[Coconutwarrior97] - Mazur907 two day server ban

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mazur907
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[Coconutwarrior97] - Mazur907 two day server ban

Post by mazur907 » #668507

BYOND account: Mazur907
Character name: Abdul Al Qanim
Ban type: Server
Ban length: 2 day
Ban reason: As a sccientist created multiple TTVs during the round,bringing a couple onto the shuttle,other players stunned and opened the locker they had welded with the bombs in it. One player disconnected a signaler, and sent signal thinking that it was the only bomb,resulting in the explosion.While the blame doesn't entirely lay on you here you still created this extremely situation by bringing TTVs onto the shuttle.Alot of folks died but ill reduce the ban to two days due to the circumstances.
Time ban was placed: Try to get this from the server when you get the ban reason. If it was a note, the note has a timestamp. If it was a server ban, it will also have a timestamp. Both of these times are in UTC.
Server you were playing on when banned: Server name, Terry
Round ID in which ban was placed: 201445
Your side of the story: I was learning toxins and managed to make some bombs myself and to see how strong they were i decided to test it in EORG. I took them to the shuttle by a locker which i welded so noone would open it. After arriving the shuttle with the locker, people asked me what it contained and i said corgis to not make them open the locker. They then forcefully took them away from me and one of them sent the signal.
Why you think you should be unbanned: I had no part in this, i did not bait anyone or sent the signal so i don't think i deserve this ban. This ban is a stretch if it happened in Manuel but hell this was on terry so i don't understand why i got banned for this.
References of good conduct: -
Anything else we should know: -
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Coconutwarrior97
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Re: [Coconutwarrior97] - Mazur907 two day server ban

Post by Coconutwarrior97 » #668512

Yea I get this wasn't intentional on your part, that's largely why I made it into a 2 day ban rather than a longer one which would be more standard for shuttle grief. However you still created the situation by bringing TTVs onto the shuttle, which then led to this outcome; hence the reason for the ban. There are alot of dangerous things you can play around with as a non-antag and its on you to make sure you don't do anything too crazy with them, like bringing two TTVs onto the shuttle in a welded locker. I don't see any reason to lift this ban currently.
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Re: [Coconutwarrior97] - Mazur907 two day server ban

Post by mazur907 » #668518

I want a headmin ruling
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Re: [Coconutwarrior97] - Mazur907 two day server ban

Post by Timberpoes » #668922

Logs as a timeline of the events.
Admin logs used:
https://tgstation13.org/raw-logs/terry/ ... 2/tgui.log

Public logs used:
https://tgstation13.org/parsed-logs/ter ... 2/game.txt
https://tgstation13.org/parsed-logs/ter ... attack.txt

The logs are filtered for mazur907, the fire-safety closet, signaller usage and Emergency Shuttle then manually filtered through for coordinates and what looked like conversation about the TTVs.

16:02:25 - 16:04:45 Mazur creates TTVs and welds them in the fire-safety closet.
Spoiler:

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[2023-03-08 16:02:25.636] ATTACK: Mazur907/(Abdul Al Qanim) attached a remote signaling device to a ttv - tank transfer valve at Research Division (139,86,2). (Research Division (139,86,2))
[2023-03-08 16:03:11.110] SAY: Mazur907/(Abdul Al Qanim) "see i told you" (Research Division (119,98,2))
[2023-03-08 16:03:51.433] ATTACK: Mazur907/(Abdul Al Qanim) attached a remote signaling device to a ttv - tank transfer valve at Experimentation Lab (125,102,2). (Experimentation Lab (125,102,2))
[2023-03-08 16:04:12.353] ATTACK: Mazur907/(Abdul Al Qanim) attached a remote signaling device to a ttv - tank transfer valve at Experimentation Lab (125,102,2). (Experimentation Lab (125,102,2))
[2023-03-08 16:04:45.397] GAME: Mazur907/(Abdul Al Qanim) welded closet the fire-safety closet with the welding tool (Ordnance Office (130,86,2))
16:05:37 - 16:07:44 "locker of corgis"
Spoiler:

