[Danno] Nilons - Banned for having a slightly odd name

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[Danno] Nilons - Banned for having a slightly odd name

Post by Nilons » #275559

Byond account and character name: Nilons, Ostrava of Nanotrasen
Admin: Danno
Time and Server(Bagil or Sybil) incident occurred: 7:20ish 4/2/2017 Bagil (Appearance banned)
Detailed summary: I was playing as the name I have been playing on for over a week, Ostrava of Nanotrasen. I got bwoinked by Danno saying I need to change it because "it sounded more like an ooc handle". During this round the name of the chef was Firstname: Chef lastname :Excellence, and there was a miner named Diggum The Sugar Smacks Frog yet I was the first one messaged. He told me that the admins had told people to change less weird names in the past and that it's really unlikely that I would have been hired with my name as is. I responded telling him about the miners name and saying that space is a weird place and that it was really lame -with all due respect-. When he did ban me from appearance he actually cut off part of the message to make it sound different, the message "If you wanna ban me because my name is slightly off in a mid-low rp server I understand but come on" was shorted to "If you wanna ban me because my name is slightly off in a mid-low rp server I understand " which I felt was purposefully misleading to anyone who saw it. I dont think "First name (where your from) is really that weird, when there are long standing community members whos names are ooc memes and things that arent even close to names. This is literally just weird formatting of a name.

Side note: Not the main focus here but later that round he deemed it acceptable for the captain to execute me on the spot before searching me after I was down and out for resisting a search (stealing a baton he put in my bag and trying to drag him off 5 tiles, didnt hurt him too badly and was caught by the CE) as a syndie when he had no provocation or probable cause. This was deemed acceptable because he had found evidence of a cult. Which is silly because swipe if you wanna search everyone. Again, not the main focus of the complaint just throwin it out there.
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Re: [Danno] Nilons - Banned for having a slightly odd name

Post by danno » #275561

"if you wanna ban me because my name is slightly off in a mid-low rp server I understand" - you
Hornygranny wrote: wtf i like danno now
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I don't even play ss13 anymore, pretty much due to dannos stupid bullshit
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Re: [Danno] Nilons - Banned for having a slightly odd name

Post by Nilons » #275562

danno wrote:"if you wanna ban me because my name is slightly off in a mid-low rp server I understand" - you
Spoiler:
but come on
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Re: [Danno] Nilons - Banned for having a slightly odd name

Post by danno » #275564

A bunch of people were messaged about their names. The order in which they were messaged doesn't matter.
Everyone was perfectly understanding and willing to change, barring you.

Shortening the "come on" part is also meaningless

I asked the other admins online for advice and they agreed this was a reasonable way to go about it

you can appeal the ban if you change your name
Hornygranny wrote: wtf i like danno now
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Re: [Danno] Nilons - Banned for having a slightly odd name

Post by Nilons » #275565

danno wrote:A bunch of people were messaged about their names. The order in which they were messaged doesn't matter.
Everyone was perfectly understanding and willing to change, barring you.

Shortening the "come on" part is also meaningless

I asked the other admins online for advice and they agreed this was a reasonable way to go about it

you can appeal the ban if you change your name
It was fine for over a week with no admin complaint and suddenly theres an issue. I can name several people with much more jarringly ooc names, I would not like to because it causes beef but if this is how its gonna be id like some consistency with people who already have ooc names
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Re: [Danno] Nilons - Banned for having a slightly odd name

Post by danno » #275566

This isn't about other people
if other people have bad names they will probably get looked at in time
Hornygranny wrote: wtf i like danno now
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Re: [Danno] Nilons - Banned for having a slightly odd name

Post by Nilons » #275567

danno wrote:This isn't about other people
if other people have bad names they will probably get looked at in time
It's okay if you treat one person differently than other people because its not about other people? Wanting consistency in admin rulings is not ok?
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Re: [Danno] Nilons - Banned for having a slightly odd name

Post by danno » #275568

The reason you're being treated differently is because all those other people went "Alright that's reasonable, I'll change my name next round." when asked.
Hornygranny wrote: wtf i like danno now
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Re: [Danno] Nilons - Banned for having a slightly odd name

