[booktower] honkeador Banned due ahelping.

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Allen Quinn
Joined: Fri Dec 14, 2018 7:06 pm

[booktower] honkeador Banned due ahelping.

Post by Allen Quinn » #462100

Byond account: Honkeador
Character name: Allen Quinn
Banning admin: Booktower
Ban Type: server
Ban reason and length: "Made wheat with teslium and water and put it around the hallways, when sec arrested him for it he ahelped. Spammed while in the shuttle brig. Ahelped when he got spaced for spamming. Has been warned for banbaiting twice this month already." 4 days https://i.imgur.com/ZuZEutU.png
Time ban was placed (including time zone): around 19:00 GMT +1
Server you were playing when banned (Sybil or Bagil): Terry
Your side of the story:
The first time I ahelped was because I was being arrested for literally doing nothing. When asked the sec officer why I was being arrested (without resisting) he told me to shut up. Previously, I had a ruckus with him, for he assaulted and stole mime's mask (actually it was a clown mask, but he was a mime. Long story). The mime had helped me earlier that round, so I thought I might help him back. The captain intervened and managed to settle things IC, so I just left and tried to forgot the whole thing, but the sec officer wanted to mess with me, and the wheat was his excuse. The fact of him not stating why he was making that arrest until a third person asked, and having him arrested the mime for "resisting arrest" (without having any other reason to do so) is why I knew it was just a excuse to arrest me. Also, when he locked me down he spend time harmbattoning and tazing me, while saying insults such as "bitch" and other things related to gay sex. I called him "mallcop" and told him he was making a terrible job.

I belive arresting due the stunwheat is quite ridiculous for various reasons:

1) Wheat is not a drug, nor any kind of illegal substance
2) The contents of the wheat (teslium and water) are not illegal by themselves
3) The whole thing did 3 damage. The same admin that banned me stated he considered bwoinking me earlier that round because of the wheat, but didnt did so due how low the damage was.
4) Both the HoP and the Captain, as well as probably all the heads knew about the existence of the stunwheat and were ok with it.
5) The distribution happened 30 mins before the sec officer assaulted me (he joined late)

I don't think it was a legal arrest and that's why I ahelpèd. If at least he had made a trial or something like that to justify the arrest, I would (gladly) have went with it. But nope.

The reason I ahelped when the guy was arresting me is due him abusing his position and me didnt wanting to start any kind of fight. But the sec officer got away, I guess.

Why you think you should be unbanned:
I think the ban is a bit excesive at best and undeserved at worst: all the events that are described in the ban description happened literally in the 20 last minutes of the game, nobody (except me) was harmed or had his game ruined, I tried to solve things IC before ahelping and when that failed, I had no response when I tried to ahelp. I literally got more ban days that damage caused the wheat that started all this. And I tried to solve it the right way. When things go south, I tried to contact the admins. I always guessed that is the right thing to do.

Plus, everything I did after the first ahelp was caused by the non-intervention of the admins at that moment. I know a lot of things go on at the same time and the admins aint omnipresent, but in this case I think its relevant because well, it got me banned.

That just reminded me the reason why Im on the blacklist of "Banbaiters". The other day I ahelped and the admin told me that It was against the rules, but in the context of that specific game it was ok, so I flipped out and basically answered back asomething like "So you admit its against the rules, but you aint gonna do nothing. Cool". Heat of the moment, I guess. Now it doesn't seem that bad. Nevertheless, I don't think having ahelped for things that were not considered worth of intervening is no excuse to simply not looking into ahelps of that same player.

Thank you for your time and for keeping the station running
User avatar
Gigapuddi420
Joined: Fri May 19, 2017 8:08 am
Byond Username: Gigapuddi420
Location: Dorms

Post by Gigapuddi420 » #462105

Arresting someone for leaving poisoned foods around the station seems pretty legit to me, the only part I'm sympathetic to is the shitty conduct of the security player.
Allen Quinn
Joined: Fri Dec 14, 2018 7:06 pm

Re:

Post by Allen Quinn » #462106

Gigapuddi420 wrote:Arresting someone for leaving poisoned foods around the station seems pretty legit to me, the only part I'm sympathetic to is the shitty conduct of the security player.
I would agree. And in a different situation I would asked for a trial and it would be greentext for sure. Hell, a trial about the stunwheat being legal or not would have been really fun!
Booktower
In-Game Admin
Joined: Mon Apr 23, 2018 4:44 pm
Byond Username: Booktower

Re: [booktower] honkeador Banned due ahelping.

Post by Booktower » #462118

I'm not going to address your misrepresentation of your interaction with the security officer, but you said "and tbh, everytime I get a ban or anything. I just take it. I know the risks I take"[1] when I asked you about your actions, shortly after spamming "GREYTIDERS WITH BATTONS GREYTIDERS WITH BATTONS" 393 times. You were warned twice about banbaiting this month already, and yet you tried thrice this round. So I'm going to have to hold you to your word here. You can't just lawyer your way out of the rules. Denied.

