Nuclear Oops? Peanut

[Kendrickorium]

Bottom post of the previous page:

viewtopic.php?f=7&t=34024

discuss

[massa]

People are showing basic kindness game is a hugbox

no i get very autistic about the things i like and i'm very particular

my tastes in all media and sensory feedback in general is usually better than everyone else's to the point my opinions are morally just and right

[The Wrench]

Name sucks, this deserves the note and is just in general rule 1 stuff. Imagine being the mapper behind one of these stations thinking you can finally go play the game and have some fun without being bombarded by "I hate X" and then the fucking nukie called "FUCK TRAM FUCK NORTHSTAR FUCK BIRDSHIT" shows up. That must fucking suck, keep the note

Hot take, but if you can’t take the heat get out of the kitchen. autists are going to autisticly screech about changes they don’t like. If you can’t handle that as a coder, don’t code for an open source game where your changes will be forced on everyone.

[The Wrench]

Rule 1 doesn't apply to antagonists like nukies who are sent to blow everyone up, nor is it there to protect a non-sentient entity like a map.

It's not protecting the map, it's protecting the creator of the map, who is, or at least was, a player before getting harrassed out of the game by things like this. To you, it's a lighthearted "hahaha get it guys i'm joking about not liking the map", to them, it's yet another slap in the face they've received for dedicating a large amount of their time to a project.
Rule 4 affords no out of character protections. You can't bully someone in OOC just because you're an antagonist in the round, as an example. Setting a nukie name is an OOC act. Your character doesn't choose their family name at the start of their mission; you're not interacting with a console, or saying something, to change your name. It's a completely OOC prompt with very few, mostly non-impactful IC consequences.
Setting your nukie name to FUCK TRAM ALL MY HOMIES HATE TRAM isn't going to do much beyond annoy players who like tram. You aren't rewarded for or encouraged to have a stupid or funny name.

On topic about the actual peanut, if you can get a note for a name like that, can you get a note for saying you don't like a map in OOC since you're technically being a dick to the mapper who made it? If you say you don't like a new feature/removal in OOC, is that a rule violation to the coder who made the change? If those examples don't count, why does it count for nuclear operative names? Where is the line in the sand drawn differently? Sorry to play the devil's advocate here, but I'm curious on the justification.

IMO it ultimately depends on how far you go. It's very contextual.
If you go on a full crag-tier rant about how the coders are dung-guzzling wankers that eat raw alligator cocks for breakfast because they removed nanites, I could see an admin muting OOC and giving you a stern talking to. "I don't like <X map>" is probably fine. going into detail is probably fine. it's when you're abusive or excessive about it that it becomes a harassment issue. Expletives generally don't lend themselves well to constructive criticism.
When you take it into a nukie name, you're taking OOC (your opinion of the map) into IC(your character's last name).

stay on Manuel.

>someone says they struggle with people verbally abusing them/their work on a regular basis
>proceeds to use weird server tribalism & rib them
I don't care if this is serious or not, the timing seems real off. You kinda suck.

Apologies for the forbidden double post, but this is an open source game, and no one is entitled to play here. Same goes for coders, if you enforce your map on people, and a vocal minority don’t like it. Learn to cope or ignore them. This is an open source project, so buck up sonny and not let them get to you, or log off. No one deserves special treatment because of how much they contribute or admin. We are all equal.

[CMDR_Gungnir]

It is everywhere. I cannot go anywhere in the community because I'm told straight to my face that the project I care about is shit without any constructive feedback behind it. I literally do not want to play the game, admin, or contribute because it feels like feeding a pack of coyotes that'll just gnaw at my arm.

To be another positive voice speaking up, I adore the map. I loved it, back in the older days, and I love the changes made to it to make it suit /tg/. I'm always excited to see it pop up in the map vote and if I'm being perfectly honest, I've not voted for anything else when it's been in the list. People just don't like it because it's not the same square map like Meta or Delta. If they actually played on it a couple times, they'd know where everything is.

no no, you're confused, i'm not upset that people hate me, I don't like that they hate people like chesify who are literally super nice and do nothing to them but try to contribute their passion.

because that's exactly what allows the situation where I am the headcoder despite all of my negative flaws.

I distinctly remember that you removed my gitban without even an apology from me, because I promised that even if I meant what I said to/about you, I just wouldn't do it again.

