[SWKittens] Ignoring precedent and circumstance for dayban
Posted: Sat Feb 04, 2017 10:49 am
Byond account and character name: ForcefulCJS, Oldman Robustin
Banning admin: Sweaterkittens
Ban reason and length: Dayban, for killing a miner and tossing his body into the lava
Time ban was placed (including time zone): ~20 minutes ago
Your side of the story:
A regular mining shift, we all suit up when Mr. Turbohitler rushes out the door within 10 seconds of the round start. Me and Miner #2 quickly grab the rest of our things and follow only to have the shuttle launch as we were standing in the airlock. For those unfamiliar if you are standing on the shuttle side of the airlock when it launches you will be spaced, killed, and your body lost forever. Fortunately we were both station side and instead both me and miner #2 were ejected into station space. We struggled to get back aboard in one piece and we immediately agreed without hesitation that Mr. Turbohitler would have to die for his crimes.
We got to mining dock, cornered Miner #3, and duked it out. I barely survived the fight and contemplated bringing Miner #3 back to station for cloning. After hearing that a medic and QM were coming to revive the miner I decided I didn't want to be blasted in the back while mining so I tossed Miner #3 into the lava instead. I reminded the crew of the ancient and venerable miner's code demanding death for such insolence. Sweaterkittens says im clearly in the wrong and bans me.
Why you think you should be unbanned:
The last ban that was successfully appealed against me was under similar circumstances. A scientist dropped a TTV in cargo, someone else picked it up and apparently tried to defuse it, and so the scientist proceeded to silently toolboxed the other guy to death (they didnt fight back, only tried to talk) and then spaced the corpse.
https://tgstation13.org/phpBB/viewtopic.php?f=34&t=7375
It was made very clear to me through that appeal that spacing a body is not a significant grievance since apparently if you have the right to murder someone you have the right to make sure they don't come back from the dead to get revenge. Not only did Miner #3 do something deliberately shitty that could've killed AND spaced me and miner #2, he fought back with a knife and survival pen and almost killed me on lavaland too. They deserved to die and they have no right to complain if I didn't want to open myself up to getting KA'd in the asshole when they got revived, lavaland is not a forgiving place and if I were murdered out in the tunnels there's no way I'd have an opportunity to come back myself.
I'm going off precedent and personal experience here. I see my circumstances as less of a close call than what I dealt with Yackem for. Yackem murdered and spaced a botanist for an action that was ambiguous if not slightly inappropriate but posed a risk to Yackem's life and property. In my case I received unqualified support from my fellow miner that Miner #3 was shitty, unreasonable, almost got us killed, and therefore deserving of death for his selfish and shitty behavior. We sought revenge and then disposed of the body so as to not open ourselves to inevitable revenge and death out in the lavaland wastes (whereas it would be much easier for a scientist to insulate themselves from a botanist trying to get revenge, a miner has few options to stay safe against an angry and vengeful fellow miner).
I feel like this is a pretty clear case for my actions being justified. There is a standard of behavior among miners and not rushing the shuttle has always been a part of it. Lavaland is harsh and unforgiving and if you do something selfish and shitty that jeopardizes the lives of your fellow miners, then you can expect rough
lavaland justice in return. That's the way it's always been on asteroid AND lavaland, you can't expect security to venture out into monster infested tunnels so you've got to settle the score yourself. Hardly a close case and I'm really curious if Sweaterkittens banned the other miner too, because we were in the right on this.
Sweaters a decent trialmin but its clear they don't have much experience mining. Launching the mining shuttle ASAP and spacing your fellow miners is a form of grief that's been around for several years. It's always been understood to be absolutely unacceptable among miners since the risk of killing someone and leaving their body in deep space is never worth the goddamn risk just to get to the mines a few seconds faster. Especially now that ash storms make it 100% pointless to shuttle rush unless you're deliberately trying to grief. Coupled with the isolation and danger of lavaland, It's been a pretty consistent theme that endangering your fellow miners is a fast track to a pickaxe to the face. The rationale here isn't complicated, if you deliberately gamble the lives of your coworkers for selfish reasons then you have no right to complain if you get taken out of the round simply because luck didn't take them out of the round first.
