/tg/Station 13

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I haven't done much admin stuff with him yet, but he's definitely the most helpful maintainer on the team. Looking forward to seeing him handle more.

Timber is both very active helping people with solving bugs and learning the game, and great at spicing up rounds that are getting stale with button pushing, it's great to have be a full codermin now!

Good admin, shows promise. Has an elegant way to talk that it's simply fabulous.

During a dynamic round, promoted a lawyer that was assaulting security and stirring sedition/paranoia to a centcom intern above that of the HoS to handle all security personnel matters, marked any Ahelp regarding this as an IC issue.

Genuinely enjoy most of timber's adminbusses, and have even benefitted from them personally, but have definitely find their current level of interference round-to-round to be increasing.

Lacran wrote:During a dynamic round, promoted a lawyer that was assaulting security and stirring sedition/paranoia to a centcom intern above that of the HoS to handle all security personnel matters, marked any Ahelp regarding this as an IC issue.

Genuinely enjoy most of timber's adminbusses, and have even benefitted from them personally, but have definitely find their current level of interference round-to-round to be increasing.

It is an IC issue. Also, as a heads up, ahelping more than once over something, demanding another reply, may get you a kick or an ahelp mute from the round.

MortoSasye wrote:

Lacran wrote:During a dynamic round, promoted a lawyer that was assaulting security and stirring sedition/paranoia to a centcom intern above that of the HoS to handle all security personnel matters, marked any Ahelp regarding this as an IC issue.

Genuinely enjoy most of timber's adminbusses, and have even benefitted from them personally, but have definitely find their current level of interference round-to-round to be increasing.

It is an IC issue. Also, as a heads up, ahelping more than once over something, demanding another reply, may get you a kick or an ahelp mute from the round.

Adminbussing something into the round isn't solely an IC issue, its an action directly related to their conduct as an admin.

Lacran wrote:During a dynamic round, promoted a lawyer that was assaulting security and stirring sedition/paranoia to a centcom intern above that of the HoS to handle all security personnel matters, marked any Ahelp regarding this as an IC issue.

Genuinely enjoy most of timber's adminbusses, and have even benefitted from them personally, but have definitely find their current level of interference round-to-round to be increasing.

I'm sorry to hear that you didn't enjoy this particular adminbussery. Here's the game logs specifically for the player involved from the round in question.

https://scrubby.melonmesa.com/round/150 ... y=astilair

The round was not dynamic, it was traitors. There were 3 traitors. At the time I started this micro-event, a 7-strong security team had executed one traitor and had both of the other traitors in custody. There were no free antags on the station, although a Revenant did later spawn in via RNG I believe.

When a station is so well staffed with security in general (4 sec officers, detective, HoS, warden), the only things that can really threaten the station are existential threats and I felt that a low-power, less chaotic round would be fine and instead I'd seek to create an emergent RP opportunity. They were picked as someone who could effectively antagonise security and they carried out their role with both great thought and great care.

I felt that a suitable antagonist to challenge Security's mettle would be the lawyer who I was observing during their arrest incident (which you were involved in). We've all seen lawyers try to hold Sec accountable for their actions and just get brushed aside, demoted or having things like their PROVE cartridge confiscated. I decided that there would be an interesting power dynamic to see a lawyer who had an actual bite of legitimate authority behind their bark against an overstaffed security force.

My lawyer-turned-intern systematically interviewed most of security as well as your last living traitor prisoner. They took no executive actions despite being empowered to do so and compiled a report for me which I got to see at the end of the shift from observer mode.

It honestly sounds like you're taking exception to my choice of player more than anything else, but the way they handled their role was a very good and involved a series of quality RP interactions.

I hope this expanded context serves as an answer to what you were requesting from the ahelps in general, and I hope you understand why I wasn't willing to explain myself while the round was still ongoing.

You're correct that it wasn't dynamic, I was misinformed that it was. I do understand that I'm not entitled to immediate justification from ahelping, and that wont be a habit in the future, apologies.

The issue I take with this is definitely more on a personal front, but in the sense that this person was causing problems for me personally as well as any sec they dealt with, using their prove cartridge to frame me for unfairly killing prisoners I didn't even process, taking sec gear from the brig, refusing to discuss these issues with anyone in security, and then resorting to assault when they didn't get their way. Nobody in sec wanted to deal with this person, least of all me. An admin looking at this person's conduct, and security's reaction to them, and then deciding to announce that they are now a centcom official, and "fully incharge of all sec personnel including the HoS" is a very strange move to be making for the betterment of the round, you rewarded someone's poor conduct.

