[<Riggle>] Hafahya - Perma for the gamer word

[Hafahya]

BYOND account: Hafahya
Character name: Vladislav Pshenov
Ban type: Server
Ban length: Permanent
Ban reason: The ban reason is: When asked not to use the n-word as an insult, responded with "no fuck you". After a short talk it's clear you're not here in good faith. Please appeal on the forums if you wish to play here again.
Time ban was placed: 2021-09-12 13:12:32
Server you were playing on when banned: Terry
Round ID in which ban was placed: 169471
Your side of the story: Was attacked by a cargo felinid because I stood withing 7 or so tiles of appeared drained influence. Cat shouted heretic at me and immideatly attacked, I ran into cargo and started running circles and using all english insults I could remember on the felinid. Gamer word was among them. Was murdered by cargo crew, and later in the proccess of being revived got bwoinked. I REALLY was not in the correct mood to respond rationally.
Why you think you should be unbanned: Come on, perma? And no, Im in the "good faith" within the community, like I try to kil as little amount of people possible when I roll anteg and just stick to doing gimmicks. Its just that I severly lack respect in administration. Like here Riggle really tried to roleplay a psycologist, of which I dont remember making an appointment.

[Riggle]

Hi, thanks for making an appeal!

I understand you might have been angry at the time of bwoinking, but your blatant racism and disregard for the rules doesn't give me confidence in your behaviour when calm. The permaban was not applied because of the gamer word itself, but because of your behaviour in the tickets. I didn't try to "roleplay a psychologist", I tried VERY hard to be lenient and not permaban you and you didn't cooperate. Saying that you're good faith for not murderboning and then saying things like that completely invalidates it.

For reference:

Spoiler:

From Ticket #4 during round 169471 on Terry
Ticket opened at 2021-09-12 12:43:21 by riggle
Log:
12:43:21: Ticket Opened by-riggle: Hey, mind not using the n-word as an insult?
12:43:31: Reply from-hafahya: no fuck you
12:44:51: Reply from-riggle: Hey, listen. I know the word can be an easy one to use, but it's very offensive to some. Imagine how you'd feel in their position
12:45:40: Reply from-hafahya: Its an EU server, if someone gets offended that he is most definitely not a negro, he is just a liberal moron. And yes I am aware
12:46:19: Reply from-riggle: Have you never seen a black person in Europe? And you know, people from all oer the world play here, not only Europeans.
12:46:44: Reply from-hafahya: well thats their problem, not mine
12:47:33: Reply from-riggle: That's not a good way to think about it, it's not going to get you anywhere in life
12:48:03: Reply from-hafahya: you are a janny, you are not the one to lecture me about success in life
12:55:57: Reply from-riggle: And because I am a jannie I must be unsuccessful, what an assumption.
12:56:42: Reply from-hafahya: You are painful to talk to, fuck off please
12:57:33: Reply from-riggle: I'm painful to talk to because I am trying to be patient? You're too used to being in a toxic community, not all people are like that
12:58:50: Reply from-hafahya: I dont care about being polite to niggers, and yes, also not all people are liberals. I am russian why the fuck should I respect both niggers and you stupiid westerner ideas
12:59:38: Reply from-riggle: You're free to believe what you want, just don't go out of your way to insult people
13:00:06: Reply from-hafahya: I was assaulted, why wouldnt I insult people
13:00:44: Reply from-riggle: Sure, you're free to do that in the situation, but please, just use less colourful language
13:00:52: Reply from-hafahya: no
13:01:03: Reply from-riggle: Why not?
13:01:13: Reply from-hafahya: Cause I want to
--sniped 15 lines until the end-- (irrelevant, most of the replies are "no" )
This ticket was generated by Statbus v.0.12.0

Come back with a vouch from another community and I'll consider reducing your ban.

