Dismemberment & Organs

Ricotez · Post by **Ricotez** » Fri Jun 26, 2015 3:56 pm #99094

Bottom post of the previous page:

Razharas wrote:Thats a nice dismemberment implementation attempt you have here
I hope nothing bad will happen to it

Remie Richards · Sat Jun 27, 2015 1:56 am

Razharas wrote:Thats a nice dismemberment implementation attempt you have here
I hope nothing bad will happen to it

Not again Razh!
Come one everybody, shout at him and he'll go away!

Not again Razh!
Not again Razh!
Not again Razh!

Scones · Post by **Scones** » Sat Jun 27, 2015 2:23 am #99216

NOT AGAIN RAZH
NOT AGAIN RAZH

Fr05tByt3 · Post by **Fr05tByt3** » Tue Jul 07, 2015 5:19 am #102144

Any updates on this?
Just curious. No rush or anything.

Ricotez · Post by **Ricotez** » Tue Jul 07, 2015 11:17 am #102215

Sorry, first the cat thing cost me much more time than I anticipated (it should have been a small side project to get my mind off things), and then I got kinda caught up in my end-of-semester work. Fortunately the only thing I have left before this semester is truly over is an essay about template cyber attacks and the deadline is tomorrow.

Not-Dorsidarf · Sun Jul 30, 2023 1:33 am

Ricotez wrote:Sorry, first the cat thing cost me much more time than I anticipated (it should have been a small side project to get my mind off things), and then I got kinda caught up in my end-of-semester work. Fortunately the only thing I have left before this semester is truly over is an essay about template cyber attacks and the deadline is tomorrow.

For what it's worth, I think you're an awesome coder for even attempting to mess with Dismemberment stuff, and the limbtypes/whatever-it's called system is really cool, even if I dislike the implementation example for the latter.

Just saying.

Ricotez · Post by **Ricotez** » Tue Jul 07, 2015 1:23 pm #102252

Latest merge with the Master branch went off without a hitch. I'm always surprised when that happens, with how fundamental some of the code is I've had to edit I'm always afraid I'll get a merge conflict somewhere down the road. I think it really speaks for Git how well it is able to automatically merge changes even to the same file.

Krutchen · Post by **Krutchen** » Thu Sep 17, 2015 8:10 pm #119448

tfw no updates in 2 months

Wyzack · Post by **Wyzack** » Thu Sep 17, 2015 8:11 pm #119449

RICO WHY HAVE YOU FORSAKEN US?

Krutchen · Post by **Krutchen** » Thu Sep 17, 2015 8:13 pm #119450

pls i want 2 b nigel nolimbs ;(((

Krutchen · Post by **Krutchen** » Thu Sep 17, 2015 8:15 pm #119451

also

Ricotez wrote: [*]IN PROGRESS - Update existing surgeries to accomodate the new system (this includes abductor). Add three new surgeries: one to amputate limbs, one to seal up open wounds caused by dismemberment, and one to install new limbs. Existing augmentation surgery will continue to exist.[/list]

limb aug is pretty much installing a robo limb, so shouldn't they need to have the current limb removed for it?

Ricotez · Post by **Ricotez** » Thu Sep 17, 2015 8:49 pm #119461

ah yes, funny story... I suffered from a terrible depression for a few weeks, then had to put that depression on hold to catch up a huge amount of work for college (working hard is like the only way I can snap out of depressions), and then the new academic year began and I am doing almost two semesters' worth of classes in a single semester

so I have absolutely no idea when I'll be able to finish this, especially considering that the branch grows increasingly desync'd with the master and I'll have to probably resolve a ton of conflicts

I do not want to say "I will pick it up again" because frankly I am not sure I ever will. all I can say for now is "I did not forget about this but right now I really don't have the time"

Krutchen wrote:limb aug is pretty much installing a robo limb, so shouldn't they need to have the current limb removed for it?

Yeah, that is what even the current surgery does, it literally drops the limb item. I actually use those exact items as the physical representation of your limbs in my data structure.

Krutchen · Post by **Krutchen** » Thu Sep 17, 2015 9:08 pm #119466

could you post what work you have on your repo so that somebody could hopefully pick up where you left off, or at least take a look at it for reference?

Remie Richards · Thu Sep 17, 2015 9:24 pm

>another person dies to Dismemberment

Join the club Rico~ there's biscuits and tea~!

