[Skoglol] Darek143 - Blatant metacomms

[Darek143]

BYOND Account: Darek143
Character Name: Maxwell Greeen
Ban Type: Server, TG event hall
Ban Length: Perma
Ban Reason: Metagaming
Round ID: 133937
Your side of the story: I got the wizard role and i called my mate on discord and told him he should off himself and play with me, i bought the scroll and used it the same second and he was with me on the ship, when i did that i bought gear for us as i have played wizard with him before and when we died that round we talked about what gear would be best or cool and decided that 2 spellblades and 2 staves of healing as i thought of it before but when buying the other spellblade i changed my mind on it and got a thor hammer, thats when the i got the admin PM.

I must have misunderstood the rules as i didnt think it was not allowed to metacom for getting a apprentice as it is still kind of luck based if anyone is dead by then and because that doesnt really affect the station or doesnt give anyone an advantage or disadvantage unlesse he was a head.

The admin also said that me and sasukexsakura1337 were warned for metacommning before which was not true, that was a coincidence as i showed my friends and my brother the game and my brother and my firend had similar BYOND account names, so my brother was using same ip as me so that made a connection between me and my firend. But there is not much more than that, just a conneciton, no rules were broken.

This was also my first punishment or warning in a while, i was breaking some rules when i first played this game because i was new and i learned from my mistakes. That lead to me playing for hundreds of hours and rounds without getting any punishment or warning, i recently started playing with my friend becaue i showed him the game and he liked we recently started playing at the same times and now i got banned for the first time in hundreds of hours. This is a mistake i made and it sucks that i got perma banned for my first offense as i could easily just stop having any communication with my friend even if i am a wizz. It just sucks that its my first ban/warning in a long really long while and its perma when im have shown that i learn overtime.

If i missed anything or you have questions about what i said here id be happy to have a call over discord explaining them
Jeffery#2463

[skoglol]

Full ban reason: "Blatant metacomms with sasukexsakura1337. Warned about this before. In this case, Darek rolled wizard, had sasuke ghost from his crew role and bought apprentice for him. Upon getting on ship, neither of them spoke a single word but got loaded up on gear just fine."

The rule you are breaking in doing this:

2. Do not use information gained outside of in character means.
I.e.. metagaming. This especially refers to communication between players outside of the game via things like Skype, known as metacomms. Characters are otherwise allowed to know everything about ingame mechanics or antagonists, as well as keep persistent friendships or relationships with other characters when not for the purpose of unfair advantage by teaming up together for little IC reason.

Metacomming is a very serious breach of trust that is generally pretty hard to detect and prove, which is why this is a permanent ban. You also used it to conspire with your friend to give him antagonist status, which only makes it that much worse. As luck would have it, I was watching the two of you because of some (lack of) interactions you had the round before. I didnt see either of you say a single word to each other for an extended period of time, yet you met up several times both to help and wordlessly hand over guns.


I've dug through the history here, and yes you are correct you werent explicitly warned not to metacomm with sasukexsakura1337 when first contacted about them. You were both playing from the same IP at the time, which is the reason you were questioned about your relation.

Full round logs, only accessible by admins since ticket logs are secret.
https://tgstation13.org/raw-logs/event- ... 2/game.log
https://tgstation13.org/raw-logs/event- ... 9/game.log

