/tg/Station 13

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https://tgstation13.org/phpBB/viewtopic ... 42#p591042

I don’t like jackrip, he’s ruined many an antag round of mine but...for fucks sake man this jannie is such a fucking loser

dude holy shit all these coders wanting to remove murderboning and wizard lmao

jackrip wrote:dude holy shit all these coders wanting to remove murderboning and wizard lmao

how do either benefit the server

jackrip wrote:

TWATICUS wrote:bro stop we dont need another 'remove wiz' discussion dont mention wizard please

Twaticus is well known for murderboning, valid hunting, and power gaming. I especially see them during my timeslot where I am often one of only two or three admins, the EST mornings. During this time, regardless of whether or not I'm playing or adminning, I will see Twaticus at the core of the conflict. If they're an antag, then a lot of people are dying/dead. If not, then they are usually one of the biggest threats to the antagonists. It was to absolutely no one's surprise when Twaticus killed virtually everyone during the round in question following the tradition of another killing spree, while only talking to complain about something or to vent their minor irritation in deadchat between revivals as a changeling. This was at both the station and the evac shuttle.

i would NEVER

Malkraz wrote:

TheFinalPotato wrote: Murderboners don't succeed because none is good enough to oppose them

No that's exactly why they succeed. You don't need comparable gear to take them on when you have such a massive difference in numbers and a single smart player can do it with tools you can find out in the open around the station. A fire extinguisher, soap, banana cream pie, flash, sunglasses and a bowman headset make anyone with combat knowledge extremely effective at, at the very least, keeping themselves alive while they inform the rest of the crew about the traitor (which they all promptly ignore because it's happening outside a 5-tile radius of them.) Keep potential problem items like the hand tele, AA cards and RD gear safe and secure and as long as you pay attention (ss13 players will never do this) then you'll always be prepared.

You have made my point for me

Malkraz wrote:jackrip stop trying to justify playing like a cocksucker lmao it's like trying to explain the morality of piracy, just do it if u want to but ur not "helping" anybody.
the rest of u eternally seethe about how you somehow can't beat 1 person when there's fucking 27 of you and an AI. SS13 players have some of the worst gamesense i've ever seen in any game and will often just hold W down 1 tile wide maint hallways after someone with slips and a gun then get confused when they get blasted. If all you Ghost mains do is shit ur pants in the forum u will never be able to prevent people from dumpstering you. Combat in this game is not difficult and a single well used fire extinguisher can completely cuck murderboning, not to mention all the rest of the infinitely more effective tools.

imagine if a single person had tried to dragnet or bola me
or if they had thrown a spear at me

like i said earlier bagil is just in a really bad state, no one knows how combat works and no one knows how to counter anything

their ancestors learned through trial by fire, i did as well. you think lexia black sat me down and taught me how to fight? i was killed hundreds of times. i know no one believes me, but i genuinely believe the only true way to get better is to just practice, thats how i did it. and the only way to practice surviving murder is for someone to try and murder you. that doesn't mean clicking the fastest or being the most accurate its about knowing the tools, counters, and environmental hazards at your disposal.

i know y'all want to hugbox it out and bar rp your way to safety but i promise a knowledgeable crew who understands counters and combat makes for a FAR more entertaining game. that's why everyone talks about 2018 as the bagil golden years

"woke" npcs deciding which piece of anti fun anti soul propaganda they want spoonfed to them today by the hugbox confederation

NoxVS wrote:

jackrip wrote:dude holy shit all these coders wanting to remove murderboning and wizard lmao

how do either benefit the server

they are fun

this is a game

jackrip wrote:like i said earlier bagil is just in a really bad state, no one knows how combat works and no one knows how to counter anything

their ancestors learned through trial by fire, i did as well. you think lexia black sat me down and taught me how to fight? i was killed hundreds of times. i know no one believes me, but i genuinely believe the only true way to get better is to just practice, thats how i did it. and the only way to practice surviving murder is for someone to try and murder you. that doesn't mean clicking the fastest or being the most accurate its about knowing the tools, counters, and environmental hazards at your disposal.

