RP rules rewrite discussion
Posted: Fri Feb 24, 2023 6:09 am
Seen here: viewtopic.php?t=33481
Who looked at Manuel, saw "ROLEPLAY SERVER" and decided that it would be best to tie all allowed behavior directly to game mechanics?NecromancerAnne wrote: ↑Fri Feb 24, 2023 8:46 am It's not quite that bad, but certainly I think the emphasis on objectives has been to the servers detriment. Completion over setup and payoff. Not that I think it any antagonists fault, their mechanics hinge on it.
I don't. Crime is crime and the law is blind. A traitor who only commits petty theft shouldn't be executed on the spot.Itseasytosee2me wrote: ↑Fri Feb 24, 2023 6:18 am If the ruling is indeed trying to make security treat antagonists and non antagonists the same under the eyes of the law, i think that is contrary to the rule requiring playing a realistic character.
It's not a rule. You can actually ignore your objectives for something else. The only thing you can't do is murderbone and meaninglessly murdering people without at least some reasoning. If you have some setup, then you should be fine. This means talking to people. The new rules even suggest someone who is nice to you is of equal target to someone who wasn't, so a knife twist betrayal is on the table as well. You can do a lot with that, and the groundwork is there for roleplay.Annihilite111 wrote: ↑Fri Feb 24, 2023 9:27 amWho looked at Manuel, saw "ROLEPLAY SERVER" and decided that it would be best to tie all allowed behavior directly to game mechanics?NecromancerAnne wrote: ↑Fri Feb 24, 2023 8:46 am It's not quite that bad, but certainly I think the emphasis on objectives has been to the servers detriment. Completion over setup and payoff. Not that I think it any antagonists fault, their mechanics hinge on it.
Frankly I like the vagueness of it all. Means following the spirit is in more focus than following the word
Rule 5 precedent 3 covers and rule 10 cover this I think.RedBaronFlyer wrote: ↑Fri Feb 24, 2023 6:25 am I'm cautiously optimistic about the changes. I look forward to seeing more plasma floods and bombings. Hopefully, it isn't just constant "I waited for my target to go into medbay then bombed medbay to kill as many people as possible" every round though. That was my experience on goon and it kinda turned me off of SS13 for a bit because it would happen almost every round.
i dont know maybe my grandma died to ligma and someone made a ligma joke and i kill them over itTheLoLSwat wrote: ↑Fri Feb 24, 2023 10:02 pm
"why did you kill Patrick paramedic?"
"too embarrased to say uwu <333"
manuel
Do you think you should get banned for that?iwishforducks wrote: ↑Fri Feb 24, 2023 10:33 pmi dont know maybe my grandma died to ligma and someone made a ligma joke and i kill them over itTheLoLSwat wrote: ↑Fri Feb 24, 2023 10:02 pm
"why did you kill Patrick paramedic?"
"too embarrased to say uwu <333"
manuel
ligma ballsArmhulen wrote: ↑Fri Feb 24, 2023 10:59 pmDo you think you should get banned for that?iwishforducks wrote: ↑Fri Feb 24, 2023 10:33 pmi dont know maybe my grandma died to ligma and someone made a ligma joke and i kill them over itTheLoLSwat wrote: ↑Fri Feb 24, 2023 10:02 pm
"why did you kill Patrick paramedic?"
"too embarrased to say uwu <333"
manuel
Youtuber debate format: Thinning out the station a little should be a valid excuse for a few people, especially if they work close to any of your objectives in some wayiwishforducks wrote: ↑Fri Feb 24, 2023 11:04 pmligma ballsArmhulen wrote: ↑Fri Feb 24, 2023 10:59 pmDo you think you should get banned for that?iwishforducks wrote: ↑Fri Feb 24, 2023 10:33 pmi dont know maybe my grandma died to ligma and someone made a ligma joke and i kill them over itTheLoLSwat wrote: ↑Fri Feb 24, 2023 10:02 pm
"why did you kill Patrick paramedic?"
"too embarrased to say uwu <333"
manuel
serious answer: i think it should be fine to kill like a few people for absolutely no reason at all. just committing small acts of murder and not systematic station genocide. i think it breeds goodness for the round for people to die (gives medical something to do, security, detective, paranoia, etc.)
iwishforducks wrote: ↑Fri Feb 24, 2023 1:31 pm i think we should just let antags kill in small doses with zero worry. it’s exhausting to come up with a reasoning for everything you do. you know why i do 90% of the things i do? because it feels right. and really? that’s what playing a character is about. i reserve my thinking and rationale for more important things, if you will.
