[MRP] Can we just entirely ban ghost roles going to the station to second life?

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spookuni
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[MRP] Can we just entirely ban ghost roles going to the station to second life?

Postby spookuni » Fri Sep 18, 2020 10:15 pm #576778

It's getting unreasonably common on Manuel that ghost roles like the charlie crew, free golems, lavaland hermits and anything else that can get a clear run to the station are used to spawn in, and then immediately assemble as quickly as possible a method of travelling to the main station so that they can play in the normal round as essentially a normal crewmember at best, or an annoying shitter at worst. This after dying or choosing to observe. Just this week we've had a lavaland hermit grab the Gluttony morph syringe and come up to the station to antag and eat the armoury, and a few days ago we had a charlie sec officer rush to the main station to ask for a promotion to station sec. Generally the defence to this kind of action is that the flavour text of the ghost role in question doesn't specifically prohibit Metaing the information that A. (the station exists) and B. (how to get to it) which seems rules lawyer-ey at best.

If respawns aren't a thing that the administration is interested in enabling or accepting, can we please just skip Ashwalker Flavour Text Policy V2.0 (This time for every flavour text that isn't locked down to prevent abuse) and just blanket ban ghost roles being used as a respawn or to spawn after choosing to observe?



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Sheodir
 
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Re: [MRP] Can we just entirely ban ghost roles going to the station to second life?

Postby Sheodir » Fri Sep 18, 2020 10:49 pm #576779

This is already policy, but should be enforced more often.
I play Holden Westmacott. Sec/PM main most of the time.

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Sylphet
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Re: [MRP] Can we just entirely ban ghost roles going to the station to second life?

Postby Sylphet » Sat Sep 19, 2020 6:09 am #576803

Yeah, we really should. The intention of these roles is not to collect gamer gear and then to go join the crew - doing that is cringe and defeats the purpose of the role. Especially Charliestation, where one person can wake up, take literally everything, and meta their way to SS13, leaving anyone who wanted to actually play it as intended without the equipment that they need.
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https://tgstation13.org/phpBB/viewtopic.php?f=37&t=27175

Timberpoes
 
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Re: [MRP] Can we just entirely ban ghost roles going to the station to second life?

Postby Timberpoes » Sat Sep 19, 2020 6:21 am #576804

The question is what level of this is acceptable?

Is the free golems converting one of their own to an AI, who then as soon as possible builds a bluespace teleporter to teleport up to the station, raid tech storage with their AA and quantum pad back down acceptable?

Speaking as a maintainer, it feels metagamey and powergamey as all hell every time I see it. It's ghost roles being played around the fact that they KNOW there's a station that they can just teleport to at will once they have the requisite techs. And teleport to it they do.

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Farquaar
 
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Re: [MRP] Can we just entirely ban ghost roles going to the station to second life?

Postby Farquaar » Sat Sep 19, 2020 8:27 am #576810

It's pretty much always lame to see ghost roles "miraculously" find the station. I rarely see it done in an interesting way.

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Stickymayhem
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Re: [MRP] Can we just entirely ban ghost roles going to the station to second life?

Postby Stickymayhem » Sat Sep 19, 2020 9:15 am #576815

spookuni wrote:It's getting unreasonably common on Manuel that ghost roles like the charlie crew, free golems, lavaland hermits and anything else that can get a clear run to the station are used to spawn in, and then immediately assemble as quickly as possible a method of travelling to the main station so that they can play in the normal round as essentially a normal crewmember at best, or an annoying shitter at worst. This after dying or choosing to observe. Just this week we've had a lavaland hermit grab the Gluttony morph syringe and come up to the station to antag and eat the armoury, and a few days ago we had a charlie sec officer rush to the main station to ask for a promotion to station sec. Generally the defence to this kind of action is that the flavour text of the ghost role in question doesn't specifically prohibit Metaing the information that A. (the station exists) and B. (how to get to it) which seems rules lawyer-ey at best.

If respawns aren't a thing that the administration is interested in enabling or accepting, can we please just skip Ashwalker Flavour Text Policy V2.0 (This time for every flavour text that isn't locked down to prevent abuse) and just blanket ban ghost roles being used as a respawn or to spawn after choosing to observe?


The gluttony morph syringe explicitly makes you antag so that's not part of the same issue
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vkalls
 
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Re: [MRP] Can we just entirely ban ghost roles going to the station to second life?

Postby vkalls » Sat Sep 19, 2020 2:52 pm #576825

I think that ghost roles should never go to the station to stay. Delta Station should pretty much never go to the station, but a role like the lavaland hermit could be "rescued" and taken to the station (I think, not sure what the flavortext on that is).
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spookuni
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Re: [MRP] Can we just entirely ban ghost roles going to the station to second life?

Postby spookuni » Sat Sep 19, 2020 3:18 pm #576826

Stickymayhem wrote: The gluttony morph syringe explicitly makes you antag so that's not part of the same issue


Feels pretty shitty that "using this item makes you an antag so all's fair" applies to people spawning in as lavaland ghost roles. It was before my time, so I'm not sure on the specifics, but weren't the lavaland xeno facehuggers removed for very similar reasons?

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Stickymayhem
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Re: [MRP] Can we just entirely ban ghost roles going to the station to second life?

Postby Stickymayhem » Sat Sep 19, 2020 5:43 pm #576831

spookuni wrote:
Stickymayhem wrote: The gluttony morph syringe explicitly makes you antag so that's not part of the same issue


Feels pretty shitty that "using this item makes you an antag so all's fair" applies to people spawning in as lavaland ghost roles. It was before my time, so I'm not sure on the specifics, but weren't the lavaland xeno facehuggers removed for very similar reasons?


The difference is morphs are extremely trash and Xenos are an often unstoppable round ender
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JusticeGoat
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Re: [MRP] Can we just entirely ban ghost roles going to the station to second life?

Postby JusticeGoat » Sun Sep 20, 2020 1:55 pm #576880

As a admin sometimes i just don't notice, i wish there was a hud icon or something in the antags panel that shows someone as a ghost spawn.


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