/tg/Station 13

Byond account and character name: Delaron - Delaron Eraborn
Banning admin: Okand37
Ban type (What are you banned from?): Manual Server Ban
Ban reason and length: Time ban was placed (including time zone): Server time: Dec 19th 2017 at 04:08:18
Server you were playing when banned (Sybil or Bagil): Sybil

Your side of the story: I was transformed into a Syndicate Medical Borg. The Huge Text stated I must assist in obtaining the Nuclear Authentication Disk. There was no instruction on not being an asshole. I proceeded to then search with the pinpointer and ahelped for clarification on why it was a blinking question mark. Told it only pointed out nearest Nuck Ops. Realized i had to be more hands on and use guesswork. So searched the captains office with no luck. Then I hunted down the two likely Heads to have the disk. I injected the HoS with Morphine and drilled him to down him. I stripped him and searched. No disk. I then medi beamed him to heal him and allowed the crew to rescue him. I hunted down someone in captains gear and did the same healing them to prevent death. I finally found the captain and was robusted. At some point I was respawned as a fire watcher and then a magicarp turned me into another syndicate medical borg (I noticed at least 6 other syndicate borgs at this point) I am not entirely sure who I killed but I do recall fighting multiple people while trying to get the captain. I honestly was trying to just get the disk and not get destroyed again in the process. I have multiple say logs in the round after the transformation asking for the nuke disk.

Why you think you should be unbanned: I am a little bummed out that this ban came so far after the round and I was never boinked. I was purposefully trying super hard to not take people out of the round unnecessarily and healed people to do just that. I even told someone that I could just kill you when they attacked me after I healed them. I instead just left since my objective was not on them. Overall I believe I add more to the round that I take. The main reason I should not be banned is that after being transformed into the borg there was no instruction to "not be an asshole" and I did not see any specific commands from others on this as well. As a watcher i was specifically told that I was "Free" and i asked what the command was and it was repeated to "Dude I said you are free." Either way I am open to positive correction and feedback. If the magicarp transformation text needs to be re-coded for better policy adherence then I suggest it be done. Otherwise I was firmly under the impression I was playing my part and was somewhat skirting the directive by healing non-syndicate.

Do magicarp transformed people even get bonded to a specific person?

BeeSting12 wrote:Do magicarp transformed people even get bonded to a specific person?

No they do not to the best of my knowledge. I did get the big text about helping Nuke Ops with the disk directive.

I did have the bonded text when respawned into a fire watcher. Thus why I asked what thier command was. "Be Free" followed by a second magicarp transformation.

BeeSting12 wrote:Do magicarp transformed people even get bonded to a specific person?

He was spawned as a magmawing watcher and then magicarp transformed into a syndie borg.

were you willingly transformed?

Armhulen wrote:were you willingly transformed?

First time no it was while I was seeing the state of xeno when I saw a alien run out. Magicarp hit me with it after i saw the mass of creatures.

Second time as the Fire watcher I let the magicarp transform me. It stopped when another borg popped. At this point there was about 6 other borgs.

delaron wrote:

Armhulen wrote:were you willingly transformed?

First time no it was while I was seeing the state of xeno when I saw a alien run out. Magicarp hit me with it after i saw the mass of creatures.

Second time as the Fire watcher I let the magicarp transform me. It stopped when another borg popped. At this point there was about 6 other borgs.

if you let yourself be transformed, you're not an antag

Armhulen wrote:

delaron wrote:

Armhulen wrote:were you willingly transformed?

First time no it was while I was seeing the state of xeno when I saw a alien run out. Magicarp hit me with it after i saw the mass of creatures.

Second time as the Fire watcher I let the magicarp transform me. It stopped when another borg popped. At this point there was about 6 other borgs.

if you let yourself be transformed, you're not an antag

I see the logic in that statement and agree it should be the case. It is however not in the rules and I cant find anything that could be interpreted as such. I also advocate then that the Objective text from being transformed into a syndicate borg be adjusted to reflect that stance.

Yeah, my bad. I was the xenobiologist, may have given accidentally false info on what orders I gave. I know I told some 10~ xenobio mobs to not be assholes but I may have just given up on that at some point to say they were free instead.

On the other hand I made like 40~ xenobio mobs and I interacted with most of them for like five seconds.

Darkgenerallord wrote:Yeah, my bad. I was the xenobiologist, may have given accidentally false info on what orders I gave. I know I told some 10~ xenobio mobs to not be assholes but I may have just given up on that at some point to say they were free instead.

On the other hand I made like 40~ xenobio mobs and I interacted with most of them for like five seconds.

