Sirnat - Killing nonantag trying to help him

[Thunder11]

Your byond account: Thunder12345
Your character name: Jazmin Malcovich
Their character name: Nathan Ward
Their byond account(optional, but useful if you can provide it): Sirnat
Server and time: Sibyl, ~9:00 PM 6th Oct
Logs and/or screenshots: Went off the end of the logs before I could press the log button, will find the relevant section in the public logs once they're available
Description of what happened:
Captain suicides in front of the HoP office, Sirnat grabs the ID, and thinking a greyshit got it, the HoP decides to hand all access out to several people, including me. A few minutes later, someone screams about a holoparatise killing people in the brig, me and a few other people rush off to help fight it. I grab an autorifle out the armoury, and before I can take a shot at it, Sirnat shoots me a couple of times with his revolver, someone, I think him, grabs the autorifle and crits me with it, along with hitting various other people who were trying to help. Sirnat then cuffs me, and continually drags be away from medical aid. I eventually die and a borg drags me to cloning. Sirnat turns up while the CMO is defibbing me, and convinces everyone in the area that I'm the traitor, even though the holoparasite was still active, and couldn't have been mine, since I was dead. Eventually he demands I get borged, by which point he's been killed with the rest of sec.
Why they should be banned:
Killing me while trying to fight a holoparasite, doing everything in his power to keep me from being revived, and indirectly getting the whole of sec killed.

[sirnat]

Let's go through this post shall we.

>Captain suicides in front of the HoP office, Sirnat grabs the ID, and thinking a greyshit got it, the HoP decides to hand all access out to several people, including me.
First mistake was using this all access to enter brig, you're not security, stop hunting for valids.

>A few minutes later, someone screams about a holoparatise killing people in the brig, me and a few other people rush off to help fight it. I grab an autorifle out the armoury,
Let me point out> I grab an autorifle out the armoury,<
Looting the armoury was your first mistake, having an autorifle, plus all access and being in a room full of dead/crit security guards was also your fault.

>someone, I think him, grabs the autorifle and crits me with it, along with hitting various other people who were trying to help.
Yep, I grabbed the autorifle and began shooting everyone but sec inside the room because it was a full fucking shit storm, if you wern't there in the first place you wouldn't have been shot.

>Sirnat then cuffs me, and continually drags be away from medical aid. I eventually die and a borg drags me to cloning. Sirnat turns up while the CMO is defibbing me, and convinces everyone in the area that I'm the traitor, even though the holoparasite was still active, and couldn't have been mine, since I was dead. Eventually he demands I get borged, by which point he's been killed with the rest of sec.

You had a auto-rifle, all access, in brig, in a room full of crit'd officers, of course you're going to be seen as a traitor. I took your body to get borg'd because you were not being helpful as your other job, plus you were a person judged traitor for your actions.

The round was hectic as fuck with all the greyshits getting all access from HoP then to have them try to be heroes and rush into the brig to "help" yeah, I bet you wanted to help. Just because you had a gun and were in the brig, also proven to have looted the armory of a auto rifle you put yourself to be shot during that situation.

If you would've not been trying to help, when you were only in the way taking weapons sec needed, then you wouldn't have been shot.

And, I didn't get all of sec killed actually. They got themselves killed by not being able to kill one single guy and a holoparasite in the brig.

>Edit

Another note, I didnt shoot everyone I saw in the room, let me rephrase that.
I shot people until the holoparasite went away, and it went away after I loaded boris and yourself with bullets, that also increased the suspicion on you.

[whodaloo]

you said first mistake twice

[Not-Dorsidarf]

Being in the armory as non-sec for virtually any reason whatsoever makes you insta-valid.
Standing atop a pile of dead sec officers in the armory carrying a lethal weapon as a greyshirt makes you so impossibly valid to sec it hurts.

[sirnat]

Funny thing was, Doris he wasn't in the armory when I shot them. They were in the place outside the HoS's room, and a holoparasite was fucking shit up. I came in, to see him holding a auto rifle and saying something and so he was my top suspect of owning the parasite. There was atleast, 7 or so people in this room.

[Saegrimr]

Well that sounds about right. You were in the wrong place at the wrong time. Being in the armory at all as non-sec practically makes you valid if they catch you.

[Thunder11]

Let's go through this post shall we.

>Captain suicides in front of the HoP office, Sirnat grabs the ID, and thinking a greyshit got it, the HoP decides to hand all access out to several people, including me.
First mistake was using this all access to enter brig, you're not security, stop hunting for valids.

>A few minutes later, someone screams about a holoparatise killing people in the brig, me and a few other people rush off to help fight it. I grab an autorifle out the armoury,
Let me point out> I grab an autorifle out the armoury,<
Looting the armoury was your first mistake, having an autorifle, plus all access and being in a room full of dead/crit security guards was also your fault.

>someone, I think him, grabs the autorifle and crits me with it, along with hitting various other people who were trying to help.
Yep, I grabbed the autorifle and began shooting everyone but sec inside the room because it was a full fucking shit storm, if you wern't there in the first place you wouldn't have been shot.

>Sirnat then cuffs me, and continually drags be away from medical aid. I eventually die and a borg drags me to cloning. Sirnat turns up while the CMO is defibbing me, and convinces everyone in the area that I'm the traitor, even though the holoparasite was still active, and couldn't have been mine, since I was dead. Eventually he demands I get borged, by which point he's been killed with the rest of sec.

You had a auto-rifle, all access, in brig, in a room full of crit'd officers, of course you're going to be seen as a traitor. I took your body to get borg'd because you were not being helpful as your other job, plus you were a person judged traitor for your actions.

