/tg/Station 13

Posted: **Mon Jun 27, 2022 6:41 am**

Byond account: Qfmysteryman23
Character name: Cleans-His-Ass
ban type: server
Ban length: one day
Ban reason:

Time of ban: In picture
Server I was banned on: Sybil
Round ID: In picture

My side of the story: As a lizard player on Sybil, any encounter with a borg is almost always going to be bad. I would like to clarify that I was not breaking the bridge airlock for no reason, it was because the AI was not letting me and another person out. I did however stop once the other person pulled out tools and started to hack the door open. Even though I stopped, the medical borg in there flashed me and took the axe, I chased after it to get it back and the other person in the room then flashed the borg and my first knee jerk reaction was to kill the borg. Mostly cause I was afraid that if I didn't kill them, they would just come back and attack me again once I left. Borg players are also major shitters, they are well known for straight up ending peoples rounds via debraining, welding you in a locker and spacing - just because you are a non-human. So sure, my kneejerk reaction wasn't cool and it was against the rules, but to say my actions happened for no reason would be false. I also think that being banned in the first place was unnecessary since the borg got revived and I gave the axe to security.

Posted: **Mon Jun 27, 2022 3:08 pm**

You're running on a lot of assumptions of what the borg would have done. There was no evidence to suggest that the borg had any intention to kill you. All the borg did was flash you and drag the fire axe away, as you were whacking down the bridge's airlocks. I sympathize with you; as a moth player I'm both non-human and a walking flash target to borgs. But this does not excuse killing borgs via improper escalation.

Appeal denied.

Posted: **Mon Jun 27, 2022 6:51 pm**

Again, The borg flashed me even after I stopped whacking the airlock. And I whacked one airlock, not multiple "Airlocks" and I did it because the AI would not let us out. Either way I stopped once the other person started to hack open the door. And since you play as a non-human, you should then agree with me that it gets tiring having your round ruined just because borg players want any reason to murderbone. So yes, I overreacted. Yes, it was a bad choice. But one relatively minor incident like this is not worthy of a ban. Especially since the borg got revived, and I returned the axe to security.

Posted: **Mon Jun 27, 2022 7:02 pm**

It would be exceptionally useful to have logs backing up this appeal from either side.

As the player and banning admin appear to be disagreeing on certain aspects of this incident that may (or may not???) be material to the player's actual actions and IC decision making, putting the stories in context of the logs will help work towards a resolution.

All logs for the shift are available at
https://tgstation13.org/parsed-logs/syb ... nd-185628/

Scrubby also has numerous logs available with search + filtering
https://scrubby.melonmesa.com/round/185628

Posted: **Mon Jun 27, 2022 7:51 pm**

[2022-06-27 05:25:02.542] ATTACK: Qfmysteryman23/(Cleans-His-Ass) has attacked [Bridge] with the fire axe (Wielded) (Bridge (113,134,2))- was the last time I hit the airlock as I stopped because the other person started to hack the door.

[2022-06-27 05:25:10.051] ATTACK: Scriptis/(Evergreen) has flashed(targeted) Qfmysteryman23/(Cleans-His-Ass) with the flash (NEWHP: 96.3) (Bridge (110,136,2))- Borg flashes me after I stopped.

I dont know what section Unscrewing airlocks is found at.

In regards to giving the axe back to security:

[2022-06-27 05:29:44.765] SAY: San7890/(Keagan Yossarian) "cook you didn't answer my simple question" (Kitchen (139,126,2))

[2022-06-27 05:29:49.814] SAY: San7890/(Keagan Yossarian) "so i'm returning the axe to a proper location" (Kitchen (139,126,2))

[2022-06-27 05:29:57.823] SAY: Qfmysteryman23/(Cleans-His-Ass) "ok take it" (Service Hallway (143,117,2))

Logs that reinforce my points:

[2022-06-27 05:32:30.034] SAY: Qfmysteryman23/(Cleans-His-Ass) "Cope, you were probably going to kill me" (Kitchen (139,125,2))

[2022-06-27 05:32:35.861] SAY: Scriptis/(Evergreen) "I was not going to kill you" (Robotics Lab (117,94,2))

[2022-06-27 05:32:38.833] SAY: Qfmysteryman23/(Cleans-His-Ass) "Im not trusting anything borg rleated" (Kitchen (139,125,2))

[2022-06-27 05:32:38.941] SAY: Scriptis/(Evergreen) "I was actively running away from you" (Robotics Lab (117,94,2))

[2022-06-27 05:32:40.695] SAY: Scriptis/(Evergreen) "you lizard plebian" (Robotics Lab (117,94,2))

[2022-06-27 05:32:44.686] SAY: Qfmysteryman23/(Cleans-His-Ass) "until you are taken off asimov" (Kitchen (139,125,2))

[2022-06-27 05:32:52.425] SAY: Scriptis/(Evergreen) "I can kill you on asimov" (Robotics Lab (117,94,2))

[2022-06-27 05:32:54.046] SAY: Scriptis/(Evergreen) "you lizard plebian" (Robotics Lab (117,94,2))

[2022-06-27 05:32:59.270] SAY: Qfmysteryman23/(Cleans-His-Ass) "My point" (Kitchen (139,125,2))

Kinda weird that he claims he was not gonna kill me, but then he brings up that he can kill me since he is on asimov as if it makes it ok.

