ADMIN CAUGHT STACKING NOTES FOR QC BAN: OWN MCPAIN STRIKES BACK
Posted: Sun Jun 18, 2023 6:33 pm
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Good luck?Adam Klein wrote: ↑Sun Jun 18, 2023 6:40 pm Good thread.
I call dibs on the peanut thread for the admin complaint this will lead to.
Yeah but banning shitters doesn't justify (potentially) terrible admin conduct.TheRex9001 wrote: ↑Sun Jun 18, 2023 6:59 pm Its pretty clear that this is just a ban to remove Owen from the chef role, honestly should have been done way earlier. Owen just CQC baits the entire shift, never once in my life do I see them cook and make food without a shitty additional that leads to them CQCing someone. This ban should as said been placed WAAAAAYYY earlier.
Apparently the issue is that midway of juggling adminbus, 3 log windows and two ticket windows i started one response with "yeah" without registering that i was asked a question of if they complained
why would you randomly say “yeah” in response to a question if it wasn’t to answer that questionKubisopplay wrote: ↑Sun Jun 18, 2023 7:11 pmApparently the issue is that midway of juggling adminbus, 3 log windows and two ticket windows i started one response with "yeah" without registering that i was asked a question of if they complained
"Yeah, and"Kubisopplay wrote: ↑Sun Jun 18, 2023 7:11 pmApparently the issue is that midway of juggling adminbus, 3 log windows and two ticket windows i started one response with "yeah" without registering that i was asked a question of if they complained
pretty sure he was saying "yeah, continue to explain this for me" not "yeah, he complained"sinfulbliss wrote: ↑Sun Jun 18, 2023 7:10 pmuhhh the fact that he was roleplaying with another player consensually and the admin banned him for it?
and then lied in the ahelp that the other player complained about it?
This isn't entirely correct.
As of that second point I have an actual opinion about this ban: it stinks. It's foetid. It reeks of rotting fish.Mothblocks in the Lucy thread wrote: To answer your concerns in the appeal:When several admins repeatedly tell you to stop using the same public places as a playground for you to buzz around like a mosquito with your hive, then you should stop. There is nothing general about this, it is admins telling you to tweak your gimmick.are people not allowed to fight in public places anymore?
This is just like, patently false man. Nearly every single time I saw Dean Ivanov we would get into scuffles and fights that led to one of us being crit or horribly injured, usually over nothing more than a slip or something that started out trivial. We were both totally fine with it and it made our rounds fun, neither of us had ever been bwoinked for it. Were we technically “escalation baiting” and “overescalating” on each other? Yeah. But did we both consent to this OOCly because it made for fun rounds and stories that we enjoyed? Also yeah.Vekter wrote: ↑Sun Jun 18, 2023 10:20 pm The REAL part that I think he's not understanding is that it's completely irrelevant whether or not someone consents to an action if you're breaking the rules. If you go and just immediately escalate straight to beating someone to death and they say "no actually I'm okay with it", you've still broken the rules and are subject to punishment. Kubi even puts in the thread a specific instance where we've acted on someone despite the fight being consensual between the two of them.
There's a massive difference between beating up your pal who you know is fine with it and beating up several different people and then one of them says after the fact that he was fine with it and so its retroactively oksinfulbliss wrote: ↑Sun Jun 18, 2023 10:30 pmThis is just like, patently false man. Nearly every single time I saw Dean Ivanov we would get into scuffles and fights that led to one of us being crit or horribly injured, usually over nothing more than a slip or something that started out trivial. We were both totally fine with it and it made our rounds fun, neither of us had ever been bwoinked for it. Were we technically “escalation baiting” and “overescalating” on each other? Yeah. But did we both consent to this OOCly because it made for fun rounds and stories that we enjoyed? Also yeah.Vekter wrote: ↑Sun Jun 18, 2023 10:20 pm The REAL part that I think he's not understanding is that it's completely irrelevant whether or not someone consents to an action if you're breaking the rules. If you go and just immediately escalate straight to beating someone to death and they say "no actually I'm okay with it", you've still broken the rules and are subject to punishment. Kubi even puts in the thread a specific instance where we've acted on someone despite the fight being consensual between the two of them.
