[MRP] Disallow willingly becoming cultists for antag privileges.

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carshalash
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[MRP] Disallow willingly becoming cultists for antag privileges.

Post by carshalash » #685410

I hate the fact this even requires a fucking thread. Apparently, there is no policy on whether running up onto cult runes and asking to be converted is 'bad' or not so admins don't want to act on it.
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Re: [MRP] Disallow willingly becoming cultists for antag privileges.

Post by AwkwardStereo » #685411

carshalash wrote: Sat May 13, 2023 6:34 am I hate the fact this even requires a fucking thread. Apparently, there is no policy on whether running up onto cult runes and asking to be converted is 'bad' or not so admins don't want to act on it.
This is already against the rules. Pretty sure it counts as antag rolling. I have banned people in the past for doing this.
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Re: [MRP] Disallow willingly becoming cultists for antag privileges.

Post by carshalash » #685412

AwkwardStereo wrote: Sat May 13, 2023 6:37 am
carshalash wrote: Sat May 13, 2023 6:34 am I hate the fact this even requires a fucking thread. Apparently, there is no policy on whether running up onto cult runes and asking to be converted is 'bad' or not so admins don't want to act on it.
This is already against the rules. Pretty sure it counts as antag rolling. I have banned people in the past for doing this.
That's interesting since mannymins just gave it a big thumbs up.
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tattle
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Re: [MRP] Disallow willingly becoming cultists for antag privileges.

Post by tattle » #685413

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You can make a complaint about it or leave admin feedback, but I dunno if I'd call this "a big thumbs up." As stereo points out, this is against the rules as written today.
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Re: [MRP] Disallow willingly becoming cultists for antag privileges.

Post by carshalash » #685414

dragomagol wrote: Sat May 13, 2023 6:52 am
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You can make a complaint about it or leave admin feedback, but I dunno if I'd call this "a big thumbs up." As stereo points out, this is against the rules as written today.
Allowing actions is a thumbs up dragomagol. Closing the ticket and not doing anything as people keep willingly getting culted is allowing actions. Logs of that round show that the only player panel inspected during that round was mine due to my complaining.
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Post by vect0r » #685415

Ok, admins, if somebody is just sitting on a rune to become a cultist, can you bwoink them? Thanks!
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Re: [MRP] Disallow willingly becoming cultists for antag privileges.

Post by Pandarsenic » #685417

As stated, already against the rules - but it can be a bit hard to spot.

If you believe this is happening, please inform us ASAP in a USEFUL ahelp - give as much detail as possible of whomstdve went to get converted voluntarily, why you believe they did it voluntarily.... when, if you're able to, for log diving reasons... and so on.

That said, I think there are key factors in the logs that would indicate a conversion was voluntary - other than the simple SAY logs, you can also see...
- Did the victim get stunned
- What was in their combat logs leading up to the stun
- WHERE did they get stunned vs. WHERE did they get converted
- Were they conspicuously inactive until they got grabbed (e.g. "AFKing" in public places waiting to be stunned) and then suddenly active after conversion

We can look for all of those things, we just need the relevant names and stuff to actually know whose vibes we need to check. Hell, if you check the logs for the above, uh...

BRING BACK BAN REQUESTS 2023 no uh apparently you have to send a Forum PM to the headmins with the relevant logs, which sure is an interesting system, but I say do it anyway if you're that convinced. Also, no rules say you can't post it here to inform the discussion or in Player's Club to talk shit about them, I guess?
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Re: [MRP] Disallow willingly becoming cultists for antag privileges.

Post by Super Aggro Crag » #685433

this is fucked up and uncool
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Re: [MRP] Disallow willingly becoming cultists for antag privileges.

Post by Fikou » #685442

pointless thread, its already not allowed. the fact that you provided 0 info for the admin to work off in a confusing situation doesnt mean the admins gave it a big thumbs up
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Re: [MRP] Disallow willingly becoming cultists for antag privileges.

Post by carshalash » #685443

Fikou wrote: Sat May 13, 2023 2:08 pm pointless thread, its already not allowed. the fact that you provided 0 info for the admin to work off in a confusing situation doesnt mean the admins gave it a big thumbs up
People were literally in bar asking to be converted by a guy in the combat cult gear, what extra context did he need?
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Re: [MRP] Disallow willingly becoming cultists for antag privileges.

Post by Farquaar » #685444

carshalash wrote: Sat May 13, 2023 2:33 pm People were literally in bar asking to be converted by a guy in the combat cult gear, what extra context did he need?
Maybe they found his theological arguments persuasive?
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Re: [MRP] Disallow willingly becoming cultists for antag privileges.

