/tg/Station 13

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viewtopic.php?f=38&p=698498#p698498
looks like the new election is starting
are you running?
im running
who else is running?
are you excited for anyone in particular
have you already decided who you want to vote for?

i cant tell if some of these threads are jokes or not

Geez, some of these candidate threads are genuinely unmedicated.

Really highlighting why we don't have a host pick yet. The pool of non-GM admins that show any aptitude for handling internal affairs and serious internal investigations is limited.

Buncha meme candidates that if they get the role, realise it's actually a genuine part time volunteer job and burn out because it's a lot of extra responsibility leading a community.

Splitting MRP and LRP headmins away from each other is also dumb. I can't believe we still have candidates trotting out this dead horse.

LRP needs encouragement to RP more which MRP headmins can nudge towards. LRP players seem to broadly enjoy policies that lead to more RP in the chaos.

MRP needs fewer HRP admin decisions which LRP headmins will form part of the view for. MRP players seem to enjoy when RP meets chaos and LRP savvy mins are good at ensuring there is room for chaos.

I hop anye future headmins try not to fuck everything up, because I'd hate to see them quit when the entire admin team or playerbase calls them out for being utter dipshits and they realise leadership has responsibilities too.

The key to being a quirky headmin like myself is the ability to make sound decisions about serious topics so you're free to experiment with unimportant stuff like unbanning somah on a forum poll.

If you're not prepared to put in the hard work of leadership, don't bother running. You'll burn out, ruin friendships and walk away a more bitter and jaded person at the end.

Timberpoes wrote: ↑Wed Aug 16, 2023 11:39 am Geez

Send help I just got mauled by an ocelot

Its cool for cats!

Timberpoes wrote: ↑Wed Aug 16, 2023 11:39 am Buncha meme candidates that if they get the role, realise it's actually a genuine part time volunteer job and burn out because it's a lot of extra responsibility leading a community.

Splitting MRP and LRP headmins away from each other is also dumb. I can't believe we still have candidates trotting out this dead horse.

LRP needs encouragement to RP more which MRP headmins can nudge towards. LRP players seem to broadly enjoy policies that lead to more RP in the chaos.

MRP needs fewer HRP admin decisions which LRP headmins will form part of the view for. MRP players seem to enjoy when RP meets chaos and LRP savvy mins are good at ensuring there is room for chaos.

Nobody takes well to having their fun dictated by someone who has no interest in playing the game the same way they enjoy it. Why do you seem to think players are incapable of choosing someone amongst their own server's population that has their best interest at heart? If it's a diversity of perspectives you're worried about... that's why we're all still in the same community.

I'm just sick of these "me knows best" candidates that push their own style of play onto both servers with a level of confidence that I can only imagine comes from a sense of elitism. Every election Sybil and Manny players push their individual button-pushers or MRPmin candidates and it just keeps building more and more resentment between the two server cultures every cycle.

Where is Conrad's one
I thought he was going to run?

Also these ones are a lot lower quality than last time. Yikes.

headmins backing felinid removal are secretly trying to buff felinids via the back door
once felinids can’t be chosen at roundstart the codebase can add cat ears and tails as selectable options to humans, finally matching the lore and giving felinids asimov protection and the ability to join as command roles

Pepper wrote: ↑Wed Aug 16, 2023 12:05 pm I'm just sick of these "me knows best" candidates that push their own style of play onto both servers with a level of confidence that I can only imagine comes from a sense of elitism. Every election Sybil and Manny players push their individual button-pushers or MRPmin candidates and it just keeps building more and more resentment between the two server cultures every cycle.

knowing what is best for all the servers is literally a headmins job, you should vote for the one who knows the best

TheRex9001 wrote: ↑Wed Aug 16, 2023 5:51 am Johnfulpwillard comes in swinging though with a code change and not headmin stuff as the main reason to vote for them.

What is and isn’t a code change can be somewhat transparent to players but this isn’t one.
As with felinids and the colour of assistant jumpsuits, whether assistants (or all crew) get maint access is a config setting that head admins can toggle.