Post by Nilons » #275569

danno wrote:The reason you're being treated differently is because all those other people went "Alright that's reasonable, I'll change my name next round." when asked.
So the reason you're being more strict with my name is because they all changed their name?
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Re: [Danno] Nilons - Banned for having a slightly odd name

Post by danno » #275570

I'm not being any more strict with you compared to anyone else. You're simply the only one who refused to change. Everyone you're complaining about agreed to change. If "Diggums The Sugar Smacks Frog", for example, had refused to change their name, they would also have received an appearance ban.
Hornygranny wrote: wtf i like danno now
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Re: [Danno] Nilons - Banned for having a slightly odd name

Post by Nilons » #275571

danno wrote:I'm not being any more strict with you compared to anyone else. You're simply the only one who refused to change. Everyone you're complaining about agreed to change. If "Diggums The Sugar Smacks Frog", for example, had refused to change their name, they would also have received an appearance ban.
Im not talking about the people also in the game when you decided a bunch of names were unacceptable, Im talking about long standing community members with names much more ooc than mine. When are you going to ask them to change theirs?
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Re: [Danno] Nilons - Banned for having a slightly odd name

Post by danno » #275572

I haven't been an admin for very long and I can only reasonably talk to people who are in the current round, I'm not planning on going dumpster diving into the history of the game to find specifically who has names I don't like.
Hornygranny wrote: wtf i like danno now
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Re: [Danno] Nilons - Banned for having a slightly odd name

Post by Nilons » #275575

danno wrote:I haven't been an admin for very long and I can only reasonably talk to people who are in the current round, I'm not planning on going dumpster diving into the history of the game to find specifically who has names I don't like.
So you don't care enough about this ruling to enforce it thoroughly, just on people who are in the game at the same time as you, this is why we need a more rocksolid ruleset. People will get different game experiences depending on which admin is in the game when they are.
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Re: [Danno] Nilons - Banned for having a slightly odd name

Post by danno » #275576

I enforced it on every "poor quality" name in that round with equal measure, everyone responded reasonably with the exception of you, and therefore after consulting the veteran administrators online at the time I appearance banned you. I will not be lifting it unless you agree to change your name.
Hornygranny wrote: wtf i like danno now
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Re: [Danno] Nilons - Banned for having a slightly odd name

Post by Nilons » #275577

danno wrote:I enforced it on every "poor quality" name in that round with equal measure, everyone responded reasonably with the exception of you, and therefore after consulting the veteran administrators online at the time I appearance banned you. I will not be lifting it unless you agree to change your name.
I've been bwoinked and ahelped multiple times since getting the name, if it wasn't actionable to them why was it actionable to you. This is a really admin specific ruling.
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Re: [Danno] Nilons - Banned for having a slightly odd name

Post by danno » #275578

That's just how naming policy is. I'm not responsible for it.
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Re: [Danno] Nilons - Banned for having a slightly odd name

Post by Screemonster » #275579

why is this an admincomplaint and not a ban appeal
Nilons wrote:It was fine for over a week with no admin complaint and suddenly theres an issue. I can name several people with much more jarringly ooc names, I would not like to because it causes beef but if this is how its gonna be id like some consistency with people who already have ooc names
On this topic though, just because you got away with it before doesn't grant any kind of immunity, nor does someone else getting away with something similar.
Earlier this week on one of the places where I admin we had to deal with the exact same "X did Y and you didn't punish them, so I'm going to do YYYYY and you can't ban me" stuff. Spoilers: we banned them.
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Re: [Danno] Nilons - Banned for having a slightly odd name

Post by Nilons » #275580

danno wrote:That's just how naming policy is. I'm not responsible for it.
Out of probably the 5 admins I've interacted with you're the only one to take issue with it, Im not saying that makes the ruling inherently wrong but what it is is inconsistent which to me is unacceptable with a structured rule system. What would you consider an acceptable name? First name Last name? And also you didn't go through a list of people with "poor" names, you were surprised when I told you about the miner.
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Re: [Danno] Nilons - Banned for having a slightly odd name

Post by Nilons » #275581

Screemonster wrote:why is this an admincomplaint and not a ban appeal
I feel like thats misrepresenting what I'm saying, if you blatantly murder people constantly all week and talk to admins about unrelated shit, and all of them are perfectly aware that the rdm are going on, youre gonna be a little taken aback when one of them says oh yeah thats not ok heres your ban a week later
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Re: [Danno] Nilons - Banned for having a slightly odd name

Post by danno » #275582

Was I supposed to go through the list first, rank you all from best to worst and THEN PM you to ask you to change it?

