/tg/Station 13

So for the longest time ive always thought that reviving a sentient animal, from mouse to space dragon, HAS to be friendly and follow the orders of the person who revived them, similar to xenobio sentience potion. however, after looking through code, rules, and headmin rulings, i cant find where thats actually stated.

I assume its just been treated the same as those other scenarios with the animal aligning with the master's allegiances

it shouldnt be assumed though - if you use a slime sentience potion on a mob you get a specific popup explicitely telling you to follow that persons orders. Laz'd mobs get nothing like that

Lazarus'd mobs with AI become friendly to you so it's actually kind of weird that they don't get any flavour text to that extent if player-controlled.
Then again, it is often used to revive fragile pets which were killed by mistake and it might be odd to tie a hypnosis effect to "I want my beloved sapient dog to be alive again".

As of now, just like with the sentient bots, I would say that, if you do not have a flavor text telling you to follow your reviver's orders, you do not have to.

i think that laz mobs should have to follower their revivers orders, since they gave you life and all

Likewise. It's funny to have a revived peaceful dragon. There'd be no incentive to do so if they retained antagonistic behavior after.

also enables funnny antag shennangians IE. traitor reviving dead spider brood mother or dragon and using them for their bidding

EmpressMaia wrote: ↑Thu Jul 27, 2023 12:00 am i think that laz mobs should have to follower their revivers orders, since they gave you life and all

EmpressMaia wrote: ↑Thu Jul 27, 2023 12:38 am also enables funnny antag shennangians IE. traitor reviving dead spider brood mother or dragon and using them for their bidding

While I completely agree with you here, this is a code issue rather than a policy one. The headmins cannot set a flavor text for when someone is revived by lazarus, so it's something that has to be coded in. With that in mind, making a ruling saying "Sentient mobs revived by Lazarus must follow their reviver's orders" is extremely unfair towards said mobs who are revived without a proper flavor text in place.
If that gets coded in, as soon as they have that flavor text, a policy thread would actually be completely unnecessary because the flavor text says it all.

isn't flavor text under a big policy json file?

Sightld2 wrote: ↑Thu Jul 27, 2023 5:33 am isn't flavor text under a big policy json file?

I think that file can handle things like "logged in as a spider" but doesn't have enough context to add a new message to "when revived via Lazarus injector" until someone codes one in.

I got bowinked once for being a bit too aggressive after being lazarused as a dragon saying I need to follow their orders. I wish it said who I was supposed to follow but yeah.

I don't believe it's codified in the rules, but the accepted handling of it has always been "do whatever the person who revived you orders you to do".

personally i rather enjoy not being certain the mob is on your side - sure it may cooperate out of gratitude for being revived, but you probably dont want to turn your back on that possibly vengeful giant dragoncarp

It really does need to be more clear whether or not a lazarus'd dragon is friendly or not. Because i've seen far too many incidents where some rando miner revives a dragon, then acts shocked when it kills half the crew all of a sudden (This happened once during a Nukies + Wizard midround and it fucked a LOT of people up)

If we decide that sentient mobs dont have to obey the lazaruser we might wanna either put an "Are you sure?" prompt on dangerous sentient mobs like dragons or add dragons to the lazarus blocklist like megafauna.

Not-Dorsidarf wrote: ↑Mon Aug 07, 2023 2:11 pm If we decide that sentient mobs dont have to obey the lazaruser we might wanna either put an "Are you sure?" prompt on dangerous sentient mobs like dragons or add dragons to the lazarus blocklist like megafauna.

It doesn't only work on sapient mobs and non-sapient mobs become friendly towards the user.
And friendly towards only the user if emped.

Maybe we should add that as flavour text if not already present.

This is a code issue, it straight up says in the item's description:
"this device can seemingly raise animals from the dead, making them become friendly to the user"
...but it makes no indication to player-mobs revived with it that they must.

while it's a code issue that the resurrected mobs do not get any manner of message when revived, the intention of the item is clear that the revived creature, sentient or not, is loyal to the one who revived them, and will be enforced with that idea in mind.

fikou - agree
cheshify - agree