/tg/Station 13

So for those who don't know, the new wiki is here: http://tgstation13.org/wiki/Main_Page

For obvious reasons it is a bad idea to copy content from elsewhere, so new guides will have to be written from scratch.

Things To Do:

- Cult update (constructs, deconversions, anything else I missed in my incomplete ghetto update, Guide to fighting a cult) DONE but probably needs fact check/cleanup
- Supermatter cyrstal update
- Xeno update
- Hunger update
- Defrib update (Not sure if this was done yet?)
- Box station map changes.


Reply if you think you can do any, or if you know of other stuff that is wildly out of date. I've been going through and updating minor things / things that flew under the radar, but obviously with the rate of game updates and the amount of shit on the wiki, there is plenty that gets missed.

EDIT: I'll try to keep this thread updated with stuff to do, let me know if anything needs adding/removing to the list. - Peoplearestrange

I can write up on the AI Satellite, least I can do since I designed it.

I added some stuff to the nuke guide.

AI Sat and Upload pages are nice and updated, AI Upload can do with some loving.

I do need to get up to date images though.

If you need help with modifying protected pages and whatnot then message me and I can lend a hand.

updated list, will rolling update it

Here's my to-do-list, anyone can help me out with these!!

Info:
* TIDY UP THE CULT PAGE, needs to be more direct and less wordy, maybe with a step-by-step quick guide for first timers
* Combined "Guide to Robust Things" and "Guide to Defense", it needs tidying up and maybe could be renamed to "Guide to Combat" or something?
* Upload the Metacide's guide to mapping if the thing isn't updated in a month or so (in case the thing doesn't just get forgotten and buried)... http://tgstation13.org/phpBB/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=399 just realized it's been over a month, uploading.
* Info how Gas Turbine + Compressor work.
* How many pieces of cable go into all constructions? Add info to construction and machine construction -guide.
* Test that all the scripts work in the NTSL Scripts database, remove/ask people to fix if some don't work.

Uploadan images:
* A nice HUD-target gif with target spots switcing.
* Exosuit Fabricator item pics.
* More pictures to the tutorial steps.

Posted this elsewhere, but I revised cult for real. Look it over, see if anything is wrong. Also, the guide to fighting a cult page can be deleted, as it is now consolidated.

Is the cult page really that wordy? IMO it's no worse than the nuke ops guide, and cult is arguably a more complicated round type than nuke ops. (Specifically, nuke is complicated over a short period of time while cult is complicated as a long game with multiple phases.

Nuke is not complicated by itself. It's not complicated at all. Changeling is a lot more complicated than that. Planning and other things of this kind are complicated, but the gamemode itself (mechanics) is not.

bandit wrote:Is the cult page really that wordy? IMO it's no worse than the nuke ops guide, and cult is arguably a more complicated round type than nuke ops. (Specifically, nuke is complicated over a short period of time while cult is complicated as a long game with multiple phases.

Yes its over written.
Its 14 pages long vs Nuke-op's 7, Changeling's 7, Rev's 3, traitors 10 and malfs 9 (both of which are borderline over the top, like does malf really need to explain to you what type of threat each job is??).
Even Space Law is only 7 pages long (granted the guide to security is an additional 10 pages)


Remember what these guides are for, they're so newbies can quickly skim across them so they can have half an idea what they've just been selected for.

A good guide needs, by order:
-A brief one-two paragraph description of what the mode is
-A bullet point list of short to the point key points of key mechanics, these should be no longer than two sentences each. And remember: key points means the important shit you need to know to atleast bumble fuck your way around at round start, you should be able to read and understand it within 5 minutes.
-A more meaty section detailing the game mechanics in depth (this is where you explain what all runes and talismans do, including the ones that are barely used), it should still be clear and concise
-A summary of the key points, yes - one at the start and one at the end. Reiteration helps to hammer things home. This one will more or less be simple list to remind the reader of things, it wont explain them.
-Further reading - this is where you link to the pages that detail advanced strategies for fighting for and against the cult. No you don't put them on the main page because that will clutter it.