In fact he was an admin (and a better one than the vast majority), so I don’t really think you’re accurate at all saying this is against the rules, it may be your own personal opinion but once again it’s not held by the vast majority of even other admins.
ok but he was bwoinked over the one who said they were fine with it. so why are you using the others as fodder? do you even know how those conflicts transpired? why are you automatically assuming he just CQCd a bunch of people FNRNoxVS wrote: ↑Sun Jun 18, 2023 10:40 pmThere's a massive difference between beating up your pal who you know is fine with it and beating up several different people and then one of them says after the fact that he was fine with it and so its retroactively oksinfulbliss wrote: ↑Sun Jun 18, 2023 10:30 pmThis is just like, patently false man. Nearly every single time I saw Dean Ivanov we would get into scuffles and fights that led to one of us being crit or horribly injured, usually over nothing more than a slip or something that started out trivial. We were both totally fine with it and it made our rounds fun, neither of us had ever been bwoinked for it. Were we technically “escalation baiting” and “overescalating” on each other? Yeah. But did we both consent to this OOCly because it made for fun rounds and stories that we enjoyed? Also yeah.Vekter wrote: ↑Sun Jun 18, 2023 10:20 pm The REAL part that I think he's not understanding is that it's completely irrelevant whether or not someone consents to an action if you're breaking the rules. If you go and just immediately escalate straight to beating someone to death and they say "no actually I'm okay with it", you've still broken the rules and are subject to punishment. Kubi even puts in the thread a specific instance where we've acted on someone despite the fight being consensual between the two of them.
In fact he was an admin (and a better one than the vast majority), so I don’t really think you’re accurate at all saying this is against the rules, it may be your own personal opinion but once again it’s not held by the vast majority of even other admins.
It's nonetheless reasonable on the other person's side to believe you're lying when you talk like that.Kubisopplay wrote: ↑Sun Jun 18, 2023 7:11 pmApparently the issue is that midway of juggling adminbus, 3 log windows and two ticket windows i started one response with "yeah" without registering that i was asked a question of if they complained
okay but he didn’t abuse anyone EXCEPT his friend, everyone else he tossed out nonlethally, and the BAN IS ABOUT HIS FRIEND not the “many people”Kendrickorium wrote: ↑Sun Jun 18, 2023 10:53 pm got a feeling the headmins are gonna side with the admin on this one boys
the whole "angry chef abuses as many people as possible with cqc" doesnt stop being a thing just because it was the guys friend in this specific instance
its already been pointed out in the thread or the appeal i forget that he does this all the time
Do you member when CQC was kitchen only? I member.
I agree, which is why I am saying this ban should have been placed way earlier.Lacran wrote: ↑Sun Jun 18, 2023 7:03 pmYeah but banning shitters doesn't justify (potentially) terrible admin conduct.TheRex9001 wrote: ↑Sun Jun 18, 2023 6:59 pm Its pretty clear that this is just a ban to remove Owen from the chef role, honestly should have been done way earlier. Owen just CQC baits the entire shift, never once in my life do I see them cook and make food without a shitty additional that leads to them CQCing someone. This ban should as said been placed WAAAAAYYY earlier.
You are free to disagree. That doesn't change the fact that you aren't allowed to do it. Feel free to open a policy discussion thread if you want to change the rules around it.
you made it look so fun I wanted to give it a shot.
because i looked at the logs and saw he CQCd a bunch of people FNRsinfulbliss wrote: ↑Sun Jun 18, 2023 10:50 pm ok but he was bwoinked over the one who said they were fine with it. so why are you using the others as fodder? do you even know how those conflicts transpired? why are you automatically assuming he just CQCd a bunch of people FNR
Man, either you were very quick to read my logs or you logdived to checkNoxVS wrote: ↑Sun Jun 18, 2023 11:51 pmbecause i looked at the logs and saw he CQCd a bunch of people FNRsinfulbliss wrote: ↑Sun Jun 18, 2023 10:50 pm ok but he was bwoinked over the one who said they were fine with it. so why are you using the others as fodder? do you even know how those conflicts transpired? why are you automatically assuming he just CQCd a bunch of people FNR
do the others magically not count? Ignoring the one who said they were fine with it just, they CQCd:
Phoebe Mehlmotte, no prior attack logs. Only grabbed and thrown.
Quirky-Lizard, no prior attack logs. Grabbed, beat, knocked out, thrown.
Xil-Go, no prior attack logs. Grabbed, beat, knocked out, thrown. Returned and was beat, cuffed, robbed, crit, thrown. Returned and unsuccessfully tried to stop Owen.
Dank O'Honker, no prior attack logs. Only grabbed and thrown, twice.
Eternius Lament, no prior attack logs, in the kitchen at the time. Only grabbed and thrown. Included for the sake of not leaving out information.
Jimmy Jimmy, prior fight. CQC used defensively, although Owen appears to be the aggressor in the prior fight.
Richard Walker, prior shoving. Just a CQC shove, not meaningful
Sergei Bobrov, no prior attack logs, in the kitchen at the time. Only grabbed and thrown. Later shoved Owen multiple times, was CQCd into crit and thrown. Returned to the kitchen, knocked out and thrown.
Bites-The-Dust, no prior attack logs. Grabbed, knocked out, failed disposal attempt, slightly beat up. Attempted to arrest Owen, seemingly unsuccessfully.
Keith Alex, no prior attack logs. Slightly beat, grabbed, thrown.