Post by wubli » #685445

carshalash wrote: Sat May 13, 2023 2:33 pm
Fikou wrote: Sat May 13, 2023 2:08 pm pointless thread, its already not allowed. the fact that you provided 0 info for the admin to work off in a confusing situation doesnt mean the admins gave it a big thumbs up
People were literally in bar asking to be converted by a guy in the combat cult gear, what extra context did he need?
did you tell them who these people were exactly or just "what's with people self antagging"
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Re: [MRP] Disallow willingly becoming cultists for antag privileges.

Post by Itseasytosee2me » #685447

Willing conversion is dumb and against the rules but I feel like there was a policy thread where a headmin (I think san or rave) said that they were alright with willing conversion if it had significant RP precedent. Like of you talked someone up enough you could convince them to take off their sunglasses to be revolutionized or something.
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Re: [MRP] Disallow willingly becoming cultists for antag privileges.

Post by Fikou » #685451

wubli wrote: Sat May 13, 2023 3:24 pm
carshalash wrote: Sat May 13, 2023 2:33 pm
Fikou wrote: Sat May 13, 2023 2:08 pm pointless thread, its already not allowed. the fact that you provided 0 info for the admin to work off in a confusing situation doesnt mean the admins gave it a big thumbs up
People were literally in bar asking to be converted by a guy in the combat cult gear, what extra context did he need?
did you tell them who these people were exactly or just "what's with people self antagging"
all the tickets were posted by tattle in this thread. the only things said by carsh were that and ":doubt:", pretending that asking to be a cultist is allowed when he just did not give any information is in bad faith
this whole thread is pretty much just an admin complaint posed as a policy thing
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Re: [MRP] Disallow willingly becoming cultists for antag privileges.

Post by Cobby » #685467

Itseasytosee2me wrote: Sat May 13, 2023 4:15 pm Willing conversion is dumb and against the rules but I feel like there was a policy thread where a headmin (I think san or rave) said that they were alright with willing conversion if it had significant RP precedent. Like of you talked someone up enough you could convince them to take off their sunglasses to be revolutionized or something.
You've always been able to "help" antags if given a particular rp incentive but that rp incentive has to measure with how youre helping.

They give you a pair of wirecutters doesnt equate to now you can help kill with the traitor for instance.

Now for cultist conversion im not sure what RP incentive outside of flat out being killed for refusing you'd want to "legally" allow for. I could see helping a cultist escape if they were particularly nice to you or something but actually joining them knowing you have to start killing or forcibly converting people who have had no quarrel with you makes it VERY difficult to justify imo (outside of the obvious I want antag).
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Re: [MRP] Disallow willingly becoming cultists for antag privileges.

Post by RedBaronFlyer » #685482

Cult Con is peak RP. But yeah, the incident they were referring to is one that happened yesterday where someone did Cult Con in the bar on Cerestation and summoned Nar'sie in, like, 15 minutes. I don't know how "roleplay-ie" it was since I was in cargo the whole shift.
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Super Aggro Crag wrote: Fri Mar 03, 2023 5:11 pm I assume he did it elsewhere because it's fucking goofball and he never half-asses his shitty ideas, he full asses them so both cheeks are absolutely slathered in shit
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Re: [MRP] Disallow willingly becoming cultists for antag privileges.

Post by Lacran » #685580

In their defence it was cerestation and I would choose Nar'sie over cerestation in a heartbeat
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Re: [MRP] Disallow willingly becoming cultists for antag privileges.

Post by Misdoubtful » #685897

This is already generally against the rules if an admin makes to the choice to enforce against it and finds evidence of it.
We agree with what Pandarsenic stated here:
Pandarsenic wrote: Sat May 13, 2023 8:19 am As stated, already against the rules - but it can be a bit hard to spot.

If you believe this is happening, please inform us ASAP in a USEFUL ahelp - give as much detail as possible of whomstdve went to get converted voluntarily, why you believe they did it voluntarily.... when, if you're able to, for log diving reasons... and so on.

That said, I think there are key factors in the logs that would indicate a conversion was voluntary - other than the simple SAY logs, you can also see...
- Did the victim get stunned
- What was in their combat logs leading up to the stun
- WHERE did they get stunned vs. WHERE did they get converted
- Were they conspicuously inactive until they got grabbed (e.g. "AFKing" in public places waiting to be stunned) and then suddenly active after conversion

We can look for all of those things, we just need the relevant names and stuff to actually know whose vibes we need to check.
However admins also have the autonomy to waive any cult gimmicks that they see.
Coconutwarrior97 wrote: Thu Mar 11, 2021 2:45 am MRP cult weight has been adjusted from 3 to 2, and traitor from 5 to 6. Admins may accommodate any kind of gimmick cult as they see fit.

This policy was made thanks to discussion in policy bus.

Headmin Votes:
Coconutwarrior97: Yes.
Domitius: Yes.
Naloac: Yes.
That being said this not a pass for walking up and asking to be or allowing themselves to be converted willy-nilly however. The intention is that there is a gimmick present creating an interesting or unique story/experience/round. Not just people silently hopping on the rune because they can.
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