[1] [2018-12-14 18:06:16.614] ADMINPRIVATE: PM: Honkeador/(Allen Quinn)->Booktower/(Jazlyn Petrov): well, a jobban would be in place. My claims are quite legit.##and tbh, everytime I get a ban or anything. I just take it. I know the risks I take
https://tgstation13.org/raw-logs/terry/ ... 2/game.log
Due to this being a raw log file only admins will have access to it. The public logs do not contain ahelp traffic.
[2] Result of a search through https://tgstation13.org/parsed-logs/ter ... 2/game.txt
Allen Quinn
Joined: Fri Dec 14, 2018 7:06 pm

Re: [booktower] honkeador Banned due ahelping.

Post by Allen Quinn » #462123

Booktower wrote:I'm not going to address your misrepresentation of your interaction with the security officer, but you said "and tbh, everytime I get a ban or anything. I just take it. I know the risks I take"[1] when I asked you about your actions, shortly after spamming "GREYTIDERS WITH BATTONS GREYTIDERS WITH BATTONS" 393 times. You were warned twice about banbaiting this month already, and yet you tried thrice this round. So I'm going to have to hold you to your word here. You can't just lawyer your way out of the rules. Denied.

[1] [2018-12-14 18:06:16.614] ADMINPRIVATE: PM: Honkeador/(Allen Quinn)->Booktower/(Jazlyn Petrov): well, a jobban would be in place. My claims are quite legit.##and tbh, everytime I get a ban or anything. I just take it. I know the risks I take
https://tgstation13.org/raw-logs/terry/ ... 2/game.log
Due to this being a raw log file only admins will have access to it. The public logs do not contain ahelp traffic.
[2] Result of a search through https://tgstation13.org/parsed-logs/ter ... 2/game.txt
Is it legit to be denied by the same admin that banned you? That does not seem fair.

Plus, I didnt knew past warnings could affect future cases. And if I would have been warned at my first ahelp, nothing of that had happened, as I previous said.
somerandomguy
Joined: Sun Nov 05, 2017 7:41 pm
Byond Username: Astatineguy12

Re: [booktower] honkeador Banned due ahelping.

Post by somerandomguy » #462128

Allen Quinn wrote:
Booktower wrote:I'm not going to address your misrepresentation of your interaction with the security officer, but you said "and tbh, everytime I get a ban or anything. I just take it. I know the risks I take"[1] when I asked you about your actions, shortly after spamming "GREYTIDERS WITH BATTONS GREYTIDERS WITH BATTONS" 393 times. You were warned twice about banbaiting this month already, and yet you tried thrice this round. So I'm going to have to hold you to your word here. You can't just lawyer your way out of the rules. Denied.

[1] [2018-12-14 18:06:16.614] ADMINPRIVATE: PM: Honkeador/(Allen Quinn)->Booktower/(Jazlyn Petrov): well, a jobban would be in place. My claims are quite legit.##and tbh, everytime I get a ban or anything. I just take it. I know the risks I take
https://tgstation13.org/raw-logs/terry/ ... 2/game.log
Due to this being a raw log file only admins will have access to it. The public logs do not contain ahelp traffic.
[2] Result of a search through https://tgstation13.org/parsed-logs/ter ... 2/game.txt
Is it legit to be denied by the same admin that banned you? That does not seem fair.

Plus, I didnt knew past warnings could affect future cases. And if I would have been warned at my first ahelp, nothing of that had happened, as I previous said.
The banning admin is the one to decide on an appeal, but headmins can overrule
User avatar
Nilons
Joined: Tue Oct 04, 2016 5:38 pm
Byond Username: NIlons
Location: Canada

Re: [booktower] honkeador Banned due ahelping.

Post by Nilons » #462135

Allen Quinn wrote:
Plus, I didnt knew past warnings could affect future cases.
what do you think a warning is for

if the punishment for being a shitter was always a warning it would literally do nothing
User avatar
Rustledjimm
Joined: Tue Feb 14, 2017 9:07 pm
Byond Username: Rustledjimm

Re: [booktower] honkeador Banned due ahelping.

Post by Rustledjimm » #462138

I'm going to call this resolved as the banning admin has stated their case.

Yes it is normal for the admin who bans you to post and rule on the ban. They should be able to defend their own ban. If other admins believe they were wrong trust me there would be posts saying such, Admins more than anyone hate bad bans. Headmins can also always overrule admins.

And I believe Nilon's post is quite relevant to help your understanding of what a warning is for.

Locked and resolved, a headmin may post to overrule booktower.
So uhh, I'm an admin. Please leave feedback! Oops took me a while to strike that through.

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