/tg/Station 13

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viewtopic.php?f=7&t=33570

Lol

BrolyButterfingers wrote: ↑Fri Mar 17, 2023 3:33 am

oranges wrote: ↑Fri Mar 17, 2023 1:48 am

Thranos wrote: ↑Fri Mar 17, 2023 1:47 am

oranges wrote: ↑Fri Mar 17, 2023 1:42 am sure just keep repeating it and it might come true but everyone on the github ban list is there for excellent reasons.

So that's a yes to the "Got any more Techbro self-fellating deflections" about the sex pest thing, got it.

There's nothing to say on that because it's quite clear you won't change your mind and you're massively overstating your point, but whatever, it's not my place to make you happy with what happened and if you and the other two want to go on saying i'm out to rape and assault women that's on you and you can live with that. I still wont let you shit on maintainers on github for doing their job and I dont' care how much it makes you rage and sperg in players club.

I'm at peace with my fuck up.

maybe if you three were able to forgive yourselves to you wouldn't be so assmad.

Seriously I can't believe more people are making fun of this Mark Wahlberg-ass post lmao

It's hard to poke fun at something that's already the biggest joke imaginable.

carshalash wrote: ↑Fri Mar 17, 2023 3:13 am

oranges wrote: ↑Fri Mar 17, 2023 3:00 am

CMDR_Gungnir wrote: ↑Fri Mar 17, 2023 2:22 am

oranges wrote: ↑Fri Mar 17, 2023 2:12 am We've been over this, it's not unreasonable to ask someone to justify their PR, unfortunately for them, when they did it was already too late because you and the bozo brigade decided you would weigh in and torpedo the PR.

So you're just gonna ignore everything I said, huh? Even if we assume this is true (It's not), it doesn't actually answer anything I said. The only people who faced repercussions for their toxicity were the two who called you out, and not your maintainer who was hyper-toxic to someone making a genuine effort to improve the codebase.

incorrect, mothblocks was not hypertoxic to carsh, carsh had some horrible things to happen to them, not that anyone could of known, that does not exempt them from the requirement to put in their PR body an description of what they were removing and why.

then before we could resolve the miscommunication caused by them saying literally nothing, their PR was spoiled by crag and the rest of you.

Lets recap here

1) the people punished are those who couldnt' keep their foot out fo their mouths for the 30 seconds on a PR they had nothing to do with.
2) carsh wasn't punished, simply had to wait
3) mothblocks was right to ask them to give more reasoning than "everyone knows"
4) the only people who are responsible for the delay are crag and the rest of you

carsh might be genuine, but they did not follow process, they didn't make a good faith effort to follow up until I got involved and when I was discussing in coderbus how to move forward, including discussing with imaginos making a replacement plush instead, crag showed up to be a genuine shit head in the PR and I decided we didn't need that bullshit for doing the work and it would be easy to punt the issue for 4 months until everyone had calmed the fuck down.

And to clear up some final things
1) i cant' close source the code
2) mothblocks ninjanomnom and rohesie from TGMC all have equal ownership over the repos and org that I do
3) I have no ability to stop the maintainers from kicking me out

The closest thing I am to load bearing is that currently I renew the tgstation13.org domain, which I have also given san and bobbah the ability to do to ensure it's not linked to just one person, but I have not and will not ever use that as a bargaining chip, just like I have not and never will use my position as repo owner as a bargaining chip.

The only value I might possess is that i've been around for longer and worked with MSO for longer, which means we are better at resolving differences, but that is not something the codebase could not live with out.

I.. kinda showed the timeline of what happened, mothblocks was actively instigating things with me in the manuelcord the entire time. Anne eventually said to quit it where mothblocks refused to back down and kept saying I was lying to get the plushie removed, even after I posted my reasoning in the PR. It's all in my post.

again, i don't have access to the manuelcord, so I can't see things I can't see, I don't agree with everything mothblocks said if the screenshots you have are all the context, but I can see how they originally formed that opinion based on your original PR body, if I had known the specifics I might have contacted you directly to work on the issue, but it wasn't ultimately the beef between you and moth-blocks that made my mind on the 4 month delay so I don't think it would have changed the outcome.