(which is why it's not already been pr'd/changed)

Jacquerel wrote: ↑Wed Aug 16, 2023 12:52 pm knowing what is best for all the servers is literally a headmins job, you should vote for the one who knows the best

This held water maybe 3 years ago. LRP and MRP players have contrasting philosophies that are so fundamentally different at this point that coexisting in their current states only brings shit half measures where every term one or the other gets neglected in some form, depending on which server the team's majority comes from.

TheLoLSwat wrote: ↑Wed Aug 16, 2023 3:36 am

• The current top 5 (Kinnebian, Cheshify, General Thrax, WineAllWine, Fikou) are running to be status-quo (mostly) headmins, atleast from what we can see

Very cool and exciting to be placed that high up on your unofficial tier list, especially since I'm running a campaign without the unfulfillable promises I usually end up seeing politicians mess around with.

I guess you could call an interest in improving the server status quo, I feel as if I'm anything but. I'm open to radical changes if I think they're genuinely positive, however I'm not going to promise anything that I know I wouldn't be able to get done.

Also the whole "Felinids are bland" argument is ridiculous. Of course they're bland, they're not allowed to be anything but space catgirls. They're constantly trapped between "Felinids should be removed because they don't have anything" and "Felinids shouldn't be getting any more content." However that's a code issue.

Some people enjoy playing them for the ability to be a silly catboy, others like going in on the whole half-animal side and eat rats, others just like not having the AI as a crutch. Either way, removing them doesn't do anything but make a large number of people be sad for a five second "wow this is so based" reaction so I'm not going to support it.

Okay idk whos removing felinids bu9t they just shot up to the top of my ballot

noticing a lot of jokers this year, lot of people who think they are funny and enjoy being put on post approval for that subforum

i agree, nearly every platform so far reads as an unfunny shitpost with one or two "real" things thrown in to not get instantly deleted. i feel like the more serious candidates also just seem to be throwing words around rather than having actual stances & principles they want to bring in. im very curious to see what the player vote ends up being because of this

CoffeeDragon16 wrote: ↑Wed Aug 16, 2023 2:46 pm i agree, nearly every platform so far reads as an unfunny shitpost with one or two "real" things thrown in to not get instantly deleted. i feel like the more serious candidates also just seem to be throwing words around rather than having actual stances & principles they want to bring in. im very curious to see what the player vote ends up being because of this

no, we save throwing words for the debates
if theres anything unclear im happy to clarify on what i mean / what ill do more specifically

although we should save that for when the threads open i guess

can we start asking questions? i dont want to lolcow myself by doing it too early

TheLoLSwat wrote: ↑Wed Aug 16, 2023 3:09 pm can we start asking questions? i dont want to lolcow myself by doing it too early

18th August as of UTC is when you can do that

THE SECOND FIRST (1.2) TIER LIST IS FINISHED!




Notes

• It appears we have a few frontrunners now! Lets see how long they can stay at the top.

• Ordered within tiers, but the big gaps are in between tiers.

• A lot of people are expressing displeasure at the lower quality of candidate introduction threads.

• If this isnt a direct cause of the last term ( Not many people having answers for "where can I go from here?" when looking at the previous term ), I will eat a sock or something

• This had to come a lot earlier than anticipated, as we have way more people running

• ! Again, expect this list to change even more drastically when questions get answered !

• Also expect the actual second list to be around then unless something crazy happens or 7 more people throw their hat in

• Stealth list edit: I forgot to give Fikou his hard earned admintrainer buff, so he has been moved up 2 spots

I would've confidently put JohnFulpWillard at the top if he didn't support the removal of felinids. Quite a frightening amount of candidates wanting to remove them. Removing assistant maintenance access is based. I don't even know why it's a config.

We need someone like Goof so I can confidently put someone at the top of my list. Disappointing start so far. Hope we get better candidates to run.

TheLoLSwat wrote: ↑Wed Aug 16, 2023 3:47 pm

► Show Spoiler

THE SECOND FIRST (1.2) TIER LIST IS FINISHED!




Notes

• It appears we have a few frontrunners now! Lets see how long they can stay at the top.

• Ordered within tiers, but the big gaps are in between tiers.

• A lot of people are expressing displeasure at the lower quality of candidate introduction threads.