You took someone who was causing problems for sec, and was dealt with fairly, and made an announcement giving them a centcom shield that put them above anyone onboard besides the captain himself, full authority to demote or promote security personnel, and to interview all of sec regarding a situation with the traitors that was resolved.

Lacran wrote:You're correct that it wasn't dynamic, I was misinformed that it was. I do understand that I'm not entitled to immediate justification from ahelping, and that wont be a habit in the future, apologies.

The issue I take with this is definitely more on a personal front, but in the sense that this person was causing problems for me personally as well as any sec they dealt with, using their prove cartridge to frame me for unfairly killing prisoners I didn't even process, taking sec gear from the brig, refusing to discuss these issues with anyone in security, and then resorting to assault when they didn't get their way. Nobody in sec wanted to deal with this person, least of all me. An admin looking at this person's conduct, and security's reaction to them, and then deciding to announce that they are now a centcom official, and incharge of all sec personnel including the HoS is a very strange move to be making for the betterment of the round, you rewarded someone's poor conduct.

You took someone who was causing problems for sec, and was dealt with fairly, and made an announcement giving them a centcom shield that put them above anyone onboard besides the captain himself, full authority to demote or promote security personnel, and to interview all of sec regarding a situation with the traitors that was resolved.

That is correct. I created a special type of antagonist using my discretion by using a person who was, for all intents and purposes, obstructing security. For reference, the Lawyer is a subordinate of the HoP in pretty much all matters and they really don't answer to security in general.

When I see a lawyer pulling PROVE cartridge antics and pretty much just trolling sec, then getting bucklecuffed to a chair in processing for almost 10 minutes while security impotently tries to figure out what specific crime they've comitted before eventually giving up and resorting to confiscating their ID, headset and PROVE cartridge - I see a fantastic opportunity to shake things up. And yes, I did see the assault. Partway through their detainment in processing, they managed to slip their cuffs off, shoved you to the floor and gave you a few choice smacks before you and Rasha subdued them again.

I created an RP-focused antagonist that you couldn't ignore, couldn't arrest, couldn't demote and couldn't silence because they quite simply outranked your entire department - An antag who had to be engaged with diplomacy. This will occasionally happen on MRP. It can even happen on LRP.

I'm aware that the HoP is the direct supervisor of the lawyer, but a lawyer is still subject to the authority of security regarding their behaviour within and towards the security department.

Timberpoes wrote: When I see a lawyer pulling PROVE cartridge antics and pretty much just trolling sec, then getting bucklecuffed to a chair in processing for almost 10 minutes while security impotently tries to figure out what specific crime they've comitted before eventually giving up and resorting to confiscating their ID, headset and PROVE cartridge

I'm not sure if this is being painted by you to justify your actions further, or this is genuinely how to believe security's conduct was towards this person either way its deeply concerning. I'd welcome any evidence regarding us keeping them in the brig solely because we hadn't pinned anything on them yet.

What happened: My takeaway from this is you felt the lawyer was dealt with unfairly, instead of maybe investigating this situation further you decided to buff them with an IC shield nothing but the captain could do anything about under the guise of an emergent roleplay experience.

Take an honest look at their conduct towards me that round and tell me how suddenly making this person in charge of the entire department would warrant anything but a negative view of your actions were you in my position.

Lacran wrote:

Timberpoes wrote:When I see a lawyer pulling PROVE cartridge antics and pretty much just trolling sec, then getting bucklecuffed to a chair in processing for almost 10 minutes while security impotently tries to figure out what specific crime they've comitted before eventually giving up and resorting to confiscating their ID, headset and PROVE cartridge

I'd welcome any evidence regarding us keeping them in the brig solely because we hadn't pinned anything on them yet.

Genuinely - You disablered them starting at 02:55:28, handcuffed at 02:55:44. They broke free to shove and punch you at 03:00:33, 5 minutes after you arrested them without yet charging them or brigging them. They were eventually released at 03:07:15 when Rasha took their cuffs off, without charges, having had their PROVE cartridge, headset and ID card stripped. Your actions against them created the perfect environment for me to turn them into the role I did and I feel fully justified IC for my actions, let alone completely justified OOC too based on admin-only information that I absolutely will not share publicly, so you'll have to take my word on it.

