[Naloac] DeiDrah23, Perma Ban Appeal

[DeiDrah23]

BYOND account: DeiDrah23
Character Name: John Mitchell
Ban type: Server
Ban length: Permanent
Ban reason: "Tried to kill the chaplain with a -guillotine- on a cult round. Then ahelped when the chaplain and security used it on him instead. Not honest in ahelps and only admitting to *misremembering* when logs w-h-ere mentioned. You have a note history a mile long and two previous attempts at trying to -guillotine- people as non-antag.
Time ban was placed: 2019-11-10 21:42:58
Server you were playing on when banned: Terry
Round ID in which ban was placed: 123391
Your side of the story: So chaplain invited me to talk, then started threating to delimb me. I carried on my clown business but chaplain just didn't want to leave me alone. I said that i need limbs to build but he insisted on delimbing me to "Roll around". Take into account that I wasn't aware about it being the cult round at that moment. So we tried to put each other into guillotine then chaplain started chasing and tackling me, I was only running away. After he lost me i found a flash and because I considered him a danger to my character well being. I ran into him and flashed him in front of security at the cult round which was indeed weird and execution worthy. I wrote to admins asking why I was executed ( Because I actually forgot who tried to put whom first otherwise (WRITING ADMINS AFTER STARTING A FIGHT WOULD BE TOO DUMB)) and after I explained the reason and some time passing i got called a liar. I told an Admin that I actually don't remember who tried to put whom first and that chaplain threatened to delimb me. Minutes later I was just permabanned.
Why you think you should be unbanned: . Lately I've been trying to behave i didn't even kill anyone or started a fight as a non-antag in a few days. I do realize that my track record is nasty and I knew that i should do everything to avoid getting banned (i.e. don't break the rules) but the record shouldn't be the only criteria to judge people. Players far worse on the rules roam this server without ever getting banned while I got blown out by a simple "U lie".
References of good conduct: Got banned today so none.

[Naloac]

Hi ya! thanks for appealing,


The first part of you appeal I dont believe to be true due to these logs.

SAY: Hamboy/(Cash Mccune) "You ever thought" (Chapel (91, 70, 2))
SAY: Hamboy/(Cash Mccune) "about how our limbs limit us" (Chapel (91, 70, 2))
SAY: Deidrah23/(Sad Clown) "yes indeed" (Chapel (93, 69, 2))
cut
SAY: Hamboy/(Cash Mccune) "How about" (Chapel (91, 70, 2))
SAY: Hamboy/(Cash Mccune) "we get rid of the arms and legs" (Chapel (91, 70, 2))
SAY: Hamboy/(Cash Mccune) "we can roll on the ground" (Chapel (91, 70, 2))
SAY: Hamboy/(Cash Mccune) "its much more aerodynamic and faster that way" (Chapel (91, 70, 2))
SAY: Deidrah23/(Sad Clown) "im building a device that detaches one limb honk" (Chapel (93, 71, 2))
SAY: Hamboy/(Cash Mccune) "but i can just do it for you" (Chapel (91, 71, 2))
SAY: Hamboy/(Cash Mccune) "its very simple" (Chapel (91, 71, 2))
SAY: Deidrah23/(Sad Clown) "wait soon will be build" (Chapel (93, 71, 2))

If the Chaplain actually wanted to delimb you/ kill you he would have done so right then in this exchange with him, You seemingly go along with his gimmick. Notice how he says "We" aswell as in he wants both of you do roll around limbless.

You both get together and put someone willing into the guillotine and chop their head off after you put his head into the guillotine.
Since you actually putting his head into the guillotine wasnt logged Imma just prove real fast you did put his head into it the best I can.
ATTACK: Hamboy/(Cash Mccune) has shoved Deidrah23/(Sad Clown) (NEWHP: 100) (Central Primary Hallway (108, 113, 2))

This is the first time he does ANYTHING aggressive against you if you check the exact position on the map this was.



directly below where you put your guillotines.

Both of you then go separate ways for awhile De-escalating the situation.

Then when both of you are near the guillotines again you decide to do
ATTACK: Deidrah23/(Sad Clown) has flashed(targeted) Hamboy/(Cash Mccune) with the flash (NEWHP: 100) (Central Primary Hallway (108, 113, 2))

Notice how its the exact same spot directly below the guillotines. With you flashing him directly below the guillotines and trying to do it before he obviously assumes that was your intent and lucky for him sec is nearby. This leads to a scuffle where you fight with sec the chaplain and another unrelated person. This leads to the security staff and the chaplain who understood what you where trying to do doing it to you.

After this happens you Ahelp
ADMINPRIVATE: Ticket #4: Deidrah23/(Sad Clown): So i got executed for flashing someone by sec ban them all
Completely leaving out all context. I begin to look into it. Im obviously thinking thats not the whole story question you on it the *ban them all* Is obviously abit worrying but I look into it.
ADMINPRIVATE: PM: Naloac/(Lepi Mewtera)->Deidrah23/(Sad Clown): which sec and is that the FULL reason they killed you?
ADMINPRIVATE: PM: Deidrah23/(Sad Clown)->Naloac/(Lepi Mewtera): Pepper oni and cash mccune because i flashed chaplain who was trying to execute me
ADMINPRIVATE: PM: Naloac/(Lepi Mewtera)->Deidrah23/(Sad Clown): Did you try to put the chaplain into a guilotine?

