/tg/Station 13

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wowza!

looks like it's time again!

will you be running? who will win? will goof secure his 2021 victory and finally control our democracy as a paradise for the proletariat? will coconut continue into his unprecedented fourth term?

all this and more in today's headmin election 14 discussion megathread and peanut emporium!

with excitement,
bobbah 'bee' brown

in the valley of head admins we sleep

I don’t like the idea of a new player server, I’d much rather see them directly integrate onto our core ones.

A new player server seems ludicrous. How do you expect new players to integrate into server culture when you're segregating them from the regular server population?

On top of that, I can say, with complete certainty, that I would not have stuck around if it weren't for the help I received from experienced players in-game. New players should be playing with experienced players as much as possible.

Man, tryna choose between the top 4 is real hard and I guess ill just wing it

Against the separated new player server too. Sharing the same opinion of posts above: segregation of the playerbase is ridiculous, learn on the move. The hard way is the only way in ss13, embrace it from the beginning.

Elo tiered servers when?

Rohesie wrote:Elo tiered servers when?

We already have Terry for that.

Imagine a server with zero new players, any problem with a new player server isn't what you're doing to the new server but rather what you're taking from the old ones

which would be nigh unplayable with all the burnout shittery

gosh voting is really a toughie

wesoda25 wrote:gosh voting is really a toughie

honestly from the voice call a lot of headmins have the right direction for /tg/ in the ways that matter to the point where i wasn't too worried while voting

wesoda25 wrote:gosh voting is really a toughie

word.

OH MY GOD, THE RESULTS ARE IN, THE PEOPLE DEMAND ANOTHER ARM TERM

AND SO I DELIVER! THQANK YOU TO EVERYONE WHO HELPED ME GET FIRST PLACE. A BETTER TG!!!

[youtube]E0JEqWT62Nw[/youtube]

Flatulent wrote:“we don’t want to ban slurs” they said when rule 11 was just introduced

oops right again

Armhulen wrote:Imagine a server with zero new players

yeah it's called bagil lmao

I’ve honestly come around to rule 11. It’s a flexible rule which can adjust alongside the community. Bigotry is a sensitive subject and people’s views on it are always changing. You can’t really define what constitutes bigotry at any one time, it’s more of a “feel” type deal; just like rule 8, which also is loosely defined. Even if we could nail down a good definition, it would be static and would either eventually require revision, or keep our community frozen with a particular viewpoint for these things, which I don’t think is healthy.

The caveat to this is that it requires deliberate guidance from the headmins/host, which while hasn’t been nonexistent, I do feel has been lacking. Timber mentioned this somewhere, so that was actually another major + for him, at least for me.

As for slurs: I personally wouldn’t be bothered if we banned them. I think theres an argument that a culture of toxicity and bigotry can exist without blatant examples of any of those these on any one persons part, which is really sort of the only thing we don’t allow ATM. I’m not sure I was of this mindset when rule 11 was created though, so really I think it’s just another example of how a community changes (thus reinforcing why rule 11 being flexible is good). Because of this I can’t help but feel that it’s a little short-minded to just smugly say “we knew slurs would get banned” or whatever because it doesn’t acknowledge the growth along the way which led people to seriously consider the idea. If something is a good change, but you fear that by doing it you may be enabling bad changes down the line, you need to consider that your entire definition of “good and bad” may change along the way.

wesoda25 wrote:I’ve honestly come around to rule 11. It’s a flexible rule which can adjust alongside the community. Bigotry is a sensitive subject and people’s views on it are always changing. You can’t really define what constitutes bigotry at any one time, it’s more of a “feel” type deal; just like rule 8, which also is loosely defined. Even if we could nail down a good definition, it would be static and would either eventually require revision, or keep our community frozen with a particular viewpoint for these things, which I don’t think is healthy.

The caveat to this is that it requires deliberate guidance from the headmins/host, which while hasn’t been nonexistent, I do feel has been lacking. Timber mentioned this somewhere, so that was actually another major + for him, at least for me.

