[Hulkamania] CMDR Gungnir
Posted: Tue Oct 26, 2021 6:57 am
BYOND account: CMDR_Gungnir
Character name: Riley Bailey
Ban type: Server
Ban length: 3 Days
Ban reason: "After a ticket which did not pan out his way, opened another one attempting to get the other admin online to give them a favorful ruling, literally admitting to admin shopping."
Time ban was placed: 2021-10-26 03:41:58
Server you were playing on when banned: Manuel
Round ID in which ban was placed: 171945
Why you think you should be unbanned: It's a bit of a long story.
First things first, that note in the ticket is fundamentally incorrect. The claim that the ticket "did not pan out (my) way" and that I opened another one to "get the other admin online to give (me) a favorful ruling" are both false. I didn't care about the result of the ticket. If you didn't think it was worth doing something about, then fair enough. I'll respect that.
What I cared about is the needlessly hostile attitude that I received in that ticket. What I cared about is that after being urged by literally every other admin I've spoken to on Manuel to ahelp problems that I see, I'm told off for doing it. What I cared about is being told that doing that was bad. What I cared about is that I received, from the very beginning, nothing but disdain for daring to give a shit.
Here's the ticket.
I've been told by quite literally every other admin that I've spoken to, to ahelp things that I see. That they want to be able to do something but can't unless someone speaks up.
And then I do that, and I'm accused of "just playing player-admin", and told that you don't even see a reason to investigate it unless the people involved ahelp it. The problem- is that this is why nobody does. Because they think that it's pointless to ahelp. That's WHY I'm told to just ahelp things that I witness. Your response to that information is to tell me to 'just accept inconsistent rulings', which is basically just hammering in that it's completely pointless to even try.
Now, after you asked for the name, if all you'd said was "I've sent them a message, but they logged out before I could actually speak with them." I'd have gone "Yeah, alright. Fair enough." At least you tried. But you follow it up by continuing to tell me off for trying to ahelp a situation. So naturally, I'm going to explain my reasoning. You're telling me off for trying to do the right thing, and as I mention in the ticket, if I AM wrong and it's not actually bad and rulebreaking, I can just be told that it's fine. But if it IS bad and rulebreaking, then the admins are now 1) Aware of it, and 2) Able to do something about it.
You proceed to tell me that my desire to actually see the server thrive is 'taking it too seriously' and 'the kind of attitude that isn't healthy for it' (Apparently reporting people for griefing is bad?). You mention that even paying attention to what server people come from is bad, and so I just explained where I was coming from. Fair enough, but if you're going to tell me off I at least want you to understand why, because everything I do or think generally has a reason to it. Maybe you can explain to me why I'm wrong, or maybe it'll make sense to you. Who knows.
You instead respond with hostility telling me, in different words, that you don't give a shit, and will just enforce the rules. I point out that I've seen that very behaviour is against the rules countless times, and your response is to just slap your metaphorical dick on the table, flex your admin status and walk off.
Thus, we come to the reason of the ban. I didn't go to Thrax because the ticket "didn't go my way" and I didn't go to him because I "wanted another admin to give me a favorful ruling", I was perfectly fine with you just trying to talk to the dude, or even just saying that it wasn't too big of an issue. I went to Thrax because your handling of that ticket was unacceptable. Because all I received from the very beginning of it from you, was Hostility.
I'd thought that it was clear as day from context, and from my response to you when you intercepted that, that it was just spite. It was "You've been an ass to me, so I'm going to go talk to someone else instead." It was specifically said because I knew that you'd read it, and if you'd been a dick to me, I was going to be a dick to you. A metaphorical middle finger.
It was about the hostility. I said as much in my response to you. You could have just muted my ahelps and told me to cool off. You could have done any myriad number of options.
Instead you chose to throw the book at me, while being incorrect about the reason. It was never about the ticket not going my way, or wanting a different outcome.
The Second Ticket
I didn't think someone GENUINELY intending to adminshop would straight up say "cool guess I'll just admin shop then" because naturally the other admin's not going to be able to do anything about it if they know you're shopping. I'd thought that it was pretty clear that it's just an angry spite thing. But you ban me while stating that I'm "trying to get a favorful result" from a different admin after "a ticket that didn't go (my) way". I have, admittedly, been told since that there ARE people who do genuinely say that they're gonna go break a rule, and then proceed to break that rule. So, while I know I can't prove it, I'd like to say that I didn't actually intend to. I did it specifically because I knew that Thrax wouldn't be able to do anything about it. I did it because it was retaliation against the hostility, and the opening of a conversation where I could actually talk to someone about the incident, without the hostility. He couldn't change the outcome, but I didn't want it changed. I just wanted a calm, polite discussion about it which I couldn't get from you, and was kinda pissed off about it.
(I've also been told while I was writing this that my "It's hard to care about the opinion of an admin who gives me hostility." was taken as not giving a shit about your opinion as an admin, rather than simply not caring about your personal opinion, which if that's the case is a whoopsy miscommunication on my part)
References of good conduct: As of the time of this incident, I've got 62020 minutes of living time recorded. This is since I started playing in April of this year.
In this length of time, I've only received a single negative note. And it was three months and 17500 minutes of living time ago. I think this speaks for itself at the fact that I don't go around breaking the rules willy nilly. And while I know it sounds like a similar vein to "But I have a black friend" I'm friends with quite a few of the Manuelmins (the only server I play on), and I doubt that'd be the case if I was an obnoxious troublestarter.
Anything else we should know: This entire thing stems from either a miscommunicated response to hostility, or miscommunications all the way down if you hadn't actually intended to be hostile from the beginning, and I think that this is excessive in either case.