I think you are probably more hard done by the decision now, but I dont' think that waiting 4 months is a heavy burden by any means.

Capsandi wrote: ↑Fri Mar 17, 2023 3:34 am Asbestos Sniffer I'm calling you out dude you have been lurking since page 3, you too BrolyButterfingers this is a peanut gallery not an art gallery you gotta say something.

There is a chance they're browsing the Reider thread and I'm talking to nobody.

My good man, I am not used to posting on forums, and I have nothing insightful to say, I merely wish to see this train crash for what it is.
That being said, Broly is right and that Mark Wahlbergesque post was funny as shit.

I asked mothblocks if we could remove pickle rick on the github 10 days prior to my PR.

https://github.com/tgstation/tgstation/pull/72878

I wonder if other opensource projects get this level of miscommunication and vitriol that could be resolved if people weren't so entrenched inside their own minds.

CMDR_Gungnir wrote: ↑Fri Mar 17, 2023 3:36 am Again, the series of events were that other than Crag making a shitpost reference back to Mothblocks in direct response and same-reference that Mothblocks was making, there wasn't any toxicity before you put the four month block on. So I'd like to know why you did that, too.

I'm sorry, but I didn't get the reference, nor do I know the meme, so you will have to forgive me on that, from where I am standing it just looked like crag was starting a fight.

oranges have you even read carsh's posts or responded to him at all? anytime someone brings it up, you reply to something unrelated.

Also this thread is very funny cos it has now become hard to double post since there's gonna be some quote tower post anyway

krookodilehunter wrote: ↑Fri Mar 17, 2023 3:39 am oranges have you even read carsh's posts or responded to him at all? anytime someone brings it up, you reply to something unrelated.

There are a lot of posts to get to but i'm going as fast as I can.

oranges wrote: ↑Fri Mar 17, 2023 3:40 am

krookodilehunter wrote: ↑Fri Mar 17, 2023 3:39 am oranges have you even read carsh's posts or responded to him at all? anytime someone brings it up, you reply to something unrelated.

There are a lot of posts to get to but i'm going as fast as I can.

I'd highly recommend you read it sooner rather than later considering it's quite a bit more substantial than the average post in this thread.

oranges wrote: ↑Fri Mar 17, 2023 3:39 am

CMDR_Gungnir wrote: ↑Fri Mar 17, 2023 3:36 am Again, the series of events were that other than Crag making a shitpost reference back to Mothblocks in direct response and same-reference that Mothblocks was making, there wasn't any toxicity before you put the four month block on. So I'd like to know why you did that, too.

I'm sorry, but I didn't get the reference, nor do I know the meme, so you will have to forgive me on that, from where I am standing it just looked like crag was starting a fight.

Mothblocks posted a character pointing a gun. I posted the same character getting his hand boiled. It's pretty self explanatory.

Addendum: dont see how its "crag starting a fight" when mothblocks is posting pictures of men brandishing weapons and making demands.

krookodilehunter wrote: ↑Fri Mar 17, 2023 3:39 am oranges have you even read carsh's posts or responded to him at all? anytime someone brings it up, you reply to something unrelated.

That's probably because, as carsh themselves said, oranges is taking flak meant for mothblocks that wouldn't've happened if he didn't decide to peanut the PR lmao

oranges wrote: ↑Fri Mar 17, 2023 3:39 am

CMDR_Gungnir wrote: ↑Fri Mar 17, 2023 3:36 am Again, the series of events were that other than Crag making a shitpost reference back to Mothblocks in direct response and same-reference that Mothblocks was making, there wasn't any toxicity before you put the four month block on. So I'd like to know why you did that, too.

I'm sorry, but I didn't get the reference, nor do I know the meme, so you will have to forgive me on that, from where I am standing it just looked like crag was starting a fight.

That's fair enough. I didn't get it either until I was talking to Crag about it afterwards.

AsbestosSniffer wrote: ↑Fri Mar 17, 2023 3:41 am

oranges wrote: ↑Fri Mar 17, 2023 3:40 am

krookodilehunter wrote: ↑Fri Mar 17, 2023 3:39 am oranges have you even read carsh's posts or responded to him at all? anytime someone brings it up, you reply to something unrelated.