It's clear that you don't take umbridge with my micro-event, but instead with the fact that I picked a player you disapproved of as my antagonist whose mission was investigate your over-staffed security department after you'd had an unfavourable run-in with them. I picked a player who had all the appropriate qualities to play the role I had in mind based on the events that had transpired during the round and this player played their role better than I could have hoped for. I'll take your feedback on board, but if that's all you have to say about it then I think this discussion has well and truly run its course.

Timberpoes wrote:
Genuinely - You disablered them starting at 02:55:28, handcuffed at 02:55:44. They broke free to shove and punch you at 03:00:33, 5 minutes after you arrested them without yet charging them or brigging them. They were eventually released at 03:07:15 when Rasha took their cuffs off, without charges, having had their PROVE cartridge, headset and ID card stripped. Your actions against them created the perfect environment for me to turn them into the role I did and I feel fully justified IC for my actions, let alone completely justified OOC too based on admin-only information that I absolutely will not share publicly, so you'll have to take my word on it.

It's clear that you don't take umbridge with my micro-event, but instead with the fact that I picked a player you disapproved of as my antagonist whose mission was investigate your over-staffed security department after you'd had an unfavourable run-in with them. I picked a player who had all the appropriate qualities to play the role I had in mind based on the events that had transpired during the round and this player played their role better than I could have hoped for. I'll take your feedback on board, but if that's all you have to say about it then I think this discussion has well and truly run its course.

Why we were bringing them in was already clearly established prior to the arrest, they were facing a potential charge of inciting a riot, and insubordination (at the HoS' request) they were being held in processing, because we were waiting for the HoS to process them, they were predisposed and told us to wait, we took all reasonable measures to get the HoS to process them, and eventually he let the warden do it. At this point the lawyer had tried to incite a riot, resisted arrest, assaulted and officer and had also been found with a flash. The total brig time were we to strictly punish them under space law would've been over 15 minutes, which is obviously on the harsher side and not something we wanted to do, we didn't even want them in for the 10 they had been in already but this is due to the HoS' unavailability and their own total lack of co-operation.

This person's behavior made them someone nobody in security wanted to deal with, whether or not they were facing charges wasn't a matter for discussion, it was only a matter of severity. I won't deny that they handled their role as a centcom official far more gracefully than they did their role of lawyer, but no admin should look at their conduct as lawyer and think "putting them in charge of security is a good idea for the round." I'm looking forward to seeing better reasoned minievents in the future.

What a nice fellow

+1

Your forum signature made me leave this angry comment

Timberpoes is great and always happy to help when it comes to coding issues. You're making the rest of us look bad, go on holiday or something.

Helps out a lot with figuring out coding stuff when adminning, but is also influential in encouraging me to unleash emagged cleanbots on those two people laying down dangerously close to each other. I am pretty sure that second part is positive feedback.

WineAllWine wrote:Timberpoes is great and always happy to help when it comes to coding issues. You're making the rest of us look bad, go on holiday or something.

Thank you. I try my best to split between tech support, adminning and general maintainer outreach. I appreciate it!

NoxVS wrote:Helps out a lot with figuring out coding stuff when adminning, but is also influential in encouraging me to unleash emagged cleanbots on those two people laying down dangerously close to each other. I am pretty sure that second part is positive feedback.

There is a lot of overlap with coding and leveraging the full power of admin tools. I'm happy to have the opportunities to help all the admins around me make the game a little bit more special for all those who play.

oranges wrote:Your forum signature made me leave this angry comment

XivilaiAnaxes wrote:What a nice fellow

+1

Thank you! I try!

Probably one the best examples of what Admins should be. Professional, extremely well-spoken, solid understanding of the rules and player behaviour on the servers they admin, very comfortable with the game mechanics and not afraid to delve deep into something to make it work.

Super helpful imo. I've had times ig where I either don't know what to do or I'm having technical issues and they always come through to help. I'm happy when I see them online.

Cimika wrote:Probably one the best examples of what Admins should be. Professional, extremely well-spoken, solid understanding of the rules and player behaviour on the servers they admin, very comfortable with the game mechanics and not afraid to delve deep into something to make it work.

♫ ♪ We do what we must, because, we can. ♪ ♫

chiva wrote:Super helpful imo. I've had times ig where I either don't know what to do or I'm having technical issues and they always come through to help. I'm happy when I see them online.

Thank you! As a Codermin I've often got my attention split between some tabbed out coding project and actually adminning in-game, however I help out to the absolute best of my ability where I can. I sincerely appreciate the words!