• If this isnt a direct cause of the last term ( Not many people having answers for "where can I go from here?" when looking at the previous term ), I will eat a sock or something

• This had to come a lot earlier than anticipated, as we have way more people running

• ! Again, expect this list to change even more drastically when questions get answered !

• Also expect the actual second list to be around then unless something crazy happens or 7 more people throw their hat in

aw fuck i dropped a tier, why

So far scriptis seems to be my favorite out of the people who already put out their thread.

kinnebian wrote: ↑Wed Aug 16, 2023 4:01 pm

TheLoLSwat wrote: ↑Wed Aug 16, 2023 3:47 pm

► Show Spoiler

THE SECOND FIRST (1.2) TIER LIST IS FINISHED!




Notes

• It appears we have a few frontrunners now! Lets see how long they can stay at the top.

• Ordered within tiers, but the big gaps are in between tiers.

• A lot of people are expressing displeasure at the lower quality of candidate introduction threads.

• If this isnt a direct cause of the last term ( Not many people having answers for "where can I go from here?" when looking at the previous term ), I will eat a sock or something

• This had to come a lot earlier than anticipated, as we have way more people running

• ! Again, expect this list to change even more drastically when questions get answered !

• Also expect the actual second list to be around then unless something crazy happens or 7 more people throw their hat in

aw fuck i dropped a tier, why

You're not an AdminTrainer, you can't sit with us

Not quite sure how you too this last term though, it was really really fucking good, so eh.

kinnebian wrote: ↑Wed Aug 16, 2023 4:01 pm

TheLoLSwat wrote: ↑Wed Aug 16, 2023 3:47 pm

► Show Spoiler

THE SECOND FIRST (1.2) TIER LIST IS FINISHED!




Notes

• It appears we have a few frontrunners now! Lets see how long they can stay at the top.

• Ordered within tiers, but the big gaps are in between tiers.

• A lot of people are expressing displeasure at the lower quality of candidate introduction threads.

• If this isnt a direct cause of the last term ( Not many people having answers for "where can I go from here?" when looking at the LUKASBEEDELL+friends term ), I will eat a sock or something

• This had to come a lot earlier than anticipated, as we have way more people running

• ! Again, expect this list to change even more drastically when questions get answered !

• Also expect the actual second list to be around then unless something crazy happens or a million more people throw their hat in

aw fuck i dropped a tier, why

Its ok Kinnebian its not because my second first opinion was lower, we just have a lot more candidates and until we get more to go off of, we can only go on introduction threads and "buffs" (being an admin buff, early bird buff, admintrainer buff, being goofball buff, kieth4 buff yadda yadda). A big gauge will be 180 day activity when someone inevitably requests it from all of you, because everyone can talk about being connected to the pulse of the server or being in touch with both LRP and MRP and hosting concerts or whatever headmins do with the playerbase but the scrubby doesnt lie. First and foremost players are inclined to vote for who they recognize, and running cool events / being a standout admin consistently over multiple (ideally but not very possible unless you want to risk burnout or something) servers is how you can become that inclined vote and get that goofball buff or kieth4 buff.

There will for sure be a lot of shaking within the top 7 or so (again, barring any major changes to the list of candidates) of this tier list before we get real ideas on who can take it home

TheLoLSwat wrote: ↑Wed Aug 16, 2023 4:22 pm

kinnebian wrote: ↑Wed Aug 16, 2023 4:01 pm

TheLoLSwat wrote: ↑Wed Aug 16, 2023 3:47 pm

► Show Spoiler

THE SECOND FIRST (1.2) TIER LIST IS FINISHED!




Notes

• It appears we have a few frontrunners now! Lets see how long they can stay at the top.

• Ordered within tiers, but the big gaps are in between tiers.

• A lot of people are expressing displeasure at the lower quality of candidate introduction threads.

• If this isnt a direct cause of the last term ( Not many people having answers for "where can I go from here?" when looking at the LUKASBEEDELL+friends term ), I will eat a sock or something

• This had to come a lot earlier than anticipated, as we have way more people running

• ! Again, expect this list to change even more drastically when questions get answered !