There are a lot of posts to get to but i'm going as fast as I can.

I'd highly recommend you read it sooner rather than later considering it's quite a bit more substantial than the average post in this thread.

do you mean their first post? I did read it, it doesn't change anything about the situation, I can't punish mohtblocks unilaterally, other than making me feel that carsh did get a worse deal than I originally thought, but as I said, they were not banned and 4 months didn't seem like the end of the world.

the people banned can appeal their ban at any time and i'm willing to hear them out too with the new information.

For what its' worth I pinged imagino's post the feature freeze to see if he wanted to make a PR swapping it out like he originally talked about but I don't think he got back to me

so was mothblocks running inference for orange?

Boot wrote: ↑Fri Mar 17, 2023 3:45 am
so was mothblocks running inference for orange?

carshalash wrote: ↑Fri Mar 17, 2023 3:38 am I asked mothblocks if we could remove pickle rick on the github 10 days prior to my PR.

https://github.com/tgstation/tgstation/pull/72878

yeah and he said you should talk to me, which you didn't do, but if you had, then your friends would probably still be able to use the github and teh stupid fucking plushie would have been replaced with some other plush instead.

oranges wrote: ↑Fri Mar 17, 2023 3:23 am so the fault could be shared equally amongst all there.

If you're going to parade the fault being shared among all equally, then you must also apply this to how you treated Carsh in the PR.

Your first interaction with the PR was to say "I turned myself into a pickle rick" and then closing the PR. When carsh replied to your shitposting closing reason, he simply said "pls," clearly implying that he didn't want to deal with shitposting. Your course of action? To respond with an A.I. generated response. While there is certainly some substance to your AI response, it's still certainly shitposty and immature. Carsh responded in turn with what I assume to be their own AI response but some parts of it seem too handcrafted to be AI. Perhaps their prompt was just extremely detailed. I don't know. Either way I just wanted the record to show they were mimicking you for your immature response. But their contents were pretty heavy. Your response to this was to deflect Carsh and their concerns. Carsh was clearly being hyperbolic about how having pickle rick in the game made them uncomfortable, and you deflected it. You then instead latch onto a completely irrelevant part of his response and try to turn the conversation to being about the reason the pickle was added. And finally, a nail in the coffin on deflecting Carsh's reasoning, of which was pretty personable. And finally, Carsh just gives up. You then vaguely say that "the negativity that people are directing unfairly towards other maintainers here" Of which beforehand, there was only Crag saying "mothblocks i will dip your hand in boiling spaghetti sauce", and your message clearly suggested that there was more than one person involved after Carsh directed a complaint directly towards Mothblocks' behavior. One would assume you were indirectly referring to Carsh himself. If you weren't then why would you not simply refer to the singular comment Crag posted? I know for a fact that's how I inferred it, and clearly other people inferred the situation that Carsh was "unfairly directing negativity towards other maintainers here."

If Crag gave a rats ass about his github ban (as you are clearly suggesting here, which he doesn't give a rat shit about) then he wouldn't be telling the person that banned him to kill himself in 4 different ways. He cares that you immaturely handled the situation and belittled his friend. Crag is suggesting that if you're trying to take the high road by saying you're defending negativity being bombarded onto other maintainers, then his fight in stopping you from giving his friend grief is merely not that much different.

So you are saying its carsh's fault for not messaging you ahead of time? Wtf i hate carsh now!?!

So should every coder expect their PR to be shitposted in by maintainers unless they backchannel you or is it only a carsh thing? It seems super inefficient if everyone has to message you asking if they can open a pr before they are allowed to open a PR without getting shitposted and baited until you have an excuse to close it.

oranges wrote: ↑Fri Mar 17, 2023 3:49 am

carshalash wrote: ↑Fri Mar 17, 2023 3:38 am I asked mothblocks if we could remove pickle rick on the github 10 days prior to my PR.

https://github.com/tgstation/tgstation/pull/72878

yeah and he said you should talk to me, which you didn't do, but if you had, then your friends would probably still be able to use the github and teh stupid fucking plushie would have been replaced with some other plush instead.