You can be a pretentious jackass and I often disagree with a lot of your takes, but you do genuinely care about the people behind the scenes, which is the most important thing.

[Archie700]

Apologies for the forbidden double post, but this is an open source game, and no one is entitled to play here. Same goes for coders, if you enforce your map on people, and a vocal minority don’t like it. Learn to cope or ignore them. This is an open source project, so buck up sonny and not let them get to you, or log off. No one deserves special treatment because of how much they contribute or admin. We are all equal.

The idea of "grow thicker skin" is so easy to say when you're not the one in the hotbox.

[conrad]

Name sucks, this deserves the note and is just in general rule 1 stuff. Imagine being the mapper behind one of these stations thinking you can finally go play the game and have some fun without being bombarded by "I hate X" and then the fucking nukie called "FUCK TRAM FUCK NORTHSTAR FUCK BIRDSHIT" shows up. That must fucking suck, keep the note

Hot take, but if you can’t take the heat get out of the kitchen. autists are going to autisticly screech about changes they don’t like. If you can’t handle that as a coder, don’t code for an open source game where your changes will be forced on everyone.

What a silly little thing to say.

[Vekter]

On topic about the actual peanut, if you can get a note for a name like that, can you get a note for saying you don't like a map in OOC since you're technically being a dick to the mapper who made it? If you say you don't like a new feature/removal in OOC, is that a rule violation to the coder who made the change? If those examples don't count, why does it count for nuclear operative names? Where is the line in the sand drawn differently? Sorry to play the devil's advocate here, but I'm curious on the justification.

No, it'd be handled like anything else - just saying you don't like it or voicing your opinion isn't against the rules, but admins reserve the right to ask you to knock it off if you're being obnoxious about it.

Apologies for the forbidden double post, but this is an open source game, and no one is entitled to play here. Same goes for coders, if you enforce your map on people, and a vocal minority don’t like it. Learn to cope or ignore them. This is an open source project, so buck up sonny and not let them get to you, or log off. No one deserves special treatment because of how much they contribute or admin. We are all equal.

My experience on the forums got a lot better when I added boot to my ignore list. Just saying.

[massa]

Name sucks, this deserves the note and is just in general rule 1 stuff. Imagine being the mapper behind one of these stations thinking you can finally go play the game and have some fun without being bombarded by "I hate X" and then the fucking nukie called "FUCK TRAM FUCK NORTHSTAR FUCK BIRDSHIT" shows up. That must fucking suck, keep the note

Hot take, but if you can’t take the heat get out of the kitchen. autists are going to autisticly screech about changes they don’t like. If you can’t handle that as a coder, don’t code for an open source game where your changes will be forced on everyone.

it's just bad vibes bro

no one wants those vibes because some people got lost a few times on their way to botany

[Kendrickorium]

Rule 1 doesn't apply to antagonists like nukies who are sent to blow everyone up, nor is it there to protect a non-sentient entity like a map.

It's not protecting the map, it's protecting the creator of the map, who is, or at least was, a player before getting harrassed out of the game by things like this. To you, it's a lighthearted "hahaha get it guys i'm joking about not liking the map", to them, it's yet another slap in the face they've received for dedicating a large amount of their time to a project.
Rule 4 affords no out of character protections. You can't bully someone in OOC just because you're an antagonist in the round, as an example. Setting a nukie name is an OOC act. Your character doesn't choose their family name at the start of their mission; you're not interacting with a console, or saying something, to change your name. It's a completely OOC prompt with very few, mostly non-impactful IC consequences.
Setting your nukie name to FUCK TRAM ALL MY HOMIES HATE TRAM isn't going to do much beyond annoy players who like tram. You aren't rewarded for or encouraged to have a stupid or funny name.

On topic about the actual peanut, if you can get a note for a name like that, can you get a note for saying you don't like a map in OOC since you're technically being a dick to the mapper who made it? If you say you don't like a new feature/removal in OOC, is that a rule violation to the coder who made the change? If those examples don't count, why does it count for nuclear operative names? Where is the line in the sand drawn differently? Sorry to play the devil's advocate here, but I'm curious on the justification.