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[2023-03-08 16:05:37.105] SAY: Mazur907/(Abdul Al Qanim) "i will show you" (Research Division (140,91,2))
[2023-03-08 16:05:59.210] SAY: Mazur907/(Abdul Al Qanim) "that is" (Aft Central Primary Hallway (141,106,2))
[2023-03-08 16:06:03.233] ATTACK: [fire-safety closet] pulled from Mazur907/(Abdul Al Qanim) with Unknown (NEWHP: 100)  (Aft Central Primary Hallway (140,106,2))
[2023-03-08 16:06:04.943] SAY: Mazur907/(Abdul Al Qanim) "locker of corgis" (Aft Central Primary Hallway (141,106,2))
[2023-03-08 16:06:11.865] ATTACK: Mazur907/(Abdul Al Qanim) shoved Intell432/(Aleksey Kuznetsov) (NEWHP: 85)  (Fore Central Primary Hallway (134,134,2))
[2023-03-08 16:06:17.987] SAY: Mazur907/(Abdul Al Qanim) "off course" (Fore Central Primary Hallway (135,137,2))
[2023-03-08 16:07:26.938] ATTACK: Mazur907/(Abdul Al Qanim) punched Mazur907/(Abdul Al Qanim) (NEWHP: 93.3)  (Emergency Shuttle (170,33,2))
[2023-03-08 16:07:44.758] SAY: Mazur907/(Abdul Al Qanim) "that is locker of corgis" (Emergency Shuttle (169,33,2))
16:08:00 - 16:08:29 Durand smashes into locker, Mazur shoved out of the way, Mazur protests and asks them to keep it in the locker.
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[2023-03-08 16:08:00.275] ATTACK: Archimus/(Archibold Henderson) healed Mazur907/(Abdul Al Qanim) with suture (NEWHP: 100)  (Emergency Shuttle (168,34,2))
[2023-03-08 16:08:03.418] ATTACK: Wozzy/(Alexandr Pechkin) attacked [fire-safety closet] with the �Durand (COMBAT MODE: 1 (DAMTYPE: BRUTE) (Emergency Shuttle (171,33,2))
[2023-03-08 16:08:04.714] ATTACK: Wozzy/(Alexandr Pechkin) attacked [fire-safety closet] with the �Durand (COMBAT MODE: 1 (DAMTYPE: BRUTE) (Emergency Shuttle (171,33,2))
[2023-03-08 16:08:05.135] SAY: Mazur907/(Abdul Al Qanim) "no" (Emergency Shuttle (169,33,2))
[2023-03-08 16:08:07.947] SAY: Voudez/(Lucia Valdez) "OH GOD" (Emergency Shuttle (164,34,2))
[2023-03-08 16:08:09.398] SAY: Wozzy/(Alexandr Pechkin) "coo" (Emergency Shuttle (171,34,2))
[2023-03-08 16:08:10.651] SAY: Mazur907/(Abdul Al Qanim) "SIR!!" (Emergency Shuttle (169,34,2))
[2023-03-08 16:08:15.332] SAY: Voudez/(Lucia Valdez) "JUST" (Emergency Shuttle (171,34,2))
[2023-03-08 16:08:17.275] SAY: Voudez/(Lucia Valdez) "KEEP" (Emergency Shuttle (171,34,2))
[2023-03-08 16:08:17.753] SAY: Voudez/(Lucia Valdez) "IT" (Emergency Shuttle (171,34,2))
[2023-03-08 16:08:19.545] SAY: Voudez/(Lucia Valdez) "IN A LOCKER" (Emergency Shuttle (171,34,2))
[2023-03-08 16:08:18.178] ATTACK: Archimus/(Archibold Henderson) shoved Mazur907/(Abdul Al Qanim) (NEWHP: 100)  (Emergency Shuttle (169,35,2))
[2023-03-08 16:08:19.125] ATTACK: Archimus/(Archibold Henderson) shoved Mazur907/(Abdul Al Qanim) with knocking them down (NEWHP: 100)  (Emergency Shuttle (169,34,2))
[2023-03-08 16:08:21.392] ATTACK: Mazur907/(Abdul Al Qanim) shaken Archimus/(Archibold Henderson) (NEWHP: 100)  (Emergency Shuttle (170,34,2))
[2023-03-08 16:08:26.500] EMOTE: Voudez/(Lucia Valdez) points at the tank transfer valve (Emergency Shuttle (168,35,2))
[2023-03-08 16:08:26.745] EMOTE: Voudez/(Lucia Valdez) points at Archibold Henderson (Emergency Shuttle (168,35,2))
[2023-03-08 16:08:26.756] ATTACK: Archimus/(Archibold Henderson) shoved Mazur907/(Abdul Al Qanim) into Henry Smith (NEWHP: 100)  (Emergency Shuttle (169,35,2))
[2023-03-08 16:08:29.038] ATTACK: Archimus/(Archibold Henderson) kicks Mazur907/(Abdul Al Qanim) with onto their side (paralyzing) (NEWHP: 100)  (Emergency Shuttle (170,34,2))
[2023-03-08 16:08:29.039] ATTACK: Archimus/(Archibold Henderson) shoved Mazur907/(Abdul Al Qanim) (NEWHP: 100)  (Emergency Shuttle (170,34,2))
[2023-03-08 16:08:29.321] SAY: Mazur907/(Abdul Al Qanim) "FUCK OFF" (Emergency Shuttle (169,36,2))
16:08:43 - 16:09:06 Voudez enters the stage and talks with Mazur. Voudez throws a welding tool at Mazur, and the locker is (I assume) re-secured by Mazur.
Spoiler:

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[2023-03-08 16:08:43.428] SAY: Voudez/(Lucia Valdez) "JUST" (Emergency Shuttle (175,35,2))
[2023-03-08 16:08:44.475] SAY: Voudez/(Lucia Valdez) "PLEASE" (Emergency Shuttle (175,35,2))
[2023-03-08 16:08:45.550] SAY: Mazur907/(Abdul Al Qanim) "ITS FINEEEE" (Emergency Shuttle (173,35,2))
[2023-03-08 16:08:45.671] SAY: Voudez/(Lucia Valdez) "KEEP" (Emergency Shuttle (175,35,2))
[2023-03-08 16:08:47.025] SAY: Voudez/(Lucia Valdez) "IT AWAY" (Emergency Shuttle (175,35,2))
[2023-03-08 16:08:48.855] SAY: Voudez/(Lucia Valdez) "FROM PEOPLE" (Emergency Shuttle (175,35,2))
[2023-03-08 16:08:51.104] EMOTE: Voudez/(Lucia Valdez) points at Abdul Al Qanim (Emergency Shuttle (175,36,2))
[2023-03-08 16:08:51.380] EMOTE: Voudez/(Lucia Valdez) points at Abdul Al Qanim (Emergency Shuttle (175,36,2))
[2023-03-08 16:08:51.611] EMOTE: Voudez/(Lucia Valdez) points at the shuttle seat (Emergency Shuttle (175,36,2)
[2023-03-08 16:08:53.199] SAY: Voudez/(Lucia Valdez) "ABDULL!!" (Emergency Shuttle (175,36,2))
[2023-03-08 16:08:54.297] ATTACK: Voudez/(Lucia Valdez) threw and hit Mazur907/(Abdul Al Qanim) with the welding tool (NEWHP: 100)  (Emergency Shuttle (175,36,2))
[2023-03-08 16:08:55.008] EMOTE: Voudez/(Lucia Valdez) points at the floor (Emergency Shuttle (176,36,2))
[2023-03-08 16:08:55.170] EMOTE: Voudez/(Lucia Valdez) points at the welding tool (Emergency Shuttle (176,36,2))
[2023-03-08 16:08:55.405] EMOTE: Voudez/(Lucia Valdez) points at the welding tool (Emergency Shuttle (176,36,2))
[2023-03-08 16:08:55.671] EMOTE: Voudez/(Lucia Valdez) points at the welding tool (Emergency Shuttle (176,36,2))
[2023-03-08 16:08:55.902] EMOTE: Voudez/(Lucia Valdez) points at the welding tool (Emergency Shuttle (176,36,2))
[2023-03-08 16:09:06.079] GAME: Mazur907/(Abdul Al Qanim) welded closet the fire-safety closet with the welding tool (Emergency Shuttle (175,35,2))
[2023-03-08 16:09:06.280] SAY: Mazur907/(Abdul Al Qanim) "EVERYTING IS UNDER CONTROLL" (Emergency Shuttle (175,35,2))
16:09:14 - 16:09:17 anxipal pings a signaller four times. The first ping activates both TTVs. Shortly after, one explosion with size [3, 7, 15].
Spoiler:

Code: Select all

[2023-03-08 16:09:14.286] anxipal (as Von Dumar at 175,35,2)
 - Using: /obj/item/assembly/signaler [0x2006d91]
 - new Signaler fancy 1
[2023-03-08 16:09:15.972] anxipal (as Von Dumar at 174,34,2) in tgui-window-1
 - Using: /obj/item/assembly/signaler [0x2006d91]
 - Action: signal {}
[2023-03-08 16:09:15.985] GAME: Bomb valve opened in Emergency Shuttle (175,33,2) with <A HREF='?_src_=holder;admin_token=28473491078791431823101703012181050;secrets=list_signalers'>The remote signaling device</A> attached by <a href='?priv_msg=mazur907'>Mazur907</a>/(Abdul Al Qanim) - Last touched by: <a href='?priv_msg=mazur907'>Mazur907</a>/(Abdul Al Qanim)
[2023-03-08 16:09:15.986] GAME: Bomb valve opened in Emergency Shuttle (175,33,2) with <A HREF='?_src_=holder;admin_token=28473491078791431823101703012181050;secrets=list_signalers'>The remote signaling device</A> attached by <a href='?priv_msg=mazur907'>Mazur907</a>/(Abdul Al Qanim) - Last touched by: <a href='?priv_msg=mazur907'>Mazur907</a>/(Abdul Al Qanim)
[2023-03-08 16:09:16.493] anxipal (as Von Dumar at 174,34,2) in tgui-window-1
 - Using: /obj/item/assembly/signaler [0x2006d91]
 - Action: signal {}
[2023-03-08 16:09:16.828] anxipal (as Von Dumar at 174,35,2) in tgui-window-1
 - Using: /obj/item/assembly/signaler [0x2006d91]
 - Action: signal {}
[2023-03-08 16:09:17.118] anxipal (as Von Dumar at 174,35,2) in tgui-window-1
 - Using: /obj/item/assembly/signaler [0x2006d91]
 - Action: signal {}
[2023-03-08 16:09:17.137] GAME: Explosion with size (3, 7, 15, 0) in (Emergency Shuttle (174,34,2)).  Possible cause: the oxygen tank. Last fingerprints: mazur907/(Abdul Al Qanim).
[2023-03-08 16:09:17.367] ATTACK: Mazur907/(Abdul Al Qanim) suffered: Hairline Fracture to left leg | Damage: 20 (rolled 61/66.2891) | WB: 10 (Emergency Shuttle (173,33,2))
[2023-03-08 16:09:17.375] ATTACK: Jamal 2.0/(Joe Griffin) crashed into Mazur907/(Abdul Al Qanim) (NEWHP: 80)  (Emergency Shuttle (173,35,2))
[2023-03-08 16:09:17.633] ATTACK: Mazur907/(Abdul Al Qanim) has died (BRUTE: 25, BURN: 0, TOX: 0, OXY: 0, CLONE: 0) (Emergency Shuttle (173,33,2))
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Re: [Coconutwarrior97] - Mazur907 two day server ban

Post by Timberpoes » #668923

Having done a log dive, individually this feels a mix of a valid yet also a harsh outcome.

Coco, can you walk us through the logs and timings above and with your thought process as to how this ended up in the ban realms instead of a less harsh outcome such as a note, verbal warning or IC issue.

