MrAlphonzo - You have reached a Le Fishe checkpoint.

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MrAlphonzo
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MrAlphonzo - You have reached a Le Fishe checkpoint.

Postby MrAlphonzo » Sun Feb 21, 2021 3:12 am #591855

Who are you, gamer man?

If you don't know me, I'm MrAlphonzo. I've been a player since early 2016, and member of staff on-and-off since 2017. I can usually be found on Sybil and Bagil, or on every single one of our servers during graveyard shift hours.

So, whats your platform kid?

Alright, you're gonna wanna buckle in for this part.

There's always gonna be a hundred different policy discussions in every waking moment, and I'd bore you to death if I sat you here and talked to you about every single little thing that I think is wrong with our little bundle of servers. So I'll stick with the biggest issues that I think are most important.


On Punishment Escalation
Spoiler:
Since November, I've seen a consistent problem in how our staff have been handling admin rulings. The short version is, a lot of members of staff seem like they either aren't paying attention to people's records or they just don't care about people's records. I'm not sure which is worse.

Persons getting multiple final warnings, people who have 8 warnings in a single month over breaking the same rule instead of an actual punishment, and people getting off-the-books talks.

Alright, let me break this down.
I've seen a lot of individuals who have been getting final warning, after final warning, after final warning. This just makes everybody's life harder, as retroactive punishments are a big-no-no, so once you pull someone aside and give them a slap on the wrist, someone who'd normally get canned is walking the beat and bringing down everyone's experience for x amount of days until they're inevitably caught in the act again.

I've seen a headadmin give a guy a warning when he was caught antag rolling the same day his perma-antag ban, for antag rolling, was lifted. That's how deep this problem goes, and that is why I think this is a big deal.

Normally, this wouldn't be a problem, but I've been consistently seeing lots of players getting pulled aside for their second or third final warning and given another one ontop of it. Its basically made our records system entirely useless, as nobody is using it.
And since you can't punish folks who have already been spoken to by another member of staff, that brings me to the big point I'd like to get at.

This has been exploited to show favoritism to certain players and allow them to get away with things that would normally get them canned.
Here's how it goes.
A fella with a bad record goes and does something he knows he shouldn't be doing. But lets say this fella was a former member of staff, or just had some form of popularity or another, or maybe just a friend in a high place.
The way it goes, they get a "talking to", but its off the books. So, the next time they get pulled over for doing something they shouldn't, well, you can't ban them because you have no proof that they've been spoken to, as that "talk" they had was off the books. Maybe they've had a lot of those "talks", too. Regardless, you're sent to square 1, and its hard to build a case against someone when all they're getting is back to back notes, because of the current administrative culture.

There's always gonna be things that just plain aren't worth noting, like accidental OOC in IC and the like. But when you're having a serious conversation about how someone has been consistently causing trouble based on the way they conduct themselves, that is not something you keep off-the-books. That entire conversation becomes meaningless if there is no record of it, and all it accomplishes is exploiting the system to protect someone breaking the rules.

TL;DR, here's my position. If I'm elected headmin, I will not allow members of staff to show favoritism and protect players who are breaking the rules by exploiting our punishment escalation system.


On the Subject of Admin Training

Spoiler:
This expands upon the previous subject down a different route.

The administrative team is not on the same page, speaking from an insider perspective. Some folks do not see a problem with giving endless final warnings, some do. Some folks think notes are a punishment and some don't. This sort of in-fighting is exactly why we are having so many of these problems, and I'm eyeing a serious reevaluation of our entire admin training process as the margin for administrative styles is simply too big. I want to lay a more solid foundation on new-coming members of staff to avoid such extensive in-fighting and have the bus driving like a well oiled machine.

This is a big goal to have, and I'll have to work with other headadmins on this, but some idea I'd like to see implemented would be candidates shown player-records with good and bad examples of punishment escalation, what makes up a proper watchlist entry, and when and how to properly use our records system.


Miscellaneous Issues

Spoiler:
Late night staffing is a beast many head admins have tried and failed to tame. Might be an impossible task, but I'd like to try a little harder.

Watchlist entries have not been used properly, many are written inappropriately, or unnecessarily. I've done an annual cleaning of watchlist entries each year since I've joined the team and suffice to say it has not improved.


I'm always open to questions, but that about sums up my platform. I have a lot of years of experience on staff, and am eager to use it in a leadership position. Thanks for reading.