Character name: Riley Bailey
Ban type: Server
Ban length: 3 Days
Ban reason: "After a ticket which did not pan out his way, opened another one attempting to get the other admin online to give them a favorful ruling, literally admitting to admin shopping."
Time ban was placed: 2021-10-26 03:41:58
Server you were playing on when banned: Manuel
Round ID in which ban was placed: 171945
Why you think you should be unbanned: It's a bit of a long story.
First things first, that note in the ticket is fundamentally incorrect. The claim that the ticket "did not pan out (my) way" and that I opened another one to "get the other admin online to give (me) a favorful ruling" are both false. I didn't care about the result of the ticket. If you didn't think it was worth doing something about, then fair enough. I'll respect that.
What I cared about is the needlessly hostile attitude that I received in that ticket. What I cared about is that after being urged by literally every other admin I've spoken to on Manuel to ahelp problems that I see, I'm told off for doing it. What I cared about is being told that doing that was bad. What I cared about is that I received, from the very beginning, nothing but disdain for daring to give a shit.
Here's the ticket.
I've been told by quite literally every other admin that I've spoken to, to ahelp things that I see. That they want to be able to do something but can't unless someone speaks up.
And then I do that, and I'm accused of "just playing player-admin", and told that you don't even see a reason to investigate it unless the people involved ahelp it. The problem- is that this is why nobody does. Because they think that it's pointless to ahelp. That's WHY I'm told to just ahelp things that I witness. Your response to that information is to tell me to 'just accept inconsistent rulings', which is basically just hammering in that it's completely pointless to even try.
Now, after you asked for the name, if all you'd said was "I've sent them a message, but they logged out before I could actually speak with them." I'd have gone "Yeah, alright. Fair enough." At least you tried. But you follow it up by continuing to tell me off for trying to ahelp a situation. So naturally, I'm going to explain my reasoning. You're telling me off for trying to do the right thing, and as I mention in the ticket, if I AM wrong and it's not actually bad and rulebreaking, I can just be told that it's fine. But if it IS bad and rulebreaking, then the admins are now 1) Aware of it, and 2) Able to do something about it.
You proceed to tell me that my desire to actually see the server thrive is 'taking it too seriously' and 'the kind of attitude that isn't healthy for it' (Apparently reporting people for griefing is bad?). You mention that even paying attention to what server people come from is bad, and so I just explained where I was coming from. Fair enough, but if you're going to tell me off I at least want you to understand why, because everything I do or think generally has a reason to it. Maybe you can explain to me why I'm wrong, or maybe it'll make sense to you. Who knows.
You instead respond with hostility telling me, in different words, that you don't give a shit, and will just enforce the rules. I point out that I've seen that very behaviour is against the rules countless times, and your response is to just slap your metaphorical dick on the table, flex your admin status and walk off.
Thus, we come to the reason of the ban. I didn't go to Thrax because the ticket "didn't go my way" and I didn't go to him because I "wanted another admin to give me a favorful ruling", I was perfectly fine with you just trying to talk to the dude, or even just saying that it wasn't too big of an issue. I went to Thrax because your handling of that ticket was unacceptable. Because all I received from the very beginning of it from you, was Hostility.
I'd thought that it was clear as day from context, and from my response to you when you intercepted that, that it was just spite. It was "You've been an ass to me, so I'm going to go talk to someone else instead." It was specifically said because I knew that you'd read it, and if you'd been a dick to me, I was going to be a dick to you. A metaphorical middle finger.
It was about the hostility. I said as much in my response to you. You could have just muted my ahelps and told me to cool off. You could have done any myriad number of options.
Instead you chose to throw the book at me, while being incorrect about the reason. It was never about the ticket not going my way, or wanting a different outcome.
The Second Ticket
I didn't think someone GENUINELY intending to adminshop would straight up say "cool guess I'll just admin shop then" because naturally the other admin's not going to be able to do anything about it if they know you're shopping. I'd thought that it was pretty clear that it's just an angry spite thing. But you ban me while stating that I'm "trying to get a favorful result" from a different admin after "a ticket that didn't go (my) way". I have, admittedly, been told since that there ARE people who do genuinely say that they're gonna go break a rule, and then proceed to break that rule. So, while I know I can't prove it, I'd like to say that I didn't actually intend to. I did it specifically because I knew that Thrax wouldn't be able to do anything about it. I did it because it was retaliation against the hostility, and the opening of a conversation where I could actually talk to someone about the incident, without the hostility. He couldn't change the outcome, but I didn't want it changed. I just wanted a calm, polite discussion about it which I couldn't get from you, and was kinda pissed off about it.
(I've also been told while I was writing this that my "It's hard to care about the opinion of an admin who gives me hostility." was taken as not giving a shit about your opinion as an admin, rather than simply not caring about your personal opinion, which if that's the case is a whoopsy miscommunication on my part)
References of good conduct: As of the time of this incident, I've got 62020 minutes of living time recorded. This is since I started playing in April of this year.
In this length of time, I've only received a single negative note. And it was three months and 17500 minutes of living time ago. I think this speaks for itself at the fact that I don't go around breaking the rules willy nilly. And while I know it sounds like a similar vein to "But I have a black friend" I'm friends with quite a few of the Manuelmins (the only server I play on), and I doubt that'd be the case if I was an obnoxious troublestarter.
Anything else we should know: This entire thing stems from either a miscommunicated response to hostility, or miscommunications all the way down if you hadn't actually intended to be hostile from the beginning, and I think that this is excessive in either case.