Ricotez · Post by **Ricotez** » Thu Sep 17, 2015 11:07 pm #119490

https://github.com/Ricotez/-tg-station/tree/organsystem

most of my additions are in code/modules/organs

the organsystem data structure is there, including all the helper methods that propagate changes up and down the data tree. I cannot remember if I tested this particular version of the data structure, but I tried to make sure that everything I had already rewritten to use it would still work even after the major rewrite I sent it through

all code related to dismemberment itself is found in dismemberment.dm, but I distinctly remember that it does not work properly yet. nothing gets dismembered even if a weapon has its probability set to 100% and its damage threshold to 0. I have yet to find the bug there.

also I've written documentation in Javadoc style, not because BYOND supports Javadoc but because I am used to it and it's a good way to document what methods do

by the way, there is another branch in there called Dismemberment, but you should ignore it because its vastly outdated. I should delete it anyway.

Post by **lumipharon** » Thu Sep 17, 2015 11:56 pm #119498

RIP. How did NT have working dismemberment, but now all it does is dismember coders?
What changed to make it so difficult?

Ricotez · Post by **Ricotez** » Fri Sep 18, 2015 12:14 am #119502

looking back on it now... I really should...

damn it. I'll look into at least resolving the conflicts when I have time. maybe it's not so bad.

lumipharon wrote:RIP. How did NT have working dismemberment, but now all it does is dismember coders?
What changed to make it so difficult?

the main problem is doing it properly, inserting a robust dismemberment system into all the other systems that never accounted for dismemberment being possible. I desperately tried to make the system as robust as possible right from the ground up, which is why I borrowed Bay's dual datum-object system and converted it into my own data structure.

Remie Richards · Fri Sep 18, 2015 12:04 pm

lumipharon wrote:RIP. How did NT have working dismemberment, but now all it does is dismember coders?
What changed to make it so difficult?

Because, and I can say this on two fronts (One as the Dev of NT-Dismemberment and the other as one of the Headcoders of NT), NT's standards were much more lax, and on top of that, in general (not targetting anyone as it's noone specifically) we had less skilled people working on BIG things, so when my then 2nd (3rd?) dismemberment PR got put up on NT, nobody conflicted with it, it was able to survive long enough for one of the other maintainers at the time to merge it, and while it was a *little* bit broken on the first few days, it was cleaned up and it worked.

That's MUCH harder to do on /tg/, since there are lots of people doing big sweeping improvements to large parts of the codebase (or people completely going against the established trend of procs dammit Razharas!!!) so p.much every PR conflicts with atleast 1 other, and the review period tends to drag on and on to the point the PR dies.

tl;dr it was a different time, a simpler time.

Not-Dorsidarf · Sun Jul 30, 2023 1:33 am

That's why you petition cheridan to start a feature freeze then use the power of "holy shit they made dismemberment" to get it merged despite the freeze.

Post by **lumipharon** » Fri Sep 18, 2015 12:15 pm #119624

Not-Dorsidarf wrote:That's why you petition cheridan to start a feature freeze then use the power of "holy shit they made dismemberment" to get it merged despite the freeze.

Remie Richards · Fri Sep 18, 2015 12:20 pm

Pretty sure there was a semi-freeze last time around, do we have dismemberment? we do not.

Post by **Thunder11** » Fri Sep 18, 2015 1:39 pm #119644

Might be one of those things that needs a freeze specifically for it, and a team of people coding for it, before it'll go anywhere. With multiple people working on it the whole project doesn't just die because real life decides to get in the way.

Luke Cox · Post by **Luke Cox** » Mon Sep 21, 2015 2:13 am #120045

As a regular player, I'd be perfectly fine with a temporary feature freeze if it meant dismemberment

Ricotez · Post by **Ricotez** » Mon Sep 21, 2015 2:32 pm #120158

looking back on the code, one of the things I tried to change is how DNA is stored. it makes sense that every limb stores a copy of your DNA, right?

and that would also mean that limbs can use the DNA to render themselves, at which point you might as well have the human rendering algorithm pass calls to all limbs, and use what image they create to render them (which in turn means that if you sew someone else's limb on and they have a different skin colour, you have one limb with a different skin)

but that causes problems for genetic superpowers. how big a part of your DNA has to have the power for it to manifest? should it be restricted to limbs? for example you can have x-ray vision anywhere you want but only if it's in your eyes you actually can use it

basically the deeper you look into stuff the more complicated it gets and the more you have to change. for the first iteration it's probably best to just ignore the DNA problem altogether and keep storing DNA directly in the mob.