Gregory Henderson, no prior attack logs, in the kitchen at the time. Grabbed, knocked out, thrown.
Code: Select all
02:36:08 ATTACK Maxoess/(Owen McShain) slipped on the [floor] (130, 130, 2) Bar Lounge
02:36:09 ATTACK Maxoess/(Owen McShain) slipped on the [floor] (131, 130, 2) Bar Lounge
02:36:09 ATTACK Maxoess/(Owen McShain) slipped on the [floor] (132, 130, 2) Bar Lounge
02:36:12 ATTACK Maxoess/(Owen McShain) slipped on the [floor] (133, 130, 2) Bar Lounge
02:36:13 ATTACK Maxoess/(Owen McShain) slipped on the [floor] (132, 130, 2) Bar Lounge
02:36:13 ATTACK Maxoess/(Owen McShain) slipped on the [floor] (131, 130, 2) Bar Lounge
02:36:13 ATTACK Maxoess/(Owen McShain) slipped on the [floor] (130, 130, 2) Bar Lounge
02:36:17 ATTACK Maxoess/(Owen McShain) slipped on the [floor] (129, 130, 2) Bar Lounge
02:36:24 ATTACK Maxoess/(Owen McShain) slipped on the [floor] (130, 130, 2) Bar Lounge
02:36:24 ATTACK Maxoess/(Owen McShain) slipped on the [floor] (131, 130, 2) Bar Lounge
02:36:24 ATTACK Maxoess/(Owen McShain) slipped on the [floor] (132, 130, 2) Bar Lounge
02:36:25 ATTACK Maxoess/(Owen McShain) slipped on the [floor] (133, 130, 2) Bar Lounge
02:36:25 ATTACK Maxoess/(Owen McShain) slipped on the [floor] (134, 130, 2) Bar Lounge
02:36:26 ATTACK Maxoess/(Owen McShain) slipped on the [floor] (134, 129, 2) Bar Lounge
02:36:26 ATTACK Maxoess/(Owen McShain) slipped on the [floor] (135, 129, 2) Bar Lounge
02:36:26 ATTACK Maxoess/(Owen McShain) slipped on the [floor] (136, 129, 2) Bar Lounge
02:36:26 ATTACK Maxoess/(Owen McShain) slipped on the [floor] (136, 128, 2) Bar Lounge
02:38:06 ATTACK Maxoess/(Owen McShain) slipped on the [floor] (134, 130, 2) Bar Lounge
02:38:06 ATTACK Maxoess/(Owen McShain) slipped on the [floor] (133, 130, 2) Bar Lounge
02:38:07 ATTACK Maxoess/(Owen McShain) slipped on the [floor] (132, 130, 2) Bar Lounge
02:38:07 ATTACK Maxoess/(Owen McShain) slipped on the [floor] (131, 130, 2) Bar Lounge
02:38:10 ATTACK Maxoess/(Owen McShain) slipped on the [floor] (132, 130, 2) Bar Lounge
Nah, I feel you on this. As long as you're not dragging others into the fight (it's their fault for joining in as some bloodthirsty lynchsquad) and getting people involved in your business (they should really mind their own business), it's fun, and it's always wonderful to watch the victor. After one contestant is out cold, it shouldn't be an issue to subject them to "tends wounds, brute, basic" hell for a bit. It should be quite self-explanatory when it's not a fight to wrestle the corpse from the winner. Alas, we can't have nice things because a space Lucy crawled her lobster ass through medbay and got doctors involved in some Peter Griffin vs Chicken fight for the umpteenth time. Granted... it was funny to watch Lucy get her ass kicked, so no complaints from me. I honestly felt that aside from how common it occurred, it added some hilarious spice to the round of "WHAT THE FUCK IS GOING ON?!!" to break the monotony.Itseasytosee2me wrote: ↑Sun Jun 18, 2023 7:47 pm I may be a minority opinion among admins, but I see picking fights to be pretty healthy for the game as long as you are acting in character. We have pretty defined escalation rules, and it doesn’t look like any were broken by either of the parties.