[Hafahya]

My behaviour in the tickets does not correspond with my behaviour IC, and no, aside from *gasp* saying the nigger-word I have not expressed any racism. Neither was I "Intentionally seeking to demean others due to their actual or perceived race, sex, gender, orientation or the like is not tolerated." As I see it, rule 11 only appiles you call negro a negro. You are most likely not a negro, and neither was the felinid I insulted IC. It can only be said that I was "Intentionally seeking to demean others due to their" political belives, wich is not forbidden according to the rules. So I did not break any rules

[Riggle]

Saying the n-word in and of itself might not be a rule 11 violation, but you most definitely used it to demean and insult IC and OOC, which is not allowed according to our rules; furthermore, you have not displayed any remorse, continuing to insult and arguably even doubled down on it, that's why a permanent ban was applied. The IC incident would have been overlooked with a note at most have you not proceeded to insult not only the administration team, but all black people as a whole. What you've done were clear violations of rule 1 & 11. Not to mention that you displayed an unwillingness to follow the rules multiple times. You don't have to play here if you don't want to.

I dont care about being polite to niggers, ...

Calling people "niggers" and "negro", at least in my eyes, counts as seeking to demean others for their perceived race.

You can't express bigotry, this comes down to context, the goal was to avoid becoming the kind of place that banned for all uses of a slur.

This means "x got banned for calling somebody a faggot" is ok, i don't see the need to censor such a use, "what are you faggots playing" is also ok, "y is a faggot" is not.

Same for "nigga pls" vs "x is being a nigg(er|a)"

The quote above is an explanation of how rule 11 was meant to work.

[Hafahya]

Explanation of rule 11 you posted implies that the word must be used "to demean others for their perceived race". Neither felinid(IC) nor you are black thus making the word a regular insult without racist context, wich is okay in the quote you brought.
>I dont care about being polite to niggers,
That was said in private conversation, therefore this phrase could insult/offend noone. So this is not violation of rule 11. You can try and search for me insulting spessmen with black skin in other rounds. but you will find nothing. Cause, as I said, I am in a good faith in the community. Only thing I am guilty of is violation of rule 1 in the ticket, wich I understand and will avoid in future.
And about "Calling people "niggers" and "negro", yes, it is only in your eyes. I am russian, we call em "негр"(negr) here. Its in the scientific name of their race "негроидная"(negroidnaya).
I belive permanent ban for rule 1 is excessive.

[Sylphet]

Relevant log section.

Spoiler:

Game log : https://tgstation13.org/parsed-logs/ter ... 1/game.txt
Attack log : https://tgstation13.org/parsed-logs/ter ... attack.txt