As for slurs: I personally wouldn’t be bothered if we banned them. I think theres an argument that a culture of toxicity and bigotry can exist without blatant examples of any of those these on any one persons part, which is really sort of the only thing we don’t allow ATM. I’m not sure I was of this mindset when rule 11 was created though, so really I think it’s just another example of how a community changes (thus reinforcing why rule 11 being flexible is good). Because of this I can’t help but feel that it’s a little short-minded to just smugly say “we knew slurs would get banned” or whatever because it doesn’t acknowledge the growth along the way which led people to seriously consider the idea. If something is a good change, but you fear that by doing it you may be enabling bad changes down the line, you need to consider that your entire definition of “good and bad” may change along the way.

It is interesting to think about how /tg/ went from being proudly pushed forward as the "bastion of free speech" when i started playing to where it is now where many people say your exact quote: “we knew slurs would get banned”

death by a thousand cuts

Hell yeah slurs are free speech
You cannot stop me from saying slurs because it's against the constitution that you swore allegiance to in school so many times

Malkraz wrote:

Flatulent wrote:“we don’t want to ban slurs” they said when rule 11 was just introduced

oops right again

What are you referring to? Did they actually ban slurs for real?
Yesterday on terry I got bwoinked by Iain for saying n-word in OOC but then he left to get the “””admin team opinions””” on the matter. I couldn’t wait 2-7 hours, so I went to sleep. As I’m banned from discord, im unaware of any events that transpire there. Why are you all discussing that slurs have been banned? Wtf just happened?

Flatulent wrote:

Malkraz wrote:

Flatulent wrote:“we don’t want to ban slurs” they said when rule 11 was just introduced

oops right again

What are you referring to? Did they actually ban slurs for real?
Yesterday on terry I got bwoinked by Iain for saying n-word in OOC but then he left to get the “””admin team opinions””” on the matter. I couldn’t wait 2-7 hours, so I went to sleep. As I’m banned from discord, im unaware of any events that transpire there. Why are you all discussing that slurs have been banned? Wtf just happened?

They're doing the slippery slope thing where they pretend they were right about everything by pretending everything they predicted is already happening

Except it's all in their delusional bubble world as they rock back and forth in the padded cell

The "SLUR BAN FREEDOM OF SPEECH AMERICA DESTROYER BAN" practical reality amounts to an admin occasionally bwoinking you and saying "hey can you stop calling people the n-word/writing "I hate n-words" on everything thanks"

And then the player says "Oh but I saw everyone else doing it so I thought it was ok"

And then the admin says "I know but we're trying to dial it back a bit"

And then the ahelp ends

Stickymayhem wrote:

Flatulent wrote:

Malkraz wrote:

Flatulent wrote:“we don’t want to ban slurs” they said when rule 11 was just introduced

oops right again

What are you referring to? Did they actually ban slurs for real?
Yesterday on terry I got bwoinked by Iain for saying n-word in OOC but then he left to get the “””admin team opinions””” on the matter. I couldn’t wait 2-7 hours, so I went to sleep. As I’m banned from discord, im unaware of any events that transpire there. Why are you all discussing that slurs have been banned? Wtf just happened?

They're doing the slippery slope thing where they pretend they were right about everything by pretending everything they predicted is already happening

Except it's all in their delusional bubble world as they rock back and forth in the padded cell

The "SLUR BAN FREEDOM OF SPEECH AMERICA DESTROYER BAN" practical reality amounts to an admin occasionally bwoinking you and saying "hey can you stop calling people the n-word/writing "I hate n-words" on everything thanks"

And then the player says "Oh but I saw everyone else doing it so I thought it was ok"

And then the admin says "I know but we're trying to dial it back a bit"

And then the ahelp ends

except they're actually right because i have a note now after checking in-game

Flatulent wrote:

Stickymayhem wrote:

Flatulent wrote:

Malkraz wrote:

Flatulent wrote:“we don’t want to ban slurs” they said when rule 11 was just introduced

oops right again

What are you referring to? Did they actually ban slurs for real?
Yesterday on terry I got bwoinked by Iain for saying n-word in OOC but then he left to get the “””admin team opinions””” on the matter. I couldn’t wait 2-7 hours, so I went to sleep. As I’m banned from discord, im unaware of any events that transpire there. Why are you all discussing that slurs have been banned? Wtf just happened?