IMO it ultimately depends on how far you go. It's very contextual.
If you go on a full crag-tier rant about how the coders are dung-guzzling wankers that eat raw alligator cocks for breakfast because they removed nanites, I could see an admin muting OOC and giving you a stern talking to. "I don't like <X map>" is probably fine. going into detail is probably fine. it's when you're abusive or excessive about it that it becomes a harassment issue. Expletives generally don't lend themselves well to constructive criticism.
When you take it into a nukie name, you're taking OOC (your opinion of the map) into IC(your character's last name).

stay on Manuel.

>someone says they struggle with people verbally abusing them/their work on a regular basis
>proceeds to use weird server tribalism & rib them
I don't care if this is serious or not, the timing seems real off. You kinda suck.

Apologies for the forbidden double post, but this is an open source game, and no one is entitled to play here. Same goes for coders, if you enforce your map on people, and a vocal minority don’t like it. Learn to cope or ignore them. This is an open source project, so buck up sonny and not let them get to you, or log off. No one deserves special treatment because of how much they contribute or admin. We are all equal.

except, we arent equal, all we do is PLAY here, and i'm on team coderbus for this one.
can you IMAGINE how many fucking hours chesh put into making northstar, only to, as he described, be attacked on all sides, in game, out of game, discord, etc etc. I don't have to be a game designer or coder to know that that's soul crushing when you put a lot of effort into something only to have a bunch of people scream at you that it sucks

it's absolutely necessary for people like chesh to speak up about how this personally affects him, so that we can take a step back every once in awhile and remind ourselves that we're all just hanging out in a small corner of the internet and that these guys are trying to make it better for us as players
yeah, chesh could get thicker skin, and get over it, but then we'd just have another oranges, and just one of him is enough, thanks

put disco inferno back into buyable shuttles plzkthx

[massa]

being calloused over and demoralized is bad, actually

[sinfulbliss]

I don't like Birdshot and Northstar, but I see them improving over time and I got no reason or right to just go ballistic at them.

Yes or no question: are nuclear operatives the type of antagonist that would "go ballistic" at things?
Big boy followup question (don't strain too hard): if yes, should their name be a valid part of that?

[conrad]

I don't like Birdshot and Northstar, but I see them improving over time and I got no reason or right to just go ballistic at them.

Yes or no question: are nuclear operatives the type of antagonist that would "go ballistic" at things?
Big boy followup question (don't strain too hard): if yes, should their name be a valid part of that?

The dent in my skull was not prospected for platinum, so I don't believe the hodgepodge.

[The Wrench]

Rule 1 doesn't apply to antagonists like nukies who are sent to blow everyone up, nor is it there to protect a non-sentient entity like a map.

It's not protecting the map, it's protecting the creator of the map, who is, or at least was, a player before getting harrassed out of the game by things like this. To you, it's a lighthearted "hahaha get it guys i'm joking about not liking the map", to them, it's yet another slap in the face they've received for dedicating a large amount of their time to a project.
Rule 4 affords no out of character protections. You can't bully someone in OOC just because you're an antagonist in the round, as an example. Setting a nukie name is an OOC act. Your character doesn't choose their family name at the start of their mission; you're not interacting with a console, or saying something, to change your name. It's a completely OOC prompt with very few, mostly non-impactful IC consequences.
Setting your nukie name to FUCK TRAM ALL MY HOMIES HATE TRAM isn't going to do much beyond annoy players who like tram. You aren't rewarded for or encouraged to have a stupid or funny name.

On topic about the actual peanut, if you can get a note for a name like that, can you get a note for saying you don't like a map in OOC since you're technically being a dick to the mapper who made it? If you say you don't like a new feature/removal in OOC, is that a rule violation to the coder who made the change? If those examples don't count, why does it count for nuclear operative names? Where is the line in the sand drawn differently? Sorry to play the devil's advocate here, but I'm curious on the justification.

IMO it ultimately depends on how far you go. It's very contextual.
If you go on a full crag-tier rant about how the coders are dung-guzzling wankers that eat raw alligator cocks for breakfast because they removed nanites, I could see an admin muting OOC and giving you a stern talking to. "I don't like <X map>" is probably fine. going into detail is probably fine. it's when you're abusive or excessive about it that it becomes a harassment issue. Expletives generally don't lend themselves well to constructive criticism.
When you take it into a nukie name, you're taking OOC (your opinion of the map) into IC(your character's last name).

stay on Manuel.

>someone says they struggle with people verbally abusing them/their work on a regular basis
>proceeds to use weird server tribalism & rib them
I don't care if this is serious or not, the timing seems real off. You kinda suck.