[2021-09-12 12:40:44.221] SAY: Lipino7/(Hans Robert) "sec to cargo heretic" (Cargo Office (89,116,4))
[2021-09-12 12:40:47.303] SAY: MerryMoose/(Slimy McGee) "HERETIC ASSISTANT" (Cargo Office (86,118,4))
[2021-09-12 12:40:48.923] SAY: Hafahya/(Vladislav Pshenov) "fucking niggers" (Cargo Bay (75,114,4))
[2021-09-12 12:40:50.466] ATTACK: Lipino7/(Hans Robert) has shoved Hafahya/(Vladislav Pshenov) (NEWHP: 69.5) (Cargo Bay (75,115,4))
[2021-09-12 12:40:50.865] ATTACK: Hafahya/(Vladislav Pshenov) has shoved Lipino7/(Hans Robert) (NEWHP: 100) (Cargo Bay (75,111,4))
[2021-09-12 12:40:50.993] SAY: MerryMoose/(Slimy McGee) "cargo" (Cargo Office (86,119,4))
[2021-09-12 12:40:53.513] ATTACK: Hafahya/(Vladislav Pshenov) has shoved Lipino7/(Hans Robert) (NEWHP: 100) (Cargo Bay (75,115,4))
[2021-09-12 12:40:56.099] OOC: Tlaltecuhtli/(Brick Carr) "vote meta or you get prions from the vaccine in your brain" (Cargo Office (91,118,4))
[2021-09-12 12:40:56.608] ATTACK: Hafahya/(Vladislav Pshenov) has shoved Lipino7/(Hans Robert) (NEWHP: 100) (Cargo Bay (76,114,4))
[2021-09-12 12:40:58.468] ATTACK: Lipino7/(Hans Robert) has shoved Hafahya/(Vladislav Pshenov) (NEWHP: 69.5) (Cargo Bay (76,116,4))
[2021-09-12 12:40:59.606] SAY: Hafahya/(Vladislav Pshenov) "Moron" (Cargo Bay (74,116,4))
[2021-09-12 12:41:00.848] ATTACK: Lipino7/(Hans Robert) has punched Hafahya/(Vladislav Pshenov) (NEWHP: 66.5) (Cargo Bay (76,115,4))
[2021-09-12 12:41:02.098] ATTACK: Pomiepup/(Soup) has fired at [floor] with the laser tag beam from Cargo Office (Cargo Office (92,116,4))
[2021-09-12 12:41:02.177] ATTACK: Pomiepup/(Soup) has fired at [floor] with the laser tag beam from Cargo Office (Cargo Office (92,116,4))
[2021-09-12 12:41:03.022] ATTACK: Lipino7/(Hans Robert) has punched Hafahya/(Vladislav Pshenov) (NEWHP: 61.5) (Cargo Bay (75,117,4))
[2021-09-12 12:41:07.128] ATTACK: Pomiepup/(Soup) has fired at [window] with the laser tag beam from Cargo Office (Cargo Office (92,119,4))
[2021-09-12 12:41:07.184] ATTACK: Pomiepup/(Soup) has fired at [window] with the laser tag beam from Cargo Office (Cargo Office (92,119,4))
[2021-09-12 12:41:09.615] SAY: Lipino7/(Hans Robert) "hjeretic" (Cargo Bay (76,115,4))
[2021-09-12 12:41:12.327] SAY: Hafahya/(Vladislav Pshenov) "NO" (Cargo Bay (77,119,4))
[2021-09-12 12:41:12.579] ATTACK: Lipino7/(Hans Robert) has shoved Hafahya/(Vladislav Pshenov) (NEWHP: 61.5) (Cargo Bay (78,120,4))
[2021-09-12 12:41:15.794] ATTACK: Hafahya/(Vladislav Pshenov) has shoved Lipino7/(Hans Robert) (NEWHP: 100) (Cargo Bay (74,117,4))
[2021-09-12 12:41:20.361] ATTACK: Lipino7/(Hans Robert) has punched Hafahya/(Vladislav Pshenov) (NEWHP: 57.5) (Cargo Bay (76,117,4))
[2021-09-12 12:41:24.704] ATTACK: Livrah/(Boris Mahnov) has thrown the wirecutters (Cargo Office (92,116,4))
[2021-09-12 12:41:25.727] ATTACK: Lipino7/(Hans Robert) has shoved Hafahya/(Vladislav Pshenov) (NEWHP: 57.5) (Cargo Bay (79,120,4))
[2021-09-12 12:41:27.725] ATTACK: Lipino7/(Hans Robert) has shoved Hafahya/(Vladislav Pshenov) (NEWHP: 57.5) (Cargo Bay (79,119,4))
[2021-09-12 12:41:28.533] ATTACK: Lipino7/(Hans Robert) has shoved Hafahya/(Vladislav Pshenov) (NEWHP: 57.5) (Cargo Bay (78,118,4))
[2021-09-12 12:41:30.559] ATTACK: Hafahya/(Vladislav Pshenov) has attacked Lipino7/(Hans Robert) with welding tool (COMBAT MODE: 1) (DAMTYPE: BURN) (NEWHP: 85) (Cargo Bay (76,114,4))
[2021-09-12 12:41:33.297] ATTACK: Lipino7/(Hans Robert) has punched Hafahya/(Vladislav Pshenov) (NEWHP: 49.5) (Cargo Bay (77,116,4))
[2021-09-12 12:41:34.455] ATTACK: Hafahya/(Vladislav Pshenov) has attacked Lipino7/(Hans Robert) with welding tool (COMBAT MODE: 1) (DAMTYPE: BURN) (NEWHP: 70) (Cargo Bay (76,116,4))
[2021-09-12 12:41:35.566] ATTACK: Lipino7/(Hans Robert) has attempted to punch Hafahya/(Vladislav Pshenov) (NEWHP: 49.5) (Cargo Bay (77,117,4))
[2021-09-12 12:41:36.779] ATTACK: Hafahya/(Vladislav Pshenov) has attacked Lipino7/(Hans Robert) with welding tool (COMBAT MODE: 1) (DAMTYPE: BURN) (NEWHP: 55) (Cargo Bay (76,118,4))
[2021-09-12 12:41:36.919] ATTACK: Lipino7/(Hans Robert) has punched Hafahya/(Vladislav Pshenov) (NEWHP: 45.5) (Cargo Bay (77,119,4))
[2021-09-12 12:41:42.201] ATTACK: Hafahya/(Vladislav Pshenov) has attacked Lipino7/(Hans Robert) with welding tool (COMBAT MODE: 1) (DAMTYPE: BRUTE) (NEWHP: 52) (Cargo Bay (82,115,4))
[2021-09-12 12:41:42.922] ATTACK: Lipino7/(Hans Robert) has shoved Hafahya/(Vladislav Pshenov) (NEWHP: 45.5) (Cargo Bay (81,118,4))
[2021-09-12 12:41:55.264] SAY: Hafahya/(Vladislav Pshenov) "rMORON" (Cargo Bay (81,113,4))
[2021-09-12 12:41:56.923] SAY: Livrah/(Boris Mahnov) "god bless new auolathes" (Cargo Office (86,120,4))
[2021-09-12 12:42:00.447] SAY: Hafahya/(Vladislav Pshenov) "IM NOT A HERETICV" (Cargo Bay (81,113,4))
[2021-09-12 12:42:01.026] ATTACK: Lipino7/(Hans Robert) has shoved Hafahya/(Vladislav Pshenov) (NEWHP: 45.5) (Cargo Bay (82,113,4))
[2021-09-12 12:42:05.487] SAY: Lipino7/(Hans Robert) "i literllay saw you" (Cargo Bay (81,114,4))
[2021-09-12 12:42:07.766] GAME: Avylaar/(Lloyd Moffardi) has teleported from (Cargo Bay (79,119,4)) to (Bridge (116,136,4))
[2021-09-12 12:42:09.646] SAY: Lipino7/(Hans Robert) "suckign the infleunce" (Cargo Bay (81,114,4))
[2021-09-12 12:42:11.329] SAY: Hafahya/(Vladislav Pshenov) "I DIDNT GO THERE IDIOT" (Cargo Bay (78,112,4))
[2021-09-12 12:42:19.089] GAME: Avylaar/(Lloyd Moffardi) has teleported from (Bridge (115,136,4)) to (Cargo Bay (80,119,4))
[2021-09-12 12:42:21.119] SAY: Hafahya/(Vladislav Pshenov) "IDIOT" (Cargo Bay (76,117,4))