Banning admin: Sweaterkittens
Ban reason and length: Dayban, for killing a miner and tossing his body into the lava
Time ban was placed (including time zone): ~20 minutes ago
Your side of the story:
A regular mining shift, we all suit up when Mr. Turbohitler rushes out the door within 10 seconds of the round start. Me and Miner #2 quickly grab the rest of our things and follow only to have the shuttle launch as we were standing in the airlock. For those unfamiliar if you are standing on the shuttle side of the airlock when it launches you will be spaced, killed, and your body lost forever. Fortunately we were both station side and instead both me and miner #2 were ejected into station space. We struggled to get back aboard in one piece and we immediately agreed without hesitation that Mr. Turbohitler would have to die for his crimes.
We got to mining dock, cornered Miner #3, and duked it out. I barely survived the fight and contemplated bringing Miner #3 back to station for cloning. After hearing that a medic and QM were coming to revive the miner I decided I didn't want to be blasted in the back while mining so I tossed Miner #3 into the lava instead. I reminded the crew of the ancient and venerable miner's code demanding death for such insolence. Sweaterkittens says im clearly in the wrong and bans me.
Why you think you should be unbanned:
The last ban that was successfully appealed against me was under similar circumstances. A scientist dropped a TTV in cargo, someone else picked it up and apparently tried to defuse it, and so the scientist proceeded to silently toolboxed the other guy to death (they didnt fight back, only tried to talk) and then spaced the corpse.
https://tgstation13.org/phpBB/viewtopic.php?f=34&t=7375
It was made very clear to me through that appeal that spacing a body is not a significant grievance since apparently if you have the right to murder someone you have the right to make sure they don't come back from the dead to get revenge. Not only did Miner #3 do something deliberately shitty that could've killed AND spaced me and miner #2, he fought back with a knife and survival pen and almost killed me on lavaland too. They deserved to die and they have no right to complain if I didn't want to open myself up to getting KA'd in the asshole when they got revived, lavaland is not a forgiving place and if I were murdered out in the tunnels there's no way I'd have an opportunity to come back myself.
I'm going off precedent and personal experience here. I see my circumstances as less of a close call than what I dealt with Yackem for. Yackem murdered and spaced a botanist for an action that was ambiguous if not slightly inappropriate but posed a risk to Yackem's life and property. In my case I received unqualified support from my fellow miner that Miner #3 was shitty, unreasonable, almost got us killed, and therefore deserving of death for his selfish and shitty behavior. We sought revenge and then disposed of the body so as to not open ourselves to inevitable revenge and death out in the lavaland wastes (whereas it would be much easier for a scientist to insulate themselves from a botanist trying to get revenge, a miner has few options to stay safe against an angry and vengeful fellow miner).
I feel like this is a pretty clear case for my actions being justified. There is a standard of behavior among miners and not rushing the shuttle has always been a part of it. Lavaland is harsh and unforgiving and if you do something selfish and shitty that jeopardizes the lives of your fellow miners, then you can expect rough
lavaland justice in return. That's the way it's always been on asteroid AND lavaland, you can't expect security to venture out into monster infested tunnels so you've got to settle the score yourself. Hardly a close case and I'm really curious if Sweaterkittens banned the other miner too, because we were in the right on this.
Sweaters a decent trialmin but its clear they don't have much experience mining. Launching the mining shuttle ASAP and spacing your fellow miners is a form of grief that's been around for several years. It's always been understood to be absolutely unacceptable among miners since the risk of killing someone and leaving their body in deep space is never worth the goddamn risk just to get to the mines a few seconds faster. Especially now that ash storms make it 100% pointless to shuttle rush unless you're deliberately trying to grief. Coupled with the isolation and danger of lavaland, It's been a pretty consistent theme that endangering your fellow miners is a fast track to a pickaxe to the face. The rationale here isn't complicated, if you deliberately gamble the lives of your coworkers for selfish reasons then you have no right to complain if you get taken out of the round simply because luck didn't take them out of the round first.