You have reached a Le Fishe checkpoint. Pull up a seat and rest, before you continue on your journey.
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Spoiler:
wesoda25 wrote:i love alphonzo and he can be a lot of fun but bro you need to get laid come on



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TribeOfBeavers
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Re: MrAlphonzo - You have reached a Le Fishe checkpoint.

Postby TribeOfBeavers » Sun Feb 21, 2021 3:29 am #591871

Could you give some examples of the administrative style you'd like to encourage with your changes in admin training?

How will you address current admins that don't fit within this style? Would they be deadminned or demoted for example?

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MrAlphonzo
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Re: MrAlphonzo - You have reached a Le Fishe checkpoint.

Postby MrAlphonzo » Sun Feb 21, 2021 3:33 am #591877

TribeOfBeavers wrote:Could you give some examples of the administrative style you'd like to encourage with your changes in admin training?

How will you address current admins that don't fit within this style? Would they be deadminned or demoted for example?


Namely encouraging proper punishment escalation, and encouraging using our records system to mark down behavior that is problematic rather than treating it as some taboo evil used to punish players. Its a system for keeping records, simple as that, and there's no reason it should be treated as some kind of lesser evil.

I could only see myself reprimanding a member of staff for failing to record important interactions. Important talks being off-the-books is something that happens frequently right now that I absolutely would not tolerate. It just causes lots of problems for the rest of the team.

What I'm eyeing is a gradual cultural change, not any kind of purge or something of the sort.
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Spoiler:
wesoda25 wrote:i love alphonzo and he can be a lot of fun but bro you need to get laid come on

Tlaltecuhtli
 
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Re: MrAlphonzo - You have reached a Le Fishe checkpoint.

Postby Tlaltecuhtli » Sun Feb 21, 2021 8:58 am #592060

you have a bad history of being wrong and not backing down until a superior slaps your wrists, do we need mso to carry a baseball bat all the time or will you learn to read the mood when you are doing something dumb?

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MrAlphonzo
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Re: MrAlphonzo - You have reached a Le Fishe checkpoint.

Postby MrAlphonzo » Sun Feb 21, 2021 9:19 am #592068

Tlaltecuhtli wrote:you have a bad history of being wrong and not backing down until a superior slaps your wrists, do we need mso to carry a baseball bat all the time or will you learn to read the mood when you are doing something dumb?


Its hard to answer this question without you naming anything specific, but I'll try my best.

I am fairly stubborn, that's fair to say. Other staff had a habit of trying to undermine me at any opportunity in my earlier days in staff, so, I guess thats made me quite jaded. That's a habit that'll have to be broken, though. Being a head admin is all about listening to what the entire team has to say. It's not like I can only be listening to MSO. He doesn't speak much.

As for any specific instances, this is all I could really think of:

Spoiler:
The only thing that comes to mind is that recent controversy over the 3 month ASCII bans. Some old habits from back when "do exactly what an admin tells you not to do gets you shot" was a thing put me into autopilot, I guess.
Being "wrong" is subjective, especially considering there are so many different ways our many members of staff choose to act.

That instance in particular was especially subjective, considering Domitius, at the time of it happening, told me I was completely justified, and he nor any other headmin said nothing else of it up until I was reprimanded.

That was probably subjective, too.

You could say I was being a little stubborn after one of my superiors said I was completely justified.
That would be a fair conclusion.

If you're referring to anything else, by all means, I'll address that too.
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Spoiler:
wesoda25 wrote:i love alphonzo and he can be a lot of fun but bro you need to get laid come on

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Re: MrAlphonzo - You have reached a Le Fishe checkpoint.

Postby bobbahbrown » Sun Feb 21, 2021 2:44 pm #592132

you say that at the time of the '3 month ascii bans' that Domitius told you that you were completely justified in doing this. can you elaborate on to what extent this is true? did they agree with you banning five different players, each for three months, for sending between 2 and 5 ascii drawings after the round ended?

for those who don't remember, there is a thread here which helps to summarize each of the bans that were placed at that time.

you stress 'proper punishment escalation', but i would say that situation sounds like insane over-escalation.

not only this, but i can't help but notice you don't say in your post here that this ban was wrong. do you feel these bans were justified, and do you feel the original length of them was reasonable?

best,
bobbah 'bee' brwon
Last edited by bobbahbrown on Sun Feb 21, 2021 6:08 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Not-Dorsidarf
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Re: MrAlphonzo - You have reached a Le Fishe checkpoint.

