fri Dec 28, 2018 9:15 pm**

@teepeepee

I agree that tiding is a bigger issue but there are a lot of tiders so its harder to single one out. This thread is 100% because isto has been playing detective a fuck ton lately and enough people hate how he plays that we see this thread.

Posted: **Fri Dec 28, 2018 9:19 pm**

DrunkenMatey wrote:@teepeepee

I agree that tiding is a bigger issue but there are a lot of tiders so its harder to single one out. This thread is 100% because isto has been playing detective a fuck ton lately and enough people hate how he plays that we see this thread.

I don't see any issue though just people needing to be remidned of rule 10, that's what I'm saying, god bless you detective lizard

Posted: **Fri Dec 28, 2018 9:34 pm**

Istoprocent1 wrote:
wesoda25 wrote:Disarms exist. Slips exist.
Hey, newfriend who has never been on field, if you open yourself up for 50/50 plays, then you are going to spend a lot of time observing as a ghost.

There are numerous accessories that exist for people like you. From Beepsky Smash rags to Ebows in Storage Implant. And you will be observing again as a ghost.

Edit: As long as there are 1 hit ggs in our laggy 2D spessman, things cannot be expected to change.

You autistic cocky piece of lizard shit, your post fucking agrees with me. I’m saying only making arrests with the baton is not smart, hence why its mechanically discouraged to make arrests.

Good God you’re a pleasure to talk with.

Posted: **Fri Dec 28, 2018 9:36 pm**

@teepeepee

I guess. Rule 10 does have a provision for admin involvement if things happen too often though and you could argue rule 1, though rule 1 is kind of a weird rule in general as there are many ic reasons to be a dick to people so... i imagine the conclusion here is either admins asking him to change the way he plays or telling people to stop bitching about him.

Edit: who am i kidding? Any resolution to this will come from his ban appeal thread not this thread.

Posted: **Fri Dec 28, 2018 10:01 pm**

Istoprocent gives detectives a bad name

Posted: **Fri Dec 28, 2018 10:31 pm**

NikNakFlak wrote:Istoprocent gives detectives a bad name

Posted: **Fri Dec 28, 2018 10:44 pm**

Detectives should be encouraged to actually play like a detective but it shouldn't be against the rules to be a shit detective who goes around acting like an officer

Should be treated like a shoeless clown

/tg/Station 13

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