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I also like how atlantaned tore a new asshole in the guy so hard he's gonna be farting doubles.

ekaterina wrote: ↑Mon Jul 10, 2023 7:13 pm How is it the RD's fault that the HoP decided to go full gorilla mode? The escalation seems valid to me on the RD's end. Of course, it's still reasonable to question why the RD was walking around with a maxcap, but the detonation is completely on the HoP.

ekaterina wrote: ↑Mon Jul 10, 2023 7:13 pm the HoP does not even have the authority to make arrests, much less arrest other heads...

ekaterina wrote: ↑Mon Jul 10, 2023 7:13 pm If the HoPcurity wants to act like security, he should learn how security acts, and it's poor practice to gun someone down past the point of being a threat

These were your criticisms of the HoP.

It's incorrect to criticise him for acting as security in this situation, as he was completely warranted to arrest that player.

It's incorrect to claim he wasn't meeting Security expectations, as killing that player in that context was 100% justified due to them almost killing you during a resonance cascade.

It's unreasonable to expect him to trust the RDs word at all, seeing as no action by the RD was anything but hostile from the HoPs perspective.


You saying "well I'm just pointing out the HoP technically activated the Killswitch" is a giant fucking back pedal. You made a lot of straight up wrong assertions which weren't just around the HoP activating the kill switch but the events that led to it.

Lacran wrote: ↑Tue Jul 11, 2023 1:44 pm It's unreasonable to expect him to trust the RDs word at all, seeing as no action by the RD was anything but hostile from the HoPs perspective.

It's extremely generous to call wordlessly tabling someone to crit an "arrest".

Lacran wrote: ↑Tue Jul 11, 2023 1:44 pm It's incorrect to claim he wasn't meeting Security expectations, as killing that player in that context was 100% justified due to them almost killing you during a resonance cascade.

Have coders changed things? As of the last time I remember being in a resonance cascade, recalling changes absolutely nothing because the shuttle wouldn't leave anyway and escape is done via wormhole.

Lacran wrote: ↑Tue Jul 11, 2023 1:44 pm It's unreasonable to expect him to trust the RDs word at all, seeing as no action by the RD was anything but hostile from the HoPs perspective.

If a spessman doesn't believe the RD has a bomb, that's that spessman being a dumbass. You can get a bomb in 5 minutes as a scientist.

Lacran wrote: ↑Tue Jul 11, 2023 1:44 pm You saying "well I'm just pointing out the HoP technically activated the Killswitch" is a giant fucking back pedal. You made a lot of straight up wrong assertions which weren't just around the HoP activating the kill switch but the events that led to it.

How can it be a backpedal to say what I've been saying since the start? Behold:

ekaterina wrote: ↑Mon Jul 10, 2023 7:13 pm it's still reasonable to question why the RD was walking around with a maxcap, but the detonation is completely on the HoP.

In conclusion, the RD shouldn't have been walking around with a set bomb but the HoP shouldn't have set it off like a dumbass.

ekaterina wrote: ↑Tue Jul 11, 2023 3:29 am Surely, you mean "kidnaps", since the HoP does not even have the authority to make arrests, much less arrest other heads...
Lacran is out here fighting for the rights of HoPcurities everywhere. HoPcurity, on MANUEL of all servers...
... showing up to the bridge and instantly tabling the RD, truly the highest roleplay tgstation can behold.

Things happened on the bridge.

Escalation rules on "MANUEL of all servers" specifically state that you are allowed to defend your own workplace. The HoPs workplace is his lil office...in the bridge. The HoP has access to an e-gun and cuffs specifically to arrest people fucking around in the bridge.

Did you know that myself, after becoming admin, was bwoinked for bucklecuffing and stripping the acting captain (a QM), on Manuel, as HoP? After beating the shit outta them? I didn't get noted, because, it being Manuel, where people are technically RPing, I took the QMs joke to build the BSA in the bridge, where my office is, very seriously.

