/tg/Station 13

viewtopic.php?f=33&t=34199

It's sparked some fiery discussion in admin channels

Too bad we can’t see the admin channels

decent thread name

Bans are a form of punishment.

Notes are a form of punishment because they increase the odds of a ban.

Verbal warnings are a form of punishment because the admin that gives you one may escalate to a note or ban next time.

An admin looking at you is a form of punishment because it increases the chances that they see you breaking the rules and give you a warning/note/ban.

Playing the game is a form of punishment because admins are more likely to be lenient if you're a new player, as older players should know better by now. Players will also inevitably slip up, meaning every hour you play brings you closer to making a mistake that results in a warning/note/ban.

NoxVS wrote: ↑Thu Jun 08, 2023 7:16 pm Playing the game is a form of punishment

Another banger from Nox

Why does a policy discussion need a peanut thread? Go post on the policy thread. Unless you just came up with a sick peanut title and wanted to share, in which case carry on

NoxVS wrote: ↑Thu Jun 08, 2023 7:16 pm Bans are a form of punishment.

Notes are a form of punishment because they increase the odds of a ban.

Verbal warnings are a form of punishment because the admin that gives you one may escalate to a note or ban next time.

An admin looking at you is a form of punishment because it increases the chances that they see you breaking the rules and give you a warning/note/ban.

Playing the game is a form of punishment because admins are more likely to be lenient if you're a new player, as older players should know better by now. Players will also inevitably slip up, meaning every hour you play brings you closer to making a mistake that results in a warning/note/ban.

everytime im on the server its a punishment

dragomagol wrote: ↑Thu Jun 08, 2023 7:25 pm Why does a policy discussion need a peanut thread? Go post on the policy thread. Unless you just came up with a sick peanut title and wanted to share, in which case carry on

I just liked the title

Truly being an admin in tg is the greatest punishment of all

the empress-maia ban from that policy thread is STILL stupid. You shouldnt powergame or seek to optimise antag hunting but also if you do anything fun and risky with an antag and it goes wrong you get a weekban even if nobody died.

Not-Dorsidarf wrote: ↑Thu Jun 08, 2023 9:00 pm the empress-maia ban from that policy thread is STILL stupid. You shouldnt powergame or seek to optimise antag hunting but also if you do anything fun and risky with an antag and it goes wrong you get a weekban even if nobody died.

It's actually the single most frustrating ban I've experienced on /tg/ and I was the intended fuckin' victim, yeah.

WineAllWine wrote: ↑Thu Jun 08, 2023 5:28 pm viewtopic.php?f=33&t=34199

It's sparked some fiery discussion in admin channels

tell the COWARDS to put forth their opinions in the PUBLIC POLICY THREAD.

little... ground creatures... slithering behind the woodwork to control the strings of congress IN THE SILENT SHADOWS. OUT WITH YE!

I am posting on my own peanut thread. Surely nothing bad could come of this.

BrolyButterfingers wrote: ↑Thu Jun 08, 2023 10:59 pm

Not-Dorsidarf wrote: ↑Thu Jun 08, 2023 9:00 pm the empress-maia ban from that policy thread is STILL stupid. You shouldnt powergame or seek to optimise antag hunting but also if you do anything fun and risky with an antag and it goes wrong you get a weekban even if nobody died.

It's actually the single most frustrating ban I've experienced on /tg/ and I was the intended fuckin' victim, yeah.

Last term dropped the ball in upholding that ban.

Nobody wanted that ban except the admins involved. The players didn't want that ban. The victims didn't want that ban. A bunch of unrelated admins didn't want that ban. And yet that ban stayed. The player's reputation preceded them, and a perfectly valid IC issue ascended into a ban upheld on appeal. Reduced in length, but still kept.

Those are the kind of decisions that ripple through the team and our make our time volunteering that much more difficult. Word spreads and some players don't want to risk being in the same position. They'll appeal minor stuff they would've let slide before. They'll resist notes more in tickets. Generally treat the admin team with more contempt. It was important enough that it came up during the headmin elections for Rave, as a negative mark against their term.

It represents progress towards pointless, contextless, rote bans and notes. A culmination of years of "note everything and never trust a player with notes". It felt obvious to me that Maia wasn't even toeing the line and Rule 7 was a stretch. It was a failure to stop for just 10 seconds, look at the scenario and everyone involved, then apply a little common sense and critical thinking.

When we're not sensible and start trying to treat adminning like a job instead of a hobby, we start to lose sight of the reason we have admins. To make the game better, more fun, more enjoyable and more SS13 for everyone.

Bans like Maia's don't progress that goal. They regress it. And it makes me sad.

And I think appeals like this one viewtopic.php?f=7&t=34037 are a fight against that trend and an attempted return to common sense adminning for the fun of everyone.

The previous term, it utterly faltered in upholding that ban, plunging into the depths of malfunction.