IMO, I think the way this should be handled is that every traitor gets 3 free kills. No questions asked. And then every kill after that needs to be justified.Itseasytosee2me wrote: ↑Sat Feb 25, 2023 2:56 am Not being able to commit random acts of violence when the opportunity erupts is a real drag. Had a recent traitor CMO round, and when you get a guy under the knife its just all to easy to yank out the heart, watch em struggle and toss the body in the morgue, or shoot a syringe gun full of lexorin into a random passer by as the shuttle arrives before running off. Or placing an X4 charge at the opposite side of the wall you know doctors are preforming surgery right on the other side of, or choral hydrating some dude whos right next to an airlock and then tossing them out. Sometimes the opportunity to preform a random act of violence is too good and I would hate to give that up.
You are so basedTimberpoes wrote: ↑Fri Feb 24, 2023 11:50 am Don't confuse the rules for the enforcement.
I mainly did the murderbone rule rewrite portion to limit what I considered bullshit admin enforcement of the existing rules.
The old murderbone rules basically allowed the same stuff the current ones do. But entrenched MRP admin team enforcement culture instead turned antags into objective bots. We have murderbone bans on the system for 1 kill.
Murderbone is gone. The word is poison on MRP. MRP admins lost sight of the purpose of the murderbone rules. In come restricted antagonists to replace them.
With new rules I expect new enforcement more in line with what the original rules intended.
And now antag objectives are finally suggestions because the ability for antags to kill outside of their objectives is fully codified in the rules - it just requires a bit of RP brain.
Requiring RP brain is a damn good outcome for an increased RP server.
If they are doing something like this and not doing what people are asking them, its not like people can do nothing but sit on their hands.Super Aggro Crag wrote: ↑Sun Feb 26, 2023 12:34 am "stay in your lane" is going to empower stupid useless fuckwits who don't do their job to take job slots and then scream and cry when you try to do it for them because they're too busy blowing up the chem lab making meth or building an autism form while the station runs out of power because they didn't set up the SM.
when i tried to do this i got banned for 3 days. stop being disingenous.Misdoubtful wrote: ↑Sun Feb 26, 2023 12:37 amIf they are doing something like this and not doing what people are asking them, its not like people can do nothing but sit on their hands.Super Aggro Crag wrote: ↑Sun Feb 26, 2023 12:34 am "stay in your lane" is going to empower stupid useless fuckwits who don't do their job to take job slots and then scream and cry when you try to do it for them because they're too busy blowing up the chem lab making meth or building an autism form while the station runs out of power because they didn't set up the SM.
It just gives people the interaction opportunity of reasonably requesting. After those requests though?
Also to everyone in general: stop caring if other people get mad. You aren't going to get banned because you made someone upset Jesus Christ. Hugboxers btfo.
Then there has to be more to this story.Super Aggro Crag wrote: ↑Sun Feb 26, 2023 12:43 amwhen i tried to do this i got banned for 3 days. stop being disingenous.Misdoubtful wrote: ↑Sun Feb 26, 2023 12:37 amIf they are doing something like this and not doing what people are asking them, its not like people can do nothing but sit on their hands.Super Aggro Crag wrote: ↑Sun Feb 26, 2023 12:34 am "stay in your lane" is going to empower stupid useless fuckwits who don't do their job to take job slots and then scream and cry when you try to do it for them because they're too busy blowing up the chem lab making meth or building an autism form while the station runs out of power because they didn't set up the SM.
It just gives people the interaction opportunity of reasonably requesting. After those requests though?
Also to everyone in general: stop caring if other people get mad. You aren't going to get banned because you made someone upset Jesus Christ. Hugboxers btfo.
i asked a guy if he could make me a glass of lye he said FUCK OFF CUNT. When he left his department i walked in to make a glass of lye and he called me a FUCKING CUNT FUCK YOU CUNT DIE and tried to set me on fire and burn me to death with acid. So I called him an aspie and got banned for 3 days.Misdoubtful wrote: ↑Sun Feb 26, 2023 12:47 amThen there has to be more to this story.Super Aggro Crag wrote: ↑Sun Feb 26, 2023 12:43 amwhen i tried to do this i got banned for 3 days. stop being disingenous.Misdoubtful wrote: ↑Sun Feb 26, 2023 12:37 amIf they are doing something like this and not doing what people are asking them, its not like people can do nothing but sit on their hands.Super Aggro Crag wrote: ↑Sun Feb 26, 2023 12:34 am "stay in your lane" is going to empower stupid useless fuckwits who don't do their job to take job slots and then scream and cry when you try to do it for them because they're too busy blowing up the chem lab making meth or building an autism form while the station runs out of power because they didn't set up the SM.