Apologies for the forbidden double post, but this is an open source game, and no one is entitled to play here. Same goes for coders, if you enforce your map on people, and a vocal minority don’t like it. Learn to cope or ignore them. This is an open source project, so buck up sonny and not let them get to you, or log off. No one deserves special treatment because of how much they contribute or admin. We are all equal.

except, we arent equal, all we do is PLAY here, and i'm on team coderbus for this one.
can you IMAGINE how many fucking hours chesh put into making northstar, only to, as he described, be attacked on all sides, in game, out of game, discord, etc etc. I don't have to be a game designer or coder to know that that's soul crushing when you put a lot of effort into something only to have a bunch of people scream at you that it sucks

it's absolutely necessary for people like chesh to speak up about how this personally affects him, so that we can take a step back every once in awhile and remind ourselves that we're all just hanging out in a small corner of the internet and that these guys are trying to make it better for us as players
yeah, chesh could get thicker skin, and get over it, but then we'd just have another oranges, and just one of him is enough, thanks

put disco inferno back into buyable shuttles plzkthx

The point is, no one is above criticism, and dispite how awful it makes me feel to say, even with how kind Chesh is, they aren’t either. It comes with the territory.

[TheLoLSwat]

Hot take, but if you can’t take the heat get out of the kitchen. autists are going to autisticly screech about changes they don’t like. If you can’t handle that as a coder, don’t code for an open source game where your changes will be forced on everyone.

there is a fine line between saying what you dont like about a map and being a poopoohead about it. Even something like "why the FUCK is x the way it is?" or "what the HELL did you do to y????" can at the very least invite a conversation. Just being mean with no valuable critique doesn't do anything for anyone though. The issue isnt that criticism happens, but that there is such a large amount that is not helpful in any way (which must be frustrating if your only goal is to improve the map and actually fix the issues)

[Kendrickorium]

The point is, no one is above criticism, and dispite how awful it makes me feel to say, even with how kind Chesh is, they aren’t either. It comes with the territory.
[/quote]

i dont understand how quotes work

as chesh has mentioned in their post, and many, many coders have mentioned in the past, criticism is not screaming that something sucks

[The Wrench]

Hot take, but if you can’t take the heat get out of the kitchen. autists are going to autisticly screech about changes they don’t like. If you can’t handle that as a coder, don’t code for an open source game where your changes will be forced on everyone.

there is a fine line between saying what you dont like about a map and being a poopoohead about it. Even something like "why the FUCK is x the way it is?" or "what the HELL did you do to y????" can at the very least invite a conversation. Just being mean with no valuable critique doesn't do anything for anyone though. The issue isnt that criticism happens, but that there is such a large amount that is not helpful in any way (which must be frustrating if your only goal is to improve the map and actually fix the issues)

While that would be the ideal, we can’t expect all our community members to have that level of decorum as nice as it would be. Everyone here is extremely passionate about this ancient space game and emotions tend to run high.

Players get assmad about changes, and then coders get assmad about players getting mad about changes. At the end of the day though, this is just a game, and nothing here really matters. Just as players have no right to play here, coders should expect no right to
Be able to code here and be completely isolated from the response to their code.

[sinfulbliss]

If you consider a nukie family name as anything more than half-assed shitposting some guy thought of during the beginning 30 seconds of adrenaline rush after rolling, you are taking this game way too seriously and need to touch grass.

That's my final comment on it.

[iwishforducks]

i remember someone talking to chesh about how chemistry was way too small and chesh replied to them that it was on purpose, that departments are meant to be “kilo-sized”. i also remember talking to chesh some months back about the pods all being in one area and how it defeats the entire design of escape pods, but they kept that in i think. im not here to comment on the design of the map- because i haven’t played it. but i want to comment on this sort of weird design mentality that mappers (and coders) seem to have on tg these days. these days, it feels like mappers intentionally try to make their station hostile to play on. tram immediately comes to mind- i mean the tagline is “tram: keeps medical busy”-, and birdshot is intentionally just fucking awful. i have more to say about these two maps but i digress.

maybe it’s a little unfair to lump northstar as one of those “hostile to play on” maps but to be honest the only reason why i have zero interest in it is because i genuinely think multi-z is a mistake and that the game would be better off without it. but anyways im rambling on here. if you’re going to intentionally design your map in a certain way you should probably expect “x sucks” - just stay true to yourself and have a design plan you’re following - it doesn’t help that there’s a headcoder whose job is solely to try to make things as toxic as possible, if they’re not already busy calling strangers “bottoms”

[iwishforducks]

anyhow if you don’t want to burn yourself out the most important part in game design is not to convince yourself it’s a war. and also to have someone that’s good at managing public relations. https://youtu.be/P05ONfLOqmY

[iwishforducks]

If you consider a nukie family name as anything more than half-assed shitposting some guy thought of during the beginning 30 seconds of adrenaline rush after rolling, you are taking this game way too seriously and need to touch grass.