Posted: **Mon Jun 27, 2022 9:04 pm**

Logs:

https://scrubby.melonmesa.com/round/185 ... e=game.txt
https://scrubby.melonmesa.com/round/185 ... attack.txt

The other person you were with asks AI to let them out of the bridge:

Code: Select all

05:24:52	SAY	GeorgeBushGaming/(Suzanna Hendricks) "ai can I be let out please"	(112, 134, 2)	Bridge

The AI doesn't respond, so 7 seconds later you start wailing on the airlock:

Code: Select all

05:24:59	ATTACK	Qfmysteryman23/(Cleans-His-Ass) has attacked [Bridge] with the fire axe (Wielded)	(113, 134, 2)	Bridge
05:25:00	ATTACK	Qfmysteryman23/(Cleans-His-Ass) has attacked [Bridge] with the fire axe (Wielded)	(113, 134, 2)	Bridge
05:25:01	ATTACK	Qfmysteryman23/(Cleans-His-Ass) has attacked [Bridge] with the fire axe (Wielded)	(113, 134, 2)	Bridge
05:25:02	ATTACK	Qfmysteryman23/(Cleans-His-Ass) has attacked [Bridge] with the fire axe (Wielded)	(113, 134, 2)	Bridge

The borg walks into the bridge and sees you with the fire axe, so they flash you and drag the fire axe away.

Code: Select all

05:25:10	ATTACK	Scriptis/(Evergreen) has flashed(targeted) Qfmysteryman23/(Cleans-His-Ass) with the flash (NEWHP: 96.3)	(110, 136, 2)	Bridge

The other person that was in the bridge chases the borg down, flashing them:

Code: Select all

05:25:15	ATTACK	GeorgeBushGaming/(Suzanna Hendricks) has flashed Scriptis/(Evergreen) with the flash (NEWHP: 72)	(101, 130, 2)	Bridge

They picked up the fire axe, but you shove them down and tell them it's yours (they later come back to ask for the fire axe to return to security):

Code: Select all

05:25:18	ATTACK	Qfmysteryman23/(Cleans-His-Ass) has shoved GeorgeBushGaming/(Suzanna Hendricks) with knocking them down (NEWHP: 91.9)	(101, 130, 2)	Bridge
05:25:21	SAY	Qfmysteryman23/(Cleans-His-Ass) "mine first"	(101, 131, 2)	Bridge

And then you proceed to kill the borg while they were stunned from the flash:

Code: Select all

05:25:22	ATTACK	Qfmysteryman23/(Cleans-His-Ass) has attacked Scriptis/(Evergreen) with fire axe (Wielded) (COMBAT MODE: 0) (DAMTYPE: BRUTE) (NEWHP: 42)	(100, 131, 2)	Bridge
05:25:23	ATTACK	Qfmysteryman23/(Cleans-His-Ass) has attacked Scriptis/(Evergreen) with fire axe (Wielded) (COMBAT MODE: 0) (DAMTYPE: BRUTE) (NEWHP: 12)	(100, 131, 2)	Bridge
05:25:24	ATTACK	Qfmysteryman23/(Cleans-His-Ass) has attacked Scriptis/(Evergreen) with fire axe (Wielded) (COMBAT MODE: 0) (DAMTYPE: BRUTE) (NEWHP: -18)	(100, 131, 2)	Bridge
05:25:25	ATTACK	Qfmysteryman23/(Cleans-His-Ass) has attacked Scriptis/(Evergreen) with fire axe (Wielded) (COMBAT MODE: 0) (DAMTYPE: BRUTE) (NEWHP: -48)	(100, 131, 2)	Bridge
05:25:26	ATTACK	Qfmysteryman23/(Cleans-His-Ass) has attacked Scriptis/(Evergreen) with fire axe (Wielded) (COMBAT MODE: 0) (DAMTYPE: BRUTE) (NEWHP: -78)	(100, 131, 2)	Bridge
05:25:27	ATTACK	Qfmysteryman23/(Cleans-His-Ass) has attacked Scriptis/(Evergreen) with fire axe (Wielded) (COMBAT MODE: 0) (DAMTYPE: BRUTE) (NEWHP: -100)	(100, 131, 2)	Bridge
05:25:28	ATTACK	Qfmysteryman23/(Cleans-His-Ass) has attacked *no key*/(Evergreen) with fire axe (Wielded) (COMBAT MODE: 0) (DAMTYPE: BRUTE) (NEWHP: -100)	(101, 131, 2)	Bridge

The bottom line of this ban is that you improperly escalated and killed a borg for trying to stop you from destroying things with a fire axe.

