What are the limits of prisoner disposability?

[Imitates-The-Lizards]

Spurred on by: viewtopic.php?f=23&t=34073

After thinking about it, there's a lot to explore here:

Can Security hand out prisoners to Scientists or MDs for experimentation? Does this have to be voluntary on the prisoner's part? Does this only apply to roundstart prisoners, or can all prisoners be voluntold for experimentation? Is antag status relevant? If so, how much? Can you only be voluntold to do things if you commit a capital offense? Is this an acceptable alternative to perma/execution?
Can we feed prisoners to a xeno egg?
Can prisoners be sold into slavery by security?
Can I work out a deal with medbay to release a prisoner only if they get their brain implanted into a monkey?
Can Prisoners be forced to defuse bombs?
Prisoners have long been able to be armed to fight things like blobs. But is this mandatory if Security orders them to? Can Security execute a prisoner who refuses to fight a blob?

I'm sure you all have other ideas. I'd love to hear what people think about the limits of prisoner disposability, especially since most people hate brig/gulag/perma sentences. This has serious opportunity to make punishments more interesting from Security.

[SkeletalElite]

Spurred on by: viewtopic.php?f=23&t=34073


Does this only apply to roundstart prisoners, or can all prisoners be voluntold for experimentation? Is antag status relevant? If so, how much?

Not going to comment on the other parts of the question, but anytime you're putting someone in perma, you're already in a scenario where you could have just killed them if you want. Antag status isn't really relevant, only if they were acting like one. So because the condition for putting someone in perma is them acting like an antag and being valid under rule 4, they are also valid for experimentation or killing. Of course, round start prisoners aren't instantly valid to rule 4 unless they try to break out.

[Timberpoes]

This is how I've always interpreted/enforced:

For non-job prisoners: Anyone validly in perma is/was also valid for execution. Their life in the hands of other players. That means anything not otherwise against the rules (including creative execution methods like feeding to Xenos) is within the rules.

For job prisoners: They're not antags and security shouldn't treat them like they're "valid". They may become valid through their own actions, like attacking security (may also be a rule break if done for no/poor reason or is excessive) or trying to escape/actually escaping. Unless this happens, they shouldn't be forcefully executed or mistreated in a way that that would also be a rule break.

Players can consent to another player breaking the rules against them within limits; the more RP-friendly this is done the better (so Family Guy chicken fighters can swivel on it). Which means that a job-role prisoner agreeing to be a science test subject is generally fine and cool RP, for example. But security forcing it would be a rule break. But everyone has to be in agreement.

[Vekter]

I'll reiterate what I said in the peanut thread - I don't see an issue with Sec handing over a prisoner to a research department for the sake of running tests on them as long as those tests aren't 1) lethal and 2) unnecessarily cruel. Letting Chemistry test different chem cocktails on them to see which one is most effective, or letting Genetics use them to figure out mutations? Sounds like fun. Nanotrasen is absolutely the kind of company to copy how SCP uses D-Class personnel. The issue arises when it chafes against the rules by either being completely non-consensual or unnecessarily cruel, ie turning someone into a nugget for no reason or trying to force them to break rules.

This is one of those few instances where I think /tg/ could benefit from having LOOC, as it'd be a convenient way to make sure everyone's on the same page before doing something someone might not enjoy, but that ship sailed ages ago and I'm not about to try and drag it kicking and screaming back to port.

tl;dr This is fine as long as it's fun for everyone and not breaking the rules/weird.

[Pandarsenic]

Me, a prisoner RP role, upset when I have to RP

[BrolyButterfingers]

If it's department-related and the prisoner seems into it OOC go nuts. Don't hand out prisoners to assistants. Probably be a little suspicious about it as the warden if it's not a scientist asking.

[Misdoubtful]

This one is a bit of a stream of thought from us but...

Security can hand out roundstart interaction willing prisoners to scientists and MD's, anything like that really, if they are willing and it doesn't result in the game becoming unplayable for them against their will. Rule 1 still applies here in this case.

Obviously people made into prisoners during the round are subject to far more interesting and creative punishments, and if they were already on the chopping block, at least it'll be more interesting than the electric chair. Even if that means feeding them to a xeno egg, or engaging in less than stellar workplace safety, sending them to do hazardous things, you name it.