[CoffeeDragon16] Mice World - Rule 8 ban?

[Mice World]

BYOND account: Mice World
Character name: Bea Socks
Ban type: Server
Ban length: A week
Ban reason: Asked to drop a creepy gimmick, that being exclusively playing a nude underaged character. When talked to about it, told me to "fuck off", Please reconsider.
Time ban was placed: 2021-01-18, 04:05:25
Round ID in which ban was placed: 154478
Your side of the story: I was doing what I always do as Bea, walking around and around in circles. CoffeeDragon messages me with the standard "Got a sec?". I say sure and find a nice safe spot to sit. His issue was that I play a naked under-aged person. Nobody has ever taken an OOC issue with this before, but fair enough. He gave me a note and told me to cut it out. I said that I'd just age Bea up to 21, I mean that would solve the issue right? But no. I was told that I shouldn't run around naked in a 2d spaceman video game anymore and that I should stop the whole gimmick because "I and others find it creepy" (Kinda funny that you walked up to me IC last round and joked with me). What I did next was stupid, I was upset IRL (I know this isn't a good excuse) After being told to kill my whole gimmick I was mad, so I told coffee to fuck off. Then realizing that I'd made a bad choice, I tried back pedaling, but I'd already been banned.
(Full ahelp log https://sb.atlantaned.space/ticket/0b6ebe97ba7cc050)
Why you think you should be unbanned: What rule have I been banned under? Rule 8? Nobody ahelped about this. Nobody took ooc issue. Some people joke around with it IC "Somebody get this catgirl dressed!" yadayda. Not once have I ever been warned or talked to about this (In 104 rounds of playing Bea). Bea was once 22, I made her 17 so I could have some fun fucking with bartenders, by taking drinks then flashing my ID. People seemed to find it funny IC so I didn't really see any reason to change it. I'm not erping with people. I'm not doing anything "sexy". I understand that I was rude in ahelps, but telling a person to kill their gimmick just because you don't like it is cruel. I also don't just play Bea, I play her when I want to relax. This is my fist time playing her in a whole month.
References of good conduct: Scrubby says I've played for 10 days in total. That's 10 days without any bans or notes (To my knowledge). I hardly even play antag. I do not play this game to win and don't care if I lose. This has been my first time getting bwoinked too. Honestly, this whole thing feels really surreal, I didn't think I'd eat a ban like this.

[ArcaneDefence]

(Full ahelp log https://sb.atlantaned.space/me/tickets/154478/3)

Just so you know bud, you gotta go into that ticket, publish it, and share the link it gives you to share with others as /me/tickets tries to look for a ticket that would belong to whoever is looking, rather than the one you're trying to share.

[MrStonedOne]

replace /me/ with /tgdb/ if you have admin access for now

[CoffeeDragon16]

What rule have I been banned under? Rule 8? Nobody ahelped about this.

Someone doesn't need to ahelp for something to warrant a talking to. Rule 8 and 0, yeah.

I understand that I was rude in ahelps, but telling a person to kill their gimmick just because you don't like it is cruel.

I don't think the rudeness was the entire point of the ban, but that you weren't listening to what I was telling you about giving you a warning for something uncomfortable. It's weird and uncomfortable, and I asked you to stop. It was just gonna be a note until you told me you were entirely missing the point of what I was saying, and showing me you weren't gonna stop the gimmick. I then gave you a choice to listen to what I was saying, and go off with a note, but you continued to contest it. I wouldn't care if your character wore clothes or something, if you do that then there won't be issues with the gimmick once the ban is over. I don't see a reason to unban you, you were told to drop it and were warned you would get banned if you didn't, and you instead mostly just got angry.

[Mice World]

(Full ahelp log https://sb.atlantaned.space/me/tickets/154478/3)

Just so you know bud, you gotta go into that ticket, publish it, and share the link it gives you to share with others as /me/tickets tries to look for a ticket that would belong to whoever is looking, rather than the one you're trying to share.

My bad. I think I've fixed it now?

What rule have I been banned under? Rule 8? Nobody ahelped about this.

Someone doesn't need to ahelp for something to warrant a talking to. Rule 8 and 0, yeah.

I understand that I was rude in ahelps, but telling a person to kill their gimmick just because you don't like it is cruel.