Additionally, the logs you brought forward do not help your point at all. The borg said that they were not going to kill you even though they could. They were trying to say that they were acting in good faith. You simply cannot assume bad faith from everyone and then kill them.

Posted: **Mon Jun 27, 2022 11:41 pm**

I didn't ahelp this, and I'm surprised somebody actually noticed it. I wrote it off as a one-off mistake, and I don't usually ahelp anything that doesn't persist across rounds.

qfmysteryman23 wrote: ↑Mon Jun 27, 2022 6:41 am Borg players are also major shitters, they are well known for straight up ending peoples rounds via debraining, welding you in a locker and spacing - just because you are a non-human. So sure, my kneejerk reaction wasn't cool and it was against the rules, but to say my actions happened for no reason would be false.

Borgs are bound by escalation policy, the same as anyone else. Silicons aren't special! We don't get relaxed escalation. If a borg lockers and spaces your body, unless a regular carbon had a reason to do the same, they're in violation of Silicon Policy:

Silicon Policy wrote: 1. Server Rule 1 "Don't be a dick" applies for law interpretation. Act in good faith to not ruin a round for other players unprompted.

and you should ahelp it. I only tried to take the axe because minutes earlier you were trying to sneak into the AI upload during a large scuffle--and I didn't trust you with it!!

qfmysteryman23 wrote: ↑Mon Jun 27, 2022 6:41 am I also think that being banned in the first place was unnecessary since the borg got revived and I gave the axe to security.

This is the second time this month I've been the subject of borg bullying. Please see the discussion and ruling here for escalation against silicons:

Mothblocks wrote: Your belief is wrong. Cyborgs are still played by players, and escalation exists just the same.

In fact, silicons are protected from basically this exact thing.

Silicon Protections 1.3 and 1.4 wrote: As a nonantagonist, killing or detonating silicons in the presence of a reasonable alternative and without cause to be concerned of potential subversion [is a violation of Rule 1].

As a nonantagonist (human or otherwise), instigating conflict with silicons so you can kill them [is a violation of Rule 1].

Similarly, "the borg was revived" is still a cop-out. Especially since you aren't the one who brought me to robotics; you didn't even make an effort to have me revived! I was rescued by a random good samaritan, Komidore Amigata:

Code: Select all

[2022-06-27 05:25:51.699] ATTACK: Afonamos/(Komidore Amigata) has grabbed *no key*/(Evergreen) passive grab (NEWHP: -100)  (Bridge (100,130,2))

Posted: **Tue Jun 28, 2022 6:12 am**

iwishforducks wrote: ↑Mon Jun 27, 2022 9:04 pm Logs:

https://scrubby.melonmesa.com/round/185 ... e=game.txt
https://scrubby.melonmesa.com/round/185 ... attack.txt