You can't express bigotry, this comes down to context, the goal was to avoid becoming the kind of place that banned for all uses of a slur.

This means "x got banned for calling somebody a faggot" is ok, i don't see the need to censor such a use, "what are you faggots playing" is also ok, "y is a faggot" is not.

Same for "nigga pls" vs "x is being a nigg(er|a)"

This quote is from the host of the server.

"y is a faggot" is not.

This is the case that you used it in, said directly to the people that you were fighting with. Which is the case above.

[2021-09-12 12:40:48.923] SAY: Hafahya/(Vladislav Pshenov) "fucking niggers" (Cargo Bay (75,114,4))

But this actually doesn't matter. The only mistake here is to argue whether or not this was a break of rule 11 - it's totally irrelevant and not the true reason for the ban. This was only the *trigger* for this ban being placed. This ban is for how you acted in the ticket, not the use of the word. You completely refused to not use it, then proceeded to insult both staff and black people as an entire race. Your ticket conduct shows that you are either unwilling or incapable of following the server rules, which is a perfectly valid reason to remove you from the community permanently under rule 0.

[Hafahya]

Yeah okay thats a way better explanation. If I promise to do rules can ban be reduced? Cause I played 400 hours this whole summer here and actually did follow them *ahem* exept for only-english rule *ahem*

[Riggle]

Thank you for agreeing to follow the rules. After a talk with other admins, I've decided to lift your ban, you should be able to play on our servers again shortly. Sorry if I couldn't explain it correctly earlier, and sorry about the second half of the ticket, I was being a bit too aggressive. Good luck and have fun!

[Hafahya]

okay cool thanks