They're doing the slippery slope thing where they pretend they were right about everything by pretending everything they predicted is already happening

Except it's all in their delusional bubble world as they rock back and forth in the padded cell

The "SLUR BAN FREEDOM OF SPEECH AMERICA DESTROYER BAN" practical reality amounts to an admin occasionally bwoinking you and saying "hey can you stop calling people the n-word/writing "I hate n-words" on everything thanks"

And then the player says "Oh but I saw everyone else doing it so I thought it was ok"

And then the admin says "I know but we're trying to dial it back a bit"

And then the ahelp ends

except they're actually right because i have a note now after checking in-game

I mean did you use a slur as an insult? The clear implication of doing that is pretty obviously bigotry.

If I said "You fucking n-word" or whatever, the implication is inferiority of the class of person you're calling them. Otherwise it wouldn't be an insult. This is the difference between using it casually amongst other members of that class as a term of endearment, and screaming it at people when they make you mad

wesoda25 wrote:As for slurs: I personally wouldn’t be bothered if we banned them. I think theres an argument that a culture of toxicity and bigotry can exist without blatant examples of any of those these on any one persons part, which is really sort of the only thing we don’t allow ATM. I’m not sure I was of this mindset when rule 11 was created though, so really I think it’s just another example of how a community changes (thus reinforcing why rule 11 being flexible is good). Because of this I can’t help but feel that it’s a little short-minded to just smugly say “we knew slurs would get banned” or whatever because it doesn’t acknowledge the growth along the way which led people to seriously consider the idea. If something is a good change, but you fear that by doing it you may be enabling bad changes down the line, you need to consider that your entire definition of “good and bad” may change along the way.

"Someone fucked with our Overton Window, and that's a good thing."

Rohen_Tahir wrote:

wesoda25 wrote:As for slurs: I personally wouldn’t be bothered if we banned them. I think theres an argument that a culture of toxicity and bigotry can exist without blatant examples of any of those these on any one persons part, which is really sort of the only thing we don’t allow ATM. I’m not sure I was of this mindset when rule 11 was created though, so really I think it’s just another example of how a community changes (thus reinforcing why rule 11 being flexible is good). Because of this I can’t help but feel that it’s a little short-minded to just smugly say “we knew slurs would get banned” or whatever because it doesn’t acknowledge the growth along the way which led people to seriously consider the idea. If something is a good change, but you fear that by doing it you may be enabling bad changes down the line, you need to consider that your entire definition of “good and bad” may change along the way.

"Someone fucked with our Overton Window, and that's a good thing."

"I feel left out now that the overton window has shifted away from nazism and bigotry being acceptable, this is the community's problem not mine!"

Stickymayhem wrote:

Rohen_Tahir wrote:

wesoda25 wrote:As for slurs: I personally wouldn’t be bothered if we banned them. I think theres an argument that a culture of toxicity and bigotry can exist without blatant examples of any of those these on any one persons part, which is really sort of the only thing we don’t allow ATM. I’m not sure I was of this mindset when rule 11 was created though, so really I think it’s just another example of how a community changes (thus reinforcing why rule 11 being flexible is good). Because of this I can’t help but feel that it’s a little short-minded to just smugly say “we knew slurs would get banned” or whatever because it doesn’t acknowledge the growth along the way which led people to seriously consider the idea. If something is a good change, but you fear that by doing it you may be enabling bad changes down the line, you need to consider that your entire definition of “good and bad” may change along the way.

"Someone fucked with our Overton Window, and that's a good thing."