A bad guide is one that's a giant wall of text that's overly fluffed up and full of opinionated bullshit (looking at valid salad's bit about 'power gaming is okay', and the 'don't murderboner' bit on traitor).
A newbie is going to take one glance at it and shit their pants out of fright, and advanced player is just going to go "Yeah.... I'm not reading someone's sperg page"

Security's guides are good. Space Law is unfluffed and tells plainly the basics of what a security officer needs to know to start patrolling and robusting greyshirts. The Guide to Security is more fleshed out and explains things more in depth and lists strategies to counter antags.
Cult, Malf, and Traitor are bad because they're giant imposing walls of text that reads like a newspaper: squished up text that obscures the facts with needless opinions and blurbs that you don't need to know off the bat.

So remember:
-Facts good, opinions bad
-Keep your facts clear of irrelevant fluff and other bullshit
-Keep the basic guide basic, keep the advanced stuff on a separate page.
-Important stuff first, depth and explanation and unimportant things second
-White space, tables, sections, and formatting are essential for ease of reading. We're not print media, space isn't at a premium so use it freely
-I just used the above template to write this guide

Malkevin wrote:A bad guide is one that's a giant wall of text that's overly fluffed up and full of opinionated bullshit (looking at valid salad's bit about 'power gaming is okay', and the 'don't murderboner' bit on traitor).
A newbie is going to take one glance at it and shit their pants out of fright, and advanced player is just going to go "Yeah.... I'm not reading someone's sperg page"

Security's guides are good. Space Law is unfluffed and tells plainly the basics of what a security officer needs to know to start patrolling and robusting greyshirts. The Guide to Security is more fleshed out and explains things more in depth and lists strategies to counter antags.
Cult, Malf, and Traitor are bad because they're giant imposing walls of text that reads like a newspaper: squished up text that obscures the facts with needless opinions and blurbs that you don't need to know off the bat.

The validsalad thing has been removed long ago. I don't know who added the "don't murderboner" thing off the top of my head but it is a fairly recent addition. But in my opinion it's pointless to have separate pages for everything because it is annoying to have to click back and forth. (One good example is botany. All the plants were moved to a separate "Guide to plants," which is stupid and time-consuming for botanists. Should all the chemicals be moved off "Guide to chemistry"?)

As for "walls of text," this is a matter of opinion. When I was a newbie I appreciated having as much information as possible. This was especially the case for Traitor. What seems overkill now is exactly the opposite when it's your first time.

The cult page at any rate has plenty of tables and bullet points so I really don't know what you're talking about. The simplest solution to this is to add images. Unfortunately that requires either having easy sprite access (I don't) or rolling antag (I can possibly get screenshots the next time I get cult, but that may be a while.) There may be some usable images in the upload database, I or someone else would have to check.

I learned from a fatal time that there is a weapon called a singularity hammer. Perhaps we can put it in 'guide to robust things' next to the energy axe.

Brotinheyst wrote:I learned from a fatal time that there is a weapon called a singularity hammer. Perhaps we can put it in 'guide to robust things' next to the energy axe.

Added. And Mjölnir too.

kosmos wrote:

Brotinheyst wrote:I learned from a fatal time that there is a weapon called a singularity hammer. Perhaps we can put it in 'guide to robust things' next to the energy axe.

Added. And Mjölnir too.

Are both of those admin-spawn only? Maybe that should be included, since most items on there mention how to get them.

Saw Kelenius updating the Guide to Chemistry to a more compact look and had a small idea: http://tgstation13.org/wiki/Talk:Guide_ ... Suggestion
What do you guys think, Y/N?

The Formula column needs to be a lot wider. I dunno. I like the way on the current page -- it's compact without being ridiculous.

Needs two things: pictures and texts that appear on hover with formulae, like here.

Sorting is almost pointless here, formula column needs to be a lot wider, and really, I don't see a point in putting them all in one table.