• Also expect the actual second list to be around then unless something crazy happens or a million more people throw their hat in

aw fuck i dropped a tier, why

Its ok Kinnebian its not because my second first opinion was lower, we just have a lot more candidates and until we get more to go off of, we can only go on introduction threads and "buffs" (being an admin buff, early bird buff, admintrainer buff, being goofball buff, kieth4 buff yadda yadda). A big gauge will be 180 day activity when someone inevitably requests it from all of you, because everyone can talk about being connected to the pulse of the server or being in touch with both LRP and MRP and hosting concerts or whatever headmins do with the playerbase but the scrubby doesnt lie. First and foremost players are inclined to vote for who they recognize, and running cool events / being a standout admin consistently over multiple (ideally but not very possible unless you want to risk burnout or something) servers is how you can become that inclined vote and get that goofball buff or kieth4 buff.

There will for sure be a lot of shaking within the top 7 or so (again, barring any major changes to the list of candidates) of this tier list before we get real ideas on who can take it home

i probably should update my page with the scrubby stuff anyways

Timberpoes wrote: ↑Wed Aug 16, 2023 11:39 am snip

i went for my plan-B platform instead of my plan-A platform this time round. i’ve been absent for the better part of 6 months, and last election cycle really showed that my plan-A platform is going to be needing work before it even hits the stage. of which zero work has been done in regards to. whoops.

i still genuinely believe that mrp/lrp separation, according to my sources, is “Gay”- there is a big fat sticky note on my monitor that says GAY = BIG BAD. i dont like that we have 2 separate rulesets, one of which can’t even make up their mind on what they want to be. the ironic thing is when Sir Stupid LRPer goes “MRP admins can’t jump on LRP servers and lay down the law”… he’s absolutely correct. same deal with LRP admins jumping on MRP servers. not really sure how people don’t see that as a horrible issue. admins are fundamental to holding this server like glue. if they can’t glue the gap between MRP and LRP then that’s BAD.

anyhow, my plan-B platform is something i genuinely believe in- and it’s also funny. i’m also curious to see what the current community stance on felinids is, so my platform honestly works as a really good gauge.

Wow. The fact that the new election's already here hit me like the tram. I did not see it coming.

Misdoubtful wrote: ↑Fri Aug 11, 2023 12:18 pm Its why I think the elections fucking suck, because there is zero point in championing a platform you can not guarantee

Anyone who votes ignoring this reality is deluding himself. Everyone knows when electing representatives in a collegial body that the person might end up not being able to materialise her goals without the support of the rest. That's not a reason to not have goals or to not campaign on them to attract the support of those with the same agenda.

kieth4 wrote: ↑Wed Aug 09, 2023 9:50 pm holy fuck get me out of here

Timberpoes wrote: ↑Wed Aug 09, 2023 10:13 pm Good luck. It's like Defense Against the Dark Arts these days. I'm not running this time around.

I have a question for you, gentlemen: how big of a time commitment was being headmin? Did it take a heavy toll on other aspects of your life?

it kinda doesnt feel like theres very many high energy/high effort threads this time around

ekaterina wrote: ↑Wed Aug 16, 2023 4:54 pm Wow. The fact that the new election's already here hit me like the tram. I did not see it coming.

Misdoubtful wrote: ↑Fri Aug 11, 2023 12:18 pm Its why I think the elections fucking suck, because there is zero point in championing a platform you can not guarantee

Anyone who votes ignoring this reality is deluding himself. Everyone knows when electing representatives in a collegial body that the person might end up not being able to materialise her goals without the support of the rest. That's not a reason to not have goals or to not campaign on them to attract the support of those with the same agenda.

kieth4 wrote: ↑Wed Aug 09, 2023 9:50 pm holy fuck get me out of here

Timberpoes wrote: ↑Wed Aug 09, 2023 10:13 pm Good luck. It's like Defense Against the Dark Arts these days. I'm not running this time around.

I have a question for you, gentlemen: how big of a time commitment was being headmin? Did it take a heavy toll on other aspects of your life?

You'd be surprised, it happens. I wouldn't even have to consider it as an idea otherwise.

I'm also going to answer your question.

For me, not too much, but life also got busier than expected and we all have had a lot going on life wise this term. We were/have been behind on some things all of us would be straight up about it if someone was to ask, but a lot of the actual time sensitive things that NEED to happen aren't as plentiful as one might think. There is plenty of time to be AFK, being in the game, working on some project, or whatever else, and we all had the things we worked on. The better the team is functioning the less there is to do.

