JusticeGoat Akoro Malo - HoS Ban

[RicardoFort]

BYOND account: BYOND RicardoFort
Character name: Akoro Malo
Ban type: Role
Ban length: 5 days
Ban reason: Banned from Roles: Head of Security for 5 days - Severe neglect of doing their job, worked with a traitor to help with do their objectives as hos.
Time ban was placed: 2021-04-26 17:28 Manuel
Server you were playing on when banned: Manuel
Round ID in which ban was placed: No clue and manuel is down
Your side of the story: A traitor confesed to me that their objectives were to steal some dumb shit, and I agreed in exchange for all of their tc and full cooperation. This all happened IC while talking to me as the Sole sec, their objectives didn't meant any harm to the station or it's crewmembers.
Why you think you should be unbanned: Why is this ruled by an admin in the first place? It's an IC issue, Nobody got hurt as result of this and the person who was taken into service was more than helpful for the duration of the round.
Anything else we should know: It was pretty uncomfortable to have a 5 days ban placed without even talking to me.

[JusticeGoat]

You are only banned from HOS, i don't see how what you did is any different from a HOP going to space or a player taking CMO to space lube the halls. Head roles are expected to have some minimum amount of effort, the HOS is not any different. So within the first ten minutes of the game trading high value objectives to a enemy of the company for syndicate gear back on the hopes to power game with it is not in the spirit of what Manuel is about.

[RicardoFort]

You are only banned from HOS, i don't see how what you did is any different from a HOP going to space or a player taking CMO to space lube the halls. Head roles are expected to have some minimum amount of effort, the HOS is not any different. So within the first ten minutes of the game trading high value objectives to a enemy of the company for syndicate gear back on the hopes to power game with it is not in the spirit of what Manuel is about.

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I didn't use any of the items from the syndicate, I only requested high TC cost items to further develop Syndicate research for the station, feel free to corroborate with the Logs.

I might be able to understand why this might warrant a talk or even a warning. but it escapes to me why not validhunting hard enough is reason for a suprise 5 day ban.

[JusticeGoat]

Well i would be ok dropping it to a note, i feel as that as the head of security there is a higher expectation on doing the job, please keep that in mind.

[RicardoFort]

Well i would be ok dropping it to a note, i feel as that as the head of security there is a higher expectation on doing the job, please keep that in mind.

I'm not exactly sure what's the take away here.
If a traitor confesses early in the round am I supposed to valid/perma them until they can no longer play the round? I'd rather opt for something more interesting for both parties.

The job of the HoS is keeping trouble to a minimum, which I was doing by striking a deal. I don't see the harm in that- It creates a more interesting dynamic where Security has to watch their back but in turn has an ally with knowledge that they simply dont-

[JusticeGoat]

The take away is if you are going to ask for a bribe it shouldn't be hos, there where other options to handle it like arresting and taking their uplink maybe letting them go with a tracker if you think they wouldn't cause harm? If a headmin wants to weigh in on this i wouldn't mind.

[RicardoFort]

The take away is if you are going to ask for a bribe it shouldn't be hos, there where other options to handle it like arresting and taking their uplink maybe letting them go with a tracker if you think they wouldn't cause harm? If a headmin wants to weigh in on this i wouldn't mind.

I would call it a bribe If I was asking for gamer gear for myself, but it was for deconstructing in SCI. Which is effective as taking their uplink but it also helps the station and keeps dynamics interesting.

I don't mind anyone else voicing their opinion, I'm just saying that it feels like i'm being punishing for not validhunting hard enough.

[mrmelbert]

This ban was placed on round 161047 on Manuel.
Link to the round on scrubby: https://scrubby.melonmesa.com/round/161047

[Vekter]

I believe the issue here is less that you struck a deal with an enemy of the corporation and more that you actively sought out traitors to give you gamer gear within a few minutes of joining.

[RicardoFort]

I believe the issue here is less that you struck a deal with an enemy of the corporation and more that you actively sought out traitors to give you gamer gear within a few minutes of joining.

As I said before, I didn't want the gamer gear for myself nor I even touched it, which you can corroborate in the logs.

[RicardoFort]

Is there any update on this? The note should either be removed or actually reflect what happened.

[JusticeGoat]

From my view the whole situation you and the tot where a bit lame, i figure out of all of the people who are on the command team the hos should be the least likely to hand someone a controlled piece of tech and the antag instead of giving up when they spawned, maybe try something then negotiate when caught. What is the point of playing those two roles if it plays out like this just another extended game?

I feel like this is a minor thing but wanted to put my foot down to stop this behavior from being mainstream and maybe define what is expected from a hos one of the main challenges, it doesn't mean you have to perma or re educate every traitor you catch, always options to tracking implant and take their uplink? Just be creative, they get a chance to attempt to steal the stuff again later in the round or maybe bribe another lower crew member? Hell if ops or any number of threats where attacking and the hos needed a item to get an edge i would understand a bribe, but early into the shift for little reason i expect them to be fired.

The only hang up i have right now the question, is handing out restricted gear to traitors being deliberately incompetent as a hos yes or no? I feel like it is and should be noted.

[Coconutwarrior97]

We'll get around to giving our two cents on this shortly.

[RicardoFort]

We'll get around to giving our two cents on this shortly.

Its fine-
Whatever the outcome it is I would like to say that hammering a 5 day ban without talking to the person is weird and it definitely made me feel uncomfortable

[JusticeGoat]

The five day HOS role ban has since been reversed a couple days ago, and a update to the note will be done now.

[Coconutwarrior97]

This ban should have been a note from the get go, we don't want to discourage folks from playing the game from this kind of angle.
However, its also important to note that an HoS doing this gimmick every round makes the game less fun since it means antagonists stop doing antagonistic things.
We asked justicegoat to change the note to,

Announced near round start that any traitors who would reveal themselves to him he would strike a deal with. A traitor responded to this and eventually gave him some uplink gear to further the station's syndicate research. This is perfectly fine as long as you don't make a habit of doing it as an HoS, as an antagonist not doing antagonistic things consistently makes the game less fun.

Headmin Votes:
Coconutwarrior97: Should be a note.
Jimmius: Should be a note.
Naloac: Should be a note.

[RicardoFort]

Thanks a lot!

What about the part of banning me without messaging me first? Is that something we should expect in the future as well?