That's my final comment on it.

maybe nuclear operative names are supposed to suck

[Archie700]

Remember when Rohesie left the community because MSO completely flubbed everything about the hooch issue and decided to take it out on them instead of trying to understand their reasoning for merging goof's PR? (and ended up blaming goof for it instead of apologising to Rohesie directly)

[Vekter]

i remember someone talking to chesh about how chemistry was way too small and chesh replied to them that it was on purpose, that departments are meant to be “kilo-sized”. i also remember talking to chesh some months back about the pods all being in one area and how it defeats the entire design of escape pods, but they kept that in i think. im not here to comment on the design of the map- because i haven’t played it. but i want to comment on this sort of weird design mentality that mappers (and coders) seem to have on tg these days. these days, it feels like mappers intentionally try to make their station hostile to play on. tram immediately comes to mind- i mean the tagline is “tram: keeps medical busy”-, and birdshot is intentionally just fucking awful. i have more to say about these two maps but i digress.

maybe it’s a little unfair to lump northstar as one of those “hostile to play on” maps but to be honest the only reason why i have zero interest in it is because i genuinely think multi-z is a mistake and that the game would be better off without it. but anyways im rambling on here. if you’re going to intentionally design your map in a certain way you should probably expect “x sucks” - just stay true to yourself and have a design plan you’re following - it doesn’t help that there’s a headcoder whose job is solely to try to make things as toxic as possible, if they’re not already busy calling strangers “bottoms”

1) Whether or not the map actually sucks isn't relevant to the conversation, though I'll note that "multi-z is a mistake" is such a weird fucking take, what?
2) If you can be bothered to bitch about how a map sucks, you can be bothered to give actual criticism. "(map) sucks" isn't criticism, it's bullshit noise. "I don't like the chemistry on this map because it's too small for me" is good feedback, but it's up to the creator as to whether or not they take that into consideration.

[Fren256]

Everyone should have the right to screech at your creations. You just gotta deal with it.

[Cobby]

While that would be the ideal, we can’t expect all our community members to have that level of decorum as nice as it would be. Everyone here is extremely passionate about this ancient space game and emotions tend to run high.

Players get assmad about changes, and then coders get assmad about players getting mad about changes. At the end of the day though, this is just a game, and nothing here really matters. Just as players have no right to play here, coders should expect no right to
Be able to code here and be completely isolated from the response to their code.

But we can because, like what was done here, we have the capability to note or even remove people if they get to the point they are being ugly to other players/developers. We can, at least for tg-facing places like discord/forums/server, absolutely enforce the decorum.

Passionate is not an excuse for being ugly to someone, I can understand getting heated but if you cant turn around and apologize for the former behavior so you can actually have a good-faith conversation, youre likely not long for this community. Most of the developers also share the player title as well, and any player has full capacity to fairly argue the changes prior to their implementation on the appropriate channels.

If "you" are actually passionate about the game, stop approaching the parts that really matter to "you" in the most undesirable and ineffective way possible.


The only assumption I think im missing here is that to say that toxicity is warranted or expected you have to believe that someone coding something that doesnt align with what "you" think is good for the game equates to legitimate malice, so therefore "you" harassing them or throwing insults at them is legitimized because they have some moral right to do so. If nothing really matters then that just gives you less ground to say people should be expected to catch a ton of harassment for very benign aspects simply because its in the nature of the gamer or whatever.