"I feel left out now that the overton window has shifted away from nazism and bigotry being acceptable, this is the community's problem not mine!"

When did we have people advocating for implementing nazism and bigotry in server policy? How would one even implement nazism in spessmen?

Stickymayhem wrote: I mean did you use a slur as an insult? The clear implication of doing that is pretty obviously bigotry.

If I said "You fucking n-word" or whatever, the implication is inferiority of the class of person you're calling them. Otherwise it wouldn't be an insult. This is the difference between using it casually amongst other members of that class as a term of endearment, and screaming it at people when they make you mad

stop implying shit sticky, we are from extremely different cultural backgrounds

Comes to think about it, there's something crazily interesting about that whole deal. It is possible to step in here after year of abscence and still see same people having umptienth go at this whole ordeal despite being repeatedly told by players that they absolutely don't want them to govern over them to any more extent than they already might. And that's despite the fact that, from where I am sitting playerbase has been nearly completely replaced since last time I logged on. Not to mention since last time I had fun here, since that's way back. So time should, at least in theory, work in their favour.
At least Risky "You gonna suck this cock CLEAN" Sikh and goof do it for lulz.
It'd make for interesting subject of psychological study, wasn't psychology as a field somewhere between astrology and tarot reading in terms of seriousness.
Anyways good luck fellas, and if not this time, then next time.

Goof is NOT doing it for lulz.

you revoke any right to having a point by engaging with sticky's take on it

British man who openly celebrates ACAB-tier cop-killing on the forums unironically mocks people for opposing restrictions on mean words. More news at 11.

Agux909 wrote:Goof is NOT doing it for lulz.

Is he not doing it for lulz, or is he not aware he is doing it for lulz?
Now that's one hell of a riddle.

Omni wrote:

Agux909 wrote:Goof is NOT doing it for lulz.

Is he not doing it for lulz, or is he not aware he is doing it for lulz?
Now that's one hell of a riddle.

Your guess is as good as mine.

Omni wrote:Comes to think about it, there's something crazily interesting about that whole deal. It is possible to step in here after year of abscence and still see same people having umptienth go at this whole ordeal despite being repeatedly told by players that they absolutely don't want them to govern over them to any more extent than they already might. And that's despite the fact that, from where I am sitting playerbase has been nearly completely replaced since last time I logged on. Not to mention since last time I had fun here, since that's way back. So time should, at least in theory, work in their favour.
At least Risky "You gonna suck this cock CLEAN" Sikh and goof do it for lulz.
It'd make for interesting subject of psychological study, wasn't psychology as a field somewhere between astrology and tarot reading in terms of seriousness.
Anyways good luck fellas, and if not this time, then next time.

jannies were always power hungry and always want more of it

Flatulent wrote:

Stickymayhem wrote: I mean did you use a slur as an insult? The clear implication of doing that is pretty obviously bigotry.

If I said "You fucking n-word" or whatever, the implication is inferiority of the class of person you're calling them. Otherwise it wouldn't be an insult. This is the difference between using it casually amongst other members of that class as a term of endearment, and screaming it at people when they make you mad

stop implying shit sticky, we are from extremely different cultural backgrounds

that's an explanation not a justification

Rohen_Tahir wrote:

Stickymayhem wrote:

Rohen_Tahir wrote:

wesoda25 wrote:As for slurs: I personally wouldn’t be bothered if we banned them. I think theres an argument that a culture of toxicity and bigotry can exist without blatant examples of any of those these on any one persons part, which is really sort of the only thing we don’t allow ATM. I’m not sure I was of this mindset when rule 11 was created though, so really I think it’s just another example of how a community changes (thus reinforcing why rule 11 being flexible is good). Because of this I can’t help but feel that it’s a little short-minded to just smugly say “we knew slurs would get banned” or whatever because it doesn’t acknowledge the growth along the way which led people to seriously consider the idea. If something is a good change, but you fear that by doing it you may be enabling bad changes down the line, you need to consider that your entire definition of “good and bad” may change along the way.