The other person you were with asks AI to let them out of the bridge:
Code: Select all
05:24:52	SAY	GeorgeBushGaming/(Suzanna Hendricks) "ai can I be let out please"	(112, 134, 2)	Bridge
The AI doesn't respond, so 7 seconds later you start wailing on the airlock:
Code: Select all
05:24:59	ATTACK	Qfmysteryman23/(Cleans-His-Ass) has attacked [Bridge] with the fire axe (Wielded)	(113, 134, 2)	Bridge
05:25:00	ATTACK	Qfmysteryman23/(Cleans-His-Ass) has attacked [Bridge] with the fire axe (Wielded)	(113, 134, 2)	Bridge
05:25:01	ATTACK	Qfmysteryman23/(Cleans-His-Ass) has attacked [Bridge] with the fire axe (Wielded)	(113, 134, 2)	Bridge
05:25:02	ATTACK	Qfmysteryman23/(Cleans-His-Ass) has attacked [Bridge] with the fire axe (Wielded)	(113, 134, 2)	Bridge
The borg walks into the bridge and sees you with the fire axe, so they flash you and drag the fire axe away.
Code: Select all
05:25:10	ATTACK	Scriptis/(Evergreen) has flashed(targeted) Qfmysteryman23/(Cleans-His-Ass) with the flash (NEWHP: 96.3)	(110, 136, 2)	Bridge
The other person that was in the bridge chases the borg down, flashing them:
Code: Select all
05:25:15	ATTACK	GeorgeBushGaming/(Suzanna Hendricks) has flashed Scriptis/(Evergreen) with the flash (NEWHP: 72)	(101, 130, 2)	Bridge
They picked up the fire axe, but you shove them down and tell them it's yours (they later come back to ask for the fire axe to return to security):
Code: Select all
05:25:18	ATTACK	Qfmysteryman23/(Cleans-His-Ass) has shoved GeorgeBushGaming/(Suzanna Hendricks) with knocking them down (NEWHP: 91.9)	(101, 130, 2)	Bridge
05:25:21	SAY	Qfmysteryman23/(Cleans-His-Ass) "mine first"	(101, 131, 2)	Bridge
And then you proceed to kill the borg while they were stunned from the flash:
Code: Select all
05:25:22	ATTACK	Qfmysteryman23/(Cleans-His-Ass) has attacked Scriptis/(Evergreen) with fire axe (Wielded) (COMBAT MODE: 0) (DAMTYPE: BRUTE) (NEWHP: 42)	(100, 131, 2)	Bridge
05:25:23	ATTACK	Qfmysteryman23/(Cleans-His-Ass) has attacked Scriptis/(Evergreen) with fire axe (Wielded) (COMBAT MODE: 0) (DAMTYPE: BRUTE) (NEWHP: 12)	(100, 131, 2)	Bridge
05:25:24	ATTACK	Qfmysteryman23/(Cleans-His-Ass) has attacked Scriptis/(Evergreen) with fire axe (Wielded) (COMBAT MODE: 0) (DAMTYPE: BRUTE) (NEWHP: -18)	(100, 131, 2)	Bridge
05:25:25	ATTACK	Qfmysteryman23/(Cleans-His-Ass) has attacked Scriptis/(Evergreen) with fire axe (Wielded) (COMBAT MODE: 0) (DAMTYPE: BRUTE) (NEWHP: -48)	(100, 131, 2)	Bridge
05:25:26	ATTACK	Qfmysteryman23/(Cleans-His-Ass) has attacked Scriptis/(Evergreen) with fire axe (Wielded) (COMBAT MODE: 0) (DAMTYPE: BRUTE) (NEWHP: -78)	(100, 131, 2)	Bridge
05:25:27	ATTACK	Qfmysteryman23/(Cleans-His-Ass) has attacked Scriptis/(Evergreen) with fire axe (Wielded) (COMBAT MODE: 0) (DAMTYPE: BRUTE) (NEWHP: -100)	(100, 131, 2)	Bridge
05:25:28	ATTACK	Qfmysteryman23/(Cleans-His-Ass) has attacked *no key*/(Evergreen) with fire axe (Wielded) (COMBAT MODE: 0) (DAMTYPE: BRUTE) (NEWHP: -100)	(101, 131, 2)	Bridge
The bottom line of this ban is that you improperly escalated and killed a borg for trying to stop you from destroying things with a fire axe.

Additionally, the logs you brought forward do not help your point at all. The borg said that they were not going to kill you even though they could. They were trying to say that they were acting in good faith. You simply cannot assume bad faith from everyone and then kill them.

I had stopped hitting the door when they flashed me. It had been a good 10-12 seconds. Also you neglect to add the part in where I gave the axe back with out any fighting. Either way the ban is over.

Posted: **Tue Jun 28, 2022 5:59 pm**

qfmysteryman23 wrote: ↑Tue Jun 28, 2022 6:12 am I had stopped hitting the door when they flashed me. It had been a good 10-12 seconds. Also you neglect to add the part in where I gave the axe back with out any fighting.

The relevancy of you hitting the airlock with the fireaxe is that you resorted to destroying the bridge's airlocks (of course, stopping when someone had opened the panel of the door) in the first place. The possession of the fireaxe is very much irrelevant which is why I was generous in my wording in the note of "took their fireaxe away". I ultimately have no qualms with you having the fireaxe. It's that you irresponsibly used it.

qfmysteryman23 wrote: ↑Tue Jun 28, 2022 6:12 am Either way the ban is over.

Are you fine with me resolving the appeal?

Posted: **Mon Jul 04, 2022 3:42 am**

Going to go ahead and mark this as resolved.

/tg/Station 13

[Iwishforducks] Cleans-His-Ass - unnecessary ban

[Iwishforducks] Cleans-His-Ass - unnecessary ban

Re: [Iwishforducks] Cleans-His-Ass - unnecessary ban

Re: [Iwishforducks] Cleans-His-Ass - unnecessary ban

Re: [Iwishforducks] Cleans-His-Ass - unnecessary ban

Re: [Iwishforducks] Cleans-His-Ass - unnecessary ban

Re: [Iwishforducks] Cleans-His-Ass - unnecessary ban

Re: [Iwishforducks] Cleans-His-Ass - unnecessary ban

Re: [Iwishforducks] Cleans-His-Ass - unnecessary ban

Re: [Iwishforducks] Cleans-His-Ass - unnecessary ban

Re: [Iwishforducks] Cleans-His-Ass - unnecessary ban