/tg/Station 13

viewtopic.php?f=7&t=35733

Sometimes we forget we're all imperfect players in an imperfect game where paranoia is a main part of the game.

I'm not reading this but when will people learn they can search up their tickets.

This is literally the first ban appeal peanut I've found that I just can't bring myself to read. I've clicked the link 3 times now but my eyes keep glazing over the walls of text and the dump of screenshots

I read "My actions were adequately justified IC"
Then read the ban reason and got hit by a mental flash bang.

Then read more of it and was more understanding but the initial viewing of it was funny.




Then I realized they decapitated the hop....You dont do that to someone if you think they are a ling. It just makes reviving them harder if they arn't one and doesnt stop them from self reviving.

I read it, I think the note needs to be edited or something because he seemed to have a lot of reasons to think the hop was a traitor or a ling. Beheading is a lot, yes, but this is LRP and you are allowed to do anything you want to antags, yeah?

Isn't this the guy who got banned from the Discord for posting a video of someone shitting all over the floor? Like a week ago?

MooCow12 wrote: ↑Sat Feb 10, 2024 8:07 pm Then I realized they decapitated the hop....You dont do that to someone if you think they are a ling. It just makes reviving them harder if they arn't one and doesnt stop them from self reviving.

It looks like this guy started playing about 3 weeks ago (and immediately started playing captain for some reason), so I think they'd probably do the same to a real ling. For whatever reason, new players tend to assume that beheading kills lings. Though this was definitely an overreaction from the captain.

i generally dislike punishing what seems like an innocent mistake for not having enough game knowledge, but this is a series of skill issues unlike any other where they used niche game knowledge as a check on someone else while failing a billion of their own checks.

choosing to believe everything they said, using knowing that carp don't attack people in crit (which i had to ask around about to test my theory that this is not well known information, i found a couple of players with over 1k living hours that didn't know this) as a tell to confirm someone as a ling, then imagining being strangled when it just didn't happen (they have to upgrade the grab multiple times each with its own sound cue and giant red message, along with the final giant red message that you're being strangled, and it takes a long time to perform so there's plenty of time to figure out what's happening) is quite a bizarre sequence of events.

then there is the fact of using niche game knowledge as an antag tell, but not knowing that a ling isn't killed by decapitation. following on from that, they must have known that they never at any point actually confirmed that this person was a ling - they never had any doubt in their mind while surgically removing their head from their body that this could be a mistake?

i think combined with the fact that the hop sorta-maybe-but-not-really threatened them earlier by proxy with the AI over public comms would be an absolutely fine reason to suspect someone, and with the dragging it starts to not look good, but they never *actually* attacked the captain? to then immediately decide to saw their head off and leave them in the morgue is quite the leap.

tl;dr passive grabbing and dragging someone away from hostile mobs is not a good tell for lings to the point that you can happily RR them with no further due diligence on your part.

i think this is a good lesson on how not to use deductive reasoning in rounds.

Constellado wrote: ↑Sat Feb 10, 2024 11:27 pm I read it, I think the note needs to be edited or something because he seemed to have a lot of reasons to think the hop was a traitor or a ling. Beheading is a lot, yes, but this is LRP and you are allowed to do anything you want to antags, yeah?

It's important to emphasize the "to antags" part. It's on you if you don't make sure your target's an antag and you end up killing a non-antag. While it doesn't mean they did it out of bad faith because they hate the HoP, it's still a fuck-up that should be noted. If they learn from it, it won't go anywhere. If they don't, then the punishments will only get harder

Constellado wrote: ↑Sat Feb 10, 2024 11:27 pm I read it, I think the note needs to be edited or something because he seemed to have a lot of reasons to think the hop was a traitor or a ling. Beheading is a lot, yes, but this is LRP and you are allowed to do anything you want to antags, yeah?

There is legitimately too little reasoning to go on that the hop was an antag, let alone a ling.

If he had very good reason, then it would not be edited, it would be removed.

i wanted to clarify that i have 0 reason to believe the captain has any true bad intentions - they just made a series of bad choices based on a number of things but to me above all else it's just inexperience. a 7 day command ban seems like a long time but this should be a lesson more than a punishment. this player needs more time to simmer and see more of how, when and why to make these execution style calls. they will make an excellent captain in due time.

this guy is definitely evading an older ban.

oranges wrote: ↑Sun Feb 11, 2024 7:02 pm this guy is definitely evading an older ban.