"Someone fucked with our Overton Window, and that's a good thing."

"I feel left out now that the overton window has shifted away from nazism and bigotry being acceptable, this is the community's problem not mine!"

When did we have people advocating for implementing nazism and bigotry in server policy? How would one even implement nazism in spessmen?

We had people openly advocating for nazi politics, talking about genociding the jews and all kinds of shit like that a year ago before Rule 11 axed them

I mean "bAnNiNg SluRrrrRs iS A nAzI pOlIcY coS fReEdOm"

Flatulent wrote:jannies were always power hungry and always want more of it

Yeah, goes without saying that anyone willingly applying for position of moderator anywhere on the internet is, at the very elast, power hungry unless proven otherwise (and in whooping 99%+ of time this does not end up being the case), and anyone that spent more than month on the internet should outright assume that. But persistency factor of it and, against all better judgement, is the weird thing.

Stickymayhem wrote:

Rohen_Tahir wrote:

Stickymayhem wrote:

Rohen_Tahir wrote:

wesoda25 wrote:As for slurs: I personally wouldn’t be bothered if we banned them. I think theres an argument that a culture of toxicity and bigotry can exist without blatant examples of any of those these on any one persons part, which is really sort of the only thing we don’t allow ATM. I’m not sure I was of this mindset when rule 11 was created though, so really I think it’s just another example of how a community changes (thus reinforcing why rule 11 being flexible is good). Because of this I can’t help but feel that it’s a little short-minded to just smugly say “we knew slurs would get banned” or whatever because it doesn’t acknowledge the growth along the way which led people to seriously consider the idea. If something is a good change, but you fear that by doing it you may be enabling bad changes down the line, you need to consider that your entire definition of “good and bad” may change along the way.

"Someone fucked with our Overton Window, and that's a good thing."

"I feel left out now that the overton window has shifted away from nazism and bigotry being acceptable, this is the community's problem not mine!"

When did we have people advocating for implementing nazism and bigotry in server policy? How would one even implement nazism in spessmen?

We had people openly advocating for nazi politics, talking about genociding the jews and all kinds of shit like that a year ago before Rule 11 axed them

That's culture, not Overton window. The Overton window is about policies.

I mean "bAnNiNg SluRrrrRs iS A nAzI pOlIcY coS fReEdOm"

https://media.discordapp.net/attachment ... o0-323.mp4

Rohen_Tahir wrote:

Stickymayhem wrote:

Rohen_Tahir wrote:

Stickymayhem wrote:

Rohen_Tahir wrote:

wesoda25 wrote:As for slurs: I personally wouldn’t be bothered if we banned them. I think theres an argument that a culture of toxicity and bigotry can exist without blatant examples of any of those these on any one persons part, which is really sort of the only thing we don’t allow ATM. I’m not sure I was of this mindset when rule 11 was created though, so really I think it’s just another example of how a community changes (thus reinforcing why rule 11 being flexible is good). Because of this I can’t help but feel that it’s a little short-minded to just smugly say “we knew slurs would get banned” or whatever because it doesn’t acknowledge the growth along the way which led people to seriously consider the idea. If something is a good change, but you fear that by doing it you may be enabling bad changes down the line, you need to consider that your entire definition of “good and bad” may change along the way.

"Someone fucked with our Overton Window, and that's a good thing."

"I feel left out now that the overton window has shifted away from nazism and bigotry being acceptable, this is the community's problem not mine!"

When did we have people advocating for implementing nazism and bigotry in server policy? How would one even implement nazism in spessmen?

We had people openly advocating for nazi politics, talking about genociding the jews and all kinds of shit like that a year ago before Rule 11 axed them

That's culture, not Overton window. The Overton window is about policies.