The round was hectic as fuck with all the greyshits getting all access from HoP then to have them try to be heroes and rush into the brig to "help" yeah, I bet you wanted to help. Just because you had a gun and were in the brig, also proven to have looted the armory of a auto rifle you put yourself to be shot during that situation.

If you would've not been trying to help, when you were only in the way taking weapons sec needed, then you wouldn't have been shot.

And, I didn't get all of sec killed actually. They got themselves killed by not being able to kill one single guy and a holoparasite in the brig.

>Edit

Another note, I didnt shoot everyone I saw in the room, let me rephrase that.
I shot people until the holoparasite went away, and it went away after I loaded boris and yourself with bullets, that also increased the suspicion on you.

Let's see here...
Barely any of the officers were down when I arrived, most of them were down by the time you'd finished fucking around with me, which, including the doctor trying to heal me, took three people out of the fight, two of whom had weapons able to actually damage to the obvious enemy. You literally left 2-3 officers with very few effective weapons trying to fight an unstunnable killing machine.

Not to mention the part where you had me detained, and still did your absolute fucking best to make sure I died, even though last I checked sec weren't supposed to be killing cuffed suspects without good reason. And no, thinking I had a holoparasite is not good reason, since if it had been mine, and I'd summoned it again, you could've just killed me in a few seconds with the auto rifle, this time with actual proof. So no, there is no reason to drag a restrained suspect away from treatment to be certain they die.

Also, by "judged a traitor", I think you meant to say "had some evidence that you might be a traitor", which isn't exactly enough evidence to have someone forcibly borged on

Additionally, there's a bit of a difference between being in the armoury to loot it, and being in the armoury because people are being torn to shreds just next door by an actual, blatant antag.

[CPTANT]

Use of Deadly Force
Armed and Dangerous - if a suspect is in possession of weapons, including stun weapons, and you have reasonable suspicion that they will use these against you, lethal force is permitted. Although in the majority of cases it is still preferable to attempt to detain them non-lethally.
Note: Unauthorised personnel in the armory are considered by default to be Armed and Dangerous, maximum force is permitted to subdue such targets.


This is a VERY bad case of only thinking from your own viewpoint. What security sees is someone not supposed to have all-access charge into the armory and loot it, while they are simultaneously being attacked by holodrones.

[oranges]

Well hold on a second, if he's already cuffed you can't just kill him after that, the policy covers up and unsecured people, not cuffed ones.

>Sirnat then cuffs me, and continually drags be away from medical aid

This probably isn't bannable but it's a fucking shitty thing to do, get them healed, ask them WTF they were doing and then decide how to deal with it.

[lumipharon]

When you have someone cuffed and captured, killing them is execution - not lethal force on an armed and dangerous individual (except shit like wizards and lings, fuck them).

[sirnat]

I didn't drag him away from medical aid, lets get that straight.

I asked the doc to revive the officers, but honestly this is all over and done with.

I took his body most likely like I did one other to robotics to be borg'd.

Wrong place, wrong time, not even suppossed to be in there.

Also, Lumi I didn't kill him after cuff. I actually shot him with my revolver, took his auto rifle and gunned down the other people inside who were not sec because of the holosprite and all of the shooting going on. It was impossible to decode whos sprite it was.

[Thunder11]

You were definitely dragging me away from medical aid, you were walking around in circles with me while being followed by a doctor with a medkit out.

[sirnat]

Also lets get this out there.

I am not obligated to help you medically. You fucked up. You were in a place you shouldn't have been. You had a lethal weapon which can kill in a very low amount of shots. You were killed.

Next time just let security deal with the problems in the brig and not use your illegally gained brig access to try and hunt valids.

[oranges]

I'm pretty sure if you use lethals on someone as sec and then detain them you're pretty much required to do your best to heal or otherwise return them to life as a borg or pod person.

[Thunder11]

I did EVENTUALLY manage to get borged, but that only happened because an engiborg dragged my corpse away to medbay, and sirnat had to step in to keep it from cloning me. The other guy I remember being mentioned at the time as having been killed, Boris Pepper, still had his un-MMI'd brain dumped in robotics the last time I was in there.

[sirnat]

He just doesn't want to realize his mistake is what the funny part is.

I took atleast two people to get borg'd, because there was no fucking way to tell who the holo belonged to.

You took it apon yourself to play hero and in a process of attempting to get valids you got fucking shot down.

You had an illegal ID given to you, HoP given or not its still illegal.

You had a sec auto rifle in the room outside the hos and security equipment room.

You were shooting in a room full of people, most of which were sec and crit.

Saeg has already put his input on this and it's dealt with, I don't see why you continue to attempt to keep dragging it out.

[Thunder11]

Because you continue to have this illusion that I was shooting anything, if you didn't notice, the rifle was completely full when you shot me, not one bullet fired at anyone, until you decided to start shooting at "possible" suspects, instead of blasting the stand a couple of times to start see who the warning message pops up on

[sirnat]

I did shoot the stand as much as I could, and then it dissappeared making me think that it was dead.

I dont know anything about a warning message when shooting stands either.

[imblyings]

Is it a crime to kill everyone not sec in the armoury?

I dunno, Sirnat could have been a bit less zealous and realized there were non-antags mixed up in the bloodbath but then, I don't really expect players to read their chatbox accurately during or after a middle of a fight. I understand sec had a huge row a few months back about feeling constricted by policy and tippy toeing over not being ahelped and getting fucked for it but hey it doesn't hurt to be cautious when you exercise the right to valid people as sec.