Postby Not-Dorsidarf » Sun Feb 21, 2021 5:06 pm #592178

How do you feel your administrative platform will be effected if Rave Radbury is your co-headmin, given their plan for removal ban warnings and de-punishmenting the notes system?
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Rohesie
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Re: MrAlphonzo - You have reached a Le Fishe checkpoint.

Postby Rohesie » Sun Feb 21, 2021 5:53 pm #592196

I hate how LRP you are but love how committed you are against admin favoritism.
That is an issue that will cost you votes, as you'd be going against the establishment, but that will make me put you high on my list. Good luck!

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MrAlphonzo
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Re: MrAlphonzo - You have reached a Le Fishe checkpoint.

Postby MrAlphonzo » Sun Feb 21, 2021 6:09 pm #592202

bobbahbrown wrote:you say that at the time of the '3 month ascii bans' that Domitius told you that you were completely justified in doing this. can you elaborate on to what extent this is true? did they agree with you banning five different players, each for three months, for sending between 2 and 5 ascii drawings after the round ended?

Yup.

bobbahbrown wrote:do you feel the original timing of them was reasonable?

No.

I already said as much, but to clarify, it was overkill. Old habits and all that.

Not-Dorsidarf wrote:How do you feel your administrative platform will be effected if Rave Radbury is your co-headmin, given their plan for removal ban warnings and de-punishmenting the notes system?


People will always have to compromise on most if not all of their campaign promises, but in this scenario there is a fundamental, complete and total difference to our perspectives on how the staff should conduct themselves. I can't say I'd want to sit for 6 months while absolutely nothing gets done, but I can't see myself being on-board with either of those things. One of them being strangely counter-productive, and the other trying to "de-punishment" something that already isn't a punishment.

I can't really see into the future to see hypothetical bickering, but a lot of that would likely come down to a tie-breaker.
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Spoiler:
wesoda25 wrote:i love alphonzo and he can be a lot of fun but bro you need to get laid come on

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Timberpoes
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Re: MrAlphonzo - You have reached a Le Fishe checkpoint.

Postby Timberpoes » Sun Feb 21, 2021 9:29 pm #592288

Working with your fellow headmins is only a third of the puzzle. The other two parts are admins and playres.

We have had our fair share of disagreements on banning and player punishment. Your input on my Trialmin thread still holds true to this day:
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Your platform is clearly aimed at eliminating the approach that admins like myself take.

How do you plan to work alongside and win over admins like myself, who would consider your approach to punishment inflexible and incompatible with the realities of modern tg administration?
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MrAlphonzo
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Re: MrAlphonzo - You have reached a Le Fishe checkpoint.

Postby MrAlphonzo » Mon Feb 22, 2021 5:13 am #592452

Timberpoes wrote:How do you plan to work alongside and win over admins like myself, who would consider your approach to punishment inflexible and incompatible with the realities of modern tg administration?


I don't have to do much of anything, really. You brag in adminbus about how you've been handing out more bans lately, which is less of a flex, and more of an admission that your approach to administration was flawed from the start.

There's not much point of giving people a warning if you're not going to follow through on it. What are you even "warning" them of at that point? That they're going to get another stern talking to for 2 minutes if they do it again?

I shouldn't have to spell it out to another member of staff that someone who has gotten reprimanded nearly 20 times after their final warning shouldn't be getting a second final warning.

EDIT: Additionally, I've already answered this question here.
Spoiler:
MrAlphonzo wrote:
TribeOfBeavers wrote:Could you give some examples of the administrative style you'd like to encourage with your changes in admin training?

How will you address current admins that don't fit within this style? Would they be deadminned or demoted for example?


Namely encouraging proper punishment escalation, and encouraging using our records system to mark down behavior that is problematic rather than treating it as some taboo evil used to punish players. Its a system for keeping records, simple as that, and there's no reason it should be treated as some kind of lesser evil.

I could only see myself reprimanding a member of staff for failing to record important interactions. Important talks being off-the-books is something that happens frequently right now that I absolutely would not tolerate. It just causes lots of problems for the rest of the team.

What I'm eyeing is a gradual cultural change, not any kind of purge or something of the sort.
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Spoiler:
wesoda25 wrote:i love alphonzo and he can be a lot of fun but bro you need to get laid come on

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Naloac
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Re: MrAlphonzo - You have reached a Le Fishe checkpoint.