Is there something Mazur did or something that you are holding Mazur responsible for which elevated this beyond a lower punishment?

Or is it as simple as their fault regardless of what the logs say because they chose to bring the TTVs onto the shuttle, players died as a result of there being a TTV on the shuttle and a ban must naturally follow?

I think it would remove any potential misunderstandings from this appeal.
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Re: [Coconutwarrior97] - Mazur907 two day server ban

Post by Coconutwarrior97 » #668951

For me Ive always worked under the understanding that in general if youre in charge of dangerous toys in game, the responsibility of what happens with them will lay on you. In this case youre a scientist, yes you get to make funny big boom bomb but its also ,to a degree, your job to make sure it doesnt end up blowing the shuttle up. If someone steals it from your department from a locked locker, hey you did your best to keep it in a secure area no fault of your own. However when you bring the locker onto the shuttle, a place where it can be a bit cramped and chaotic when everybody crowds in and shit can go down youre opening up a situation where something can go very wrong, and in it did.
In this case, I understand that they brought in a welded locker onto the shuttle, but if another player sees a scientist dragging a welded onto the locker I completely understand when they want to bust it down irregardless of what the scientist thinks, that screams this guy is a traitor looking to get his greentext by blowing the shuttle up. Mazur has more than 1000 hours playtime, were they relatively new I wouldve gone with a note instead, because hey youre new i get it you made a solid attempt to keep the TTVs safe and secure, and wanted to see the funny big boom at centcomm. However I believe they should know better at this point. Thats my thought process.
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Re: [Coconutwarrior97] - Mazur907 two day server ban

Post by Timberpoes » #668952

Thanks, it helps clarify stuff a lot!
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Re: [Coconutwarrior97] - Mazur907 two day server ban

Post by mazur907 » #668957

Thanks for logs Timberpoes,yes you are right that i have more than 1000 hours of playing time coconutwarrior but toxin is constantly changing,i made these TTVs with my new setup and tried my best with secure them,everyone haves plans for EORG and that was my plan, I still want headmin ruling for this ban
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Re: [Coconutwarrior97] - Mazur907 two day server ban

Post by Coconutwarrior97 » #672293

Per the headmin team's request I've reduced this to a note and altered the text to:
As a scientist created multiple TTVs during the round, bringing a couple onto the shuttle, other players stunned and opened the locker they had welded with the bombs in it. One player disconnected a signaler, and sent a signal thinking that it was the only bomb, resulting in the explosion. While the blame doesn't entirely lay on you here you still created this extremely dangerous situation by bringing TTVs onto the shuttle in an obvious and blatantly suspicious way. If you want to do things like this again, please secure them in a less suspicious way.
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Re: [Coconutwarrior97] - Mazur907 two day server ban

Post by Timberpoes » #672363

This was actually quite a split headmin discussion. The ultimate agreed outcome was a compromise in the middle.

Each headmin expressed a desire to put their individual thoughts down. I've breifly paraphrased our reasonings below. Kieth or Misdoutful may present more complete thoughts than my tl;dr over the next day or so.

Misdoubtful felt this should have been upheld in full; "I've from the start always seen the approach of you're also responsible for the blatantly dangerous situations you make fucking up be something reoccurring. If you take the risk and fuck up, just be a homie and take the L." - They also suggested we may benefit from a policy discussion on this topic since it was rather polarising, as evidenced by the headmin 3-way split.

Kieth4 felt neither the ban nor the note were appropriate and this was simply a classic SS13 moment; "... if someone takes your bomb, breaks it apart then spams the signaller it's not your fault that they're being a troglodyte and it's a true hand to heart ss13 moment."

I felt the (amended) note was valid but the ban portion was excessive. Mazur907 got unlucky in the choices another totally unrelated player made by activating a signaller they acquired from the TTV, but ultimately Mazur907 did lay the foundation by bringing the bombs onto the shuttle in the first place for such an OOC/failRP reason as EoRG and in such a less-than-subtle manner.
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