You mainline Terry. Maybe check MRP rules before you make a fool of yourself?

I think it makes more sense to assume the RD that just recalled doesn't actually have a kill switch bomb they made to kill abductors. Especially considering they were about to try to fix the engine during a resonance cascade which would be pretty hazardous.

All of those things seem highly unlikely to assume because that would be an extremely, incredibly stupid thing to do that would get you into a lot of trouble.

It's far more reasonable and likely that the player is lying to you to avoid you beating the piss out of them. Especially when they immediately return once they have the upper hand to shoot you with a Mosin.

So the HoP had three options:

Run away from the hostile RD (and the RD recalls the shuttle again)
Stand there (and risk getting shot to death by the hostile RD with a mosin)
Kill the RD (and risk activating the bomb the RD stashed)

None of these are desirable.

ekaterina wrote: ↑Tue Jul 11, 2023 12:15 pm

dendydoom wrote: ↑Tue Jul 11, 2023 9:48 am it's also ironic that ekat would defend the RD because the hop shouldn't be acting like a vigilante when the RD is walking around with a rifle and a health sensor maxcap to hunt an antag that isn't a stationwide threat.

You misunderstand the extent to which I'm defending the RD. I'm more criticising the HoP. See below:

ekaterina wrote: ↑Mon Jul 10, 2023 7:13 pm The HoP was warned and he ignored the warning because he randomly decided the RD was bluffing. The HoP fucked around and found out. How is it the RD's fault that the HoP decided to go full gorilla mode? The escalation seems valid to me on the RD's end. Of course, it's still reasonable to question why the RD was walking around with a maxcap, but the detonation is completely on the HoP.

that's fair, yeah. without the maxcap this situation would just be a silly fight. maybe it's on the hop that the bomb went off but the RD had no valid reason to have a health sensor maxcap in their back pocket in the first place, hence why they got into trouble for it. i would argue that it's fine that the hop killed them after being shot with a rifle, though. it's why they carry a self-defence weapon, and in this instance they used it in self-defence. the RD was still on 56~ hp after the fight and could've easily walked away, or they could've resorted to fists themselves if they wanted to continue the confrontation (the same level of escalation that the hop was using) but this would've also been a stupid move.

the fact that the hop had sechuds on is a little cringe, but in light of the circumstances i'm choosing to overlook it... >:)

dendydoom wrote: ↑Tue Jul 11, 2023 2:28 pm the fact that the hop had sechuds on is a little cringe, but in light of the circumstances i'm choosing to overlook it... >:)

I find it weird that the person who's in charge of assigning jobs doesn't have the HUD that shows jobs. Maybe they should get a modified secHUD that doesn't show arrest status

conrad wrote: ↑Tue Jul 11, 2023 2:04 pm Things happened on the bridge. Escalation rules on "MANUEL of all servers" specifically state that you are allowed to defend your own workplace.

Defend your workplace from... other people who share that workplace? The Research Director, as a member of command, has every right to be in the bridge.
Is conrad, an admin, saying I can beat up people who share my space in the name of "defending my workplace"?

conrad wrote: ↑Tue Jul 11, 2023 2:04 pm You mainline Terry. Maybe check MRP rules before you make a fool of yourself?

You peddling the notion that not knowing the rules of a server you don't play on makes you a fool yet again shows why you're wrong and I'm right.

Lacran wrote: ↑Tue Jul 11, 2023 2:09 pm I think it makes more sense to assume the RD that just recalled doesn't actually have a kill switch bomb they made to kill abductors. Especially considering they were about to try to fix the engine during a resonance cascade which would be pretty hazardous.

You're making the mistake of assuming what people do makes sense. We're dealing with wacky spessmen, you won't always understand their motivations.