[TheLoLSwat]

Hot take, but if you can’t take the heat get out of the kitchen. autists are going to autisticly screech about changes they don’t like. If you can’t handle that as a coder, don’t code for an open source game where your changes will be forced on everyone.

there is a fine line between saying what you dont like about a map and being a poopoohead about it. Even something like "why the FUCK is x the way it is?" or "what the HELL did you do to y????" can at the very least invite a conversation. Just being mean with no valuable critique doesn't do anything for anyone though. The issue isnt that criticism happens, but that there is such a large amount that is not helpful in any way (which must be frustrating if your only goal is to improve the map and actually fix the issues)

While that would be the ideal, we can’t expect all our community members to have that level of decorum as nice as it would be. Everyone here is extremely passionate about this ancient space game and emotions tend to run high.

Players get assmad about changes, and then coders get assmad about players getting mad about changes. At the end of the day though, this is just a game, and nothing here really matters. Just as players have no right to play here, coders should expect no right to
Be able to code here and be completely isolated from the response to their code.

Exactly which is why we have admins that can tell people when they are doing too much. We are also all adults here so if you cant express your opinions and concerns in a way other than "FUCK X REEEE KILL YOURSELF MUH KILO", you could just be quiet or maybe ask someone else to help articulate your point.

[iwishforducks]

1) Whether or not the map actually sucks isn't relevant to the conversation, though I'll note that "multi-z is a mistake" is such a weird fucking take, what?

i agree on whether or not the map sucks isn't relevant to this conversation. as i said and outlined below:

im not here to comment on the design of the map- because i haven’t played it. but i want to comment on this sort of weird design mentality that mappers (and coders) seem to have on tg these days.

this is a completely separate conversation but i think multi-z measurably makes the game worse. it's obtuse and niche (you have to press a dedicated key/button to Look Up, and ditto for Look Down. let's not even talk about Move Up/Move Down) and yet it's a central part of the gameplay. the biggest impact multi-z has on rounds is when some greyshit is running up and down the stairs over and over again to avoid capture, or when blobs go for Le Epic Permabrig on icebox. there's no real answer to "how should projectiles work in multi-z combat" and combat suffers because of it. if you can press move up/move down in space you become essentially unhittable.

2) If you can be bothered to bitch about how a map sucks, you can be bothered to give actual criticism. "(map) sucks" isn't criticism, it's bullshit noise. "I don't like the chemistry on this map because it's too small for me" is good feedback, but it's up to the creator as to whether or not they take that into consideration.

i agree on the latter part: that it's entirely up to the map creator on whether or not they take it into consideration. it's important that map creators have the freewill to make interesting design choices. however, if a designer isn't willing to take things into consideration, the only feedback to give at that point is to say whether or not their vision sucks.

if you’re going to intentionally design your map in a certain way you should probably expect “x sucks” - just stay true to yourself and have a design plan you’re following

[iain0]

You can come up with a better name, right? Without too much real effort? Just do that. Hooray, problem solved, note is meaningless if not repeated, move on with your life.

Just take the L and learn from it. Overturning it sets the precedent that this is all okay, which I don't feel is a precedent that actually benefits anyone in any way and is demonstrably potentially negative.

[dirk_mcblade]

We have look up and move up keybindings???

[Not-Dorsidarf]

As someone who loves stupid idiot dumbass names, clowns being called "THE GREAT SHITTENER", "Willy The Wizard Who Suicides Immediately", and generally wild, wacky, stupid and referential stuff for all the antags and special roles with special naming privileges.... "FUCK TRAM FUCK NORTHSTAR FUCK BIRDSHIT" is an obnoxious trash name and you should have been forcibly renamed team "Idiot Parade" lol

[Kendrickorium]

Hot take, but if you can’t take the heat get out of the kitchen. autists are going to autisticly screech about changes they don’t like. If you can’t handle that as a coder, don’t code for an open source game where your changes will be forced on everyone.

there is a fine line between saying what you dont like about a map and being a poopoohead about it. Even something like "why the FUCK is x the way it is?" or "what the HELL did you do to y????" can at the very least invite a conversation. Just being mean with no valuable critique doesn't do anything for anyone though. The issue isnt that criticism happens, but that there is such a large amount that is not helpful in any way (which must be frustrating if your only goal is to improve the map and actually fix the issues)

While that would be the ideal, we can’t expect all our community members to have that level of decorum as nice as it would be. Everyone here is extremely passionate about this ancient space game and emotions tend to run high.