Notepad++ is great. CTRL + F, Mark, search using a word in the logs you want removed "slipped on the [floor]", mark all, Search, Bookmark, Removed Bookmarked Lines.Archie700 wrote: ↑Mon Jun 19, 2023 12:01 am Also the worst part of the logs was trying to remove this clutter in the middle of fightsCode: Select all
02:36:08 ATTACK Maxoess/(Owen McShain) slipped on the [floor] (130, 130, 2) Bar Lounge 02:36:09 ATTACK Maxoess/(Owen McShain) slipped on the [floor] (131, 130, 2) Bar Lounge 02:36:09 ATTACK Maxoess/(Owen McShain) slipped on the [floor] (132, 130, 2) Bar Lounge 02:36:12 ATTACK Maxoess/(Owen McShain) slipped on the [floor] (133, 130, 2) Bar Lounge 02:36:13 ATTACK Maxoess/(Owen McShain) slipped on the [floor] (132, 130, 2) Bar Lounge 02:36:13 ATTACK Maxoess/(Owen McShain) slipped on the [floor] (131, 130, 2) Bar Lounge 02:36:13 ATTACK Maxoess/(Owen McShain) slipped on the [floor] (130, 130, 2) Bar Lounge 02:36:17 ATTACK Maxoess/(Owen McShain) slipped on the [floor] (129, 130, 2) Bar Lounge 02:36:24 ATTACK Maxoess/(Owen McShain) slipped on the [floor] (130, 130, 2) Bar Lounge 02:36:24 ATTACK Maxoess/(Owen McShain) slipped on the [floor] (131, 130, 2) Bar Lounge 02:36:24 ATTACK Maxoess/(Owen McShain) slipped on the [floor] (132, 130, 2) Bar Lounge 02:36:25 ATTACK Maxoess/(Owen McShain) slipped on the [floor] (133, 130, 2) Bar Lounge 02:36:25 ATTACK Maxoess/(Owen McShain) slipped on the [floor] (134, 130, 2) Bar Lounge 02:36:26 ATTACK Maxoess/(Owen McShain) slipped on the [floor] (134, 129, 2) Bar Lounge 02:36:26 ATTACK Maxoess/(Owen McShain) slipped on the [floor] (135, 129, 2) Bar Lounge 02:36:26 ATTACK Maxoess/(Owen McShain) slipped on the [floor] (136, 129, 2) Bar Lounge 02:36:26 ATTACK Maxoess/(Owen McShain) slipped on the [floor] (136, 128, 2) Bar Lounge 02:38:06 ATTACK Maxoess/(Owen McShain) slipped on the [floor] (134, 130, 2) Bar Lounge 02:38:06 ATTACK Maxoess/(Owen McShain) slipped on the [floor] (133, 130, 2) Bar Lounge 02:38:07 ATTACK Maxoess/(Owen McShain) slipped on the [floor] (132, 130, 2) Bar Lounge 02:38:07 ATTACK Maxoess/(Owen McShain) slipped on the [floor] (131, 130, 2) Bar Lounge 02:38:10 ATTACK Maxoess/(Owen McShain) slipped on the [floor] (132, 130, 2) Bar Lounge
I get you, I was just rushing for time because I had to leave home and just searched Owen McShain on scrubby
This sounds like more of a QC ban with past incidents taken into accountBanned from Roles: Cook permanently - This is a discretionary permaban from chef, prompted by repeated incidents of baiting people into conflict by witholding food, and then abusing CQC to escalate the conflict. You were warned for it before, and you were banned for it before. If you believe it to be a mistake, appeal on forums
It is a chef perma job ban.TypicalRig wrote: ↑Mon Jun 19, 2023 12:45 am I once had Iain note him because roundstart he cooked food, put it on the inside of the kitchen, and pretended to afk inside of a closet so he could CQC anyone that climbed the table to get food with no visible chef around for ages. And he told me that he was already observing him pre-ahelp. So he does have a tendency to roll chef just to attack people with shoddy reasoning and even if this particular instance seems particularly harmless I can definitely understand why an admin would see this and think "Holy shit man needs to stop." You know someone's behavior is sketchy when kindmin Iain is monitoring them near roundstart as a ghost for hiding in a closet. Go chef and use it to self-antag, wonder why an admin doesn't believe that one of your many fights as chef is in good faith.
Lucy Cicero got in trouble for doing it round after round after round. Owen is getting the same treatment. But why the hell isn't this just a chef job ban in this scenario?
Ah misread and only saw the "permanent." Cheers! Then I think there's nothing wrong with the ban. It's just for repeat CQC abuse.Archie700 wrote: ↑Mon Jun 19, 2023 12:47 amIt is a chef perma job ban.TypicalRig wrote: ↑Mon Jun 19, 2023 12:45 am I once had Iain note him because roundstart he cooked food, put it on the inside of the kitchen, and pretended to afk inside of a closet so he could CQC anyone that climbed the table to get food with no visible chef around for ages. And he told me that he was already observing him pre-ahelp. So he does have a tendency to roll chef just to attack people with shoddy reasoning and even if this particular instance seems particularly harmless I can definitely understand why an admin would see this and think "Holy shit man needs to stop." You know someone's behavior is sketchy when kindmin Iain is monitoring them near roundstart as a ghost for hiding in a closet. Go chef and use it to self-antag, wonder why an admin doesn't believe that one of your many fights as chef is in good faith.
Lucy Cicero got in trouble for doing it round after round after round. Owen is getting the same treatment. But why the hell isn't this just a chef job ban in this scenario?