WineAllWine wrote: ↑Tue Jul 11, 2023 2:55 pm

dendydoom wrote: ↑Tue Jul 11, 2023 2:28 pm the fact that the hop had sechuds on is a little cringe, but in light of the circumstances i'm choosing to overlook it... >:)

I find it weird that the person who's in charge of assigning jobs doesn't have the HUD that shows jobs. Maybe they should get a modified secHUD that doesn't show arrest status

I like this idea. We should extend this new command HUD, ComHUD™ if you will, to all heads of staff.

Main character syndrome

ekaterina wrote: ↑Tue Jul 11, 2023 3:34 pm

conrad wrote: ↑Tue Jul 11, 2023 2:04 pm Things happened on the bridge. Escalation rules on "MANUEL of all servers" specifically state that you are allowed to defend your own workplace.

Defend your workplace from... other people who share that workplace? The Research Director, as a member of command, has every right to be in the bridge.
Is conrad, an admin, saying I can beat up people who share my space in the name of "defending my workplace"?

If said person is behaving like an antag, threatening to blow up, and shooting you with a Mosin, yeah. Tunnel vision is real, it seems.

ekaterina wrote: ↑Tue Jul 11, 2023 3:34 pm

conrad wrote: ↑Tue Jul 11, 2023 2:04 pm You mainline Terry. Maybe check MRP rules before you make a fool of yourself?

You peddling the notion that not knowing the rules of a server you don't play on makes you a fool yet again shows why you're wrong and I'm right.

I swear Sinful and Ekat must draw straws to determine which one of them has to die on the hill in these peanut threads.

conrad wrote: ↑Mon Jul 10, 2023 6:13 pm viewtopic.php?t=34413
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I also like how atlantaned tore a new asshole in the guy so hard he's gonna be farting doubles.

they had 0 reason to make the steps so large to scale

RedBaronFlyer wrote: ↑Tue Jul 11, 2023 5:25 pm I swear Sinful and Ekat must draw straws to determine which one of them has to die on the hill in these peanut threads.

It's lucky they don't team up; we wouldn't stand a chance.

Fren256 wrote: ↑Tue Jul 11, 2023 3:40 pm Main character syndrome

Nobody knows what this means. Devin doesn't have MC syndrome, he's just dumb sometimes.

Also Kat literally the only thing the HoP did wrong was not communicate with Devin. If he'd sat down and talked to him instead of going guns blazing it wouldn't have been an issue.

Devin is still in the wrong because the HoP's actions are entirely irrelevant to the situation save for them resulting in the bomb going off. The issue is that the RD shouldn't be building a maxcap tied to a health monitor as a non-antag.

You make the bomb and trigger conditions, its your responsibility if it goes off under your specified conditions.

Imagine if the bomb went off and took someone out who was just a bystander in an otherwise valid situation?

I'm quite disappointed in Devin. I was hoping he would improve and this makes me wonder if that may ever happen. I do not mind Devin at all as a person and I do wish him the best, but this is somewhat distressing to see.

saprasam wrote: ↑Tue Jul 11, 2023 6:09 pm

conrad wrote: ↑Mon Jul 10, 2023 6:13 pm viewtopic.php?t=34413
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I also like how atlantaned tore a new asshole in the guy so hard he's gonna be farting doubles.

they had 0 reason to make the steps so large to scale

Lots of schools do this. People probably sit there and eat lunch.

NecromancerAnne wrote: ↑Wed Jul 12, 2023 4:08 pm You make the bomb and trigger conditions, its your responsibility if it goes off under your specified conditions.

We have monthly threads on shit like this, wonder if people will ever figure this concept out.

Ziiro wrote: ↑Thu Jul 13, 2023 5:28 pm

NecromancerAnne wrote: ↑Wed Jul 12, 2023 4:08 pm You make the bomb and trigger conditions, its your responsibility if it goes off under your specified conditions.

We have monthly threads on shit like this, wonder if people will ever figure this concept out.

I started this game in 2017. People were detonating maxcaps fnr then.