Wyzack · Post by **Wyzack** » Mon Sep 21, 2015 3:03 pm #120164

>cutting out the eyes of a guy with xray and having them implanted to yourself to steal his power

Oh what might have been

Ricotez · Post by **Ricotez** » Mon Sep 21, 2015 4:26 pm #120191

xray was too easy of an example. how would TK work?

or *shudder* Hulk? I spent days trying to figure out how to do Hulk with a system like that

Krutchen · Post by **Krutchen** » Mon Sep 21, 2015 7:44 pm #120238

HULK ARMS ON A REGULAR BODY

NEVER SKIP LEG DAY.

Wyzack · Post by **Wyzack** » Mon Sep 21, 2015 7:48 pm #120239

I figure those ones would be non-transferrable. In fact TK should go with the brain, so if you get moved to a different body you would keep that one.

Ricotez · Post by **Ricotez** » Mon Sep 21, 2015 10:40 pm #120273

the genomes are in the DNA anyway, what's important is in which body parts they should manifest. so my issue is: say your body and legs have hulk, but your arms are someone else's. how does that work? should hulk only check your torso and apply the effect to your entire body if it finds it?

also if the brain is where TK is active, then that would allow for some amusing possibilities like TK brains zooming around the station

Post by **lumipharon** » Mon Sep 21, 2015 10:59 pm #120279

I'd make it simple and make it your torso that carries the main DNA, since torso replacement surgery seems improbable, and involves removing every limb including the head anyway.

Ricotez · Post by **Ricotez** » Wed Oct 21, 2015 1:49 pm #128194

It's still impossible for me to make any promises at this point - but I am taking another look at my old code and my old design.

One of my main realizations is that I might have been going at this from the wrong direction. Rather than start with a barebones dismemberment system and slowly expand it, I think I should start by adding in details here and there (such as human rendering using icons generated by its limbs, so later down the line those limbs can use that same code to generate their own icons once they're separated) and then later tie them all together in a proper dismemberment system.

I'm also still working on a good way to distinguish between body and mind. In my old system, your chest is the core of your body that everything else is attached to, and snowflake code moves your mind to your head upon decapitation. But there has to be a better way to do this. I'm thinking of having the data structure keep track of a CORE and a MIND organ right from the start (which can be the same organ), and using standardized code to deal with mind movement if the MIND organ is removed from the CORE. But this is still in the design stage.

So yeah. No promises, I am still very busy for uni, but this project is back on my radar.

EndgamerAzari · Wed Oct 21, 2015 5:01 pm

I BELIEVE

Incoming · Post by **Incoming** » Wed Oct 21, 2015 5:58 pm #128247

I kind of used the "bodyparts visually being built on top of a base sprite" trick when I implemented all of those lizard features. I don't know if you could throw some of that into this to make your life easier, but the basic pieces are already there.

Ricotez · Post by **Ricotez** » Wed Oct 21, 2015 6:55 pm #128272

the main reason why I want to move icon generation to the limbs themselves is because it then makes sense to save appearance data and DNA in organs too, so the effect of that is that if you sew a lot of other people's limbs on you look like Frankenstein's fucking monster

DemonFiren · Post by **DemonFiren** » Wed Oct 21, 2015 6:58 pm #128277

Ricotez wrote:the main reason why I want to move icon generation to the limbs themselves is because it then makes sense to save appearance data and DNA in organs too, so the effect of that is that if you sew a lot of other people's limbs on you look like Frankenstein's fucking monster

I wonder how many limbs a lizard needs to replace to be considered human.

ThanatosRa · Post by **ThanatosRa** » Wed Oct 21, 2015 9:17 pm #128326

DemonFiren wrote:
Ricotez wrote:the main reason why I want to move icon generation to the limbs themselves is because it then makes sense to save appearance data and DNA in organs too, so the effect of that is that if you sew a lot of other people's limbs on you look like Frankenstein's fucking monster
I wonder how many limbs a lizard needs to replace to be considered human.

Lizard doing ghetto surgery in maintenance, capturing and dismembering assistants to make a human suit?

Zilenan91 · Post by **Zilenan91** » Sat Oct 24, 2015 12:18 am #128881

Is a lizard a human if they're fully human except for their head

Asd396 · Post by **Asd396** » Thu Nov 12, 2015 7:32 pm #133295

Hey Ricotez, do you mind if I port this over and try to finish it on an other codebase?

Ricotez · Post by **Ricotez** » Thu Nov 12, 2015 8:42 pm #133302

I strongly recommend that you don't, the data structure is unfinished and a bit of a mess, and the code has fallen horribly behind current revisions. you're better off starting over

Ricotez · Post by **Ricotez** » Fri Apr 01, 2016 2:11 pm #166018

Dismemberment test PR is up

help with testing is appreciated

Post by **lumipharon** » Fri Apr 01, 2016 8:22 pm #166073

I'll chop YOU up motherfucker.