Postby Naloac » Mon Feb 22, 2021 7:12 pm #592599

You say about punishment escalation in this thread and id like to know more, this term me and the headmin team had to take you aside and speak to you about your over zealous nature of banning at times, some of which being a three month ban for ascii art in ooc for few who had little/no bans for similar do you think you've curbed that habit in 2 months?
I Might Be an admin, You should leave me feedback: https://tgstation13.org/phpBB/viewtopic.php?f=37&t=24032
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MrAlphonzo
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Re: MrAlphonzo - You have reached a Le Fishe checkpoint.

Postby MrAlphonzo » Tue Feb 23, 2021 3:42 am #592725

Naloac wrote:me and the headmin team had to take you aside and speak to you

You never said anything.
Naloac wrote:some of which being a three month ban for ascii art in ooc

I'm not sure why you're saying "some of which." Either you're being misleading, or your memory is failing you, but that is the only thing that was discussed.
Naloac wrote:do you think you've curbed that habit in 2 months?

Do you have anything that shows otherwise?
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Spoiler:
wesoda25 wrote:i love alphonzo and he can be a lot of fun but bro you need to get laid come on

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Naloac
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Re: MrAlphonzo - You have reached a Le Fishe checkpoint.

Postby Naloac » Tue Feb 23, 2021 4:53 am #592737

MrAlphonzo wrote:
Naloac wrote:me and the headmin team had to take you aside and speak to you

You never said anything.
Naloac wrote:some of which being a three month ban for ascii art in ooc

I'm not sure why you're saying "some of which." Either you're being misleading, or your memory is failing you, but that is the only thing that was discussed.
Naloac wrote:do you think you've curbed that habit in 2 months?

Do you have anything that shows otherwise?


Dodging the question by asking a question back at me doesnt really inspire hope, just because I didnt speak in it doesnt mean my opinions didnt get relayed through the headmin who spoke to you. Pardon I had assumed since then you only banned a few of them for 3 months for it not them all.
I Might Be an admin, You should leave me feedback: https://tgstation13.org/phpBB/viewtopic.php?f=37&t=24032
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PostThis post was deleted by oranges on Tue Feb 23, 2021 5:27 am.

PostThis post was deleted by Swept on Tue Feb 23, 2021 4:59 am.
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MrAlphonzo
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Re: MrAlphonzo - You have reached a Le Fishe checkpoint.

Postby MrAlphonzo » Tue Feb 23, 2021 5:09 am #592744

Naloac wrote:
Dodging the question by asking a question back at me doesnt really inspire hope, just because I didnt speak in it doesnt mean my opinions didnt get relayed through the headmin who spoke to you. Pardon I had assumed since then you only banned a few of them for 3 months for it not them all.


I think its a valid question to ask one of my supervisors, seeing as how it is your job to know. And obviously its something you're concerned about, so I'm sure you have something to backup those concerns.
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Spoiler:
wesoda25 wrote:i love alphonzo and he can be a lot of fun but bro you need to get laid come on

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Naloac
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Re: MrAlphonzo - You have reached a Le Fishe checkpoint.

Postby Naloac » Tue Feb 23, 2021 6:53 am #592753

MrAlphonzo wrote:words


Generally asking questions on a candidate thread is so the candidate can give an answer. Not deflect onto the person asking the question. My concern is the thing I brought up in my first message since its quite relevant with the direction you want to go as headmin. I dont see whats so difficult about you giving your own opinion on how you've changed since then.
I Might Be an admin, You should leave me feedback: https://tgstation13.org/phpBB/viewtopic.php?f=37&t=24032
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MrAlphonzo
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Re: MrAlphonzo - You have reached a Le Fishe checkpoint.

Postby MrAlphonzo » Tue Feb 23, 2021 9:25 am #592764

Naloac wrote:
MrAlphonzo wrote:words


Generally asking questions on a candidate thread is so the candidate can give an answer. Not deflect onto the person asking the question. My concern is the thing I brought up in my first message since its quite relevant with the direction you want to go as headmin. I dont see whats so difficult about you giving your own opinion on how you've changed since then.


"Deflecting" is changing to a different subject. Who better to ask if I've improved than one of my supervisors?

Seeing as how I haven't heard any complaints in the last couple of months, and the only bit of evidence you put forward was a misleading exaggeration of why I was reprimanded, I'd say there's been an improvement.
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Spoiler:
wesoda25 wrote:i love alphonzo and he can be a lot of fun but bro you need to get laid come on


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