That being said everyone this term put their life first, and life does always come first.

updated to include skubby

ekaterina wrote: ↑Wed Aug 16, 2023 4:54 pm Wow. The fact that the new election's already here hit me like the tram. I did not see it coming.

Misdoubtful wrote: ↑Fri Aug 11, 2023 12:18 pm Its why I think the elections fucking suck, because there is zero point in championing a platform you can not guarantee

Anyone who votes ignoring this reality is deluding himself. Everyone knows when electing representatives in a collegial body that the person might end up not being able to materialise her goals without the support of the rest. That's not a reason to not have goals or to not campaign on them to attract the support of those with the same agenda.

kieth4 wrote: ↑Wed Aug 09, 2023 9:50 pm holy fuck get me out of here

Timberpoes wrote: ↑Wed Aug 09, 2023 10:13 pm Good luck. It's like Defense Against the Dark Arts these days. I'm not running this time around.

I have a question for you, gentlemen: how big of a time commitment was being headmin? Did it take a heavy toll on other aspects of your life?

It only burrowed into my gaming time. My irl time was kept separate

This update is wild, some of these weapons will need significant buffs before I personally would use them.

ekaterina wrote: ↑Wed Aug 16, 2023 4:54 pm I have a question for you, gentlemen: how big of a time commitment was being headmin? Did it take a heavy toll on other aspects of your life?

It's less the time commitments in a bubble and more how the time commitments present themselves.

You have a 6 month term. For the entire term:

You have a mix of stuff that's on your time schedule; what you want to do.
You have a mix of stuff that's on your team's schedule; what your term wants to do collectively.
You have a mix of stuff that's on other people's schedules; what other people want you to do.
You have a mix of stuff that requires immediate attention; what you have to do right now.
And you have a mix of stuff that needs doing and has no immediate timescale, but if you delay it too much the opportunity passes; random events during your headmin term.

Many times I'd lose entire evenings investigating and responding to ban appeals and figuring out policy. Last week I was up until 4am mentoring a trial admin through a ticket. I've lost entire weekends to internal affairs investigations. On any usual day I'll get between 5-10 pings on Discord split between the headmin role and the "you're an online headmin, help me" individual pings. You also get all sorts of DMs of people with problems too.

Some weeks you'll basically do nothing, and some weeks you'll lost a sizable portion of your free time to headmin work. For 6 months.

This term was particularly draining for me because I did a lot of drafting of our responses as everyone else was busy, so I lost a lot of free time to it.

Timberpoes wrote: ↑Wed Aug 16, 2023 5:56 pm This term was particularly draining for me because I did a lot of drafting of our responses as everyone else was busy, so I lost a lot of free time to it.

TheLoLSwat wrote: ↑Wed Aug 16, 2023 3:36 am

• The current top 5 (Kinnebian, Cheshify, General Thrax, WineAllWine, Fikou) are running to be status-quo (mostly) headmins, atleast from what we can see

late response but the reason for this is im generally very happy with the current headmin term

Misdoubtful wrote: ↑Wed Aug 16, 2023 5:09 pm

ekaterina wrote: ↑Wed Aug 16, 2023 4:54 pm I have a question for you, gentlemen: how big of a time commitment was being headmin? Did it take a heavy toll on other aspects of your life?

For me, not too much (...) There is plenty of time to be AFK, being in the game, working on some project, or whatever else, and we all had the things we worked on.

kieth4 wrote: ↑Wed Aug 16, 2023 5:20 pm It only burrowed into my gaming time. My irl time was kept separate

Timberpoes wrote: ↑Wed Aug 16, 2023 5:56 pm Some weeks you'll basically do nothing, and some weeks you'll lost a sizable portion of your free time to headmin work. For 6 months.
This term was particularly draining for me because I did a lot of drafting of our responses as everyone else was busy, so I lost a lot of free time to it.

Thank you all for your replies, Timber in particular for his reality check - the first two answers had me thinking being headmin was easy. I find this discrepancy in the answers quite curious.

The discrepancy is 'cause Timber had to do all the writing apparently lol

the essayposter's guild sends its regards.