It just gives people the interaction opportunity of reasonably requesting. After those requests though?
Also to everyone in general: stop caring if other people get mad. You aren't going to get banned because you made someone upset Jesus Christ. Hugboxers btfo.
stay in your lane is just a dumb rule over all i dont like it in any capacitySuper Aggro Crag wrote: ↑Sun Feb 26, 2023 12:34 am "stay in your lane" is going to empower stupid useless fuckwits who don't do their job to take job slots and then scream and cry when you try to do it for them because they're too busy blowing up the chem lab making meth or building an autism form while the station runs out of power because they didn't set up the SM.
viewtopic.php?p=651942#p651942Super Aggro Crag wrote: ↑Sun Feb 26, 2023 1:08 ami asked a guy if he could make me a glass of lye he said FUCK OFF CUNT. When he left his department i walked in to make a glass of lye and he called me a FUCKING CUNT FUCK YOU CUNT DIE and tried to set me on fire and burn me to death with acid. So I called him an aspie and got banned for 3 days.Misdoubtful wrote: ↑Sun Feb 26, 2023 12:47 amThen there has to be more to this story.Super Aggro Crag wrote: ↑Sun Feb 26, 2023 12:43 amwhen i tried to do this i got banned for 3 days. stop being disingenous.Misdoubtful wrote: ↑Sun Feb 26, 2023 12:37 amIf they are doing something like this and not doing what people are asking them, its not like people can do nothing but sit on their hands.Super Aggro Crag wrote: ↑Sun Feb 26, 2023 12:34 am "stay in your lane" is going to empower stupid useless fuckwits who don't do their job to take job slots and then scream and cry when you try to do it for them because they're too busy blowing up the chem lab making meth or building an autism form while the station runs out of power because they didn't set up the SM.
It just gives people the interaction opportunity of reasonably requesting. After those requests though?
Also to everyone in general: stop caring if other people get mad. You aren't going to get banned because you made someone upset Jesus Christ. Hugboxers btfo.
yeah because him acting like an absolute cockhead and breaking rule 1 by being a dickhole is now actually super cool and good and you can get banned for not liking it, under the new rules you champion. i can't wait for power to not come on for 45 minutes every shift because the engineers are jerking themselves off instead of setting up the engine and then get told it's valid when i get murdered for asking for engineering access to try and set it upMisdoubtful wrote: ↑Sun Feb 26, 2023 1:34 amviewtopic.php?p=651942#p651942Super Aggro Crag wrote: ↑Sun Feb 26, 2023 1:08 ami asked a guy if he could make me a glass of lye he said FUCK OFF CUNT. When he left his department i walked in to make a glass of lye and he called me a FUCKING CUNT FUCK YOU CUNT DIE and tried to set me on fire and burn me to death with acid. So I called him an aspie and got banned for 3 days.Misdoubtful wrote: ↑Sun Feb 26, 2023 12:47 amThen there has to be more to this story.Super Aggro Crag wrote: ↑Sun Feb 26, 2023 12:43 amwhen i tried to do this i got banned for 3 days. stop being disingenous.Misdoubtful wrote: ↑Sun Feb 26, 2023 12:37 amIf they are doing something like this and not doing what people are asking them, its not like people can do nothing but sit on their hands.Super Aggro Crag wrote: ↑Sun Feb 26, 2023 12:34 am "stay in your lane" is going to empower stupid useless fuckwits who don't do their job to take job slots and then scream and cry when you try to do it for them because they're too busy blowing up the chem lab making meth or building an autism form while the station runs out of power because they didn't set up the SM.
It just gives people the interaction opportunity of reasonably requesting. After those requests though?
Also to everyone in general: stop caring if other people get mad. You aren't going to get banned because you made someone upset Jesus Christ. Hugboxers btfo.
You were banned for a rule 11 issue though, not a stay in your lane issue. I thought I remembered what you were talking about.
There was in fact much much more to this story.