"people made the game shitty for me so i make it shitty for others"
pack it up folks, thread over, nothing of value left here
not that there ever was

Cobby wrote:

Capsandi wrote:

Armhulen wrote:I'd rather players maintain a healthy relationship with the game and quit/take breaks when needed instead of trying to force themselves to squeeze a little more dopamine out of the game with unhealthy tactics

This point would be valid if traitors & lings were given a challenge outside of murdering as many crewmen as they can. You dont need to be burnt out to find that greentexting is piss easy. Then its back to "how many people can I kill with a toolbox?"

You're the one opting into these roles, opting into choosing to take the challenge of killing people until you die, yet not opting into taking other challenges because you only see the objective as something you pass/fail (and consequently choosing the most optimal route) when how you complete these tasks could be interesting as well.

In the murderboners defense though its more "logical" i imagine to have fun at the expense of others rather than challenging/debilitating yourself which may result in you yourself sitting out (even funnier is if you were a murderboner, regulars definitely would not let you leave alive which means you're further discouraged to debilitate/challenge yourself).

there is no greater challenge than the extermination of all life

if jackrip was a bad faith actor posting this shit with the intent of rallying as many people as possible against murderboning i'd say he's done a fantastic job with all this shit he's said.

I love how you can tell which people got killed by a murderboner in this thread : ) losers

jackrip wrote:

Malkraz wrote:jackrip stop trying to justify playing like a cocksucker lmao it's like trying to explain the morality of piracy, just do it if u want to but ur not "helping" anybody.
the rest of u eternally seethe about how you somehow can't beat 1 person when there's fucking 27 of you and an AI. SS13 players have some of the worst gamesense i've ever seen in any game and will often just hold W down 1 tile wide maint hallways after someone with slips and a gun then get confused when they get blasted. If all you Ghost mains do is shit ur pants in the forum u will never be able to prevent people from dumpstering you. Combat in this game is not difficult and a single well used fire extinguisher can completely cuck murderboning, not to mention all the rest of the infinitely more effective tools.

imagine if a single person had tried to dragnet or bola me
or if they had thrown a spear at me

like i said earlier bagil is just in a really bad state, no one knows how combat works and no one knows how to counter anything

their ancestors learned through trial by fire, i did as well. you think lexia black sat me down and taught me how to fight? i was killed hundreds of times. i know no one believes me, but i genuinely believe the only true way to get better is to just practice, thats how i did it. and the only way to practice surviving murder is for someone to try and murder you. that doesn't mean clicking the fastest or being the most accurate its about knowing the tools, counters, and environmental hazards at your disposal.

You seem to be under the fallacy that reinforcing that Bagil is a TDM shithole where you must carry bolas and spears on you at all times, while looking for the next valid to hunt down is a positive change to the server. I don't. The data suggests other people don't. If you want a game that is actually designed around TDM, I suggest TGMC.

that doesn't mean clicking the fastest or being the most accurate its about knowing the tools, counters, and environmental hazards at your disposal.

This is ironic coming from the winner of the toolbox tournament.

NoxVS wrote:

jackrip wrote:like i said earlier bagil is just in a really bad state, no one knows how combat works and no one knows how to counter anything

their ancestors learned through trial by fire, i did as well. you think lexia black sat me down and taught me how to fight? i was killed hundreds of times. i know no one believes me, but i genuinely believe the only true way to get better is to just practice, thats how i did it. and the only way to practice surviving murder is for someone to try and murder you. that doesn't mean clicking the fastest or being the most accurate its about knowing the tools, counters, and environmental hazards at your disposal.

"people made the game shitty for me so i make it shitty for others"
pack it up folks, thread over, nothing of value left here
not that there ever was

nah, i loved every moment. I look on the days of getting absolutely shit on by lexia / prosper / every other robust staticnamer at the time as my best ss13 years by far

its because of how much better the average round was. it was EXCITING. everyone was skilled and talented and you never knew what someone would do. people came up with new and exciting gimmicks because the limits of ss13 mechanics were being thoroughly explored. having the crew be robust only led to more interesting and dynamic situations / rounds

NoxVS wrote:

jackrip wrote:dude holy shit all these coders wanting to remove murderboning and wizard lmao

how do either benefit the server

Woah nox cool it with the unallowed thinking

NoxVS wrote:

jackrip wrote:dude holy shit all these coders wanting to remove murderboning and wizard lmao

how do either benefit the server

how does the chance at getting to play a rare, super powerful role that is unlike any other gaming experience around benefit the server?

uhh well it gets people to play the game?