I don't think the rudeness was the entire point of the ban, but that you weren't listening to what I was telling you about giving you a warning for something uncomfortable. It's weird and uncomfortable, and I asked you to stop. It was just gonna be a note until you told me you were entirely missing the point of what I was saying, and showing me you weren't gonna stop the gimmick. I then gave you a choice to listen to what I was saying, and go off with a note, but you continued to contest it. I wouldn't care if your character wore clothes or something, if you do that then there won't be issues with the gimmick once the ban is over. I don't see a reason to unban you, you were told to drop it and were warned you would get banned if you didn't, and you instead mostly just got angry.

I made this appeal hoping that I'd be able to talk with others and explain that playing a naked character doesn't fall anywhere close to a Rule 8 ban. I changed their age, they are now 21. I mainly got upset with you AFTER you told me that I needed to stop the whole gimmick, even after changing their age. Do you know how many naked people I've seen on TG? Many. Sure, most of them don't do it every shift but many people play naked to meme. Like I do. Look, my character is a low effort shitpost. And acting like they're anything else is just stupid. I know you don't like my character coffee, you've made that very clear IC. But you're really grasping at straws to get rid of me here. One of the last times I played A.I. the crew was sent a naked photo of a man named "Greasy Steve". Would you ban them? Would you say "Uhh... Steve that's a rule 8 violation"? Because I really don't see how my character is any different. if me playing a naked character in a 2d spacegame makes you feel uncomfortable then you really shouldn't play this game. This IS the same game where changelings can suck out every last part of a human and leave behind a grotesque husk.

[Cobby]

could you clarify if you made a point to let others know that you were underaged, or did you just set your age to 17 and happen to run a gimmick where you are a streaker?

[Mice World]

could you clarify if you made a point to let others know that you were underaged, or did you just set your age to 17 and happen to run a gimmick where you are a streaker?

So, the whole point of the being 17 at first was that I'd take drinks that the bartender had made and drink them. Then I'd use my ID in hand, It then shows to everyone in an 8? title radius you're name and if you're character is underaged it adds the word MINOR on to it. Then at some point a few rounds later I dropped my ID by mistake, some moth found it and started screaming over comms about how I was underaged and naked. So sec was chasing me and trying to get me dressed, I found it funny so I kept it, the same thing has happened multiple times. The only time I've ever seen anyone talk about it OOC was when Jaredfogle said he liked my character then someone said something like "name checks out"

[Mice World]

Real quick I'd like to add that the joke isn't that my character is underaged. Their name is "Bea Socks" and they wear "Bee Socks" that's the joke.

[Mice World]

Also on the topic of rule 0.

"Rule 0 should only be invoked by admins when it is in the best interests of the server."
(https://tgstation13.org/wiki/Rules#Rule_0_Precedents.)

How on earth is getting rid of my character acting with the best interests of the server?

Edit: Are you done posting here Coffee? I'm still waiting for a reply on the other posts I made.

[CoffeeDragon16]

Be patient, I'm still thinking it over and getting second opinions from others.

[Mice World]

Be patient, I'm still thinking it over and getting second opinions from others.

Alright that's fine, I was just wondering.

[CoffeeDragon16]

Alright, I see where you're coming from. My viewpoint isn't shared, which I think is pretty important as a large part of the ban was that I saw it as uncomfortable. I think my ban here was a little knee jerk from your attitude, and I should not have let that get to me.I appreciate you making the appeal to let me know how you feel about it. I also won't mind if you continue the gimmick as long as the character is not naked. I'll unban you and reduce it to a note and edit the note to match.

[Mice World]

Alright, I see where you're coming from. My viewpoint isn't shared, which I think is pretty important as a large part of the ban was that I saw it as uncomfortable. I think my ban here was a little knee jerk from your attitude, and I should not have let that get to me.I appreciate you making the appeal to let me know how you feel about it. I also won't mind if you continue the gimmick as long as the character is not naked. I'll unban you and reduce it to a note and edit the note to match.

Alright, I'm not too happy with this ruling but I'll go with it. I feel I've made a big enough fool out of myself as is and I don't really want anymore drama.

[Vekter]

Works for me.

[Coconutwarrior97]

We're stepping in to address this real quick.

The underage aspect is admittedly a bit strange. Though running around naked by itself is less a violation of rule 8 and moreso some silly thing.
Now it can be made weird with what an individual says/does while running around naked but that doesn't seem to be the case here. We believe this would have better served as a note relating to the character being underaged.
So we've asked coffee to make it clear in the note that the character being underage was the only issue with the gimmick.

Headmin Votes:
Coconutwarrior97: Reduce to note.
Domitius: Reduce to note.
Naloac: Reduce to note.