Round 131622

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[2020-03-06 13:12:39.199] ADMINPRIVATE: PM: Doctor Brutality/(Jaime Lowstetter)->Darek143/(Maxwell Green): Hey. Can I ask what you're doing with that body bro.
[2020-03-06 13:12:48.460] ADMINPRIVATE: PM: Darek143/(Maxwell Green)->Doctor Brutality/(Jaime Lowstetter): what body
[2020-03-06 13:13:04.783] ADMINPRIVATE: PM: Darek143/(Maxwell Green)->Doctor Brutality/(Jaime Lowstetter): the cargo?
[2020-03-06 13:13:18.075] ADMINPRIVATE: PM: Doctor Brutality/(Jaime Lowstetter)->Darek143/(Maxwell Green): Adrian's, by any chance do you know someone with the ckey  SasukexSakura1337
[2020-03-06 13:13:39.214] ADMINPRIVATE: PM: Darek143/(Maxwell Green)->Doctor Brutality/(Jaime Lowstetter): jsut getting access to all the departaments and stuff, got 3 ID on my already
[2020-03-06 13:14:10.438] ADMINPRIVATE: PM: Doctor Brutality/(Jaime Lowstetter)->Darek143/(Maxwell Green): Right... do you know anyone who uses that ckey though?
[2020-03-06 13:14:22.521] ADMINPRIVATE: PM: Darek143/(Maxwell Green)->Doctor Brutality/(Jaime Lowstetter): ckey?
[2020-03-06 13:14:29.406] ADMINPRIVATE: PM: Doctor Brutality/(Jaime Lowstetter)->Darek143/(Maxwell Green): Username,  SasukexSakura1337
[2020-03-06 13:15:41.710] ADMINPRIVATE: PM: Doctor Brutality/(Jaime Lowstetter)->Darek143/(Maxwell Green): No?
[2020-03-06 13:16:06.325] ADMINPRIVATE: PM: Darek143/(Maxwell Green)->Doctor Brutality/(Jaime Lowstetter): what do you mean? what is a ckey
[2020-03-06 13:16:38.384] ADMINPRIVATE: PM: Doctor Brutality/(Jaime Lowstetter)->Darek143/(Maxwell Green): I already said, a username. You beelined after Adrian's body so I was wondering if you knew someone who uses the username  SasukexSakura1337 ?
[2020-03-06 13:18:32.508] ADMINPRIVATE: PM: Darek143/(Maxwell Green)->Doctor Brutality/(Jaime Lowstetter): im not sure how I was bleeding after the adrians body, i did the same thing in medbay, searching for access. sasukexsakura sounds like my brothers lol username
[2020-03-06 13:19:13.575] ADMINPRIVATE: PM: Doctor Brutality/(Jaime Lowstetter)->Darek143/(Maxwell Green): Right ok, thanks. That's all I needed to hear dude.

Round 131639

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[2020-03-06 16:14:15.663] ADMINPRIVATE: PM: Thunder12345/(Nyaazmin Meowcovich)->Darek143/(Maxwell Green): Hey, do you know a player called SasukexSakura1337?
[2020-03-06 16:14:30.512] ADMINPRIVATE: PM: Darek143/(Maxwell Green)->Thunder12345/(Nyaazmin Meowcovich): got asked this last round i played in school
[2020-03-06 16:14:47.231] ADMINPRIVATE: PM: Thunder12345/(Nyaazmin Meowcovich)->Darek143/(Maxwell Green): So he's not your brother?
[2020-03-06 16:14:54.185] ADMINPRIVATE: PM: Darek143/(Maxwell Green)->Thunder12345/(Nyaazmin Meowcovich): he is why?
[2020-03-06 16:15:01.387] ADMINPRIVATE: PM: Thunder12345/(Nyaazmin Meowcovich)->Darek143/(Maxwell Green): "sasukexsakura sounds like my brothers lol username "
[2020-03-06 16:15:13.005] ADMINPRIVATE: PM: Darek143/(Maxwell Green)->Thunder12345/(Nyaazmin Meowcovich): yeah`?
[2020-03-06 16:15:27.719] ADMINPRIVATE: PM: Darek143/(Maxwell Green)->Thunder12345/(Nyaazmin Meowcovich): sorry#he is, why
[2020-03-06 16:15:47.247] ADMINPRIVATE: PM: Thunder12345/(Nyaazmin Meowcovich)->Darek143/(Maxwell Green): So are these two different people who happen to use similar usernames, or is he actually your brother
[2020-03-06 16:16:29.529] ADMINPRIVATE: PM: Darek143/(Maxwell Green)->Thunder12345/(Nyaazmin Meowcovich): what do you mean im lost, sasukeandsakura is my brother, what is the other one?
[2020-03-06 16:16:57.417] ADMINPRIVATE: PM: Thunder12345/(Nyaazmin Meowcovich)->Darek143/(Maxwell Green): SasukexSakura1337, the BYOND user
[2020-03-06 16:17:31.811] ADMINPRIVATE: PM: Darek143/(Maxwell Green)->Thunder12345/(Nyaazmin Meowcovich): oh there is a sasukeandsakura and a sasukeandsakrua1337?
[2020-03-06 16:18:06.570] ADMINPRIVATE: PM: Thunder12345/(Nyaazmin Meowcovich)->Darek143/(Maxwell Green): Well, one is what you said your brother's LoL username was, and the other is your very similarly named classmate. I'm sure you can understand why I'm suspicious about this
[2020-03-06 16:18:40.891] ADMINPRIVATE: PM: Darek143/(Maxwell Green)->Thunder12345/(Nyaazmin Meowcovich): yeah i fully understand, my i told my firends about this game and they both are weebs