After asking the Chaplain and the security member. The security member says they put you in to joke and the chaplain pulled it which the logs show. They did so most likely because you wanted to do it to them.
You reply with
ADMINPRIVATE: PM: Deidrah23/(Sad Clown)->Naloac/(Lepi Mewtera): He tried to put me first
He denies this and says you put him into it first.

ADMINPRIVATE: PM: Deidrah23/(Sad Clown)->Naloac/(Lepi Mewtera): now i remember i actually did try to put him into guillotine but after he threatened me
You then suddenly remember! You did put him in after he *threatened* you
I also looked at your notes which say.

Banned from the server for 1 week - Once again used a guillotine to behead a random crewmember as a non-antag, despite having been banned for doing the same two weeks ago.
You've collected five notes since then. Please use your time off to review our rules. If you don't, you're going to find yourself permabanned before long.

This note reinforces my opinion that you lied in ahelps when you got dunked. When confronted about being wrong about trying to guillotine him suddenly *remembering* that you did it first. That coupled with the Ban Them comment in the original ahelp and the other 19 notes you've managed to pick up in less than a year. I think you should go play on some other servers or learn to actually follow the rules. Although granted I dont believe all the crew knew about the cult at that moment in time. The chaplain also said in ahelp logs that they wanted to clone you but got dragged off due to the cult. Ill amend that part but I stand by the Perma ban. You tried to murder the chaplain and failed. When you got back together you flash him and together with sec they dunk you. Then you ahelp *accidentally* leaving out info that makes you look bad. Unless you can convince me otherwise I dont believe you should be unbanned.

[DeiDrah23]

If the Chaplain actually wanted to delimb you/ kill you he would have done so right then in this exchange with him No, because I convinced him that I'm building a special device "As a gift" for him when he met me in the halls before that dialogue.
Since you actually putting his head into the guillotine wasnt logged Imma just prove real fast you did put his head into it the best I can. As far as i remember(funny enough) he was putting his head on guillotine by himself.
So after that first de-escalation when i ran off and we got to separate ways I came back to guillotines for a brief moment when he proposed myself "A deal" that i should be purified by guillotining (Pointing at guillotine after saying "Purified") and that's after he was tackling me so I considered that as a threat. Before that he was also following me and i was trying to talk with him that i still need my limbs. My actions weren't entirely unprovoked and if they were i wouldn't go off to complain to Administration after security just murdered me on spot for flashing chaplain during cult round I wasn't aware of and instead of explanation i got permabanned. I flashed him because i wanted to restrain him for threatening and tackling me (I had handcuffs from the corporate showroom in my backpack.). As for notes I already said that i've been trying to behave as good as possible and i consider that this minor confrontation and supposedly "LYING" (not really) is not worth the permaban. I do realize that it's my fault for escalating further with the flash but since he did try to put my head into the guillotine I only tried to stop us from killing each other since previously he was following me and asking me to delimb me despite my numerous protests. Considering that none of us actually intended to kill each other, and that i didn't harm him a single time and all that happened on a cult round I DISAGREE that this situation is PERMABAN worthy even considering my bad notes.

[Naloac]

I fully disagree with your comment. You ahelped when you got dunked with obvious intent to get everyone who *wronged you* banned. When you where killed killed you admitted to misremembering which coupled with your other notes makes me not believe you and believe that you lied. in your first ahelp you say you asked why you where killed but as I have proven your original ahelp was a context less filled comment with the words ban them all. I fully believe you purposely left out anything which made you look bad. Only admitting to it when things where obviously not going your way to save yourself from possible punishment. You yourself admitted to *misremembering* and you are now walking back that statement because its made you look like your in the wrong.

In my opinion you tried to kill someone, got dunked then ahelped with intention to get them banned. I believe you where trying to mis represent the situation so the other people would be punished.

Overall unless I am missing something I do not believe you should be unbanned.