Timberpoes is pretty Cool.

Can someone let me out of this timeline? I'd like a refund.

the deleted messages all say timberpoes is good and i agree with them

Has more patience than my babysitter when I was 12. What a saint.

I'm not gonna say that I agree with all of timberpoes' ideas. I disagree with some of his takes on what LRP should and shouldn't be, and think that sometimes he makes decisions and takes actions that don't really "fit in" with the sort of judgement I've come to expect on sybil.

However, even if I disagree with how he might decide to act or enforce the rules, I think that he's still a good admin - interactions with him have been pleasant in all circumstances.
He's a cool dude, even if we don't see eye-to-eye, and I feel that he actually cares about our (the players') experience quite a bit. It's nice to have someone dedicated like that.

goodmin,very polite and helpful in ahelps

Too smart, won't stop making me look bad by answering my questions. If you know so much go work on the car of the future

Timberpoes gave me a positive note for a good round I had, and I'm still proud of that note today. I can't say if he's a good admin, or bad admin, or anything else- but I can say he has made me more happy with that note than anything any other player has done in ss13 over the last 2 years I've been playing or so.

*Edit
Since then he has done a number of very cool things on manuel that I've noticed. He is understanding in bwoinks, and doesn't jump to assumptions even when one side is convincing, instead opting to listen to both sides in any given situation. He actually listens to IC prayers, and OOC prayers. I've never seen him get angry. Definitely the best admin in my books.

over a year? Yeah he's a cool guy(Manuel Min does cool stuff)

Although we often disagree, I must give Timber extreme credit for their thoughtfulness and good attitude. These are good qualities that are very appreciated in the community, and in life generally.

Jonathan Gupta wrote: ↑Mon Feb 07, 2022 1:38 pm over a year? Yeah he's a cool guy(Manuel Min does cool stuff)

Bawhoppennn wrote: ↑Mon Feb 07, 2022 11:07 pm Although we often disagree, I must give Timber extreme credit for their thoughtfulness and good attitude. These are good qualities that are very appreciated in the community, and in life generally.

When two people agree all the time, one of them is useless.

Disagreement in good faith breeds discussion. It spreads and shares ideas. Ideally everyone walks away more informed, even if they still disagree.

More like TimberPOS because he's a piece of shit.

Fucker put me on post approval for being "too hostile" in a thread where people are actively attacking and insulting me. How do you manage to be a more obnoxious greenname than fucking oranges? Get a grip, you fucking tropical pussy.

If you have a problem with your posts being deleted, please take it up with Mothblocks who was the maintainer who deleted your posts in the topic in question.

Only the group leaders of the dev forums mod approval group can put you on post approval. Those group leaders are oranges and Cyberboss. The description of the group is copied below and contains instructions to appeal and a link.

Dev forums mod approval

Users in this group require mod approval to post in the dev forums.

Appeals should be directed to the head coders via forum pm.
ucp.php?i=pm&mode=compose&address_list% ... 5B61%5D=to
This is a closed group, new members can only join upon invitation of a group leader.

Thank you for your feedback.

he's not so bad!

Super Aggro Crag wrote: ↑Wed Feb 09, 2022 3:46 am he's not so bad!

Wow! Thanks for the glowing vote of confidence! *grin

My best wishes to you and yours, Crag!

Timberpoes wrote: ↑Wed Feb 09, 2022 3:54 am

Super Aggro Crag wrote: ↑Wed Feb 09, 2022 3:46 am he's not so bad!

Wow! Thanks for the glowing vote of confidence! *grin

My best wishes to you and yours, Crag!

please wish good health to my dog

Super Aggro Crag wrote: ↑Wed Feb 09, 2022 4:07 am please wish good health to my dog

I don't believe in a God so you don't get any prayers, but you do get my most best thoughts and my most best well-wishes to your pupper. They're family too. Look after 'em and look after yourself too, Crag.

Don't ask me why I'm ending every message with Crag, Crag.

It's 4:11am and I've gone a little peculiar.

Genuinely appears to have driven the admin team at speed into a wall for no discernible reason.

When a player or admin requests headadmin review they are giving up the right to decide the outcome

Gotta go fast.

Goes very fast, please promote to full admin

Honestly all my interactions with Timberpoes have been great. I'm not quite qualified to judge but what I've seen from them was great, as far as I am able to tell they really strive to make /tg/station a good place to be. Well thought-out elaborate posts. Diplomatic I suppose?

very cool person