Players get assmad about changes, and then coders get assmad about players getting mad about changes. At the end of the day though, this is just a game, and nothing here really matters. Just as players have no right to play here, coders should expect no right to
Be able to code here and be completely isolated from the response to their code.

good post, but I think there is a difference between a player putting in 100 hours playing and a coder spending 100 hours on a map

no ones saying coders should be isolated, were saying holy shit dont come at them so hard that it makes them want to stop even playing

[datorangebottle]

The point is, no one is above criticism, and dispite how awful it makes me feel to say, even with how kind Chesh is, they aren’t either. It comes with the territory.

Dropping trow and shitting all over something is not criticism. It's offensive.

[Fren256]

We have look up and move up keybindings???

Because no one here is polite enough to answer you:

• "L" is to look up the Z level above you, ";" is to look down the Z level below you (though I've never been able to get this one to work)

• "Page Up" lets you move upwards Z levels

[WineAllWine]

This is the best peanut title we've had recently (most of them have been crap)

[The Wrench]

My final point, it is completely irrelevant how many hours of work someone puts on something. You will get criticized for it, and some may take it too far. If you want to make changes that everyone else who wants to play the game is *Forced* to use then prepare for the consequences be them good or bad. You could spend a million hours playing or coding, and both of them are worth jack shit when it comes to your immunity to criticism.

To the coders- Grow the fuck up and realize that sometimes people don’t like what you make, and that’s okay! You love this game and are putting your energy into making it better. Some people will be malicious for the sake of it. Don’t let it get to you but remember that these players are as passionate as you are!

To the players- Grow the fuck up and stop bullying coders over stupid bullshit. These people are volunteers working to create new things for the game you love. They are those of you who put in the time to make this game. Remember that. They are not a secret kabal of fun removers, they are just players who learned Git. Chill out.

[Kendrickorium]

This is the best peanut title we've had recently (most of them have been crap)

lamos keep making them before i do

[Archie700]

I believe the major issue is that Sinful is sincere in that it was meant to be a joke.

[Vekter]

I believe the major issue is that Sinful is sincere in that it was meant to be a joke.

And I believe the major issue is that I think they didn't.

[Archie700]

I believe the major issue is that Sinful is sincere in that it was meant to be a joke.

And I believe the major issue is that I think they didn't.

And I believe the major issue is that Sinful is wrong regardless.

[Boot]

I'm not a big fan that this note started off with Vekter misunderstanding the current naming policy then post hoc rationalizing it. The fact is that Vekter noted him "mainly" because of something that wasn't even a rule. This should be lifted on these grounds alone.

[Cobby]

I'm not a big fan that this note started off with Vekter misunderstanding the current naming policy then post hoc rationalizing it. The fact is that Vekter noted him "mainly" because of something that wasn't even a rule. This should be lifted on these grounds alone.

The only actual rule surrounding this says "try to reasonable" and is still under the purview of

Admins [...] can approve or disallow names at their discretion while in-game.

though


I dont think the mental gymnastics one has to take to consider a last name of "FUCK [maps i dislike]" perfectly reasonable to the point no admin should challenge it seems sane either.

[Fikou]

@boot ur stupid and you suck

[Fikou]

@adam klein you are more stupid and punchable as well

[Cheshify]

Hot take, but if you can’t take the heat get out of the kitchen. autists are going to autisticly screech about changes they don’t like. If you can’t handle that as a coder, don’t code for an open source game where your changes will be forced on everyone.

This is the worst kind of take. You can't simply chalk up bad and stupid behaviour to "how it's always been" or else nothing will ever change. You need to make a stand and tell people to shut the fuck up or contribute constructively. If you can't handle that, don't play an open source game where you refuse to make the changes you want to see.

[Cheshify]

The point is, no one is above criticism, and dispite how awful it makes me feel to say, even with how kind Chesh is, they aren’t either. It comes with the territory.

Here's the thing. I ADORE criticism. Criticism means someone is approaching the piece of work and finding a fault with design and I can tackle that in order to improve things. I fucking love improving the map, there's a reason I've put the time I have into it.

What Zytolg, MMM, and I get isn't criticism (the analysis and judgment of the merits and faults of a literary or artistic work.) it's blind hatred without a listed cause. I can work with "Man the North Star sucks I hate how maintenance is too deadly" (has been addressed, a large number of grilles were removed and plans are in the work to make more interesting traps. I can't work with "FUCK NORTHSTAR".

[Boot]

Hot take, but if you can’t take the heat get out of the kitchen. autists are going to autisticly screech about changes they don’t like. If you can’t handle that as a coder, don’t code for an open source game where your changes will be forced on everyone.