SasukexSakura1337 being questioned about your relation in the same round:

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[2020-03-06 16:08:50.904] ADMINPRIVATE: PM: Thunder12345/(Nyaazmin Meowcovich)->SasukexSakura1337/(Adrian Willey): Hey, do you know a player called Darek143?
[2020-03-06 16:09:18.687] ADMINPRIVATE: PM: SasukexSakura1337/(Adrian Willey)->Thunder12345/(Nyaazmin Meowcovich): Yeah hes the one of the people that introduced me to ss13
[2020-03-06 16:09:36.092] ADMINPRIVATE: PM: Thunder12345/(Nyaazmin Meowcovich)->SasukexSakura1337/(Adrian Willey): Is that all you know about him?
[2020-03-06 16:10:06.829] ADMINPRIVATE: PM: SasukexSakura1337/(Adrian Willey)->Thunder12345/(Nyaazmin Meowcovich): Hes my classmate and we usually play ss13 mid class
[2020-03-06 16:11:06.073] ADMINPRIVATE: PM: Thunder12345/(Nyaazmin Meowcovich)->SasukexSakura1337/(Adrian Willey): Do you use the same username in any other games?
[2020-03-06 16:11:32.216] ADMINPRIVATE: PM: SasukexSakura1337/(Adrian Willey)->Thunder12345/(Nyaazmin Meowcovich): His username I'm not sure. I ususally use -snip- as my username
[2020-03-06 16:13:50.189] ADMINPRIVATE: PM: SasukexSakura1337/(Adrian Willey)->Thunder12345/(Nyaazmin Meowcovich): If there seem to be more usernames on his ip than one, might be his brother trying out aswell

Lets go through your side of the story, from your appeal.

I got the wizard role and i called my mate on discord and told him he should off himself and play with me

Given my suspicion that you were communicating outside the game in the last round already, I dont buy this.

I must have misunderstood the rules as i didnt think it was not allowed to metacom for getting a apprentice as it is still kind of luck based if anyone is dead by then and because that doesnt really affect the station or doesnt give anyone an advantage or disadvantage unlesse he was a head.

You used out of game communications to tell your friend it was a wizard round, which on its own is a big no no. He then used that information to be given antagonist by you. This isn't about whether or not this is a victimless crime.

The admin also said that me and sasukexsakura1337 were warned for metacommning before which was not true, that was a coincidence as i showed my friends and my brother the game and my brother and my firend had similar BYOND account names, so my brother was using same ip as me so that made a connection between me and my firend. But there is not much more than that, just a conneciton, no rules were broken.

Both you and sasukexsakura1337 were playing on the same IP during both of the above quoted rounds, and there is no trace of a third account playing with you. I dont buy that your brother is involved at all here, considering you are claiming sasukexsakura1337 both is and isnt your brother in the above ahelp logs. Giving you the benefit of the doubt, what is your brothers byond account name?