Not to derail, but it's worth noting that when you make xeno mobs and give them orders, if they proceed to follow those orders and your order was fucked up, that's on you as a xenobiologist.

This is one of the tradeoffs for sentiencing things.

The reason as for its lateness as that the issue only occurred on the emergency shuttle and there were enough adminhelps that I wasn't able to get to you in time. I attempted to message you the round after, but you logged off and I wasn't able to. From my short sifting through the logs and questioning of other players, I had the understanding you were a xenobiology mob who got willingly changed then proceeded to go a little attack-happy despite your orders being not to-but as Darkgenerallord stated, he may have given the wrong information on accident and if that is the case I apologise.

[03:38:00]ACCESS: Mob Login: Delaron/(magmawing watcher) was assigned to a /mob/living/simple_animal/hostile/asteroid/basilisk/watcher/magmawing
[03:38:38]SAY: magmawing watcher/Delaron : change me (130,66,2)
[03:38:41]ACCESS: Mob Login: Delaron/(magmawing watcher) was assigned to a /mob/living/carbon/alien/humanoid/sentinel
[03:39:03]ACCESS: Mob Login: Delaron/(magmawing watcher) was assigned to a /mob/living/carbon/human
[03:39:04]SAY: magmawing watcher/Delaron : again please (129,66,2)
[03:39:07]ACCESS: Mob Login: Delaron/(magmawing watcher) was assigned to a /mob/living/carbon/human
[03:39:11]ACCESS: Mob Login: Delaron/(magmawing watcher) was assigned to a /mob/living/silicon/robot/modules/syndicate/medical
[03:42:15]GAME: Delaron/(magmawing watcher) has emagged the emergency shuttle in (123,63,2) 67 seconds before launch.

[03:49:15]ADMINPRIVATE: PM: Okand37/(Okand37)->Darkgenerallord/(Darkgenerallord): Just to clarify something, did you create a syndimedical borg named "Magnawing Watcher" last round?
[03:49:30]ADMINPRIVATE: PM: Darkgenerallord/(Darkgenerallord)->Okand37/(Okand37): I did, I think my orders to that one were 'be free, but don't be an asshole' or something along those lines
[03:49:45]ADMINPRIVATE: PM: Okand37/(Okand37)->Darkgenerallord/(Darkgenerallord): Alright, thanks, just needed to check that out as it seems they've clocked out! Have a good one.

From these two points, I think the judgement call seemed fair enough but as Darkgenerallord mentioned he could have very well not kept an accurate retention of what entirely he told you. In that case since I don't want to keep a ban up on you if I'm not one-hundred percent sure, I'd be willing to lift it so long as you agree to keep in mind the rules of self-antaging regarding xenobiology mobs, ie; "if you let yourself be transformed, you're not an antag." Hopefully we can both agree on this, but if you find anything else in the logs that might support and or abolish the claim of what your orders were, then let me know.

Okay so since its related to the second transformation i will leave details of the appeal as it relates to the second transformation.

[03:38:00]ACCESS: Mob Login: Delaron/(magmawing watcher) was assigned to a /mob/living/simple_animal/hostile/asteroid/basilisk/watcher/magmawing
[03:38:07]SAY: Lane Stewart/Darkgenerallord : You are free, my watcher boys (133,43,2)
[03:38:14]SAY: magmawing watcher/Delaron : goals? (132,41,2)
[03:38:18]SAY: Lane Stewart/Darkgenerallord : I told you (133,43,2)
[03:38:20]SAY: Lane Stewart/Darkgenerallord : You rae free. (133,43,2)

So I went about to the top of a packed xeno lab and saw the magicarp. I asked for a transformation and was looking for something fun (non human) the magicarp stopped and went away after the Borg form. I was going to look for the disk again and got into altercations with shuttle people but mostly chased down the captain and was not effective. Regardless I understand the policy of self-antag != Antag. I do urge we add something to the official rules and at some point adjust the text from the transformation situation.

I did find the particular attack event that resulted in a death. This individual was wearing captain gear so was my target to get the disk. I missed them dying and was even using the medibeam trying to heal until I noticed they died. Took a moment to initiate the beam due to harm intent and close proximity.