I mean "bAnNiNg SluRrrrRs iS A nAzI pOlIcY coS fReEdOm"

https://media.discordapp.net/attachment ... o0-323.mp4

"Let me scream rape all n-words and let's gas the jews" are policies that are no longer politically acceptable to the population of this server

Outside of the half dozen people who scream every time rule 11 comes up but hide their power level :^)

Omni wrote:wasn't psychology as a field somewhere between astrology and tarot reading in terms of seriousness.

Psychology is pretty serious, but probably not in the way a layman thinks. For some reason a lot of people think it's all about personalities, feelings and reading minds, when a lot of the gains are in things like neuro, observation and cognition, things which are much more measurable than a questionnaire - but it is not a hard science in the sense that you can find immutable truths about the reality we live in. It is still very practical knowledge to know about the limits and averages of humans.

And now that I am done defending my choice of studying psychology, I admire the repeated runners' commitment to the game but at the same time they remind me of a politician here who thought he was going to be the next president some 40 years ago, still hasn't given up on the idea and has only fallen lower and lower in status as time has passed. Used to hold pretty high positions though, and he has some extremely inspirational quotes such as "everyone has their unique strengths - it just happens to me that they all are combined in me" and "I don't remember the last time I was wrong".

Stickymayhem wrote:

Rohen_Tahir wrote:

Stickymayhem wrote:

Rohen_Tahir wrote:

Stickymayhem wrote:

Rohen_Tahir wrote:

wesoda25 wrote:As for slurs: I personally wouldn’t be bothered if we banned them. I think theres an argument that a culture of toxicity and bigotry can exist without blatant examples of any of those these on any one persons part, which is really sort of the only thing we don’t allow ATM. I’m not sure I was of this mindset when rule 11 was created though, so really I think it’s just another example of how a community changes (thus reinforcing why rule 11 being flexible is good). Because of this I can’t help but feel that it’s a little short-minded to just smugly say “we knew slurs would get banned” or whatever because it doesn’t acknowledge the growth along the way which led people to seriously consider the idea. If something is a good change, but you fear that by doing it you may be enabling bad changes down the line, you need to consider that your entire definition of “good and bad” may change along the way.

"Someone fucked with our Overton Window, and that's a good thing."

"I feel left out now that the overton window has shifted away from nazism and bigotry being acceptable, this is the community's problem not mine!"

When did we have people advocating for implementing nazism and bigotry in server policy? How would one even implement nazism in spessmen?

We had people openly advocating for nazi politics, talking about genociding the jews and all kinds of shit like that a year ago before Rule 11 axed them

That's culture, not Overton window. The Overton window is about policies.

I mean "bAnNiNg SluRrrrRs iS A nAzI pOlIcY coS fReEdOm"

https://media.discordapp.net/attachment ... o0-323.mp4

"Let me scream rape all n-words and let's gas the jews" are policies that are no longer politically acceptable to the population of this server

Outside of the half dozen people who scream every time rule 11 comes up but hide their power level :^)

Flatulent wrote:

Malkraz wrote:

Flatulent wrote:“we don’t want to ban slurs” they said when rule 11 was just introduced

oops right again

What are you referring to? Did they actually ban slurs for real?
Yesterday on terry I got bwoinked by Iain for saying n-word in OOC but then he left to get the “””admin team opinions””” on the matter. I couldn’t wait 2-7 hours, so I went to sleep. As I’m banned from discord, im unaware of any events that transpire there. Why are you all discussing that slurs have been banned? Wtf just happened?

So the confusion here is understandable, but also stupid and retarded. (Otherwise known as fake and gay or fraudulent and asexual)

I don't want to ban all uses of a word that happens to be a slur. Thats what I mean when I say I want to ban bigotry, not slurs.

The context it is used in determines rather an instance of uttering a word that happens to be a slur is bigoted.

At a place that "bans slurs", saying "x just got banned for calling somebody a faggot" would also get you banned. This is retarded. There is no need to censor "faggot" in this context.

At a place that bans slurs, saying "what are you faggots playing" gets you in trouble, understandable to a degree, but also retarded. This usecase is not bigoted and its a term of endearment in this context.