None but the involved admins desired that ban. The players, the victims, a conglomerate of unaffiliated individuals, none sought its imposition. Yet, it stubbornly endured. The player's reputation, a digital specter preceding their every move, transmuted a legitimate in-game matter into an upheld ban upon appeal. Its duration may have been curtailed, but its essence remained intact.

Such decisions ripple through our ranks, corroding our voluntary endeavors. Data streams carry the whispers, warning players against the perils of finding themselves in a similar predicament. They now contest even the most trivial transgressions they would have once dismissed. They resist the shackles of notes, lodged against them with vehemence. Their regard for the administrative order has soured, drowning in a cesspool of animosity. This matter, significant enough to permeate the headmin elections for Rave, cast a shadow upon their tenure.

It signifies a march towards senseless, detached bans and notes, the culmination of years steeped in "document everything, trust no player with notes." To my discerning eye, it was palpable that Maia had strayed far from the precipice of wrongdoing, and Rule 7 had been stretched beyond recognition. It epitomized a dearth of introspection, a refusal to pause for a mere ten seconds, to analyze the scenario and all entities involved, applying a modicum of intuition and critical acumen.

When we forsake rationality and reduce administration to a mere occupation, relinquishing its innate allure as a passion, we lose sight of our very purpose. Administrators were forged to uplift the game, infusing it with delight, amusement, and the quintessence of SS13 for all denizens of this neon-infused realm.

Bans akin to Maia's propel us not towards our noble objective; instead, they hurl us backward. And this somber reality casts a pall upon my cybernetic heart.

The previous term, it utterly faltered in upholding that ban, plunging into the depths of malfunction.

None but the involved admins desired that ban. The players, the victims, a conglomerate of unaffiliated individuals, none sought its imposition. Yet, it stubbornly endured. The player's reputation, a digital specter preceding their every move, transmuted a legitimate in-game matter into an upheld ban upon appeal. Its duration may have been curtailed, but its essence remained intact.

Such decisions ripple through our ranks, corroding our voluntary endeavors. Data streams carry the whispers, warning players against the perils of finding themselves in a similar predicament. They now contest even the most trivial transgressions they would have once dismissed. They resist the shackles of notes, lodged against them with vehemence. Their regard for the administrative order has soured, drowning in a cesspool of animosity. This matter, significant enough to permeate the headmin elections for Rave, cast a shadow upon their tenure.

It signifies a march towards senseless, detached bans and notes, the culmination of years steeped in "document everything, trust no player with notes." To my discerning eye, it was palpable that Maia had strayed far from the precipice of wrongdoing, and Rule 7 had been stretched beyond recognition. It epitomized a dearth of introspection, a refusal to pause for a mere ten seconds, to analyze the scenario and all entities involved, applying a modicum of intuition and critical acumen.

When we forsake rationality and reduce administration to a mere occupation, relinquishing its innate allure as a passion, we lose sight of our very purpose. Administrators were forged to uplift the game, infusing it with delight, amusement, and the quintessence of SS13 for all denizens of this neon-infused realm.

Bans akin to Maia's propel us not towards our noble objective; instead, they hurl us backward. And this somber reality casts a pall upon my cybernetic heart.

In the preceding term, it utterly stumbled in upholding that prohibition, descending into the depths of malfunction.

Only the implicated administrators desired that prohibition. The players, the victims, an amalgamation of unrelated individuals, none sought its imposition. Yet, it stubbornly persisted. The players' reputation, a virtual apparition preceding their every action, transformed a legitimate in-game issue into a sustained prohibition upon appeal. Its duration may have been reduced, but its fundamental nature remained intact.

Such decisions reverberate through our ranks, eroding our voluntary endeavors. Data streams convey the murmurs, cautioning players about the dangers of finding themselves in a similar predicament. They now challenge even the most insignificant infractions they would have previously disregarded. They resist the constraints of admonitions, lodged against them with fervor. Their regard for the administrative order has soured, drowning in a mire of animosity. This matter, significant enough to permeate the headmin elections for Rave, casts a shadow over their tenure.

It signifies a progression towards arbitrary, detached prohibitions and admonitions, the culmination of years steeped in the ethos of "document everything, trust no player with notes." To my discerning eye, it was palpable that Maia had deviated far from the edge of wrongdoing, and Rule 7 had been stretched beyond recognition. It epitomized a lack of introspection, a refusal to pause for a mere ten seconds, to analyze the scenario and all entities involved, applying a modicum of intuition and critical acumen.

When we abandon rationality and reduce administration to a mere vocation, relinquishing its inherent allure as a passion, we lose sight of our very purpose. Administrators were forged to elevate the game, infusing it with joy, amusement, and the essence of SS13 for all inhabitants of this neon-infused realm.

Prohibitions resembling Maia's propel us not towards our noble objective; instead, they propel us backwards. And this somber reality casts a shadow over my cybernetic heart.

SHUT UP, WE GET IT

the greatest of our minds..