[03:40:06]ATTACK: magmawing watcher(delaron) attacked Oldman Robustin(forcefulcjs) with surgical drill(INTENT: HARM) (DAMTYPE: BRUTE) (NEWHP: 69) (106,79,2)
[03:40:07]ATTACK: magmawing watcher(delaron) attacked Oldman Robustin(forcefulcjs) with surgical drill(INTENT: HARM) (DAMTYPE: BRUTE) (NEWHP: 54) (106,79,2)
[03:40:09]ATTACK: magmawing watcher(delaron) attacked Oldman Robustin(forcefulcjs) with surgical drill(INTENT: HARM) (DAMTYPE: BRUTE) (NEWHP: 39) (106,79,2)
[03:40:15]ATTACK: magmawing watcher(delaron) attacked Kashindra Kalcronk(bobbahbrown) with surgical drill(INTENT: HARM) (DAMTYPE: BRUTE) (NEWHP: 90) (105,79,2)
[03:40:16]ATTACK: magmawing watcher(delaron) attacked Oldman Robustin(forcefulcjs) with surgical drill(INTENT: HARM) (DAMTYPE: BRUTE) (NEWHP: 24) (104,79,2)
[03:40:17]ATTACK: magmawing watcher(delaron) attacked Oldman Robustin(forcefulcjs) with surgical drill(INTENT: HARM) (DAMTYPE: BRUTE) (NEWHP: 8.99999) (104,79,2)
[03:40:18]ATTACK: magmawing watcher(delaron) attacked Oldman Robustin(forcefulcjs) with surgical drill(INTENT: HARM) (DAMTYPE: BRUTE) (NEWHP: -6.00001) (104,79,2)
[03:40:20]ATTACK: magmawing watcher(delaron) attacked Kashindra Kalcronk(bobbahbrown) with surgical drill(INTENT: HARM) (DAMTYPE: BRUTE) (NEWHP: 80) (105,79,2)
[03:40:22]ATTACK: magmawing watcher(delaron) attacked Oldman Robustin(forcefulcjs) with surgical drill(INTENT: HARM) (DAMTYPE: BRUTE) (NEWHP: -21.6667) (106,79,2)
[03:40:23]ATTACK: magmawing watcher(delaron) attacked Oldman Robustin(forcefulcjs) with surgical drill(INTENT: HARM) (DAMTYPE: BRUTE) (NEWHP: -36.6667) (106,79,2)
[03:40:24]ATTACK: magmawing watcher(delaron) attacked Oldman Robustin(forcefulcjs) with surgical drill(INTENT: HARM) (DAMTYPE: BRUTE) (NEWHP: -51.6667) (106,79,2)
[03:40:25]ATTACK: magmawing watcher(delaron) grabbed Oldman Robustin(forcefulcjs) with passive grab (NEWHP: -52.3333) (106,79,2)
[03:40:26]ATTACK: magmawing watcher(delaron) attacked Oldman Robustin(forcefulcjs) with surgical drill(INTENT: HARM) (DAMTYPE: BRUTE) (NEWHP: -67.3333) (105,79,2)
[03:40:27]ATTACK: magmawing watcher(delaron) attacked Oldman Robustin(forcefulcjs) with surgical drill(INTENT: HARM) (DAMTYPE: BRUTE) (NEWHP: -83) (105,79,2)
[03:40:29]ATTACK: magmawing watcher(delaron) attacked Oldman Robustin(forcefulcjs) with surgical drill(INTENT: HARM) (DAMTYPE: BRUTE) (NEWHP: -98) (105,79,2)

[03:40:36]ATTACK: magmawing watcher(delaron) stripped Oldman Robustin(forcefulcjs) with of the captain's backpack (NEWHP: -100) (105,79,2)

[03:40:37]ATTACK: Unknown(zaracka) attacked magmawing watcher(delaron) with stunbaton(INTENT: HELP) (DAMTYPE: BRUTE) (NEWHP: 90) (104,79,2)
[03:40:39]ATTACK: magmawing watcher(delaron) attacked Unknown(zaracka) with surgical drill(INTENT: HARM) (DAMTYPE: BRUTE) (NEWHP: 62.19) (105,79,2)

[03:40:46]ATTACK: magmawing watcher(delaron) attacked Oldman Robustin with Medical Beamgun(INTENT: HARM) (DAMTYPE: BRUTE) (NEWHP: -105) (105,79,2)
[[03:40:48]ATTACK: magmawing watcher(delaron) attacked Oldman Robustin with Medical Beamgun(INTENT: HARM) (DAMTYPE: BRUTE) (NEWHP: -110) (105,79,2)

Just to make it clear, I understand the policy of not acting like an antag if you self antag. I agree to follow it and be more mindful of such things in the future.

Alrighty, I think that is all I needed to know then, thank you. I'll go ahead and lift the ban as well as remove the corresponding note. I appreciate your patience and thoroughness in your presenting of the logs! Have fun! : )