Okay, I'm kind of dumb, but I'm a bit confused by the "Such reasons may include escalating against people who are excessively polite or helpful as well as being mean or rude" part. Is this so that people don't go, "wtf I was nice why kill?"Such reasons may include escalating against people who are excessively polite or helpful as well as being mean or rude, escalating against groups of people who exclude them or escalating against people who ignore or avoid attempts to communicate entirely.
You can't go out of your way to mass maim or indiscriminately kill the crew after the fact, but you can do mass sabotage (such as spacing the station or plasma fires) which some types of sabotage will inherently get a fairly big body count depending. Is this meaning, "Hey, don't go from maint tunnel to maint tunnel gunning people down indiscriminately after you spaced/bombed/plasma-flooded?"Mass station sabotage that is likely to kill people is allowed so long as the antagonist does not take any direct and specific personal actions to maximise the bodycount beyond what the sabotage itself causes. Examples of mass station sabotage include plasma flooding, causing a supermatter delamination and spacing the station.
That's the point. You just need to have a reason. As long as you can say "I did it because (XYZ)" and that "XYZ" isn't "Because I wanted to" you're fine.RedBaronFlyer wrote: ↑Sun Feb 26, 2023 8:05 amOkay, I'm kind of dumb, but I'm a bit confused by the "Such reasons may include escalating against people who are excessively polite or helpful as well as being mean or rude" part. Is this so that people don't go, "wtf I was nice why kill?"Such reasons may include escalating against people who are excessively polite or helpful as well as being mean or rude, escalating against groups of people who exclude them or escalating against people who ignore or avoid attempts to communicate entirely.
It kind of feels a bit like doublespeak. You can kill, but you need a reason per escalation guidelines, the reason can be if the person was nice, wasn't nice, seemed cliquey, or weren't responding to you. It's kind of the same issue I have with the sabotage rule.
So, if you set off a singulo? That's great. If you stun baton people and throw them into it, that's not so great.RedBaronFlyer wrote:You can't go out of your way to mass maim or indiscriminately kill the crew after the fact, but you can do mass sabotage (such as spacing the station or plasma fires) which some types of sabotage will inherently get a fairly big body count depending. Is this meaning, "Hey, don't go from maint tunnel to maint tunnel gunning people down indiscriminately after you spaced/bombed/plasma-flooded?"Mass station sabotage that is likely to kill people is allowed so long as the antagonist does not take any direct and specific personal actions to maximise the bodycount beyond what the sabotage itself causes. Examples of mass station sabotage include plasma flooding, causing a supermatter delamination and spacing the station.
I haven't seen this in action so I have no idea how it's playing out. I figure it's fine, and I'm just reading a bit too much into it.
While *in my opinion* we are a little over-harsh on some insults, if you ahelped that he was acting like someone with aspergers oocly instead of calling him an aspie icly you would have probably gotten him bannedSuper Aggro Crag wrote: ↑Sun Feb 26, 2023 2:26 amyeah because him acting like an absolute cockhead and breaking rule 1 by being a dickhole is now actually super cool and good and you can get banned for not liking it, under the new rules you champion. i can't wait for power to not come on for 45 minutes every shift because the engineers are jerking themselves off instead of setting up the engine and then get told it's valid when i get murdered for asking for engineering access to try and set it upMisdoubtful wrote: ↑Sun Feb 26, 2023 1:34 amviewtopic.php?p=651942#p651942
You were banned for a rule 11 issue though, not a stay in your lane issue. I thought I remembered what you were talking about.
There was in fact much much more to this story.
okArmhulen wrote: ↑Sun Feb 26, 2023 10:10 pmWhile *in my opinion* we are a little over-harsh on some insults, if you ahelped that he was acting like someone with aspergers oocly instead of calling him an aspie icly you would have probably gotten him bannedSuper Aggro Crag wrote: ↑Sun Feb 26, 2023 2:26 amyeah because him acting like an absolute cockhead and breaking rule 1 by being a dickhole is now actually super cool and good and you can get banned for not liking it, under the new rules you champion. i can't wait for power to not come on for 45 minutes every shift because the engineers are jerking themselves off instead of setting up the engine and then get told it's valid when i get murdered for asking for engineering access to try and set it upMisdoubtful wrote: ↑Sun Feb 26, 2023 1:34 amviewtopic.php?p=651942#p651942
You were banned for a rule 11 issue though, not a stay in your lane issue. I thought I remembered what you were talking about.
There was in fact much much more to this story.