[youtube]lPGipwoJiOM[/youtube]

You've reached a Le Fishe checkpoint, anon. Congrats on making it this far into the thread. Pull up a seat, and take a break before you continue on your journey.

MrAlphonzo wrote:[youtube]lPGipwoJiOM[/youtube]

You've reached a Le Fishe checkpoint, anon. Congrats on making it this far into the thread. Pull up a seat, and take a break before you continue on your journey.

disgusting

jackrip wrote:

NoxVS wrote:

jackrip wrote:dude holy shit all these coders wanting to remove murderboning and wizard lmao

how do either benefit the server

how does the chance at getting to play a rare, super powerful role that is unlike any other gaming experience around benefit the server?

uhh well it gets people to play the game?

how does giving a single person, who is equally likely to die an extremely disappointing death or keep everyone else from playing by killing them, having all the power in a round benefit the server

NoxVS wrote:

jackrip wrote:

NoxVS wrote:

jackrip wrote:dude holy shit all these coders wanting to remove murderboning and wizard lmao

how do either benefit the server

how does the chance at getting to play a rare, super powerful role that is unlike any other gaming experience around benefit the server?

uhh well it gets people to play the game?

how does giving a single person, who is equally likely to die an extremely disappointing death or keep everyone else from playing by killing them, having all the power in a round benefit the server

How does having jannies like you, who have more brain tumor than brain benefit the server

thehogshotgun wrote:How does having jannies like you, who have more brain tumor than brain benefit the server

i probably dont

NoxVS wrote:

jackrip wrote:dude holy shit all these coders wanting to remove murderboning and wizard lmao

how do either benefit the server

they're fun to fight & play
now get good and stop boohooing

I don't know, but at least you have the self-evaluation skills needed to realize you are not a benefit to the server either.

MrAlphonzo wrote:[youtube]lPGipwoJiOM[/youtube]

You've reached a Le Fishe checkpoint, anon. Congrats on making it this far into the thread. Pull up a seat, and take a break before you continue on your journey.

CHINA NUMBA ONE

TheFinalPotato wrote: You have made my point for me

Leave it to a c*der to think having to secure important items in a game where you know there's people who want to kill you is a bad thing
Make the game eternally green shift or go cope

Malkraz wrote:

TheFinalPotato wrote: You have made my point for me

Leave it to a c*der to think having to secure important items in a game where you know there's people who want to kill you is a bad thing
Make the game eternally green shift or go cope

you shouldn't have to go on a scavenger hunt for gamer gear every round just to keep someone from also going on a scavenger hunt for gamer gear and keeping everyone from playing the game

jackrip wrote: i know y'all want to hugbox it out and bar rp your way to safety but i promise a knowledgeable crew who understands counters and combat makes for a FAR more entertaining game. that's why everyone talks about 2018 as the bagil golden years

i dont know why ur replying to me with this when i told everyone else to keep seething about being killed in that same post

NoxVS wrote:

Malkraz wrote:

TheFinalPotato wrote: You have made my point for me

Leave it to a c*der to think having to secure important items in a game where you know there's people who want to kill you is a bad thing
Make the game eternally green shift or go cope

you shouldn't have to go on a scavenger hunt for gamer gear every round just to keep someone from also going on a scavenger hunt for gamer gear and keeping everyone from playing the game

Keep dying while waxing philosophic about how everyone should play like its greenshift every round then lol. There's a fire extinguisher within arm's reach of pretty much everywhere on the station if doing as much as grabbing that is too much self-preservation for your taste then you're a lost cause.

Jaredfogle wrote:I don't know, but at least you have the self-evaluation skills needed to realize you are not a benefit to the server either.

Complaining that a player is taking a break from the game instead of burning out and murder boning or just being a general cock.

What's your argument here? That you can't post on the forums unless you play daily?

