Heads give permission to drug makes you not valid?

[sirnat]

So today on Bagil I was the detective, doing detective things and generally just being a normal security member.

Saw a guy with my same last name (Ward) so as a joke I threw him into a reinforced window once and walked away, (From what ik this shit isn't lethal at all. )

Later on the QM is continuously pdaing me trying to obviously bait me somewhere.

Chemist then pdas me to come help him that someone was attacking him, obviously baiting as well.

So I goto the area only for the qm (This is the dude who I threw in the window /One/ time) shoot me with a syringe gun, me having .357 in my .38 (I didn't know you could actually do this until that round I remembered something about screw driving the gun).

Anyway he cried about how I was in the wrong about out right gunning him down for drugging me, killing him out right and after I killed him the HOS who was "Security Lizard" said she gave him permission to drug me because i was being "Shit" when all I truly did was throw the guy one time into a reinforced window.

I then took his corpse and spaced the body because for what I knew the dude was a traitor as he drugged me and could've killed me if I hadn't gunned him down before I fell unconcious.

PDA messages (May be a little wrong but I'm sure there's logs)
Qm to (Either cap or hos):Can I show Nathan Ward why he should never fuck with me and throw me into a window please? He wont die
Hos/Cap: "He doesn't die"
Qm:" I promise he wont die"
Hos/cap:"Then sure"

The hos after I spaced the corpse chased me into maint trying to stun me and to retaliate the shitty behavior I shot him once and threw two ninja stars into them, which yeah probably was shitty but they legit gave a guy permission to drug me and possibly kill me, which he said in deadchat he was basically going to do. Anyway hos and I die by a esword traitor and parasite in maint.

Big question here is: Just because a head of staff gives you permission can you seriously try and cry that the person you drugged doesn't have the right to kill you? Because last I checked shooting people with a syringe gun makes you valid especially security personnel.

[Davidchan]

HoS giving permission to assault people? The fuck? If anything you should have been brigged for 5-10 minutes for unprovoked assault on someone. Killing him for syringing you is valid, though kinda borderline at that. Spacing him without finding contraband is also a very dick move since a resourceful QM can probably get/trade a syringe full of capatellium from chemistry without much trouble, specially since the chemist was working with him.

As an afterthought, modding your revolver to 357 is pretty dumb unless you like it blowing up in your hands.

[TechnoAlchemist]

Yeah killing him for syringe gunning you is like, kinda shit but I get it, but unless you were dying from the chems that he shot you with why would you space him?

[CPTANT]

Another case of different people have different information about a situation.

Hos thinks qm wants to morphine the detective if he comes into cargo or something.

Detective sees someone shooting at him with an unknown syringe.

Syringes can kill you before you even know what is happening. If someone shoots me with an unknown syringe I am going to take him out.

[Malkevin]

If the end result of most fights was the loser getting spaced or turned into burgers then most fights wouldn't happen.

Getting thrown into a window is a shitty reason to go to the effort of getting a syringe gun and chemicals to go in it.

[Saegrimr]

Syringes can kill you before you even know what is happening. If someone shoots me with an unknown syringe I am going to take him out.

I can't think of anything beyond *whips out esword* that screams valid harder than getting plugged with a syringe gun out of nowhere. Could be Omnizine, Chloral, Acid, or space aids from Viro.

[TheNightingale]

Shooting someone with a syringe gun is about as deadly as throwing an unlabelled grenade at them; if they don't immediately say "It's medicine!" and I start feeling the effects, they're getting shot at least three times for their trouble. Even if he did just shoot you with morphine, it could've still ended very poorly for you if the QM wasn't safely taken care of.

The HoS is there to take care of 'rogue' Security members, not wannabe-Batman QMs; the QM should've just said "Your Detective threw me into a window, beat his ass" and left it at that. Similarly, the HoS had every right to detain you for killing him - it was still a breach of protocol, even if he did have it coming, and throwing ninja stars at him was pretty bad (again, even though he authorised the QM syringing). Sounds like a miscommunication here.

QM: "[PDA] HALP DET ROGUE can i siryng him"
HoS: "[PDA] So what did he do?"
QM: "[PDA] THREw me into Windah"
HoS: "[PDA] No."

[Scott]

On the other hand, your idea of a joke is randomly attacking other people.

[Incomptinence]

Drug me in a private place when I have sec equipment on me and I will probably kill you before you can loot me.

Spacing the corpse is a bit much though.

[Malkevin]

Similarly, the HoS had every right to detain you for killing him - it was still a breach of protocol

No its not.

Spacing on the other hand

[Davidchan]

Last I checked, modifying the .38 into a .357 was illegal and made it contraband.

Personally I subscribed to the school of thought that Security shouldn't be killing anyone when they have the opportunity to detain them instead. Escalation is a thing, and while syringe someone is a damn good reason to knock them into crit, Security doesn't need the 'You did something that /could/ have killed me, so I killed you' excuse.

They definitely shouldn't be spacing people either.

[sirnat]

Yeah ill admit the spacing was a bit much, it was a decision made in anger toward the hos randomly calling me shit and saying he'd allow it to happen again for again, throwing someone into a window which deals zero damage as far as I've seen

Also both HoS's that round were shit, the first was metacomming so hard I was already tired of even having to deal with the first one, he literally walked up to people, batons them, and checks their PDA! Lmao, I think the king of basil got onto him but it was the loudest version of, "IM A PUBBIE AND IM GONNA TRY AND RUIN YOUR ROUND"

With what I did to security lizard I guess you can call it a act of trying to revolt? Kinda like how regular officers can if the hos is really shitty.

Again, spacing the body was a dick move and that's the only thing I feel bad for in this situation. I told the dude to just ahelp it so he'd be explained to the rules of escalation, but couldn't remember the word escalation for my life lmao.

Also about killing him: I didn't shoot him to crit and then saw and finished him off, actually rather it was "SPRAY AND PRAY HIS ASS DOWN BEFORE I GO DOWN HE'LL BLEED OUT IN THIS CROWDED HALLWAY"

[Cheimon]

On the other hand, your idea of a joke is randomly attacking other people.

IT'S A PRANK!

[imblyings]

>you throw a guy into a window for no raisin
>the guy happens to be very short tempered
>shoots a syringe at you because fuck you
>you kill them because fuck you
>then the hos tries to catch you before you and the hos die
>all parties involved die

beautiful case of 'ic issue'

[sirnat]

I had to tell the guy multiple times last night it was all handled, lmao and his last statement was, "I still won" but yeah imblyings you basically have it down in that version,

[Zilenan91]

I'd have done the exact same thing in the det's situation. If someone, especially in that situation, shoots a fucking syringe at me they're taking a long flight out of a short airlock to the derelict.

[oranges]

Why do people space others, that is the action of a basic bitch who is afraid of a fight

[Wyzack]

Is this the first ban request thinly veiled as a policy discussion?

[sirnat]

Nah, I didn't really post anyones name other than the HoS and don't really want them banned.

The reason I brought this up, is because I wanted to make sure my ass wasn't grass in the future for cucking someone who does this, as well as to make sure just because you get permission doesn't make you valid to getting treated like an antag.

[iamgoofball]

Is this the first ban request thinly veiled as a policy discussion?

i think so yes

[Not-Dorsidarf]

I think it's pretty clear that if you're nebulous about intentions to the HOS to extract "Go Ahead", you have no right to complain when you get to suck vacuum.
Firing a syringe at sec under almost any circumstance is only slightly less agressve than firing a gyroget or wand of death/poly at them, especially if they know you're out to get them