Wasn't your argument that moth blocks was unaware of any issues involving the sprite/plushie/rickandmorty? Is it really that hard to say "golly carsh, sorry we were assholes and fucked with you for fun."

conrad wrote: ↑Fri Mar 17, 2023 3:38 am I wonder if other opensource projects get this level of miscommunication and vitriol that could be resolved if people weren't so entrenched inside their own minds.

The thing is that they can be resolved if people are willing to talk it out, and i'm perfectly willing to talk, the only disappointing part is that it took ages for some people to get to the meat and potatoes of the argument because they're so insistent on making sure they own their mortal enemies first.

All of this over a damn pickle/dead meme from years past.

AsbestosSniffer wrote: ↑Fri Mar 17, 2023 3:57 am All of this over a damn pickle/dead meme from years past.

Did you know the writer of the pickle Rick episode is the showrunner of she hulk?

I think it's a fun lil factoid. especially considering the fan bases of both shows.

carshalash wrote: ↑Fri Mar 17, 2023 3:55 am

oranges wrote: ↑Fri Mar 17, 2023 3:49 am

carshalash wrote: ↑Fri Mar 17, 2023 3:38 am I asked mothblocks if we could remove pickle rick on the github 10 days prior to my PR.

https://github.com/tgstation/tgstation/pull/72878

yeah and he said you should talk to me, which you didn't do, but if you had, then your friends would probably still be able to use the github and teh stupid fucking plushie would have been replaced with some other plush instead.

Wasn't your argument that moth blocks was unaware of any issues involving the sprite/plushie/rickandmorty? Is it really that hard to say "golly carsh, sorry we were assholes and fucked with you for fun."

No, when I say they are unaware of the context I am referring to your personal brushes with issues of domestic assault and how that would affect your perception of someone asking you to put a reason on your PR.

If you want an apology i'm happy to say im sorry that this has happened the way it did, I did not have the full context, if I had known, it's possible I would have selected another alternative to making you wait 4 months and I really wish you would have shared any of these things before now.

Say what you want about lean, it never caused this sort of kerfuffle. Some FOTM memes are just better than others.

iwishforducks wrote: ↑Fri Mar 17, 2023 3:54 am

oranges wrote: ↑Fri Mar 17, 2023 3:23 am so the fault could be shared equally amongst all there.

Carsh responded in turn with what I assume to be their own AI response but some parts of it seem too handcrafted to be AI. Perhaps their prompt was just extremely detailed. I don't know. Either way I just wanted the record to show they were mimicking you for your immature response. But their contents were pretty heavy.

► Show Spoiler

And finally, Carsh just gives up. You then vaguely say that "the negativity that people are directing unfairly towards other maintainers here" Of which beforehand, there was only Crag saying "mothblocks i will dip your hand in boiling spaghetti sauce", and your message clearly suggested that there was more than one person involved after Carsh directed a complaint directly towards Mothblocks' behavior.

► Show Spoiler

Nope, that post was all carsh written, no AI involved.

The giving up can be boiled down to mothblocks continued behavior in the manuelcord, at that point I had already explained myself which was met with continued shitposts and claims of lying.

oranges wrote: ↑Fri Mar 17, 2023 4:00 am

carshalash wrote: ↑Fri Mar 17, 2023 3:55 am

oranges wrote: ↑Fri Mar 17, 2023 3:49 am

carshalash wrote: ↑Fri Mar 17, 2023 3:38 am I asked mothblocks if we could remove pickle rick on the github 10 days prior to my PR.

https://github.com/tgstation/tgstation/pull/72878

yeah and he said you should talk to me, which you didn't do, but if you had, then your friends would probably still be able to use the github and teh stupid fucking plushie would have been replaced with some other plush instead.

Wasn't your argument that moth blocks was unaware of any issues involving the sprite/plushie/rickandmorty? Is it really that hard to say "golly carsh, sorry we were assholes and fucked with you for fun."

No, when I say they are unaware of the context I am referring to your personal brushes with issues of domestic assault and how that would affect your perception of someone asking you to put a reason on your PR.

If you want an apology i'm happy to say im sorry that this has happened the way it did, I did not have the full context, if I had known, it's possible I would have selected another alternative to making you wait 4 months and I really wish you would have shared any of these things before now.