How quickly does Orange remove coder little green names for not contributing their monthly code?

thehogshotgun wrote:

*voice drops 8 octaves, chest visibly swells* lol ur a little bitch haahaha suck a candy cane idiot

chocolate_bickie wrote:-snip-

Complaining that a player is taking a break from the game instead of burning out and murder boning or just being a general cock.

Yes, it is. So is talking direct shit to another person trying to better the game, who was speaking about the game generally. Can't take the heat stay out of the kitchen.

chocolate_bikie wrote: How quickly does Orange remove coder little green names for not contributing their monthly code?

I'll be fine.

NoxVS wrote:

Malkraz wrote:

TheFinalPotato wrote: You have made my point for me

Leave it to a c*der to think having to secure important items in a game where you know there's people who want to kill you is a bad thing
Make the game eternally green shift or go cope

you shouldn't have to go on a scavenger hunt for gamer gear every round just to keep someone from also going on a scavenger hunt for gamer gear and keeping everyone from playing the game

im out here killing people with a toolbox they can make a bola from wire cuffs and 5 metal

NoxVS wrote:

Malkraz wrote:

TheFinalPotato wrote: You have made my point for me

Leave it to a c*der to think having to secure important items in a game where you know there's people who want to kill you is a bad thing
Make the game eternally green shift or go cope

you shouldn't have to go on a scavenger hunt for gamer gear every round just to keep someone from also going on a scavenger hunt for gamer gear and keeping everyone from playing the game

make a bola
learn to throw
run away

i can seriously survive any fucking round with like 5 bolas or a dragnet

if you cant learn how to properly defend yourself learn how to at least run the fuck away

this game aint hard

like the guy above me said go eternal greenshift or go home

christ there are so many butthurt people in this thread

the flavor text literally says dieing is part of the game
cope
seethe
cry

go breath into your paper bags god damn

The only time I feel like murderboning I do it with a Toolbox filled with TC crystals and a bar of soap and how effective it is against the average playerbase just leaves me disgusted

How did I get here

Malkraz wrote:

NoxVS wrote:

Malkraz wrote:

TheFinalPotato wrote: You have made my point for me

Leave it to a c*der to think having to secure important items in a game where you know there's people who want to kill you is a bad thing
Make the game eternally green shift or go cope

you shouldn't have to go on a scavenger hunt for gamer gear every round just to keep someone from also going on a scavenger hunt for gamer gear and keeping everyone from playing the game

Keep dying while waxing philosophic about how everyone should play like its greenshift every round then lol. There's a fire extinguisher within arm's reach of pretty much everywhere on the station if doing as much as grabbing that is too much self-preservation for your taste then you're a lost cause.

how is an extinguisher supposed to help, you unrobust carebear
yes, i know fire extinguishers slip people
everyone knows that
its why everyone going on murder sprees either takes precautions against it or watches for it
there is nothing a fire extinguisher can do against a guy with no slips and a gun

and thats entirely fine. you are going to lose, you are going to die
the unpredictable nature of rounds is what makes it fun
its fun as fuck to kill people
its fun to face off against someone attempting to murder you
the point where the fun ends is when its killing for the sake of keeping as many people as possible from playing the game
deciding the only way you can have fun is at the expense of others

chocolate_bickie wrote:How quickly does Orange remove coder little green names for not contributing their monthly code?

they review code not make it biscuit

NoxVS wrote: how is an extinguisher supposed to help, you unrobust carebear

lmfao

Malkraz wrote:

TheFinalPotato wrote: You have made my point for me

Leave it to a c*der to think having to secure important items in a game where you know there's people who want to kill you is a bad thing
Make the game eternally green shift or go cope

I don't think every player should need to have a backpack of tools to prevent them from getting ganked 30 minutes into the round. Doesn't mean that dying or killing people is bad for the game, I just don't think the base expectation should be powergaming every way someone could try and kill you