You overall seem to have been pretty dishonest with us during all this, which makes me quite wary of giving you any leeway here. You decided to lie about knowing your friend and who they were on two separate occasions when questioned about it, which leads me to believe you knew what you were doing was wrong. Your playtime is high enough that being familiar with our rules is expected of you.
Do keep in mind that even if you dont get unbanned as a result of this appeal, your conduct here will be scrutinized in future appeals. If there was ever a time to be honest, its now.

[Darek143]

This is a bit confusing and would be easier to solve during a call where i can answer your questions, but i can attempt to do it here:

I got the wizard role and i called my mate on discord and told him he should off himself and play with me

Given my suspicion that you were communicating outside the game in the last round already, I dont buy this.

Well this point cant be defended or attacked as it is something i cant prove, well i only asked him before to teach me how to toxin bombs and he showed me the setup that round.

must have misunderstood the rules as i didnt think it was not allowed to metacom for getting a apprentice as it is still kind of luck based if anyone is dead by then and because that doesnt really affect the station or doesnt give anyone an advantage or disadvantage unlesse he was a head.

You used out of game communications to tell your friend it was a wizard round, which on its own is a big no no. He then used that information to be given antagonist by you. This isn't about whether or not this is a victimless crime.

Yes, this was the rules i wasnt familiar with as i said in the appeal, i wasnt sure how it worked and if i could or couldnt tell my friend to off himself to be antag with me, thats why i also said that i do learn from my mistakes and avoid making them twice.

You overall seem to have been pretty dishonest with us during all this, which makes me quite wary of giving you any leeway here. You decided to lie about knowing your friend and who they were on two separate occasions when questioned about it, which leads me to believe you knew what you were doing was wrong. Your playtime is high enough that being familiar with our rules is expected of you.
Do keep in mind that even if you dont get unbanned as a result of this appeal, your conduct here will be scrutinized in future appeals. If there was ever a time to be honest, its now.

yes, i intorduced my friends and brother to this game as i liked it and wanted them to learn it with me, that meant that i played both at home and in school with my school laptop and my main pc, that lead to me and my friend or brother having the same IP adress as me. I didnt lie about my friend as i didnt know his BYOND account name which is where the confusion came from, i only knew my brothers account name on lol as i usually play on it but didnt think it was to do anyhting with byond.

which leads me to believe you knew what you were doing was wrong.

I still dont understand what i did wrong there, unless it is against the rules to have the same IP adress.

Both you and sasukexsakura1337 were playing on the same IP during both of the above quoted rounds, and there is no trace of a third account playing with you. I dont buy that your brother is involved at all here, considering you are claiming sasukexsakura1337 both is and isnt your brother in the above ahelp logs. Giving you the benefit of the doubt, what is your brothers byond account name?

I just got confused as i got questioned about sasukexsakura account which i didnt know anything about, only thing that came to mind was my brothers league account as i didnt know his byond acc name at the time, what i knew even less about was that my friend i played in class with had a similiar name to my brother which is where my confiusion came from. Also the time we had same IPs was when i was playing with my friend in class and showing him how to do the basics, i dont think the we have ever played from the same IP past 17:00 swedish time as that is when our school closes.

Metacomming is a very serious breach of trust that is generally pretty hard to detect and prove, which is why this is a permanent ban. You also used it to conspire with your friend to give him antagonist status, which only makes it that much worse. As luck would have it, I was watching the two of you because of some (lack of) interactions you had the round before. I didnt see either of you say a single word to each other for an extended period of time, yet you met up several times both to help and wordlessly hand over guns.

Yes i fully agree with the first part which is what i initially thought i was banned for, it was wrong of me to handpick my friend and give him the antag role, it is something i wont do as now i know that any info about events my friend could partake in is bad to share even if it isnt directly affecting anyone.

I cant agree with the second part though, my friend is semi competent and that is why i wasnt turly RPing with him as i would with a stranger that i dont have any expectation of gameknowledge, for example when i was at cargo i saw 3 guns and when i saw them i decided to take one extra with a extra armor for my mate and just drop it for him, i dont think it seemed unreasonable as he was in medbay after the radstorm and i saw him by the place where they give out mutadone pills, dropped him guns and moved along back to toxins as he was teaching me by showing the builds with the mixers and such.