At somewhere like goon, responding to a ridiculous request with "nigga please" would get you banned, by some white know it alls from the most privileged forum on the internet, despite being how a historically unprivileged social economical class actually speaks (to be clear, this is a culture argument, not a race one. If you grew up in the hood or adjacent communities, it didn't matter if you were white, black, mexican, or asian, soft-as were in your instinctive vocabulary, if not flat out hard-rs.).

MrStonedOne wrote:

Flatulent wrote:

Malkraz wrote:

Flatulent wrote:“we don’t want to ban slurs” they said when rule 11 was just introduced

oops right again

What are you referring to? Did they actually ban slurs for real?
Yesterday on terry I got bwoinked by Iain for saying n-word in OOC but then he left to get the “””admin team opinions””” on the matter. I couldn’t wait 2-7 hours, so I went to sleep. As I’m banned from discord, im unaware of any events that transpire there. Why are you all discussing that slurs have been banned? Wtf just happened?

So the confusion here is understandable, but also stupid and retarded. (Otherwise known as fake and gay or fraudulent and asexual)

I don't want to ban all uses of a word that happens to be a slur. Thats what I mean when I say I want to ban bigotry, not slurs.

The context it is used in determines rather an instance of uttering a word that happens to be a slur is bigoted.

At a place that "bans slurs", saying "x just got banned for calling somebody a faggot" would also get you banned. This is retarded. There is no need to censor "faggot" in this context.

At a place that bans slurs, saying "what are you faggots playing" gets you in trouble, understandable to a degree, but also retarded. This usecase is not bigoted and its a term of endearment in this context.

At somewhere like goon, responding to a ridiculous request with "nigga please" would get you banned, by some white know it alls from the most privileged forum on the internet, despite being how a historically unprivileged social economical class actually speaks (to be clear, this is a culture argument, not a race one. If you grew up in the hood or adjacent communities, it didn't matter if you were white, black, mexican, or asian, soft-as were in your instinctive vocabulary, if not flat out hard-rs.).

I didnt know our weedman was a certified hood classic, the more you know

MrStonedOne wrote:

Flatulent wrote:

Malkraz wrote:

Flatulent wrote:“we don’t want to ban slurs” they said when rule 11 was just introduced

oops right again

What are you referring to? Did they actually ban slurs for real?
Yesterday on terry I got bwoinked by Iain for saying n-word in OOC but then he left to get the “””admin team opinions””” on the matter. I couldn’t wait 2-7 hours, so I went to sleep. As I’m banned from discord, im unaware of any events that transpire there. Why are you all discussing that slurs have been banned? Wtf just happened?

So the confusion here is understandable, but also stupid and retarded. (Otherwise known as fake and gay or fraudulent and asexual)

I don't want to ban all uses of a word that happens to be a slur. Thats what I mean when I say I want to ban bigotry, not slurs.

The context it is used in determines rather an instance of uttering a word that happens to be a slur is bigoted.

Nobody said you want to ban the words MSO, I think YOUR intention for Rule 11 is good. But I also think very few who apply it actually do so in line within the framework you've presented and there's a handful who have actively made it known they want to push it further (as they have and will.)

MrStonedOne wrote: At a place that bans slurs, saying "what are you faggots playing" gets you in trouble, understandable to a degree, but also retarded. This usecase is not bigoted and its a term of endearment in this context.

At somewhere like goon, responding to a ridiculous request with "nigga please" would get you banned, by some white know it alls from the most privileged forum on the internet, despite being how a historically unprivileged social economical class actually speaks (to be clear, this is a culture argument, not a race one. If you grew up in the hood or adjacent communities, it didn't matter if you were white, black, mexican, or asian, soft-as were in your instinctive vocabulary, if not flat out hard-rs.).