Kelenius wrote:Needs two things: pictures and texts that appear on hover with formulae, like here.

Sorting is almost pointless here, formula column needs to be a lot wider, and really, I don't see a point in putting them all in one table.

Pictures? Of bottles with different color reagent inside? Hmm. Alright, well let's just leave it be if current one is good.

Also, how the fuck do I take a picture of the current BoxStation? It takes like stitching up 10 huge pictures if taken with Change view to 128 and F2 and my computer can't handle editing that big image. Jordie told me about https://github.com/N3X15/OpenBYOND but how do I use these tools?

Took the liberty of updating the Guide to Security's wiki page in relation to cultists and deconversion.

Guide to Combat needs info about at least these weapons: Disabler, Decloner (if it even is a weapon?), Projectile Gun, Chem Sprayer, Uzi, Tommy Gun, Russian Revolver, Silenced Pistol and others I'm sure.

Oh and "Little things that can be game changing" could be updated to the Awesome Misc Stuff again, I updated them to page 2 only. So from page 3 forward updating required. And Awesome Misc Stuff should be cleaned up a little from out-of-date hints (there's probably loads of them), I'll add a needs revision there.

Decloner and chem sprayer are unavailable in normal gameplay.

chem sprayer is for fluke ops though woefully underused

What is this decloner of which you speak? I have seen it under the RnD wiki page.

Kelenius wrote:Decloner and chem sprayer are unavailable in normal gameplay.

Alright. This brings us to the next question though: Should items which are unavailable in normal gameplay (as in, only available through admin intervention) be hidden from the wiki altogether? Will they only cause confusion? Do other servers, which use our wiki, use them? We have the Singularity Hammer and Mjölnir already there, which kinda feels silly now that you think about it.

Decloner is a weapon that exists in the game files and even has R&D design, but requires combat tech 8, which is unobtainable in the game, because there is no item with origin combat tech of 7 or above. It fires charges that deal ~amazing~ 40 radiation damage.

Cloneloss damage is probably one people are more familiar with, the damage you have when you're an incomplete clone. Extremely hard to treat.

paprika wrote:Cloneloss damage is probably one people are more familiar with, the damage you have when you're an incomplete clone. Extremely hard to treat.

Yeah, except it's not dealing genetic damage.

Hey could someone who knows wikicode do a favor? It would be awesome if the Template:Item could be used anywhere without having the "Found in:", "Used for:", "Strategy:" parts. Could it be made so that if one of those is blank, but description has anything, the template would show normally but without those texts?

So we could make a nicer High-risk items -page with item templates, without having the same "Strategy: Steal it." for every single item and/or duplicate info etc. Thanks!

kosmos wrote:Hey could someone who knows wikicode do a favor? It would be awesome if the Template:Item could be used anywhere without having the "Found in:", "Used for:", "Strategy:" parts. Could it be made so that if one of those is blank, but description has anything, the template would show normally but without those texts?

So we could make a nicer High-risk items -page with item templates, without having the same "Strategy: Steal it." for every single item and/or duplicate info etc. Thanks!

It's already posssible, just don't put |strategy= and others into the template, like show at this section.

Kelenius wrote:

kosmos wrote:Hey could someone who knows wikicode do a favor? It would be awesome if the Template:Item could be used anywhere without having the "Found in:", "Used for:", "Strategy:" parts. Could it be made so that if one of those is blank, but description has anything, the template would show normally but without those texts?

So we could make a nicer High-risk items -page with item templates, without having the same "Strategy: Steal it." for every single item and/or duplicate info etc. Thanks!

It's already posssible, just don't put |strategy= and others into the template, like show at this section.

Yes, but my point was that this wouldn't happen:

Or am I missing something here?