It's all irrelevant. It wouldn't make a difference if I PMed Diggum or you first. You were the name I saw first, you were the one I PMed first.
It doesn't matter how many admins you've interacted with before either.
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Re: [Danno] Nilons - Banned for having a slightly odd name

Post by Nilons » #275584

danno wrote:Was I supposed to go through the list first, rank you all from best to worst and THEN PM you to ask you to change it?

It's all irrelevant. It wouldn't make a difference if I PMed Diggum or you first. You were the name I saw first, you were the one I PMed first.
It doesn't matter how many admins you've interacted with before either.
First of all you didnt answer my question on what you consider an appropriate name, so if you dont actually expect me to change it to what you want why did you even tell me to change it? Second of all you're right, you're not expected to go through a list of names. But I would argue that a name that literally has an ingame organization in it doesnt fall under this rule. If I was going to make no effort it would have been Of Boletaria. What part of my name is excessively ooc?

"Excessively OOC names fall under rule 3. Make a minimum effort to have your name fit in a setting involving a wacky space station in the future. Admins may get involved if your name is dumb." ~ taken from the wiki
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Re: [Danno] Nilons - Banned for having a slightly odd name

Post by Nilons » #275585

Screemonster wrote:why is this an admincomplaint and not a ban appeal
I'm more bothered by the way the ban was administered than the ban. If I have to make a separate appeal after its settled I will.
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Re: [Danno] Nilons - Banned for having a slightly odd name

Post by danno » #275586

"if you wanna ban me because my name is slightly off in a mid-low rp server I understand" - you
Hornygranny wrote: wtf i like danno now
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Re: [Danno] Nilons - Banned for having a slightly odd name

Post by Nilons » #275587

danno wrote:"if you wanna ban me because my name is slightly off in a mid-low rp server I understand" - you
I honestly don't know if you're meming by cutting the quote short, it was meant to be sarcastic and used as a way of describing how fucking silly this situation is. I'm sorry if I was initially unclear.
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Re: [Danno] Nilons - Banned for having a slightly odd name

Post by danno » #275588

I don't think "but come on" adds any meaningful context to the quote. Don't be sarcastic in adminhelps regardless.
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Re: [Danno] Nilons - Banned for having a slightly odd name

Post by Nilons » #275589

danno wrote:I don't think "but come on" adds any meaningful context to the quote. Don't be sarcastic in adminhelps regardless.
I know that you don't think it adds meaningful context to the quote, just because you dont doesn't mean that no one can garner any meaning from it. I personally feel like it changes the tone of the entire message.
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Re: [Danno] Nilons - Banned for having a slightly odd name

Post by Qbopper » #275592

For the record I and other admins bwoink people when we notice the name policy is being broken - we don't always see it because people don't ahelp it and we aren't always able to see everything
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Re: [Danno] Nilons - Banned for having a slightly odd name

Post by Nilons » #275593

Qbopper wrote:For the record I and other admins bwoink people when we notice the name policy is being broken - we don't always see it because people don't ahelp it and we aren't always able to see everything
Thats fair, but from the name rule I don't see where I'm vehemently breaking any rules. And like I said I've been in multiple ahelp situations with this name.
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Re: [Danno] Nilons - Banned for having a slightly odd name

Post by Qbopper » #275594

I don't know when you last played with that name, but the name policy is a relatively recent change

If we notice someone with a non Firstname Lastname format name we usually ask them to change it for the next round

This is policy now, so it's unfortunate you feel it's lame, but that's the way it is

the ban reason being edited may have been slightly lame by danno but that's not the problem here
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Re: [Danno] Nilons - Banned for having a slightly odd name

Post by Nilons » #275595

Qbopper wrote:I don't know when you last played with that name, but the name policy is a relatively recent change

If we notice someone with a non Firstname Lastname format name we usually ask them to change it for the next round

This is policy now, so it's unfortunate you feel it's lame, but that's the way it is

the ban reason being edited may have been slightly lame by danno but that's not the problem here
When was it changed and where can I see it? I'm going off the wiki rule so I didn't see any other name policy. Sorry if I'm coming off aggro as fuck this whole thread but I like this name.
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Re: [Danno] Nilons - Banned for having a slightly odd name