[DeiDrah23]

So because I said something stupid like "Ban them" in report you think that I actually intended to ban them instead of wanting a simple explanation why i got dunked? The decision is always up to administrator obviously and I as a player can't just ask to ban someone that's why it's called reporting not ban request or whatever. I reported that i got killed for merely flashing someone and got permabanned. As i stated before i didn't want to kill anybody who was unwilling to put their head into guillotine. I already said that I didn't know who started putting whom in the execution machine and under your pressure the best thing i could think of was admitting something i wasn't even sure of. Is it so hard to believe that i don't remember something so irrelevant.
If you feel that you're missing something here's full chronology for that matter:

Chaplain approaches me in the hall and asks me to visit Chapel
I told him that i'm preparing a gift for him
I grabbed some materials to change chapel style including steel, glass, crayons and such
I go to chapel and that dialogue about delimbing happened and i just tried to talk it off.
I thought that guillotines would be perfect for a chaplain like this and I built 3 of them.
Chaplain tries to convince me to delimb now ME only
I try to talk him out of this saying that i need limbs to build.
I put guillotines in the hall
Me with chaplain executed a paramedic who willingly put his head in
Chaplain starts to put himself into guillotine WILLINGLY and i try to pull the lever a few times
He started putting me into guillotine and pulling the lever
He started tackling me and i started running away
After a minute i ran off, grabbed handcuffs ( silly clown ) in corporate showroom and flash in robotics
I came back and i see him and a security officer with her head sticking out of the guillotine
I thought it would be okay to flash him since there are 2 security officers nearby
I flashed him
Turned out it was a cult round so i got killed
Asked for explanation
You asked if that's the full reason they killed me (Flashing chaplain) i said yes referring to security officers who killed me ( I didn't see the second officer name so i quickly checked chat, saw chaplain name, thought it was a second officer Bindy Johal)
You tell me that chaplain said that it was because i was trying to execute him
I told you that i remember that we had a conflict and i actually tried to execute him
You called me a liar and permabanned me

I hope that you will get my message, this is in no way is permaban worthy. You say that i tried to get someone banned or lied just because i wrote a quick shitty report and you didn't give me any time to explain.
That's all what i can say and i swear if i left something out that's because i only vaguely remember what happened.
I ain't no griefer or someone who intentionally tries to ban people I know rules of escalation and how admins treat conflicts between players (You escalate you're guilty) but you treated me as some kind of a criminal just because i have a lot of notes for playing like a retard.

[Naloac]

You have already said yourself in our ahelp conversation that YOU put his head into the guillotine. Proven by this log

ADMINPRIVATE: PM: Deidrah23/(Sad Clown)->Naloac/(Lepi Mewtera): now i remember i actually did try to put him into guillotine but after he threatened me

I fully believe you intended to kill him. You have two notes on doing it before. I do not believe you where being truthful and I feel like your trying to walk back your statements because they paint you in a bad light. Overall I do feel this is perma ban worthy due to your have a long note history and two previous offences about doing this before. With one literally noting you will be permabanned if you continue. I had this convo with you where trying to get the truth out was a hassle, you didnt fully explain things leaving out parts that made you look bad. Reviewing it seemed extremely ban baity and it still does.

Overall I will be denying this appeal. Im not convinced that it isnt worth a perma ban and I still believe you where purposely omitting info that made you seem bad only saying it once you realised the ahelp wasn't going your way.

[DeiDrah23]

You would remain unconviced no matter what i do. Of course you just banned me in a few minutes for some bullshit reason like """""""lying"""""""" and """""""backpedaling"""""""""" when i was literally murdered by a sec officer for flashing a chaplain I can't complain about that? Anyone who has a note shouldn't complain or ask for explanation at all? Ofcourse i'm trying to revert everything because instead of investigation and explanation why i was executed i got fucking permad for some idiotic reason you literally made up. Permabanned for being executed and ahelping asking why. You couldn't make my day any better, thank you for your service.

[Agux909]

This should be obvious but I want to point it out:

Rule 1:
Don't be a dick.
We're all here to have a good time, supposedly. Going out of your way to seriously negatively impact or end the round for someone with little IC justification is against the rules, this also includes harassing a player OOC (Out of character). Legitimate conflicts where people get upset do happen however, as detailed in the escalation section of the rules.

Escalation policy:

If a player wrongs you(theft, attacks, etc), you may retaliate. If you choose to retaliate with violence, you in turn have opened yourself up to violence. If you choose this route, do not expect admins to help you out if you die, even if you were not the original instigator. If you are concerned about being "kill baited" then consider calling security, using non lethal means to subdue your opponent, fleeing, or otherwise working things out (talking them down, getting your stolen items replaced, etc)

You may instigate conflict with another player within reason (you can't completely destroy their department, kill them unprovoked, or otherwise take them out of the round for long periods of time) but they are entitled to respond with violence. If you think it's unfair or excessive they killed you for taking their ID, consider not stealing next round.

If you are the instigator in a conflict and end up killing or severely impairing the round of the person you are fighting, you should make a reasonable effort to return them to life at least once or make amends, only seeking round removal if they continue to pursue you. This protection doesn't apply to an instigator being killed.

Exceptions: Security is expected not to retaliate with random abuse or violence unless the person in question is otherwise eligible for execution. You can't kill or maim security for trying to arrest you for legitimate reasons.

Given escalation policy, were you or not the instigator in this mess (and it seems you were?) it was an extremely dick move for you to ahelp being killed after your shenanigans with the chap, and having notes about similar situations doesn't help you at all. Given the context, maybe you should've sucked it up and waited for the next round?

Sorry if this isn't allowed, remove it if I am stepping out of line here.