Spoiler:

Sat Apr 02, 2016 1:55 am

Ricotez wrote:Dismemberment test PR is up

help with testing is appreciated

what the FUCK BRO

Post by **MMMiracles** » Sat Apr 02, 2016 2:51 am #166168

that wasn't even a joke, that was just plain cruel.

Ricotez · Post by **Ricotez** » Sat Apr 02, 2016 1:05 pm #166219

april fools

Septavius · Post by **Septavius** » Sun Apr 03, 2016 3:29 pm #166450

why you gotta play us like that, man?

yackemflam · Post by **yackemflam** » Tue Apr 19, 2016 2:35 am #169721

Dismemberment

Note:This will require a crawling mechanic

What is the core?

The core is a simple hierarchy starting from the body

Body -> Limbs
Head

You can add to every limbs if you'r autistic enough.

Body ->

Head ->
eyes
tongue
mouth
ears

Arms

Crotch ->

Legs
Genital

For the Head - Body situation, if the characters head gets cut off, the head will act like a brain and the body will still be a body.

Every limb will have a 'cut damage' variable that is seperate from the normal damage variable.

Lets say each limb has a threshold of 40 damage. If the damage goes greater than or equal to 40, the limb will be severed.

What happens when the body loses a limb?

Every limb has a 'stub' variable that starts at 1.

If you lose a limb, the game will reduce this variable to 0. If you do have it at 0, you will have a permament damage of 30 brute damage and will be bleeding for each limb.

To increase this 'stub' variable back to 1, you will need to either cauterize it, which will stop the bleeding, set the brute damage to 5, and deal 15 burn damage but lowers, or you will need to perform surgery on it, which will reduce the brute damage to 0 and stop the bleeding.

If you are missing a limb, the game will check which limb you are missing.

For arms, you will drop whatever you are holding in that arm immediately. Afterwards you will be equipped with a cursed 'nothing'.

For legs, if you are missing ONE leg, then you will be 'buckled' to the ground. You can crawl around and such, but you will be moving slower than standard walking.
If are missing BOTH legs, you will be forced to equip a cursed 'nothing' in your leg slot.
You can have a crutch in one arm and will be fine if you are missing the opposite leg.

To make this SS13 like, you can equip TWO crutches and walk/run around without legs.

Or use a wheelchair like the unrobust shitter you are.

The head if decapitated acts like a brain. You can carry it around and the person who controls the head will be forced there. You can still loot the body and such.

EXAMPLE

Lets say Greytyde McTraitor has a double esword and he attacks the Sec Goodman's right arm, which has a taser.

A double esword deals 40 'cut damage' on top of its 36 brute damage.

Sec Goodman loses his right arm, which he drops his taser, and is 'cursed' with 'nothing' in his right arm.

Sec Goodman also only have 15 burn and 5 brute damage overall since his right arm is gone, but the esword cauterized the arm too.

Extras

You can have a crutch in one arm and will be fine if you are missing the opposite leg.

To make this SS13 like, you can equip TWO crutches and walk/run around without legs.

Or use a wheelchair like the unrobust shitter you are.

Heavy guns blasting off limbs

Sharpening stuff increases 'cut damage'

Surgeries

Removal of limbs

Replacement of limbs

Cauterizing 'surgery' (You just use a lighter or a blowtorch on a missing limb, no need for a blanket)

Mending of an artery

Problems

the problem with the decapitation is that you'd have to do some complicated shit with the clothes or re-sprite every clothes to separate parts of the clothes. A simple jump suit would have 5 seperate sprites just to wear.

Most likely it's going to be a buggy mess with the first two months or so of testing

Not all of this is my idea. I just cobbled a bunch of shit together from this thread.

Ricotez · Post by **Ricotez** » Tue Apr 19, 2016 10:05 am #169799

er what

yackemflam · Post by **yackemflam** » Wed Apr 20, 2016 2:45 am #170106

Ricotez wrote:er what

It's to give the coders something to follow because I'm bored at work.

Ricotez · Post by **Ricotez** » Wed Apr 20, 2016 4:04 pm #170263

why did you post it in my thread though

Post by **MMMiracles** » Wed Apr 20, 2016 5:09 pm #170279

just a prank bro

yackemflam · Post by **yackemflam** » Thu Apr 21, 2016 3:29 pm #170387

Ricotez wrote:why did you post it in my thread though

Unless you want to make a whole new thread on this.

Also you even said that if someone wants to take over they should write their own