Through trial, pizza and error I've made a new template for you: http://tgstation13.org/wiki//index.php? ... temUsedFor

This functions identically to the ItemMedium template with the strategy line removed, so all you have to do to generate it is not include a strategy variable (this may have broken some existing item tables, I didn't check)

I couldn't think of a situation where you would only have Found In or just a description, but since I've now figured out how these templates work its pretty simple to make them if they're needed.

Awesome! Thanks, Jordie.

Aright, so surgery page is mostly complete. All it needs now is some distinct pictures for the operations. For eye surgery, gender reassignment and plastic surgery I seriously have no idea. Slime core will probably get pictures for decored slime and a core, lipoplasty will get second picture with meat, and an implanter for implant removal as a second one. Don't know what to add to cavity. Any ideas for these?

Info needed:
BoxStation -page needs info about the history of BoxStation, everyone feel free to add in some events in the timeline if I forgot something and anything you want in the story of any boxstation-department evolving. This page can be a huge wall-of-text bunch of stories and such, it's not a guide to anything!
Creatures -page needs info about Statues.
Guide to Combat needs info about gun ammo, magazine sizes, damage and such.
Telescience -page seems to be out of date, no idea how badly. Needs halp.
I can't remember if someone was working on this before, but Head of Personnel -page could use a small list of different accesses (the ones he sees on the ID computer like "Surgery") and what places can be accessed with it (e.g. "Surgery" = Operating Theatre + Medbay Storage).

I don't know if this has been noted or not, but the selective mute script on the NTSL page doesn't work.

Reimoo wrote:I don't know if this has been noted or not, but the selective mute script on the NTSL page doesn't work.

Gun Hog reported he just tested it. It is working properly. Make sure you set your name so that you have mute and unmute access. Also keep in mind that the script only mutes people using the same server where the script is installed. This script will not block intercoms or station bounced radios.

Would someone be kind enough to add a coordinate map to the wiki? It would help a lot when looking for things with a GPS or messing around with telescience.

Silavite wrote:Would someone be kind enough to add a coordinate map to the wiki? It would help a lot when looking for things with a GPS or messing around with telescience.

Added. Post here if they're not up to date.

kosmos wrote:

Silavite wrote:Would someone be kind enough to add a coordinate map to the wiki? It would help a lot when looking for things with a GPS or messing around with telescience.

Added. Post here if they're not up to date.

I'm kind of embarrassed to ask this, but what page is it on?

Just got the following error:

Database error
A database query error has occurred. This may indicate a bug in the software.

This was upon searching for "Statue" in the search box.

If this thing gets merged https://github.com/tgstation/-tg-station/pull/4532

Then the guide to aliens may need a fair bit of visual overhaul. There isn't anything majorly game changing aside from nightvision and the looks, but more changes can be expected to come in the future.

EDIT: Now that I look over the alien guide it's really really outdated. Far too many jokes that could confuse new players and beat around the bush.

Update the botany page with information about the different colors of kudzu vines and what they do.

Also update the botany page with info about what mutating weeded trays can get you.

Steelpoint, Skasi and I have written a Drone page. Please take a look and make sure it doesn't tell people to do shit they aren't supposed to.

Noticed on the wiki that the Station Reference Map on the Engineer page is very much outdated. Some others might be as well, unless someone just forgot that one.

Added the little bit on Ian's thread about killing him making you valid, since most people don't know/care.

Research guide's table needs info about the new drone parts (in the exosuit fabricator?). False alarm that's already there! Awesome.
SMESes were moved to the ex-Secure Construction Area (which was ex-Gravity Generator Room for a while), that place's name, engineering picture and other info on the engineering-page need updating.
Also yeah, paging all alium-experts to update the guide, please.

Did a little dusting up in the combat guide. Added a bit for the Big Red button, updated the Chem Sprayer, and put bullets on the shotgun ammo types.

Updated some of the antag sprites in the job section, added in additional antags. I did not add the gangster antags yet.

Also slightly updated the basic cult guide and how to handle Security.

Added a note on how to construct the elusive terminal for the SMES.
http://tgstation13.org/wiki/Guide_to_ad ... ction#SMES