I'm not sure this guy is old enough to have an older ban

dendydoom wrote: ↑Sun Feb 11, 2024 6:49 pm i wanted to clarify that i have 0 reason to believe the captain has any true bad intentions - they just made a series of bad choices based on a number of things but to me above all else it's just inexperience. a 7 day command ban seems like a long time but this should be a lesson more than a punishment. this player needs more time to simmer and see more of how, when and why to make these execution style calls. they will make an excellent captain in due time.

this guy just got banned from the discord for posting someone taking a shit on the floor

IT’S THE SAME FUCKING GUY??? WILD!

Blacklist897 wrote: ↑Sun Feb 11, 2024 9:14 pm

dendydoom wrote: ↑Sun Feb 11, 2024 6:49 pm i wanted to clarify that i have 0 reason to believe the captain has any true bad intentions - they just made a series of bad choices based on a number of things but to me above all else it's just inexperience. a 7 day command ban seems like a long time but this should be a lesson more than a punishment. this player needs more time to simmer and see more of how, when and why to make these execution style calls. they will make an excellent captain in due time.

this guy just got banned from the discord for posting someone taking a shit on the floor

trying to see the good in people aint easy but im out here and im doin it every dang day

Trilinear wrote: ↑Sun Feb 11, 2024 9:46 am For whatever reason, new players tend to assume that beheading kills lings.

If I were to guess, it's probably zombie logic. Most media tends to follow the rule that anything that can self-revive can be killed by destroying or decapitating the head. Plus, in SS13, your "self" is always your brain, whatever your brain is in is what you are, so by destroying the head with the brain they think they're killing the ling or at the very least leaving the ling alive as a head.

We should probably make policy/clarification on cumulative escalation or evidence not being a thing, a lot of player's act on cumulative things that build up their frustration/assurance of other's antag status throughout a round and will eventually act on it even though in the grand scheme of things it might just be a laundry list of alot of tiny things and no direct smoking gun that allows them to escalate further while admins seem to stick to the smoking gun only approach.

Like when i got banned for throwing paris konuts infront of the tram shuttle to get him ran over, i had cumulative reasons of 1, i was convinced he random searched me, 2, he kept me from my heirloom, 3 he didnt even care about the hand tele that i had he just openly flaunted/gloated that he could permabrig me because i had it (i wanted to make an abandoned teleporter base) then axlebrady tided brig and just picked it up off the floor and let me out, 4, he didnt let me out of permabrig after captain told him to let me out saying "he keeps his radio off" none of these were smoking gun things but that cumulative shit made me feel like I could do something when we apparently have smoking gun policy.

MooCow12 wrote: ↑Tue Feb 13, 2024 1:00 am We should probably make policy/clarification on cumulative escalation or evidence not being a thing, a lot of player's act on cumulative things that build up their frustration/assurance of other's antag status throughout a round and will eventually act on it even though in the grand scheme of things it might just be a laundry list of alot of tiny things and no direct smoking gun that allows them to escalate further while admins seem to stick to the smoking gun only approach.

Like when i got banned for throwing paris konuts infront of the tram shuttle to get him ran over, i had cumulative reasons of 1, i was convinced he random searched me, 2, he kept me from my heirloom, 3 he didnt even care about the hand tele that i had he just openly flaunted/gloated that he could permabrig me because i had it (i wanted to make an abandoned teleporter base) then axlebrady tided brig and just picked it up off the floor and let me out, 4, he didnt let me out of permabrig after captain told him to let me out saying "he keeps his radio off" none of these were smoking gun things but that cumulative shit made me feel like I could do something when we apparently have smoking gun policy.

Yeah, this.

There are times when one can think a person has to be an antag because of lots of small little things that build up over time. This seems to be one of them.
He also thought he was being choked because he was being dragged slowly into another room while we was in crit. I wouldn't blame him for it. That would count as a smoking gun if it was real. The issue is... it was not.