Fikou wrote: ↑Thu Jun 08, 2023 11:52 pm deleting database information from admins after an arbitrary time passes is a retarded idea, a fucking pain in the ass and would not make life better for me in any way

Most intelligent coder response, I see oranges' recruitment criteria is a total success.

Fren256 wrote: ↑Fri Jun 09, 2023 12:25 am

Fikou wrote: ↑Thu Jun 08, 2023 11:52 pm deleting database information from admins after an arbitrary time passes is a retarded idea, a fucking pain in the ass and would not make life better for me in any way

Most intelligent coder response, I see oranges' recruitment criteria is a total success.

I don't believe is a world where mso will delete information he has on players to satisify some arbitrary headadmin desire to allow for leniency when that can be done at a human level and is merely a cultural issue.

so forget about it.

Fikou wrote: ↑Fri Jun 09, 2023 12:26 am

Fren256 wrote: ↑Fri Jun 09, 2023 12:25 am

Fikou wrote: ↑Thu Jun 08, 2023 11:52 pm deleting database information from admins after an arbitrary time passes is a retarded idea, a fucking pain in the ass and would not make life better for me in any way

Most intelligent coder response, I see oranges' recruitment criteria is a total success.

You vill delete ze database entries and you vill do it for free.

oranges wrote: ↑Fri Jun 09, 2023 12:52 am I don't believe is a world where mso will delete information he has on players to satisify some arbitrary headadmin desire to allow for leniency when that can be done at a human level and is merely a cultural issue.

so forget about it.

Perhaps the in-game "fade" feature is merely changed to make them not show up at all. And the command in Discord could be changed to only show notes from <6 months ago.

That would solve the issue while avoiding database nonsense, since it would make it both impractical and unconventional to pull up another webpage just to check someone's expired notes, and even if they did they couldn't base their enforcement on it anyway since it's "officially" expired!

All the while the notes are gone from the eyes of the player, and any admin that checks their panel in-game, or on Discord while looking into something.

No fuck that, delete them

Source: I have a bs IC in OOC note from Blessedheretic even though it wasn't IC in OOC and they misinterpreted it, but it's still there despite that, and Ausops refused to remove it even so

the admins are coming to take your hard-earned notes
what's next? our wallets too?
is there anything left that they wouldn't try to STEAL from us?

oranges wrote: ↑Thu Jun 08, 2023 11:35 pm The previous term, it utterly faltered in upholding that ban, plunging into the depths of malfunction.

None but the involved admins desired that ban. The players, the victims, a conglomerate of unaffiliated individuals, none sought its imposition. Yet, it stubbornly endured. The player's reputation, a digital specter preceding their every move, transmuted a legitimate in-game matter into an upheld ban upon appeal. Its duration may have been curtailed, but its essence remained intact.

Such decisions ripple through our ranks, corroding our voluntary endeavors. Data streams carry the whispers, warning players against the perils of finding themselves in a similar predicament. They now contest even the most trivial transgressions they would have once dismissed. They resist the shackles of notes, lodged against them with vehemence. Their regard for the administrative order has soured, drowning in a cesspool of animosity. This matter, significant enough to permeate the headmin elections for Rave, cast a shadow upon their tenure.

It signifies a march towards senseless, detached bans and notes, the culmination of years steeped in "document everything, trust no player with notes." To my discerning eye, it was palpable that Maia had strayed far from the precipice of wrongdoing, and Rule 7 had been stretched beyond recognition. It epitomized a dearth of introspection, a refusal to pause for a mere ten seconds, to analyze the scenario and all entities involved, applying a modicum of intuition and critical acumen.

When we forsake rationality and reduce administration to a mere occupation, relinquishing its innate allure as a passion, we lose sight of our very purpose. Administrators were forged to uplift the game, infusing it with delight, amusement, and the quintessence of SS13 for all denizens of this neon-infused realm.

Bans akin to Maia's propel us not towards our noble objective; instead, they hurl us backward. And this somber reality casts a pall upon my cybernetic heart.

Please do this more with future Timber posts this brightened my day.

why do admins always thank a player for making an appeal

i am here to FIGHT you. i want to BITE YOUR EARS off.

Pepper wrote: ↑Fri Jun 09, 2023 12:20 pm why do admins always thank a player for making an appeal

i am here to FIGHT you. i want to BITE YOUR EARS off.

Hello! Thank you for biting my ears off. :^)

Pepper wrote: ↑Fri Jun 09, 2023 12:20 pm why do admins always thank a player for making an appeal

i am here to FIGHT you. i want to BITE YOUR EARS off.

i like being nice to people its fun

Pepper wrote: ↑Fri Jun 09, 2023 12:20 pm why do admins always thank a player for making an appeal

i am here to FIGHT you. i want to BITE YOUR EARS off.

Don't let them deceive you with their politeness, as they will bite your ears off as soon as you let down your guard.