I still think that talking over discord would be the easiet way of explaining things you have a problem with as you could just ask me what happened instead of thinking that i was trying to goin some advantage by not knowing the sasukexsakura account whilist knowing that its my brothers lol unsername. Jeffery#2463

[Vekter]

A Discord call isn't going to happen - all contact between admins and players is kept to a public area in order to keep a solid paper trail of what's going on.

[SasukexSakura1337]

I'm somewhat directly related to the ban, i just want to add that me,Sasukexsakura and Darek143 was on beestation most of the time. You'll see Sasukexsakura and Darek143 sharing the same ip while me(Sasukexsakura1337) do not because I'm at home and playing. This was during the late in the day aswell which os when I'm home my ip is actually a private home internet. Just to clarify. We then moved after a bit of time gap i think onto tg station played once with sasukexsakura and he never got on ever again due to being on absolutely useless and not understanding what RPG is overall.

Also times me and Darek143 as state in his post above our time and ip being the same was during specially 13:00 to 16:00 on Fridays. Because we had lessons together since this was a month ago i WAS extremely new to the server and game itself with less than 4 hours spent. I was simply taught keybindings and along those stuff.

P. S if this broke the "do not post here rule" i'm sorry.

[skoglol]

So you didnt explictly say when I asked. You keep telling me that your brothers byond name is similar to sasukexsakura1337, what is the exact byond username your brother uses?

[Darek143]

So you didnt explictly say when I asked. You keep telling me that your brothers byond name is similar to sasukexsakura1337, what is the exact byond username your brother uses?

Im not sure if we are reading the same logs but from what i can see in the logs its kinda obvious that i was confused at the time as i didnt know what you were talkinga about. My brothers ckey is mrpretzel, the username that is similar to my friends ckey is sasukexsakura123 which is a username for my brothers lol (League of Legends) account.

Also can you explain if there is anything else youd like explained? im not sure what i am accused of, yes i admitted to metacomming that i was wiz with my friend and unfairly giving him antag. Is there anything else to it?

[iamgoofball]

the username that is similar to my friends ckey is sasukexsakura123 which is a username for my brothers lol (League of Legends) account.

Care to explain why this League of Legends summoner account doesn't actually exist?
https://lolprofile.net/search/world/sasukexsakura123

[Darek143]

Care to explain why this League of Legends summoner account doesn't actually exist?
https://lolprofile.net/search/world/sasukexsakura123

Care to explain the difference between a displayname and username for login?

[skoglol]

Allright, that sounds believeable.

You are on the hook for metacomming, the reason I am digging into your previous interaction as well is to get a straight story out of you. If I were to reduce the ban, that requires me to be able to trust you not to do this again. The story as presented didnt fill me with confidence. As you said there was confusion, and I'll give you the benefit of the doubt here.

Let me first off be very clear about the metacomming and metagaming rules. You are not allowed to give or use any information about the current round outside the game. That includes but is not limited to telling someone what job you currently are, what is happening in the round, or asking them for help/assistance. If you are introducing a friend to the game, you are allowed to take on a teaching role over comms if you clear it with the admins beforehand.
Another thing you should be aware of is the rules against antag rolling. These cover suiciding or ghosting roundstart when you didnt get antagonist, and only playing the game when you are. Telling your friend to suicide to roll for ghost roles also makes him break this rule.

I am considering reducing this ban to three months, at which point you will still be on the watchlist for a time and admins will be keeping an eye on you. Any suspicion of metacomming with anyone will lead to a new permanent ban after which you can expect no leniency. If you have questions or concerns regarding this as you start playing, you can talk with the admins in game. Let me be extremely clear: Most people who get a metacomming ban is not coming back from the first one.

So. Will you play by the rules if I do so?

[Darek143]

Thank you for giving me a reduction to the ban, i will not dissapoint you.

[skoglol]

Good. Ban reduced to 90 days, will expire 2020-07-03 23:53:52, see you then.