We just recently banned a guy for saying "Nigga?" and "some nigga killed the HoP". A headmin deemed it "not worth overturning." Did you just miss that appeal?
https://tgstation13.org/phpBB/viewtopic ... 34&t=29615

If you project any harder IMAX will be trying to harness you for film

whats on the toast

vegemite

We just recently banned a guy for saying "Nigga?" and "some nigga killed the HoP". A headmin deemed it "not worth overturning." Did you just miss that appeal?
viewtopic.php?f=34&t=29615

They said it to a black person you fucking cheese-head.

Timonk wrote:vegemite

they're right

wesoda25 wrote:

We just recently banned a guy for saying "Nigga?" and "some nigga killed the HoP". A headmin deemed it "not worth overturning." Did you just miss that appeal?
viewtopic.php?f=34&t=29615

They said it to a black person you fucking cheese-head.

So much misinformation here.
First, it wasn’t a permaban. It was a note for saying the N-word. Not “to” a black person, but in reference to someone who was black. It was vague whether that was meant specifically as a bigoted slur or just as a generic bad word like “retard” but that’s why it was a note. The user was pretty upset about the note so they decided to just self-perma or quit. It wasn’t a permaban.

For the forum peoples: there was a headmin debate about rule 11 and a new player server came up so that’s why this topic is here out of the blue.

As far as the new player server, you need to understand the sentiment behind it. The issue is that new players are treated horribly by the SS13 community at large. If you are new and come into a server where most people have 200+ or even 1000+ hours, instead of being kind and welcoming many users will be toxic to these new players. They’ll make fun of them for wearing duffel bags, call them retards or just outright robust them and steal their things, “cope seethe skill issue” etc. and the new player is gone. That’s to the detriment of the community at large.

The game is difficult to learn with a high skill ceiling and once people finally reach that skill ceiling they feel they’ve earned the right to be just as mean to those below them as the people above them were to them. It’s like a high school where you’re shit on as a freshman, then once you become a senior you shit on the freshmen because you feel like you’ve taken your beatings and now it’s your turn to dole them out.

It’s a bad mentality and that’s why some headmins suggest a new player server. Unfortunately such a proposal only serves to divide our community in the end. What we need is an attitude change. It’s worst on Terry, Sybil could use better vibes too, Manuel doesn’t have this problem but instead it’s become a bit too insular and runs the risk of alienating new players.

But how do you mandate love and kindness? You don’t... but maybe you can start with rule 11 to shift the culture in a more positive direction. That’s what the debate sort of centered around.

sinfulbliss wrote:You don’t... but maybe you can start with rule 11 to shift the culture in a more positive direction.

i rest my case

Im putting my foot down. You guys have been getting away with making dumbfuck fucking posts for way too long. I dont want to be toxic but holy fuck someone has to tell you that you are at times so lost in delusion or semantics that you make literally zero fucking sense to a person who is even remotely normal. Ive literally started to view browsing forums as going to the zoo because i know there is a good chance i will see the unthinkable product of an incomprehensibly idiotic thought process. PLEASE give yourselves time outs like you are so far past the point of embarrassment i hurt FOR you

sinfulbliss » Tue Aug 31, 2021 11:49 pm #613462
wesoda25 wrote:
We just recently banned a guy for saying "Nigga?" and "some nigga killed the HoP". A headmin deemed it "not worth overturning." Did you just miss that appeal?
viewtopic.php?f=34&t=29615

They said it to a black person you fucking cheese-head.

So much misinformation here.
First, it wasn’t a permaban. It was a note for saying the N-word. Not “to” a black person, but in reference to someone who was black.
“””

SINFUL WHAT IN THE FUCK ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT NO ONE SAID SHIT ABOUT A PERMA BAN AND YOUR DISTINCTION DOESNT MATTER. NO ONES GONNA READ YOUR ESSAY IF YOUR THESIS IS SHIT. AND WHILE WE’RE AT IT WTF WAS THIS SHIT ABOUT SAYING “pretending to rape a corpse actually is pretty tame” I MEAN WHAT FUCKING PLANET DO YOU BUY YOUR TAKES FROM FFS