This is a non-apology. This the equivalent of me calling somebody a racial slur and when they report me to the admins about it i say "sorry he got so offended about it i didn't realize he would get butthurt."

Capsandi wrote: ↑Fri Mar 17, 2023 4:01 am Say what you want about lean, it never caused this sort of kerfuffle. Some FOTM memes are just better than others.

can we add lean back at this point since it's no longer fotm?

We discussed you being banned from the Discord. It was broadly agreed that anyone else with your history should have been permanently banned. That is the reality of how serious your conduct was, regardless of how lenient I was.

Your ban wasn't lenient because you did something small. It was lenient because of the practical realities of the tgstation project, server and codebase all sharing the same space. At the time you were the only genuinely active headcoder.

Y'know.
Maybe someone should reconsider the whole Oranges ban thing.
After all, he's no longer "the only genuinely active headcoder", so the special treatment could be reconsidered.

Thranos wrote: ↑Fri Mar 17, 2023 4:04 am
Y'know.
Maybe someone should reconsider the whole Oranges ban thing.
After all, he's no longer "the only genuinely active headcoder", so the special treatment could be reconsidered.

are you even in the discord? ninja is typically dormant/inactive (but they show up when pinged, which is fine) and mothblocks is only contactable through coderbus (and maybe manuel-cord idk), although they do check the GitHub quite often, which is also fine. oranges is the only one who is commonly in and out.

i also don't know by what you mean "someone should reconsider the whole Oranges ban" seeing as it was reconsidered last term and i remain perfectly content with that reconsideration

also: i feel split on my term's giving maintainers full access to player's club without playtime... i am unsure if a lot of this could have been prevented but it is quite likely that some of the feelings displayed in this thread would likely be communicated between both parties in a different context/different channel

It wouldn't have come up outside of this channel san

oranges wrote: ↑Fri Mar 17, 2023 4:10 am It wouldn't have come up outside of this channel san

i mean a lot of this is repeating/re-mentioning stuff that already happened on the github (another channel)

yes but none of these people bothered to relitigate it until today because it happened to be something they could mald about that was tangentially related to me.

As it was it's the only thing of value to come from the thread so I was happy to continue talking about it,

We're reaching 6 pages bois

Timberpoes wrote: ↑Fri Mar 17, 2023 4:19 am

I-I'm just trying to figure out why you would do this. Why anyone would do this.

armhulen lock the thread before 6 pages no more will come out of this.

Sightld2 wrote: ↑Fri Mar 17, 2023 4:25 am

Timberpoes wrote: ↑Fri Mar 17, 2023 4:19 am

I-I'm just trying to figure out why you would do this. Why anyone would do this.

The reason anyone would do this is, if they could, which they can't, would be because they could, which they can't.

Terra, we have to get going, or we're gonna be late.

I'd like to point out that mothblocks came to the manual discord to gloat about how little this thread matters to them

Timberpoes wrote: ↑Fri Mar 17, 2023 4:19 am

Would you say you consider Oranges to be a "load-bearing asshole"?

Omega_DarkPotato wrote: ↑Sun Mar 12, 2023 5:37 am

oranges wrote: ↑Sat Mar 11, 2023 9:51 pm also if the discord janitorial team was a lot more proactive instead of composed of entirely the most inactive motherfuckers this side of the planet they would probably intervene earlier before problems blew out of control also

if I intervened before everything blows out of control you'd be claiming I stifle discussion.
People can have a little verbal conflict as a treat, keyword being little.

To think this is how we started and we got this far into a chaotic thread full of uncivilized hate... The discussion has not been stifled, lol.

I didn't read this thread at all after the initial post, until like page 5
Why is oranges facing a deposition

i committed grand delaying

i want this thread to get more posts than the ntr huts deletion

Honestly, i can empathize with Carshalash. Pickle Rick raped me too.

Still unclear on the matter on whether shit posting on other people's PRs is allowed

I knew something had to be up when this thing was over three pages. Good lord, what a harvest.

oranges is kind of a shit head but he spent months roleplaying thog from order of the stick in official channels and that shows his pure heart

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