This is the worst kind of take. You can't simply chalk up bad and stupid behaviour to "how it's always been" or else nothing will ever change. You need to make a stand and tell people to shut the fuck up or contribute constructively. If you can't handle that, don't play an open source game where you refuse to make the changes you want to see.

Sounds pretty easy then. Just ignore the rabble who have no power over you and keep on doing what you want to do. If you can't handle people not liking what you make in a way you view as "unconstructive" then I would suggest going to a space where only you get to decide who speaks. Personally I would think that would suck because I like what you do so I do ask you to grow up, not out of a sense of being mean or spiteful but because you are going to deal with people who are alot crazier then some random shitters saying "northstar sucks".

[TheLoLSwat]

Hot take, but if you can’t take the heat get out of the kitchen. autists are going to autisticly screech about changes they don’t like. If you can’t handle that as a coder, don’t code for an open source game where your changes will be forced on everyone.

This is the worst kind of take. You can't simply chalk up bad and stupid behaviour to "how it's always been" or else nothing will ever change. You need to make a stand and tell people to shut the fuck up or contribute constructively. If you can't handle that, don't play an open source game where you refuse to make the changes you want to see.

Sounds pretty easy then. Just ignore the rabble who have no power over you and keep on doing what you want to do. If you can't handle people not liking what you make in a way you view as "unconstructive" then I would suggest going to a space where only you get to decide who speaks. Personally I would think that would suck because I like what you do so I do ask you to grow up, not out of a sense of being mean or spiteful but because you are going to deal with people who are alot crazier then some random shitters saying "northstar sucks".

why should volunteer coders / mappers have to take weirdos attacking them instead of an admin telling them to knock it off for not giving anything constructive

[AwkwardStereo]

• "L" is to look up the Z level above you, ";" is to look down the Z level below you (though I've never been able to get this one to work)

You have to be standing on a lattice or glass floor tile for look down to work.

[Boot]

Sounds pretty easy then. Just ignore the rabble who have no power over you and keep on doing what you want to do. If you can't handle people not liking what you make in a way you view as "unconstructive" then I would suggest going to a space where only you get to decide who speaks. Personally I would think that would suck because I like what you do so I do ask you to grow up, not out of a sense of being mean or spiteful but because you are going to deal with people who are alot crazier then some random shitters saying "northstar sucks".

why should volunteer coders / mappers have to take weirdos attacking them instead of an admin telling them to knock it off for not giving anything constructive

I don't want to create a space where saying "I don't like northstar" gets you nuked for not being constructive. We don't do this for anyone else and we've been doing fine.

[Jacquerel]

I believe the major issue is that Sinful is sincere in that it was meant to be a joke.

There's two options here which are either:
- Sinfull is telling the truth and even actually likes Northstar, only possibly conclusion is that he's a dumbass who doesn't understand the concept of his actions having an effect in the world.
- Sinfull is lying, only possible conclusion is that he thinks everyone else is a dumbass because his argument that his name wasn't meant to be an OOC comment is completely unbelievable.

Sounds pretty easy then. Just ignore the rabble who have no power over you and keep on doing what you want to do. If you can't handle people not liking what you make in a way you view as "unconstructive" then I would suggest going to a space where only you get to decide who speaks. Personally I would think that would suck because I like what you do so I do ask you to grow up, not out of a sense of being mean or spiteful but because you are going to deal with people who are alot crazier then some random shitters saying "northstar sucks".

why should volunteer coders / mappers have to take weirdos attacking them instead of an admin telling them to knock it off for not giving anything constructive

I don't want to create a space where saying "I don't like northstar" gets you nuked for not being constructive. We don't do this for anyone else and we've been doing fine.

If someone named their nukie team "FUCK BOOT AND FUCK SINFULL" they'd probably get noted for it too im pretty sure, there's no double standard here

[Fren256]

Sounds pretty easy then. Just ignore the rabble who have no power over you and keep on doing what you want to do.

[ekaterina]

Coders don't need to be coddled and shouldn't be coddled. If they're adding things that the players don't like, they should hear it. The game is for the players, after all.
Of course it sucks to see people shitting on something you put a lot of work into, but that's part of life. Not everybody likes you, not everybody likes your work, and players have a right to voice their opinions without walking on eggshells.