Post by danno » #275596

I didn't edit anything
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Re: [Danno] Nilons - Banned for having a slightly odd name

Post by Nilons » #275597

danno wrote:I didn't edit anything
Except for things you "don't think add meaningful context"
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Re: [Danno] Nilons - Banned for having a slightly odd name

Post by Nilons » #275599

Just wondering did anyone personally take offense to the name Ostrava of Nanotrasen, like did it break anyones immersion or give them ooc info they shouldn't have had? Curious
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Re: [Danno] Nilons - Banned for having a slightly odd name

Post by Steelpoint » #275601

This is the current ruling on names on the most up to date rule page on the wiki.

"Excessively OOC names fall under rule 3. Make a minimum effort to have your name fit in a setting involving a wacky space station in the future. Admins may get involved if your name is dumb."

It leaves the idea of a "OOC name" very open to interpretation, but it's not a iron clad ruling and it seems to give leeway for names.
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Re: [Danno] Nilons - Banned for having a slightly odd name

Post by Cobby » #275602

"Admins may get involved if your name is dumb." means admins have something short of full jurisdiction in your name choice.

We all have acceptable thresholds of what we deem to be "dumb" in terms of naming. Your name just happened to bypass Danno's [to which I agreed it was poor after they pointed it out].
During this round the name of the chef was Firstname: Chef lastname :Excellence, and there was a miner named Diggum The Sugar Smacks Frog yet I was the first one messaged
All of the people were bwoinked and they changed their name to something more oriented as an actual name instead of a Dark Souls Character [which I'm assuming the name is based off of anyways].

I'm not really sure what the actual complaint is except they bwoinked you in a matter that wasn't in your favor.
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Re: [Danno] Nilons - Banned for having a slightly odd name

Post by Lazengann » #275603

Nilons wrote:Just wondering did anyone personally take offense to the name Ostrava of Nanotrasen, like did it break anyones immersion or give them ooc info they shouldn't have had? Curious
I'm annoyed by it and I'm not even in the game
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Re: [Danno] Nilons - Banned for having a slightly odd name

Post by Saegrimr » #275604

anon3 amendment

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Re: [Danno] Nilons - Banned for having a slightly odd name

Post by Nilons » #275607

Since people have said that they're upset by it ill change it, as soon as Im given access to do so. But I still fail to see how someone who's last name literally has Nanotrasen in it, could be construed as even mildly ooc. Just because something is a reference doesn't mean it's game changingly ooc. There are people running around with names like "Carrot Top", "Dr. Feelgood", and "Vlazza" literally as this post is being written, should all their names be deemed unacceptable because they're either references or 1 word? This feels like an admin made a ruling that only served to adhere to a rule and not to actually make anyone have more fun. And that the only reason its still in place is because they are an admin, and because they made a ruling.
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Re: [Danno] Nilons - Banned for having a slightly odd name

Post by danno » #275609

ban lifted so you can change it
I guess this is "Resolved"
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Re: [Danno] Nilons - Banned for having a slightly odd name

Post by PKPenguin321 » #275624

Wait, this is an admincomplaint?
danno, next time just ask them to have a more IC appropriate name and VV them to something more appropriate if you want, this isn't really a big issue, especially not one to appearance ban over

Those are my thoughts, I'll direct the other headmins to this
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Re: [Danno] Nilons - Banned for having a slightly odd name

Post by danno » #275625

I only chose to appearance ban under the suggestion of the fullmins online
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Re: [Danno] Nilons - Banned for having a slightly odd name

Post by Nilons » #275628

danno wrote:I only chose to appearance ban under the suggestion of the fullmins online
Youve mentioned the fullmins telling you what to do like 4 times in this thread, shouldn't a trialmin be independent enough to take responsibility for his own appearance ban when its barely being called into question
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Re: [Danno] Nilons - Banned for having a slightly odd name

Post by PKPenguin321 » #275629

Right, the consensus is not actionable, especially with the unban. Just play nice. Danno's still a baby admin he's still learning so it's not a real big deal. A ban appeal would have been more appropriate than a complaint.
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