Timber likes to do big essay posts around certain topics- I wouldn't mind writing things but I think that people appreciate timber's longform more than my posts.

dendydoom wrote: ↑Wed Aug 16, 2023 6:54 pm the essayposter's guild sends its regards.

*bang*

Kieth and I are both short posters if people haven't figured that out by now.

The platforms are so bad. they're all so bad. there's like 2 people i would be willing to vote for.

Somepan wrote: ↑Wed Aug 16, 2023 7:18 pm The platforms are so bad. they're all so bad. there's like 2 people i would be willing to vote for.

Somepan wrote: ↑Wed Aug 16, 2023 7:18 pm The platforms are so bad. they're all so bad. there's like 2 people i would be willing to vote for.

whomst

Misdoubtful wrote: ↑Wed Aug 16, 2023 6:59 pm Kieth and I are both short posters if people haven't figured that out by now.

me post short

scriptis comin' outta the gate swinging with a completely unhinged insane person type campaign "speech" (is it really a speech if its typed?)

other than fikou i think scriptis is about the only person running this year who has any weight

"more events" is such a broad goal that i'm not exactly sure there would be anyone actually against it, so listing it as a goal just seems like a slot-filler,

now what i'd LOVE is one of these candidates to encourage admins to run even more grandoise and fucking wild events, looking at YOU MRPmins, theres no shortage of events but there is a shortage of ones that make everyone enthralled (in my opinion(my opinion sucks)) i wanna see the crazy shit rolled out more instead of VV editing and pixel shifting people with a color overlay and calling it a day, i wanna see EXPLOSIONS and CAR CRASHES and LEGAL BATTLES against KITTENS WHO HAVE GUNS THAT CAUSED THE CAR CRASHES AND EXPLOSIONS WHO ARE NOW BEING SUED FOR INCOMPETENCE.

WineAllWine wrote: ↑Wed Aug 16, 2023 7:47 pm

Somepan wrote: ↑Wed Aug 16, 2023 7:18 pm The platforms are so bad. they're all so bad. there's like 2 people i would be willing to vote for.

whomst

3 actually. Fikou, chesh, kinneb.

If your headmin campaign is making one config change just make a policy thread instead. Also there are 5 good options, slight, Fikou, chesh, kinneb, iain. Most of it is just bait, and the MRP headmin stuff is a terrible idea serving only to further divide the community and will eventually just lead to a fork.

TheRex9001 wrote: ↑Wed Aug 16, 2023 7:57 pm If your headmin campaign is making one config change just make a policy thread instead. Also there are 5 good options, slight, Fikou, chesh, kinneb, iain. Most of it is just bait, and the MRP headmin stuff is a terrible idea serving only to further divide the community and will eventually just lead to a fork.

Is that a bad thing? That’s clearly the direction Manuel is heading regardless. The reunification project failed, and the MRP and the LRP player bases are almost so different they are all but practically independent already.

Why not let Manuel do it’s own thing?

TheRex9001 wrote: ↑Wed Aug 16, 2023 7:57 pm the MRP headmin stuff is a terrible idea serving only to further divide the community and will eventually just lead to a fork.

Explain to me why this is a bad thing. MSO has always been interested in an alt-codebase server anyways.

The Wrench wrote: ↑Wed Aug 16, 2023 8:48 pm

TheRex9001 wrote: ↑Wed Aug 16, 2023 7:57 pm If your headmin campaign is making one config change just make a policy thread instead. Also there are 5 good options, slight, Fikou, chesh, kinneb, iain. Most of it is just bait, and the MRP headmin stuff is a terrible idea serving only to further divide the community and will eventually just lead to a fork.

Is that a bad thing? That’s clearly the direction Manuel is heading regardless. The reunification project failed, and the MRP and the LRP player bases are almost so different they are all but practically independent already.

Why not let Manuel do it’s own thing?

I completely disagree. I admin and play on both LRP and MRP, I think the divide between the two is massively exaggerated. What code differences would manuel even have? A fork would just lead to one codebase dying and another being severely weakened. We just dont have the amount of coders and maintainers for it.

MRP and LRP players are, as much as each side would hate to admit it, not that different in the end.