Honestly I don't like the execution of murderboning but at present I don't think there is an acceptable way to get rid of it and uphold the "threat of death at any time" aspect of ss13. Without antags having free reign to end you rightly at any point, I'm playing a game where I nearly always have to personally engage in combat for combat to happen to me. Mass destruction via sabotage also count as murderbone in 99% of peoples' books (which I disagree with), which I find also to be an unacceptable loss.
Maybe its because I expect unfair circumstances and don't have any lasting cares if I get blown the fuck out by some omega cheesy murderbone shit/""""""imbalanced"""""" equipment, that I'm completely fine with murderboners wiping me off the face of the station with no chance of ever being revived as an aspect of the game. I'd much rather have those occasional salty rounds than the game itself becoming largely stagnant because I know unless I'm holding an objective or standing in the way of one, I'm largely immune to death. If more people held to the creed of "losing is part of the game" then murderboning wouldn't have the pop dip it always spurs on, but I understand that this isn't really a point that can go anywhere, asking everyone to sit around in dchat and wait for the round that could go on for 3 more hours to stick around isn't exactly a realistic request, and is thus really the only point of murderboning I find to be a truly bitter negative that has no solid solution (thus far).
I'm just gonna throw this in here at the end, but I guarantee you people would feel less helpless against murderbone if the current balance flow wasn't playing wack-a-mole to nerf anything that is particularly useful. An oppressive murderer will always have the current flavor of the month really useful thing to kick your ass in combat. The only difference here is if you actually have useful equipment to defend yourself with... which you likely don't, because a nerfbat balance cycle is one that is attempting to chase perfection, and always results in 1 thing being stronger than anything else with no competition. At least with nuke-tag style balancing, you can counter bullshit with bullshit.

(nearly) antags turned off btw, I don't murderbone let alone play any antags period, if you think I'm arguing with the intent of holding onto my precious murderbone.

Malkraz wrote:

NoxVS wrote: how is an extinguisher supposed to help, you unrobust carebear

lmfao

there was more to the post friend

a bar of soap and shades is powergaming now lol

Jaredfogle wrote: there was more to the post friend

i get what he's saying in the rest the first line is just extremely funny

Kel wrote:Without antags having free reign to end you rightly at any point, I'm playing a game where I nearly always have to personally engage in combat for combat to happen to me.

I believe you're using the Manuel definition of murderbone, which is broad enough to where this may be the case. The way we're (at least I'm) using murderbone in this thread is to refer to systematic, department slaughter. This is what negatively impacts the servers, not just people killing fur nu raisin. When you deny a vast majority of the playerbase the chance to play the game.

Kel wrote: Mass destruction via sabotage also count as murderbone in 99% of peoples' books (which I disagree with), which I find also to be an unacceptable loss.

Not mine, though I think if you're maxcapping the station every single round you're antag, it'd be hard to argue you're not boring.

The rest of your post is more or less the same--I think you're not applying the definition of murderbone that we're implying. I don't blame you, the term murderbone has been soured so much over the years that it essentially loses its meaning until we have specific cases to point to.

Malkraz wrote:

Jaredfogle wrote: there was more to the post friend

i get what he's saying in the rest the first line is just extremely funny

fair enough it made me laugh too in isolation

can we get back to how murderbone is actually good for the playerbase, i have a few points i want to bring up

How does it feel to be famous? You will be forgotten like the rest of the murderbonerers but for now it is your time.

jackrip wrote:can we get back to how murderbone is actually good for the playerbase, i have a few points i want to bring up

whenever you feel like it, you never gave a response when i asked

okay this is specifically directed to oranges no one else look at it please

murderbone inspires certain players
1. i admired lexia black coming up and their sprees inspired me to become a better gamer
2. others have told me the same thing about their experiences

it may not help everyone get better, a lot of people might completely hate it, but there will absolutely be people inspired by the talent and want to become better themselves.

if you combo that with actual training (teaching people in boxing ring, holodeck, etc) you can teach a significant part of the community how to fight. and you might even make some turbo gamers out of it

jackrip wrote:can we get back to how murderbone is actually good for the playerbase, i have a few points i want to bring up

cacogen wrote:How does it feel to be famous? You will be forgotten like the rest of the murderbonerers but for now it is your time.

who dis

jackrip wrote:can we get back to how murderbone is actually good for the playerbase, i have a few points i want to bring up

I'd like to see a pros and cons